Gaia's Decision on zOMG!

[Prue]

I have a question. Why would Gaia stop updating zOMG if it was in fact a very profitable feature? It would appear to me that there's a disconnect going on somewhere in there.

I don't believe Gaia would just shoot itself in the foot if zOMG was indeed pulling in the profits that Gaia had anticipated.

Though zOMG does receive new users daily, DarkNRGY pointed out in the ATA that more users are actually leaving over prolonged periods of time.

By looking at this and seeing a trend, Gaia may feel removing zOMG developers and relocating them into features that are doing well is a more effective and efficient marketing strategy. This would include the social gaming network that Gaia has recently become a stakeholder in. Games like "Backyard Monsters" have become extremely successful, and they may be a better way for Gaia to protect their assets.

It is also notable that Gaia has made significant cuts to their staff not just in zOMG, but in other areas as well, including customer service. Actions like this are not an attack on zOMG, but in fact a change in direction that Gaia is taking as a company to consolidate their assets and maintain an influx of profit.

For these reasons, although I love zOMG, I also support Gaia cutting major updates to it for the time being. I don't feel as if we've been lied to, and I don't feel Gaia has been disingenuous to any of us. I do feel some of the developers are trying to paint Gaia as that way to protect the project they've been working on for so long.

[Environmental Unity]

zOMG won't shut down,there just won't be any major updates on it, like brand new areas,things like that.There will be fixes, server cycles,etc.

[Mortok]

zOmg is not being shut down. It is in maintenance mode, which is not the same thing. It's a minor point, but I feel it needs clarification. There is always the possibility of it receiving more attention at a later date, even if that possibility is looking extremely unlikely right now.

The mixed messages are indeed confusing. I don't want to accuse anyone of lying, but the fact is that we have one developer saying one thing, while several other developers in ATA and outside of it have been saying pretty much the complete opposite. And swarf's post reads, to me, like the typical bluster of a disgruntled employee. How do we know that he's not just speaking out of anger because his project got cut?

I'm not the least bit surprised that the zOmg fanbase (along with the usual suspects of SF) are allying themselves with the one and only developer who's saying exactly what they want to hear. But more rational individuals are going to realise that it's still just one voice against many.

Gaia has no reason to lie, and we know they've never abandoned profitable ventures before, even when the entirity of Site Feedback was bitching them out about it (every single RIG of 2010, comes to mind).

EDIT: Even if zOmg is making a profit, swarf did not state an amount, so we're still groping around in the dark here. He is being just as vague as all the other staff members are. Being "profitable" is not the same thing as being "an efficient use of resources". I find his assertion that "other companies" would keep a profitable game even if the profit margin was tiny to be extremely odd.

I also find it telling that he compares zOmg's performance to other flash spaces on Gaia. Its performance compared to other Gaia features isn't relevent. Gaia is not dropping zOmg to work on other internal features, it is dropping zOmg to work on games that will be hosted by a third-party social site (ie, Facebook), but swarf conveniently avoids any mention of their performance.

[Luste]

Mortok

zOmg is not being shut down. It is in maintenance mode, which is not the same thing. It's a minor point, but I feel it needs clarification. There is always the possibility of it receiving more attention at a later date, even if that possibility is looking extremely unlikely right now.

The mixed messages are indeed confusing. I don't want to accuse anyone of lying, but the fact is that we have one developer saying one thing, while several other developers in ATA and outside of it have been saying pretty much the complete opposite. And swarf's post reads, to me, like the typical bluster of a disgruntled employee. How do we know that he's not just speaking out of anger because his project got cut?

I'm not the least bit surprised that the zOmg fanbase (along with the usual suspects of SF) are allying themselves with the one and only developer who's saying exactly what they want to hear. But more rational individuals are going to realise that it's still just one voice against many.

Gaia has no reason to lie, and we know they've never abandoned profitable ventures before, even when the entirity of Site Feedback was bitching them out about it (every single RIG of 2010, comes to mind).

EDIT: Even if zOmg is making a profit, swarf did not state an amount, so we're still groping around in the dark here. He is being just as vague as all the other staff members are. Being "profitable" is not the same thing as being "an efficient use of resources". I find his assertion that "other companies" would keep a profitable game even if the profit margin was tiny to be extremely odd.

I also find it telling that he compares zOmg's performance to other flash spaces on Gaia. Its performance compared to other Gaia features isn't relevent. Gaia is not dropping zOmg to work on other internal features, it is dropping zOmg to work on games that will be hosted by a third-party social site (ie, Facebook), but swarf conveniently avoids any mention of their performance.

