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Princess-Orphelia's avatar

Romantic Genius

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It took me 13 attempts to craft the Aurora kitten, so 13 mill gold later. This is just way to much for crafting costs. My thoughts on this would be, to not charge gold to craft items, so that even if it failed, at least we're not losing our gold. gonk

Also another thought, what about having all the formulas and some of the rare components for sale in bitfrost? That way we can purchase what formula we want at a reasonable price? sweatdrop

One final thing: Can you please make the wings a bit easier to obtain? Having them available only in the Alchemy case and hoping the chance of coming across one, is just taking way too much time, and quite costly opening a zillion cases in hopes of obtaining one. crying
rainbowlady1's avatar

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Since you've split up the PHILOSOPHER CACHE into different colors with their particular set of components, it would be a GREAT HELP to put a TAG WORD that INDICATES WHICH COLOR PC in the item market description that particular component came from, so that people can either choose to buy the component, or buy the PC it comes in, or find somebody selling that particular component or or the PC it can be found in, in the exchange wink .

Currently components not have that color designation, just says PC (duh) which is way too general now that PC's have been updated.
Nyadriel's avatar

Dangerous Fairy

Princess-Orphelia
It took me 13 attempts to craft the Aurora kitten, so 13 mill gold later. This is just way to much for crafting costs. My thoughts on this would be, to not charge gold to craft items, so that even if it failed, at least we're not losing our gold. gonk

Also another thought, what about having all the formulas and some of the rare components for sale in bitfrost? That way we can purchase what formula we want at a reasonable price? sweatdrop

One final thing: Can you please make the wings a bit easier to obtain? Having them available only in the Alchemy case and hoping the chance of coming across one, is just taking way too much time, and quite costly opening a zillion cases in hopes of obtaining one. crying


I quit after the 11th time trying to do a 4th lv item. It's why I think that it should be 9 out of 10 failures. 100% or over is just not acceptable.
Kuro Ryuu Hime's avatar

Timid Bunny

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Nyadriel
I quit after the 11th time trying to do a 4th lv item. It's why I think that it should be 9 out of 10 failures. 100% or over is just not acceptable.

Well, maybe it does have a 90% fail rate (idk for sure, but just as an example). That does not mean that if you try to craft it ten times that you'll be guaranteed to craft it once. It just means that you have a 90% chance to fail each time. So, if you try 11 times with a 90% fail rate, it means that there's roughly a 30% chance that you will not have crafted it by the end of that 11th try (take a fail rate to the x (# of tries) power to find probability of not crafting after x tries). There's no way to have a "100% or over" fail rate. It just means you have to either be really lucky or very persistent.

However, it should be that lower level formulas have lower fail rates. You know, like .01 - 5% fail rate for level 1, then slowly ramp it up to 95 - 99% fail rate (for example) at level 10, though keeping the crafting costs fairly low throughout the process. If you only have to spend up to 10k to craft an item, but it takes an average of, say, 50 - 100 tries, that's still only 500k - 1 mil in total costs; plus some will get lucky and craft after a small number of tries to raise peoples' hopes, but an unlucky few will need to try many, many more times, allowing for an adequate combination of gold sink and potential hope -- basically the same concept as a casino, with big winners frequent enough to keep people trying in the hopes that they'll get lucky like that.
Nyadriel's avatar

Dangerous Fairy

Kuro Ryuu Hime
Nyadriel
I quit after the 11th time trying to do a 4th lv item. It's why I think that it should be 9 out of 10 failures. 100% or over is just not acceptable.

Well, maybe it does have a 90% fail rate (idk for sure, but just as an example). That does not mean that if you try to craft it ten times that you'll be guaranteed to craft it once. It just means that you have a 90% chance to fail each time. So, if you try 11 times with a 90% fail rate, it means that there's roughly a 30% chance that you will not have crafted it by the end of that 11th try (take a fail rate to the x (# of tries) power to find probability of not crafting after x tries). There's no way to have a "100% or over" fail rate. It just means you have to either be really lucky or very persistent.

However, it should be that lower level formulas have lower fail rates. You know, like .01 - 5% fail rate for level 1, then slowly ramp it up to 95 - 99% fail rate (for example) at level 10, though keeping the crafting costs fairly low throughout the process. If you only have to spend up to 10k to craft an item, but it takes an average of, say, 50 - 100 tries, that's still only 500k - 1 mil in total costs; plus some will get lucky and craft after a small number of tries to raise peoples' hopes, but an unlucky few will need to try many, many more times, allowing for an adequate combination of gold sink and potential hope -- basically the same concept as a casino, with big winners frequent enough to keep people trying in the hopes that they'll get lucky like that.


