If you are against gay marriage, you are a bad Christian.

[Solarn]

Titaniumceadda

Solarn

Titaniumceadda

Excuse me, your interpretation is all wrong. Try learning the Bible before using it.

1. " Love thy neighbor as thyself" doesn't mean to want to get in their pants, and thinking a Christian MUST hate all homosexuals is a stereotype.

2. Again, Christains do not judge these people, but merely reject their beleifs, as the Book of Exodus examples, where the people at the foot of the mountain are being homosexual and lesbianic. This enrages God's man, Mosses, and he eventually ends up with all the homosexuals and lesbians killed for their abominational sin that had noforgiveness, from their lack of asking and then repenting from what they did.

3. God has mentioned many times the Bible over that homosexuality is an abomination unto Him, which further ruins this life style. I'd provide a verse for this, but you may want to actually READ the Bible before you try using it, thanks.

4. You DON'T have to get married. It is a choice where God unites you with who you belong with in a matromony of love, and it is a holy union. Two homosexuals being united in marriage is completely wrong, becuase they lack the ability to even reproduce, for one, and, as I mentioned, it IS an abomination to God. The proof is in the pudding, or this case, the Bible.

Saying that the Bible is a mistranslation is a bit of blasphemy. If you don't know what that is, look up the story of David and Goliath, and WHY do you think homosexual queers are so rejected? Becuase their love is an unnatural one, dealing with lust and rebellion against nature itself. Have you seen a male horse go at it with another male horse? If you have, PLEASE send me evidence, becuase the horse is another part of nature, who follows it to further the species.

So, according to what you say, NO laws apply from the Old Testemant? Oh, yipee! Let's go kill everyone we know, rape them, worship rocks, and loot the corpses! NOT. That was an example of how much more out of control things would be without the 10 Commandments. You see, you merely base yourself off of your own ignorant veiw, by twisting the truth until it is unrecognizable.

In closing, Homosexuality is an abomination to God, and if you think this unnatural love is better than how God made nature, then you probably need therapy. Thank you.

Wow. Just... wow. You managed to display a greater lack of understanding of this thread's arguments than all the n00bs who ever came here, with better grammar. Please try to actually read the Bible before you try to use it in arguments. Also, your post reeks of ad hominem, which is very unwelcome here.

Thank you for your ignorance, lack of reading, and insults.

*is dead from irony*

But seriously? Cite exact verses and I will point out why they can't be applied to mean that Christians should regard homosexuality as an abomination and not as a form of love like heterosexuality.

[linaloki]

Servus Dei

linaloki

o_O ORLY? Last I checked, being baptized was just a proclaimation of your faith, and was not required for entry into heaven.

Not according to the Catholic faith.

"Unless a man be born of water and spirit, he cannot have life everlasting."
"Remember brethren, when I baptised you, you were baptised into the death of Christ."

How strange... I wonder how that theif on the cross made it into Paradise that day? Hm...

Catholic faith =/= inherently correct. Let's try using the Bible for these things, shall we?

[TrunkstheSlayer]

Ah, I love how everytime they're told to back their bullshit they start whining and crying thus proving they don't know squat about the book they claim to follow.
This is getting pathetic. I need addresses and explosives

[Servus Dei]

linaloki

How strange... I wonder how that theif on the cross made it into Paradise that day?

The Catechism and Baptism

Catechism of the Catholic Church 1214-1216

1214 This sacrament is called Baptism, after the central rite by which it is carried out: to baptize (Greek baptizein) means to "plunge" or "immerse"; the "plunge" into the water symbolizes the catechumen's burial into Christ's death, from which he rises up by resurrection with him, as "a new creature."6

1215 This sacrament is also called "the washing of regeneration and renewal by the Holy Spirit," for it signifies and actually brings about the birth of water and the Spirit without which no one "can enter the kingdom of God."7

1216 "This bath is called enlightenment, because those who receive this [catechetical] instruction are enlightened in their understanding . . . ."8 Having received in Baptism the Word, "the true light that enlightens every man," the person baptized has been "enlightened," he becomes a "son of light," indeed, he becomes "light" himself:9