This time a million. Both sides are being very non-committal about the whole thing, and I don't think we should take either statements without a pillar of salt. No one here is infallible.

[Prue]

Mortok

zOmg is not being shut down. It is in maintenance mode, which is not the same thing. It's a minor point, but I feel it needs clarification. There is always the possibility of it receiving more attention at a later date, even if that possibility is looking extremely unlikely right now.

The mixed messages are indeed confusing. I don't want to accuse anyone of lying, but the fact is that we have one developer saying one thing, while several other developers in ATA and outside of it have been saying pretty much the complete opposite. And swarf's post reads, to me, like the typical bluster of a disgruntled employee. How do we know that he's not just speaking out of anger because his project got cut?

I'm not the least bit surprised that the zOmg fanbase (along with the usual suspects of SF) are allying themselves with the one and only developer who's saying exactly what they want to hear. But more rational individuals are going to realise that it's still just one voice against many.

Gaia has no reason to lie, and we know they've never abandoned profitable ventures before, even when the entirity of Site Feedback was bitching them out about it (every single RIG of 2010, comes to mind).

EDIT: Even if zOmg is making a profit, swarf did not state an amount, so we're still groping around in the dark here. He is being just as vague as all the other staff members are. Being "profitable" is not the same thing as being "an efficient use of resources". I find his assertion that "other companies" would keep a profitable game even if the profit margin was tiny to be extremely odd.

I also find it telling that he compares zOmg's performance to other flash spaces on Gaia. Its performance compared to other Gaia features isn't relevent. Gaia is not dropping zOmg to work on other internal features, it is dropping zOmg to work on games that will be hosted by a third-party social site (ie, Facebook), but swarf conveniently avoids any mention of their performance.

I very much agree this is the case. I went ahead and tweaked my OP so that it didn't say "shutting down", perhaps that is a bad choice of words.

I would like to point out, however, that when you stop updating an MMO it's essentially the same thing as starving it to death.

[Azurimi]

Look it's not about zOMG! not making profit, is just that the FB games have a far higher potential at getting more revenue, for obvious reasons.

As a company I can understand Gaia trying to make as much money as they can, and putting their resources into creating new games for FB seems more appealing to them logically. Of course this means older features like zOMG will be stripped of their resources then, since there's just a limited amount of developers and funds.

The problem arises when they decide to outright lie about the status of zOMG! in an attempt to appease it's users who are not pleased with the lack of attention/updates. Saying that zOMG is in red numbers and that in order to save it people need to buy this or that, all the way knowing their intention from the beginning was to abandon zOMG! no matter what the users did, is a terrible business practice I can't agree with. If your intention is to leave zOMG to embark in other new projects, say so from the start, don't mislead people while milking as much cash as you can from them.

They are losing something very important here and that is the trust of their customers and loyal users.

[Prue]

Azurimi

Look it's not about zOMG! not making profit, is just that the FB games have a far higher potential at getting more revenue, for obvious reasons.

As a company I can understand Gaia trying to make as much money as they can, and putting their resources into creating new games for FB seems more appealing to them logically. Of course this means older features like zOMG will be stripped of their resources then, since there's just a limited amount of developers and funds.

The problem arises when they decide to outright lie about the status of zOMG! in an attempt to appease it's users who are not pleased with the lack of attention/updates. Saying that zOMG is in red numbers and that in order to save it people need to buy this or that, all the way knowing their intention from the beginning was to abandon zOMG! no matter what the users did, is a terrible business practice I can't agree with. If your intention is to leave zOMG to embark in other new projects, say so from the start, don't mislead people while milking as much cash as you can from them.

They are losing something very important here and that is the trust of their customers and loyal users.

If I remember correctly, many of the statements were made by developers within the zOMG! community. Ultimately, they cannot make indefinite statements that zOMG! will be fine if users do "x".

I think the real problem here is the developers speaking out without really taking time (or being given the opportunity) to consult with upper level management. Swarf's post has essentially riled up the entire community and led everyone to believe they've been lied to all along. This simply isn't fair, especially when Swarf only has a limited knowledge of what Gaia plans to do with the feature and how Gaia feels about zOMG! as a long term asset.

[Diamond Cache]

Exactly. I don't get why people are complaining; these are the straight facts. Obviously the site needs money, and throwing money into an open fire doesn't get them anywhere. I would rather have zOMG! at a halt if it means keeping the site going. At least they're keeping the game on the site.

