Abortion <33

[Blitzkrieg Beauty]

dark_beauty_moe15

I'm totally against abortion. I don't believe killing a life of a child is right at all.
An unborn child deserves to be born and see and experience the world.
I love babies and they deserve to live and breath like the rest of us do.
Parents are just CRAZY choosing abortion now and days.
It is their decision, but they can always think of adoption instead or taking the life of a baby.

...We are all entitled to our opinions, and this is my view on abortion.

I don't think anyone deserves or is entitled to anything, especially at the expense of someone else.

But, it's good to know that you accept that it's the mother's decision.

[Lexia_Starr]

dark_beauty_moe15

I'm totally against abortion. I don't believe killing a life of a child is right at all.
An unborn child deserves to be born and see and experience the world.
I love babies and they deserve to live and breath like the rest of us do.
Parents are just CRAZY choosing abortion now and days.
It is their decision, but they can always think of adoption instead or taking the life of a baby.

...We are all entitled to our opinions, and this is my view on abortion.

No one ever "deserves" to be born. Women deserve the right to control their bodies and reproductive organs. Some non-sentient blob should not be able to remove someone's basic right to possession of their own body.
Just because you "love babies" doesn't make every woman required to bear children.
Also, there are plenty of people morally opposed to adoption.

[june barcarole]

Satil

Yuki Cross Zero

Blitzkrieg Beauty

Masturbating_Rot_Crow

Blitzkrieg Beauty

Yes, but forking over a certain amount of money every month isn't anywhere near as straining as a pregnancy and birth.

What happens if the woman has complications that ruin her life, or even dies in childbirth with a child she doesn't want but is forced to keep because the father does?
A lot of times pregnancy turns into a massive surgery, too.

I wish there was a way for men to get out of paying child support for children they don't want, but there isn't, and in no way is paying your bills comparable to pregnancy.

I wonder if the mother could exempt the father from paying child support. Do you think they could sign a legal agreement that would supersede the regular court way of doing things?

There probably is a way around it, but I'm sure it's extensive and complicated.

I think a man should be responsible for helping out financially with whatever the woman chooses to do while she's pregnant. Like, pay for part (or half) of an abortion, help pay for prenatal care, and help pay for the actual birth.
But, after that, he should be able to get out of paying child support. Of course this should be concluded a long time before the child is born.

Also, if the father isn't notified about the pregnancy, he shouldn't be held accountable for it against his will.

If you can't take care of a child by yourself, rethink having one. It's that simple.

You can actually choose to have the father's name removed/not put on the birth certificate at all, which exempts him from ANY involvement in the child's life - meaning, no visits, no custody, no payments, no ANYTHING.[/quote

That's not true. My friend refused to sign the birth certificate and at the time didn't even know if the kid was his. After they court ordered him to have a paternity test then they took him to court and are not trying to garnish a ridiculous amount of his wages for child support. If you can prove he's the father- he's stuck.

Also, I agree that every relationship should involve the "worst case scenario" discussion before the p***s and v****a ever meet. My husband and I started having sex at 17 and he agreed he would pay for an abortion should the unthinkable happen, and I would agree to have one. End of discussion. It's not that bad to talk about.

Oh, really? That's ridiculous. I have heard of a few cases where the father has just chosen not to be listed on the birth certificate and basically signing away his involvement in the kid's life. I think it's just awful that your friend is going through that.

[Blitzkrieg Beauty]

SummonMoreZiggurats

Blitzkrieg Beauty

I don't see anything wrong with child support.

But, I do see something wrong with trapping men into paying for a child for the rest of their lives. Especially when you see those ridiculous amounts some men have to pay.

Of course it's only wishful thinking, and it's probably never going to happen.

But frankly, it's not his call. I think if a woman's going through that to birth the child, keep it, etc, it's kind of the father's responsibility to chip in and make it possible for her to actually make a place for the child

However, it would be much better if the system were more flexible, that is true. It should not be a lifelong thing, and should allow a little more slack for the two individuals to work with. But as you said, it's unlikely much will change. Even so, I think having the system as flawed as it is, is better than anybody getting a shot at dismantling it.

