Abortion <33

[Lexia_Starr]

I'm all for abortions. I think no woman should ever be forced to undergo any pregnancy she doesn't want. I for one, would abort any and every pregnancy that befell me. I refuse to gestate or procreate. Ever.

[Blitzkrieg Beauty]

Yuki Cross Zero

Blitzkrieg Beauty

Masturbating_Rot_Crow

Blitzkrieg Beauty

Yuki Cross Zero

dhayzi

^ I know it's not aimed at me, but I would say that, so long as the woman or baby aren't harmed in the process, she should give birth and then hand over all legal rights to the father.

I'd agree with that too. I find it very hypocritical that a woman will force the father into paying child support for eighteen years, but will scream that it's "barbaric" to have her go through nine months of pregnancy and then hand the kid over.

Yes, but forking over a certain amount of money every month isn't anywhere near as straining as a pregnancy and birth.

What happens if the woman has complications that ruin her life, or even dies in childbirth with a child she doesn't want but is forced to keep because the father does?
A lot of times pregnancy turns into a massive surgery, too.

I wish there was a way for men to get out of paying child support for children they don't want, but there isn't, and in no way is paying your bills comparable to pregnancy.

I wonder if the mother could exempt the father from paying child support. Do you think they could sign a legal agreement that would supersede the regular court way of doing things?

There probably is a way around it, but I'm sure it's extensive and complicated.

I think a man should be responsible for helping out financially with whatever the woman chooses to do while she's pregnant. Like, pay for part (or half) of an abortion, help pay for prenatal care, and help pay for the actual birth.
But, after that, he should be able to get out of paying child support. Of course this should be concluded a long time before the child is born.

Also, if the father isn't notified about the pregnancy, he shouldn't be held accountable for it against his will.

If you can't take care of a child by yourself, rethink having one. It's that simple.

You can actually choose to have the father's name removed/not put on the birth certificate at all, which exempts him from ANY involvement in the child's life - meaning, no visits, no custody, no payments, no ANYTHING.

That's good, as long as the mother complies.

I still wish there was a way to do it without her compliance.

[volley15]

SummonMoreZiggurats

Yuki Cross Zero

SummonMoreZiggurats

Me? Aggressive? But I'm just so cuddly. You like cuddling, right?

And I've been discussing the topic for awhile today if you look back. Just saw your name, and of course as an old buddy wanted to catch up! That's not so bad, right? biggrin And if I were seeking a little attention, wouldn't you just be handing that over to me? I think you being crazy is entirely relevant; how can somebody who is not sound of mind seriously debate a subject, and make a responsible decision? You're unfit to even make the decision if you're not entirely sane, wouldn't you think?

Um...and you're qualified to judge my mental state...how? Did I miss some kind of discussion in which you identified yourself as a medical professional or even someone who's taken a few psychology courses?

You're right, honey, I'm going to quit feeding the troll. Nice catching up with you.

Truly was great. Good luck with the crazy. I missed you!

Wow. Just wow. Yuki is one of the few religious people I respect. She doesn't force her opinions or views on people. And in regards to some christian people I've seen she is really quite tame. She is really rather quite sane.

[For The Overmind]

Blitzkrieg Beauty

Masturbating_Rot_Crow

Blitzkrieg Beauty

Yuki Cross Zero

dhayzi

^ I know it's not aimed at me, but I would say that, so long as the woman or baby aren't harmed in the process, she should give birth and then hand over all legal rights to the father.

I'd agree with that too. I find it very hypocritical that a woman will force the father into paying child support for eighteen years, but will scream that it's "barbaric" to have her go through nine months of pregnancy and then hand the kid over.

Yes, but forking over a certain amount of money every month isn't anywhere near as straining as a pregnancy and birth.

What happens if the woman has complications that ruin her life, or even dies in childbirth with a child she doesn't want but is forced to keep because the father does?
A lot of times pregnancy turns into a massive surgery, too.

I wish there was a way for men to get out of paying child support for children they don't want, but there isn't, and in no way is paying your bills comparable to pregnancy.

I wonder if the mother could exempt the father from paying child support. Do you think they could sign a legal agreement that would supersede the regular court way of doing things?

There probably is a way around it, but I'm sure it's extensive and complicated.

I think a man should be responsible for helping out financially with whatever the woman chooses to do while she's pregnant. Like, pay for part (or half) of an abortion, help pay for prenatal care, and help pay for the actual birth.
But, after that, he should be able to get out of paying child support. Of course this should be concluded a long time before the child is born.

Also, if the father isn't notified about the pregnancy, he shouldn't be held accountable for it against his will.

If you can't take care of a child by yourself, rethink having one. It's that simple.

I don't quite understand all the hate here against men paying child support. You did half the deed here, really. There's no reason that a woman should both have to birth the child, and take full responsibility while you run along elsewhere. You know how hard it is to raise a child? Not only does the woman take responsibility for actually raising the child, but a lot of the time child support isn't paid anyway, which gets into a lot of tangled work. All it's asking is that a man puts some of his money, not even his time into it.

It just dumps the whole load on the woman. Really, I completely agree with child support. If I get a girl pregnant, I should always be held partially accountable in some way. It would be unjust for anything else to happen in that situation.