Baptism is God's most beautiful and magnificent gift. . . .We call it gift, grace, anointing, enlightenment, garment of immortality, bath of rebirth, seal, and most precious gift. It is called gift because it is conferred on those who bring nothing of their own; grace since it is given even to the guilty; Baptism because sin is buried in the water; anointing for it is priestly and royal as are those who are anointed; enlightenment because it radiates light; clothing since it veils our shame; bath because it washes; and seal as it is our guard and the sign of God's Lordship.10

Quote:

Catholic faith =/= inherently correct.

Prove that.

Quote:

Let's try using the Bible for these things, shall we?

1 Timothy 3:15 says that the Bible isn't the pillar and foundation of the Truth. The Church is.

[Servus Dei]

Also, Catechism 1267, Ty

Quote:

Baptism makes us members of the Body of Christ: "Therefore . . . we are members one of another."71 Baptism incorporates us into the Church. From the baptismal fonts is born the one People of God of the New Covenant, which transcends all the natural or human limits of nations, cultures, races, and sexes: "For by one Spirit we were all baptized into one body."72

Technically, all Christians are part of the Catholic Church by their baptism. Protestants are just really, really seperated.

[Rookherst[KOS]]

TrunkstheSlayer

Ah, I love how everytime they're told to back their bullshit they start whining and crying thus proving they don't know squat about the book they claim to follow.
This is getting pathetic. I need addresses and explosives

Explosives aren't as fun.

Try a SVD Dragunov semi automatic, Gas-operated, Scoped Battle Riffle with 7.62X 54R Ammunition.
MUCH more fun.

[linaloki]

Servus Dei

linaloki

How strange... I wonder how that theif on the cross made it into Paradise that day?

Blah blah blah Catechisms.

Says nothing of the now in heaven unbaptized thief. Also a logical fallacy. I'm right because I say so just doesn't work.

Servus Dei

Quote:

Catholic faith =/= inherently correct.

Prove that.

I prove it by the fact that you can't prove it. If you cannot prove it to be inherently correct, then, logically, it must be considered to not be so. Also, you have yet to answer the points I've brought against Catholic dogma.

Servus Dei

Quote:

Let's try using the Bible for these things, shall we?

1 Timothy 3:15 says that the Bible isn't the pillar and foundation of the Truth. The Church is.

Prove that. First off, you're misinterpreting that verse to the obscenemost degree. Second, prove that the church mentioned in that verse meant the Catholic Church, which had not even yet been established.

And why, oh WHY, would Jesus have kept referring to Scripture if Scripture was not the basis of the truth? Why didn't Jesus just say, "I will found a Church. They will guide you with 100% accuracy. Listen to them."

[Servus Dei]

linaloki

Blah blah blah Catechisms. Says nothing of the now in heaven unbaptized thief.

Baptism of desire.

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Also a logical fallacy. I'm right because I say so just doesn't work.

It was technically a valid appeal to authority.

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I prove it by the fact that you can't prove it.

Argumentum ad ignorantiam.

Quote:

Prove that. First off, you're misinterpreting that verse to the obscenemost degree.

"The house of God, which is the Church, the pillar and ground of Truth."

I am just quoting, man.

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Second, prove that the church mentioned in that verse meant the Catholic Church

No other Church, save the Gnostic church, existed at the time.

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which had not even yet been established.

Prove that.

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And why, oh WHY, would Jesus have kept referring to Scripture if Scripture was not the basis of the truth?

He was talking about the OT, nitwit.

Quote:

Why didn't Jesus just say, "I will found a Church. They will guide you with 100% accuracy. Listen to them."

He did say that. Matthew 16:18, Luke 10:16, among others.

[Solarn]

You know, even if your viewpoints clash to the degree of making you accuse each other of fallacies and occassionally insult each other, it's good to see someone from the opposite side actually making an effort to debate this properly.

Also, seems we scared away the troll.

[linaloki]

Servus Dei

linaloki

Blah blah blah Catechisms. Says nothing of the now in heaven unbaptized thief.