Yes, it would be nice if it was a much more flexible system.

Oh well, at this point, if you don't want a child, use birth control. It doesn't always work, but it's good to try.
If you're a man and you're worried, use a condom every time, if you're a woman, take the pill or use something else.

[cloud_is_clive]

Blitzkrieg Beauty

I don't see anything wrong with child support.

But, I do see something wrong with trapping men into paying for a child for the rest of their lives. Especially when you see those ridiculous amounts some men have to pay.

Of course it's only wishful thinking, and it's probably never going to happen.

In response to the whole 'no child support' thing, and not just this comment in general:

If he was willing to have sex and possible get the girl pregnant then he should have to pay child support. He's responsible all the way when he decided to have sex with her in my opinion. On the other hand, it does kind of sound like entrapment doesn't it? : / It's a hard question to answer. All I can say that is my father wants absolutely nothing to do with me, but if I didn't have the childsupport money from him there would be no way for me to survive on my own.

[For The Overmind]

volley15

SummonMoreZiggurats

volley15

Wow. Just wow. Yuki is one of the few religious people I respect. She doesn't force her opinions or views on people. And in regards to some christian people I've seen she is really quite tame. She is really rather quite sane.

I've been wrong.

I find that people who are so quick to throw the troll label are never worth taking seriously.

Which is why people really need to be careful with how they word things and how sarcastic or not it sounds to the reader. Perceptions can lead to troll labels being thrown around.

Look, I'm not here to coddle anybody. Walking on eggshells is for dysfunctional relationships and family reunions, not this place. I recognize your opinion, and I don't begrudge you for it. But I have a different view.

[june barcarole]

dark_beauty_moe15

I'm totally against abortion. I don't believe killing a life of a child is right at all.
An unborn child deserves to be born and see and experience the world.
I love babies and they deserve to live and breath like the rest of us do.
Parents are just CRAZY choosing abortion now and days.
It is their decision, but they can always think of adoption instead or taking the life of a baby.

...We are all entitled to our opinions, and this is my view on abortion.

Good for you for expressing your opinion and for respecting others as well.

I have something to say, though: adoption isn't just this amazing easy solution to things. The adoption system is overburdened and underfunded. There are too many kids and not enough willing parents - especially if the child is older, or requires expensive medical care. Foster care isn't much better. It's not like you just give your kid up for adoption and some wonderful family swoops in and saves them - it doesn't happen like that as often as you would think.

[Satil]

Yuki Cross Zero

Satil

Yuki Cross Zero

Blitzkrieg Beauty

Masturbating_Rot_Crow

Blitzkrieg Beauty

Yes, but forking over a certain amount of money every month isn't anywhere near as straining as a pregnancy and birth.

What happens if the woman has complications that ruin her life, or even dies in childbirth with a child she doesn't want but is forced to keep because the father does?
A lot of times pregnancy turns into a massive surgery, too.

I wish there was a way for men to get out of paying child support for children they don't want, but there isn't, and in no way is paying your bills comparable to pregnancy.

I wonder if the mother could exempt the father from paying child support. Do you think they could sign a legal agreement that would supersede the regular court way of doing things?

There probably is a way around it, but I'm sure it's extensive and complicated.

I think a man should be responsible for helping out financially with whatever the woman chooses to do while she's pregnant. Like, pay for part (or half) of an abortion, help pay for prenatal care, and help pay for the actual birth.
But, after that, he should be able to get out of paying child support. Of course this should be concluded a long time before the child is born.

Also, if the father isn't notified about the pregnancy, he shouldn't be held accountable for it against his will.

If you can't take care of a child by yourself, rethink having one. It's that simple.

You can actually choose to have the father's name removed/not put on the birth certificate at all, which exempts him from ANY involvement in the child's life - meaning, no visits, no custody, no payments, no ANYTHING.