I will not accept that. No one really wants to spend that much gold and time trying to succeed. Takes the enjoyment completely out of the game (not to mention adding stress).
And since when is there ever an "unlucky few" on Gaia? Try "unlucky many".
This is part of the reason why so many are angry.
Princess-Orphelia's avatar

Romantic Genius

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Nyadriel
Princess-Orphelia
It took me 13 attempts to craft the Aurora kitten, so 13 mill gold later. This is just way to much for crafting costs. My thoughts on this would be, to not charge gold to craft items, so that even if it failed, at least we're not losing our gold. gonk

Also another thought, what about having all the formulas and some of the rare components for sale in bitfrost? That way we can purchase what formula we want at a reasonable price? sweatdrop

One final thing: Can you please make the wings a bit easier to obtain? Having them available only in the Alchemy case and hoping the chance of coming across one, is just taking way too much time, and quite costly opening a zillion cases in hopes of obtaining one. crying


I quit after the 11th time trying to do a 4th lv item. It's why I think that it should be 9 out of 10 failures. 100% or over is just not acceptable.


This is true. I've actually lost a lot of gold, in the crafting stages and having failure almost for everything I did. sweatdrop
Kuro Ryuu Hime's avatar

Timid Bunny

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Nyadriel
Kuro Ryuu Hime
Nyadriel
I quit after the 11th time trying to do a 4th lv item. It's why I think that it should be 9 out of 10 failures. 100% or over is just not acceptable.

Well, maybe it does have a 90% fail rate (idk for sure, but just as an example). That does not mean that if you try to craft it ten times that you'll be guaranteed to craft it once. It just means that you have a 90% chance to fail each time. So, if you try 11 times with a 90% fail rate, it means that there's roughly a 30% chance that you will not have crafted it by the end of that 11th try (take a fail rate to the x (# of tries) power to find probability of not crafting after x tries). There's no way to have a "100% or over" fail rate. It just means you have to either be really lucky or very persistent.

However, it should be that lower level formulas have lower fail rates. You know, like .01 - 5% fail rate for level 1, then slowly ramp it up to 95 - 99% fail rate (for example) at level 10, though keeping the crafting costs fairly low throughout the process. If you only have to spend up to 10k to craft an item, but it takes an average of, say, 50 - 100 tries, that's still only 500k - 1 mil in total costs; plus some will get lucky and craft after a small number of tries to raise peoples' hopes, but an unlucky few will need to try many, many more times, allowing for an adequate combination of gold sink and potential hope -- basically the same concept as a casino, with big winners frequent enough to keep people trying in the hopes that they'll get lucky like that.


I will not accept that. No one really wants to spend that much gold and time trying to succeed. Takes the enjoyment completely out of the game (not to mention adding stress).
And since when is there ever an "unlucky few" on Gaia? Try "unlucky many".
This is part of the reason why so many are angry.

Well, that's why I said that they would have to lower the craft cost and slowly increase the fail rate. That way you'd start out guaranteed to craft a lvl. 1 formula for, say, 1k. Then lvl. 2 formulas would cost, say, 1.5 - 3k to craft, and maybe you'd only have to try twice if you're unlucky. Slowly increasing costs and fail rates so that it doesn't seem hopeless. I mean, based on what Princess-Orphelia said at the top of this page, it takes 1 mil per try to craft an Aurora Kitten. Now, compare that to my plan where even a lvl. 10 formula would only take up to 1 mil on average. Yes, it would take longer, but you'd have to be extremely unlucky to be forced to spend insane amounts. At 10k per craft, with a 99% fail rate, the chances of having to spend 13 mil like she did would be equal to .000212%. As Alchemy is set up now, it's very easy to end up spending that much with a high fail rate and high crafting cost.

As for the "unlucky many"...then they really are unlucky. It's just that, when you know that people are upset, are you really going to go around and be like "HEY, LOOK AT ME, I CRAFTED THE BACKWINGS IN LESS THAN FIVE TRIES FOR EACH FORMULA! ISN'T THAT COOL???" or something like that? No, if someone got lucky on Alchemy, they're probably going to stay quiet so that they don't get flamed by haters. The unlucky ones, however, are going to be very vocal in voicing their displeasure, thinking that Gaia is purposefully trying to screw them (personally) over. The fact of the matter is that Alchemy formula success/fail is determined by chance. Probability. Statistics. People will get unlucky. But there is a standard mean that all number of tries center around. That number is very low for some formulas, and very high for others.