Baptism of desire.

Meaning accepting the Holy Spirit. Whatcha know? Baptism isn't required, merely acceptance of the Holy Spirit.

Servus Dei

Quote:

Also a logical fallacy. I'm right because I say so just doesn't work.

It was technically a valid appeal to authority.

ERRK. Wrong. Prove the Catholic Church is authority over Christendom.

Servus Dei

Quote:

I prove it by the fact that you can't prove it.

Argumentum ad ignorantiam.

Not so. My proof is in the fact that no proof of its existence is there. Until proof of its existence appears, it is to be assumed that it doesn't exist.

And lovely how you again ignore my challenge for you to prove the finer dogmatic points of your faith. It's starting to make me think you can't...

Servus Dei

Quote:

Prove that. First off, you're misinterpreting that verse to the obscenemost degree.

"The house of God, which is the Church, the pillar and ground of Truth."

I am just quoting, man.

Actually, you are misquoting.

1 Timothy 3:15, NIV

if I am delayed, you will know how people ought to conduct themselves in God's household, which is the church of the living God, the pillar and foundation of the truth.

Funny. No capital C, and the antecedant points at God, not church. You fail to prove anything.

Servus Dei

Quote:

Second, prove that the church mentioned in that verse meant the Catholic Church

No other Church, save the Gnostic church, existed at the time.

Wait wait... what was that? Another Church existed? Oh, dear. Now you need to prove that this Gnostic Church was not the one inferred. Or that church wasn't referring to the congregation of peoples under the guidance of the Holy Spirit.

Servus Dei

Quote:

which had not even yet been established.

Prove that.

It was not known as Catholic, with a capital C, until it was institutionalized, which happened AFTER the death of Paul.

Servus Dei

Quote:

And why, oh WHY, would Jesus have kept referring to Scripture if Scripture was not the basis of the truth?

He was talking about the OT, nitwit.

OT is in the Bible, yes? So, if the Bible isn't the foundation of Truth, then wouldn't you be saying Jesus was wrong for quoting Scripture and not the Church?

Servus Dei

Quote:

Why didn't Jesus just say, "I will found a Church. They will guide you with 100% accuracy. Listen to them."

He did say that. Matthew 16:18, Luke 10:16, among others.

Matthew does not state that A) the church is Catholic or B) the church will always be correct. And Luke 10:16 has absolutely nothing to do with the church.

And are you saying that the Church has always been correct?

[SapphWolf]

Solarn

You know, even if your viewpoints clash to the degree of making you accuse each other of fallacies and occassionally insult each other, it's good to see someone from the opposite side actually making an effort to debate this properly.

Also, seems we scared away the troll.

Agreed...Debates in the ED are usually so one sided they're boring...

[jaden kendam]

Titaniumceadda

deadmanjake

Titaniumceadda

Tripe.

1. Collosians 2:14. Look it up. It says the Old Laws are fullfilled.

2. The Ten Commandments falls under the Law of Agape. Care to explain how killing someone would be justified under Jesus' teachings?

3. If you follow one of the Old Laws, then you must follow them all. No clothes that are blended with other materials. No shrimp, crab, or lobster for you then.

4. Marriage is not just a Christian thing. Other religions, even ones before Christianity had a concept of marriage.

5. The Greeks, Egyptians, Romans kind of frowned on murder and theft, so prove that if it was not for the Ten Commandments that we would have been in Anarchy.

If you read what I put, you would know that I was insulting the beleif of killing being okay, and so on. Also, things such as pork are justified when cooked, becuase otherwise you could get a worm. Duh. And, without morals such as the Ten Commandments, we would be in a literal Hell on Earth.

Uhm..did you even comprehend what I wrote? Can your prove that Jews, who have to follow the OT are allowed to eat pork if it is cooked? And again, prove that without the Ten Commandments we would be in a hell on Earth?

[PoeticVengeance]

Titaniumceadda

Excuse me, your interpretation is all wrong. Try learning the Bible before using it.