That's not true. My friend refused to sign the birth certificate and at the time didn't even know if the kid was his. After they court ordered him to have a paternity test then they took him to court and are not trying to garnish a ridiculous amount of his wages for child support. If you can prove he's the father- he's stuck.

Also, I agree that every relationship should involve the "worst case scenario" discussion before the p***s and v****a ever meet. My husband and I started having sex at 17 and he agreed he would pay for an abortion should the unthinkable happen, and I would agree to have one. End of discussion. It's not that bad to talk about.

Oh, really? That's ridiculous. I have heard of a few cases where the father has just chosen not to be listed on the birth certificate and basically signing away his involvement in the kid's life. I think it's just awful that your friend is going through that.

I fixed my manged quote tree.

And yes, I am sad to see him go through this. Truth is, he's a really nice guy and he's trying to make a good start in life and has never wanted children to begin with. He has said many times he didn't want children until he was past 30. The kicker to this whole situation? The girl told him not to use a condom. He told her if she got pregnant it was her fish to fry and he wanted nothing to do with it. After she was pregnant he told her that she hoped she would get pregnant so it could tie someone to her forever. It's the reason she's contesting the parental right termination so much.

Men are victims of this system in truth. Women can't have complete power in these situations. I like the compromise someone listed of the man helping pay for prenatal care, but after that if he wants to terminate his rights he can uncontested. This helps the woman get a good start in life, and she can't drag him down.

[Malaresian Lotus]

Tute Sweet

Lisa knight

To be honest with you abortion is murder wether you beleive it or not

No, it isn't. Murder is the intentional killing of a human being.
A developing fetus does not have the physical attributes to qualify it as a human being. Last time I checked, human beings had brains. rolleyes

Lisa knight

the baby is a living being..

So is a cow. Does that mean slaughtering animals for meat is murder?
Bacteria is living too. Does that mean washing your hands is murder?

Lisa knight

You should put yourself in the babies eyes and helpless form. I ask you this if you wer that developing baby would you want to live or die?

That developing fetus does not "want" anything. It has no sense of self yet, and does not have the brain function to make it capable of wanting anything.

Lisa knight

I'm highly postive nearly 95% of mothers agree with this even if 5% dont want to go thru with their pregnancie's.

Bullshit. Don't pull statistics out of your arse and claim that it's fact.

I'm a mother. I wanted my daughter. My husband and I planned and prepared for the baby for a long time... but I still respect another woman's right to control her own body.

Lisa knight

The baby is a living being wether its developing in our bodies or not its still a living human being.

No, it is not a living human being, because as I said before, it is completely anatomically different than a human being until much later in the pregnancy.

Lisa knight

I'm 100% against abortion.

Then don't have one.

You are perfectly within your rights to never have an abortion yourself, but you have absolutely no right to try to dictate to another human being what they should or shouldn't do with their own body.

Lisa knight

It's not right killing an inocent child cuz we wer raped by another guy that we dont like.

Wait... so not only do you know nothing about pregnancy, birth and human anatomy, you also know nothing about rape. It can be a truly harrowing, violent experience that some women never get over... not just some "guy that we don't like".
I assure you, if you were raped yourself, your opinion on this would change.

Lisa knight

Theirs places where you could put your child up for adoption if you dont want him/her.

Do you have any idea how many unwanted children there would be in the adoption system if nobody ever had abortions?
Millions.
Who would look after all those unwanted children? You?

Lisa knight

Killing an inocent child cuz we dont want them isn't right nor is murder.

You're right... luckily, a fetus isn't a child. It's a fetus.

Lisa knight

Don't make the mistake of killing an inocent baby that did nothing to deserve that horrible fate.

Whereas expecting a woman to endure nine months of pregnancy, birth and expecting her to risk her life in favour of a child she doesn't want isn't a horrible fate at all. rolleyes

I hate to break it to you, but women aren't baby-making machines. Shocking.