Also, which way of going about things would make Alchemy more accessible: having to craft lots of times with low gold values so that it doesn't take as long to try again (my suggestion), or having to craft a few times with a very high gold value so that it could potentially take months or years to build up the gold needed to try again, just to fail yet again (how alchemy currently is)?

Trust me, I know the problems with Alchemy. I think I've only been able to craft four formulas because of how stupid the system is. But you have to understand how the system works in order to be able to suggest better alternatives and, at the very least, I think my suggestion would make Alchemy at least a little more bearable than how it could currently bankrupt you in one try and still get nothing.
l Kiffa l's avatar

Malevolent Warlord

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:/ I would like if you guys had more cheap things....and GOOD cheap things, wth am I gonna do with a duck in the box? a chicken suit? but you have no prob making bad a** weapons companions and armor costing millions...

20 shovel blades + 3 black ink + 3 purple ink + 3 Green ink +year one sword + coraline key + 3 orb "bundles " [forget the name] + 10000 gold= new key blade that is purple ,green and black. Make it toxic themed.

1 alruna's rose [any gen or alchemy] + 100 purple town flowers + 3 orb "bundles" +25000 = Nexus Alruna's Rose [Same poses as alruna's rose plus a brand new summon pose that can be used in zomg to have Alruna/Anurla follow you.]

1 Death whisper [any gen or alchemy] +40 Demascus + 1000 saw blade + 5 Night fire + 10 orb "bundles" + 50000 gold = Death's bundle [bundle containing a Death Whisper + a new Ragnarok Ring : similar to Hack , stronger attack / longer recharge time.]

Just some ideas....
i_am_ioi's avatar

Chatty Cutie-Pie

I searched "wings" in the marketplace and saw some beautiful new ones, but then I noticed that the prices were insane and there weren't actually many in the marketplace at all. It all made sense when I saw that they came from alchemy. It makes me sad that no one will be able to get those cool new wings because it's basically flipping impossible for almost anyone to craft them or build up the gold to buy them in the marketplace.
If Gaia is going to spend the time and effort making such good items why no allow some of the users to actually have them.
Getting back to the main topic; I've wanted to try alchemy for a while but every time I even consider it I find posts from people explaining why it's a waste of time and gold.
Having read the past few pages of this thread, I also agree that good cheap items from alchemy would be a good idea to get people interested in it and that most items should only be made from readily available items such as: gold shop items, ink, flowers, ZOMG loot, and so on.
Yoru Kurosawa's avatar

Man-Hungry Vampire

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And she thinks the solution is...

Okay. This is a suggestion regarding the Sacred Keys and the lack of things to use them on. So far, the ONLY things that one may use Sacred Keys on are the Inizio (first levels) of the Quest chains. These are among the rarest formulas in Alchemy, and since everyone gets a Sacred Key on their Gaianniversary, it seems rather pointless to have SO MANY keys and SO FEW formulas. So, I present three possible options.

1. Make the Inizio Quest formulas more abundant. That does not mean make them easier to complete. One would still require time and effort to complete the quest all the way to its finish (or a large amount of money.)

2. Make more fomulas that require the use of the sacred keys. These shouldn't be throw away formulas, these should actually be something that users would WANT to make. Basically, don't turn out a crap item. Make a decent item, and make one (as in A SINGLE) key as one of the components.

3. Create an object (like the aquarium box) that requires a Sacred Key to open. The objects inside should be alchemy related, and should also be worth the usage of a Sacred Key. Perhaps place the Quest chain formulas within these boxes, so that one can either spend time and money in attempting to locate one, or can sacrifice an object that is only granted once every year to acquire one.

To become just like the air...
Sand Dancer Shaka's avatar

Shirtless Codger

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pepper-tea

We want to know what you think! We have been working hard on this feature, so we want to know what makes it good and what could be better. So tell us here!



I have just one question:
Is alchemy even still being worked on any more?

We haven't had any updates as to the status of alchemy, so it can only lead us to assume that it's not... Which I hope is not the case!
Yoru Kurosawa
1. Make the Inizio Quest formulas more abundant. That does not mean make them easier to complete. One would still require time and effort to complete the quest all the way to its finish (or a large amount of money.)

To the bold: Considering it took several of the richest people on the site working together to craft the few that currently exist (and were only able to make decent progress after the update to the cache), combined with the fact that the angelic/demonic backwing quest chains require rares that run well into the millions, yes, they need to be made easier to complete. Period. As that particular aspect of alchemy stands now, with the rarity of the formula and the absolutely insane cost of actually completing it, it may as well not exist for the majority of people here.

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