1. " Love thy neighbor as thyself" doesn't mean to want to get in their pants, and thinking a Christian MUST hate all homosexuals is a stereotype.

The first post deals with this argument and destroys it.

Phail number 1

Quote:

2. Again, Christains do not judge these people, but merely reject their beleifs, as the Book of Exodus examples, where the people at the foot of the mountain are being homosexual and lesbianic. This enrages God's man, Mosses, and he eventually ends up with all the homosexuals and lesbians killed for their abominational sin that had noforgiveness, from their lack of asking and then repenting from what they did.

False, no where in Exodus does it actually refer to specifically homosexual sex occurring and no where does it reference homosexual sex as the reason for those occurances.

Phail number 2

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3. God has mentioned many times the Bible over that homosexuality is an abomination unto Him, which further ruins this life style. I'd provide a verse for this, but you may want to actually READ the Bible before you try using it, thanks.

Funny how this was pwned in 20 different ways by all of us and *gasp* the first post, which I doubt you read.

Phailure number 3

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4. You DON'T have to get married. It is a choice where God unites you with who you belong with in a matromony of love, and it is a holy union. Two homosexuals being united in marriage is completely wrong, becuase they lack the ability to even reproduce, for one, and, as I mentioned, it IS an abomination to God. The proof is in the pudding, or this case, the Bible.

False, the Bible does not show homosexuality as an abomination.

Also, marriage as in secular marriage is the one we are referring to, something Christians shouldn't b***h and whine about anyways. But especially because homosexuality isn't a sin.

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Saying that the Bible is a mistranslation is a bit of blasphemy.

You believe the Bible was originally written in English?

Are you retarded?

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If you don't know what that is, look up the story of David and Goliath,

I as an apostate am well aware of what blasphemy is. You moron.

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and WHY do you think homosexual queers are so rejected?

They are rejected because we fear the unknown.

Quote:

Becuase their love is an unnatural one, dealing with lust and rebellion against nature itself.

Poetic, but false. Turns out homosexuality is present in animals too.

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Have you seen a male horse go at it with another male horse? If you have, PLEASE send me evidence, becuase the horse is another part of nature, who follows it to further the species.

Whiptail lizards for one, have homosexual relations all the ******** time.

Quote:

So, according to what you say, NO laws apply from the Old Testemant? Oh, yipee! Let's go kill everyone we know, rape them, worship rocks, and loot the corpses! NOT.

Oh false, you idiot.

Jesus gave specific teachings that accounted for all ten of the commandments.

Idolatry, rape, killing, and stealing are all still wrong because Jesus' teachings say so.

Have you even read the New Testament?

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You see, you merely base yourself off of your own ignorant veiw, by twisting the truth until it is unrecognizable.

IRONY!

Quote:

In closing, Homosexuality is an abomination to God, and if you think this unnatural love is better than how God made nature, then you probably need therapy. Thank you.

In closing you know s**t about the Bible, about God, about your own religion and should be immediately excommunicated by every sect in existance. Sadly the majority of mainstream Christianity is just as ******** as you.

[PoeticVengeance]

Servus Dei

linaloki

o_O ORLY? Last I checked, being baptized was just a proclaimation of your faith, and was not required for entry into heaven.

Not according to the Catholic faith.

"Unless a man be born of water and spirit, he cannot have life everlasting."
"Remember brethren, when I baptised you, you were baptised into the death of Christ."

Um, Loki... Servus is actually right about baptism, for Catholics it is required for entry into heaven.

That's why new members are required to get baptized as soon as possible, to prevent their entrance into purgatory if they die immediately.

Of course this is blasphemous to the Scriptures, and another issue I have with Catholicism, but we'll leave that for another time.

[Dei Servus]

PoeticVengeance

That's why new members are required to get baptized as soon as possible, to prevent their entrance into purgatory Limbo if they die immediately.

Dear God, you have a piss poor understanding of Catholic doctrine.

Quote:

Of course this is blasphemous to the Scriptures, and another issue I have with Catholicism, but we'll leave that for another time.

No, it isn't. stare