Don't get me wrong, motherhood can be a wonderful thing, but forcing it upon a woman that doesn't want it is just plain disgusting, and debases the experience.

[For The Overmind]

Blitzkrieg Beauty

SummonMoreZiggurats

Blitzkrieg Beauty

I don't see anything wrong with child support.

But, I do see something wrong with trapping men into paying for a child for the rest of their lives. Especially when you see those ridiculous amounts some men have to pay.

Of course it's only wishful thinking, and it's probably never going to happen.

But frankly, it's not his call. I think if a woman's going through that to birth the child, keep it, etc, it's kind of the father's responsibility to chip in and make it possible for her to actually make a place for the child

However, it would be much better if the system were more flexible, that is true. It should not be a lifelong thing, and should allow a little more slack for the two individuals to work with. But as you said, it's unlikely much will change. Even so, I think having the system as flawed as it is, is better than anybody getting a shot at dismantling it.

Yes, it would be nice if it was a much more flexible system.

Oh well, at this point, if you don't want a child, use birth control. It doesn't always work, but it's good to try.
If you're a man and you're worried, use a condom every time, if you're a woman, take the pill or use something else.

It's not that simple though. Abortion has been demonized a lot, but considering Murphy's Law, it should be respected a little more. Because a woman's pregnant, it doesn't mean she's been having constant unprotected sex everywhere just for the hell of it. Sometimes things go wrong, in which case, she should not be held accountable for it and forced to birth a child (swinging back to the main subject here)

What's others' solutions? Just never have sex? To me, that spells out a rather sad relationship.

[Aphster]

In 100% seriousness, my English teach made me pro-choice. Total b***h. Abortion helps prevent people like her from reproducing.

[june barcarole]

Satil

I fixed my manged quote tree.

And yes, I am sad to see him go through this. Truth is, he's a really nice guy and he's trying to make a good start in life and has never wanted children to begin with. He has said many times he didn't want children until he was past 30. The kicker to this whole situation? The girl told him not to use a condom. He told her if she got pregnant it was her fish to fry and he wanted nothing to do with it. After she was pregnant he told her that she hoped she would get pregnant so it could tie someone to her forever. It's the reason she's contesting the parental right termination so much.

Men are victims of this system in truth. Women can't have complete power in these situations. I like the compromise someone listed of the man helping pay for prenatal care, but after that if he wants to terminate his rights he can uncontested. This helps the woman get a good start in life, and she can't drag him down.

Haha yes, the quote tree was getting out of control.

In my personal opinion, women were legally screwed over for so many years that the legal system is almost bending over backwards in some ways to "undo the damage" or something. It's shocking what one can get away with - for instance, it was on the news that this one cabbie had been accused of raping two girls, even though he had VIDEO from the security cam in his cab proving that it wasn't the case. But, since he was being accused by two girls, he still had to undergo a lengthy and arduous trial that only succeeded in proving that the girls were lying. What if a man had claimed to be raped? The police wouldn't even take him seriously and file the report. It's just sad.

I'm all for equal rights, but I mean EQUAL rights. It's definitely difficult to find a balance, but the stereotype that men are irresponsible jerks who knock up poor women right and left is not helping...

[For The Overmind]

Masten_22

In 100% seriousness, my English teach made me pro-choice. Total b***h. Abortion helps prevent people like her from reproducing.

That's a rather ignoble reason for your stance.

[Qinne]

SummonMoreZiggurats

Masten_22

In 100% seriousness, my English teach made me pro-choice. Total b***h. Abortion helps prevent people like her from reproducing.

That's a rather ignoble reason for your stance.

Need additional pylons!

[For The Overmind]

Qinne

SummonMoreZiggurats

Masten_22

In 100% seriousness, my English teach made me pro-choice. Total b***h. Abortion helps prevent people like her from reproducing.

That's a rather ignoble reason for your stance.

Need additional pylons!

Haha! Yeah! I love it when people pick up where my names came from. Starcraft/Warcraft FTW!