[Backstrom]

Azurimi

The problem arises when they decide to outright lie about the status of zOMG! in an attempt to appease it's users who are not pleased with the lack of attention/updates. Saying that zOMG is in red numbers and that in order to save it people need to buy this or that, all the way knowing their intention from the beginning was to abandon zOMG! no matter what the users did, is a terrible business practice I can't agree with. If your intention is to leave zOMG to embark in other new projects, say so from the start, don't mislead people while milking as much cash as you can from them.

is that the fault of gaia or some of the developers of zomg?

sounds like a lot of people weren't being honest all around if you ask me

[Azurimi]

Madkool

Azurimi

Look it's not about zOMG! not making profit, is just that the FB games have a far higher potential at getting more revenue, for obvious reasons.

As a company I can understand Gaia trying to make as much money as they can, and putting their resources into creating new games for FB seems more appealing to them logically. Of course this means older features like zOMG will be stripped of their resources then, since there's just a limited amount of developers and funds.

The problem arises when they decide to outright lie about the status of zOMG! in an attempt to appease it's users who are not pleased with the lack of attention/updates. Saying that zOMG is in red numbers and that in order to save it people need to buy this or that, all the way knowing their intention from the beginning was to abandon zOMG! no matter what the users did, is a terrible business practice I can't agree with. If your intention is to leave zOMG to embark in other new projects, say so from the start, don't mislead people while milking as much cash as you can from them.

They are losing something very important here and that is the trust of their customers and loyal users.

If I remember correctly, many of the statements were made by developers within the zOMG! community. Ultimately, they cannot make indefinite statements that zOMG! will be fine if users do "x".

I think the real problem here is the developers speaking out without really taking time (or being given the opportunity) to consult with upper level management. Swarf's post has essentially riled up the entire community and led everyone to believe they've been lied to all along. This simply isn't fair, especially when Swarf only has a limited knowledge of what Gaia plans to do with the feature and how Gaia feels about zOMG! as a long term asset.

But I doubt that developers can make zOMG pets, amulets even sell tickets to an unfinished area without someone of higher rank approving it. Those things have to be ordered by the heads. I don't know how Gaia's insides work, but obviously Gaia making all this attempts at getting more money from it's users when they already decided to abandon zOMG is not very honest.

So even if the higher ups didn't promise the users they could save zOMG, Gaia still took advantage of the users hopes.

I play zOMG and I've never supported it with cash, I saw the scam right away when they opened BB without content. What kind of serious company does that?.

[Chibi Halo]

Mortok

zOmg is not being shut down. It is in maintenance mode, which is not the same thing. It's a minor point, but I feel it needs clarification. There is always the possibility of it receiving more attention at a later date, even if that possibility is looking extremely unlikely right now.

The mixed messages are indeed confusing. I don't want to accuse anyone of lying, but the fact is that we have one developer saying one thing, while several other developers in ATA and outside of it have been saying pretty much the complete opposite. And swarf's post reads, to me, like the typical bluster of a disgruntled employee. How do we know that he's not just speaking out of anger because his project got cut?

I'm not the least bit surprised that the zOmg fanbase (along with the usual suspects of SF) are allying themselves with the one and only developer who's saying exactly what they want to hear. But more rational individuals are going to realise that it's still just one voice against many.

Gaia has no reason to lie, and we know they've never abandoned profitable ventures before, even when the entirity of Site Feedback was bitching them out about it (every single RIG of 2010, comes to mind).

EDIT: Even if zOmg is making a profit, swarf did not state an amount, so we're still groping around in the dark here. He is being just as vague as all the other staff members are. Being "profitable" is not the same thing as being "an efficient use of resources". I find his assertion that "other companies" would keep a profitable game even if the profit margin was tiny to be extremely odd.

I also find it telling that he compares zOmg's performance to other flash spaces on Gaia. Its performance compared to other Gaia features isn't relevent. Gaia is not dropping zOmg to work on other internal features, it is dropping zOmg to work on games that will be hosted by a third-party social site (ie, Facebook), but swarf conveniently avoids any mention of their performance.

Thank Edmund for a voice of reason. We have zOMG forum going people in the GCD saying Lanzer's flat out lying and disgruntled over other features people jumping in to agree with them. I have to agree that there were things about swarf's post that were lacking and just didn't sit right with me. Why post it at four in the morning for one thing? Was it so no one else at HQ would know he was posting those things until it was too late and the damage done? It sure comes off that way with how and when it was posted. Why compare zOMG to Ultima Online, which is only a pay to play MMO site that from what I can see doesn't have forums? If zOMG had it's own site for the game then yes I'd say that comparison is warranted. Just because something has been online longer than Gaia's been around doesn't mean it's doing as well or better.

His third post was all it took to brand him as a person who was unhappy they were kept out of the loop. Now he knows how the GCD and possibly the SF feel when he and JK tell the zOMG community things and it takes someone who's in all three forums to tell us things days after it happened. Obviously someone is out to make someone else look like the villain here. It's the Alchemy journal entry all over again.

[Prue]

Azurimi

Madkool

Azurimi

Look it's not about zOMG! not making profit, is just that the FB games have a far higher potential at getting more revenue, for obvious reasons.

As a company I can understand Gaia trying to make as much money as they can, and putting their resources into creating new games for FB seems more appealing to them logically. Of course this means older features like zOMG will be stripped of their resources then, since there's just a limited amount of developers and funds.

The problem arises when they decide to outright lie about the status of zOMG! in an attempt to appease it's users who are not pleased with the lack of attention/updates. Saying that zOMG is in red numbers and that in order to save it people need to buy this or that, all the way knowing their intention from the beginning was to abandon zOMG! no matter what the users did, is a terrible business practice I can't agree with. If your intention is to leave zOMG to embark in other new projects, say so from the start, don't mislead people while milking as much cash as you can from them.

They are losing something very important here and that is the trust of their customers and loyal users.

If I remember correctly, many of the statements were made by developers within the zOMG! community. Ultimately, they cannot make indefinite statements that zOMG! will be fine if users do "x".

I think the real problem here is the developers speaking out without really taking time (or being given the opportunity) to consult with upper level management. Swarf's post has essentially riled up the entire community and led everyone to believe they've been lied to all along. This simply isn't fair, especially when Swarf only has a limited knowledge of what Gaia plans to do with the feature and how Gaia feels about zOMG! as a long term asset.

But I doubt that developers can make zOMG pets, amulets even sell tickets to an unfinished area without someone of higher rank approving it. Those things have to be ordered by the heads. I don't know how Gaia's insides work, but obviously Gaia making all this attempts at getting more money from it's users when they already decided to abandon zOMG is not very honest.

So even if the higher ups didn't promise the users they could save zOMG, Gaia still took advantage of the users hopes.

I play zOMG and I've never supported it with cash, I saw the scam right away when they opened BB without content. What kind of serious company does that?.

Gaia selling items to support themselves isn't really the same thing as them lying to us. Even now, if Gaia sold a new zOMG! ring in the cash shop, people would still buy it. Would you say that Gaia is thus lying to all those users because they don't really have an intent in putting any more major updates in zOMG! for the time being?

We also don't know how long areas like DMS were in development. In fact, I'd wager to say they were in development before Gaia decided that it wanted to drop major updates to zOMG! Big updates like that take a long time to make.

I don't think this is us being scammed at all. If anyone has lied to us, it's the people telling us zOMG! could be saved if only we spent enough. Those are the zOMG! developers, and it would appear that they weren't being given credence to make statements like that =P

[Sinivar]

Diamond Cache

Exactly. I don't get why people are complaining; these are the straight facts. Obviously the site needs money, and throwing money into an open fire doesn't get them anywhere. I would rather have zOMG! at a halt if it means keeping the site going. At least they're keeping the game on the site.

If you choose to believe what swarf posted, then zOMG hasn't been a financial drain to the site. He said it has covered it's own expenses and extra.

People have questioned whether the money put into it's creation has been returned, but since the money not being returned hinged on their not working to make the game a continued success, I'd consider that debt their own and not the fault of the game.

[Prue]

Sinivar

Diamond Cache

Exactly. I don't get why people are complaining; these are the straight facts. Obviously the site needs money, and throwing money into an open fire doesn't get them anywhere. I would rather have zOMG! at a halt if it means keeping the site going. At least they're keeping the game on the site.

If you choose to believe what swarf posted, then zOMG hasn't been a financial drain to the site. He said it has covered it's own expenses and extra.

People have questioned whether the money put into it's creation has been returned, but since the money not being returned hinged on their not working to make the game a continued success, I'd consider that debt their own and not the fault of the game.

If you choose to believe what Swarf and DarkNRGy said, then it's still an inevitable drain.

The number of users is falling at a higher rate than those that are joining. At this point in time, a few months ago, a year ago, etc Gaia may have been pulling in a fair profit from zOMG. However, when they look at the projected cost with how many users have been leaving (which according to DarkNRGY, is more than are coming in), it might paint a more bleak picture for the success of the MMO.

[Arwen]

It's a crap-load of he said she said right now. @.@