[june barcarole]

volley15

SummonMoreZiggurats

Yuki Cross Zero

SummonMoreZiggurats

Me? Aggressive? But I'm just so cuddly. You like cuddling, right?

And I've been discussing the topic for awhile today if you look back. Just saw your name, and of course as an old buddy wanted to catch up! That's not so bad, right? biggrin And if I were seeking a little attention, wouldn't you just be handing that over to me? I think you being crazy is entirely relevant; how can somebody who is not sound of mind seriously debate a subject, and make a responsible decision? You're unfit to even make the decision if you're not entirely sane, wouldn't you think?

Um...and you're qualified to judge my mental state...how? Did I miss some kind of discussion in which you identified yourself as a medical professional or even someone who's taken a few psychology courses?

You're right, honey, I'm going to quit feeding the troll. Nice catching up with you.

Truly was great. Good luck with the crazy. I missed you!

Wow. Just wow. Yuki is one of the few religious people I respect. She doesn't force her opinions or views on people. And in regards to some christian people I've seen she is really quite tame. She is really rather quite sane.

Awww, thanks heart

[june barcarole]

SummonMoreZiggurats

I don't quite understand all the hate here against men paying child support. You did half the deed here, really. There's no reason that a woman should both have to birth the child, and take full responsibility while you run along elsewhere. You know how hard it is to raise a child? Not only does the woman take responsibility for actually raising the child, but a lot of the time child support isn't paid anyway, which gets into a lot of tangled work. All it's asking is that a man puts some of his money, not even his time into it.

It just dumps the whole load on the woman. Really, I completely agree with child support. If I get a girl pregnant, I should always be held partially accountable in some way. It would be unjust for anything else to happen in that situation.

The hate isn't against men paying child support, really. If both the man and the woman agree on keeping the child, then of course both should pitch in, because it IS both their accountability - and as either Rot_Crow or Blitzkrieg said, it would be a good idea for men to be accountable to help pay for the pregnancy. However, what if the woman wants to keep it and the man wants it put up for adoption? If she makes a decision like that without consulting him, then no, it's not fair for him to pay child support.

[Blitzkrieg Beauty]

SummonMoreZiggurats

Blitzkrieg Beauty

Masturbating_Rot_Crow

Blitzkrieg Beauty

Yuki Cross Zero

dhayzi

^ I know it's not aimed at me, but I would say that, so long as the woman or baby aren't harmed in the process, she should give birth and then hand over all legal rights to the father.

I'd agree with that too. I find it very hypocritical that a woman will force the father into paying child support for eighteen years, but will scream that it's "barbaric" to have her go through nine months of pregnancy and then hand the kid over.

Yes, but forking over a certain amount of money every month isn't anywhere near as straining as a pregnancy and birth.

What happens if the woman has complications that ruin her life, or even dies in childbirth with a child she doesn't want but is forced to keep because the father does?
A lot of times pregnancy turns into a massive surgery, too.

I wish there was a way for men to get out of paying child support for children they don't want, but there isn't, and in no way is paying your bills comparable to pregnancy.

I wonder if the mother could exempt the father from paying child support. Do you think they could sign a legal agreement that would supersede the regular court way of doing things?

There probably is a way around it, but I'm sure it's extensive and complicated.

I think a man should be responsible for helping out financially with whatever the woman chooses to do while she's pregnant. Like, pay for part (or half) of an abortion, help pay for prenatal care, and help pay for the actual birth.
But, after that, he should be able to get out of paying child support. Of course this should be concluded a long time before the child is born.

Also, if the father isn't notified about the pregnancy, he shouldn't be held accountable for it against his will.

If you can't take care of a child by yourself, rethink having one. It's that simple.

I don't quite understand all the hate here against men paying child support. You did half the deed here, really. There's no reason that a woman should both have to birth the child, and take full responsibility while you run along elsewhere. You know how hard it is to raise a child? Not only does the woman take responsibility for actually raising the child, but a lot of the time child support isn't paid anyway, which gets into a lot of tangled work. All it's asking is that a man puts some of his money, not even his time into it.

It just dumps the whole load on the woman. Really, I completely agree with child support. If I get a girl pregnant, I should always be held partially accountable in some way. It would be unjust for anything else to happen in that situation.

I don't see anything wrong with child support.

But, I do see something wrong with trapping men into paying for a child for the rest of their lives. Especially when you see those ridiculous amounts some men have to pay.

Of course it's only wishful thinking, and it's probably never going to happen.

[For The Overmind]

volley15

Wow. Just wow. Yuki is one of the few religious people I respect. She doesn't force her opinions or views on people. And in regards to some christian people I've seen she is really quite tame. She is really rather quite sane.

I've been wrong.

I find that people who are so quick to throw the troll label are never worth taking seriously.

[volley15]

Yuki Cross Zero

volley15

SummonMoreZiggurats

Yuki Cross Zero

SummonMoreZiggurats

Me? Aggressive? But I'm just so cuddly. You like cuddling, right?

And I've been discussing the topic for awhile today if you look back. Just saw your name, and of course as an old buddy wanted to catch up! That's not so bad, right? biggrin And if I were seeking a little attention, wouldn't you just be handing that over to me? I think you being crazy is entirely relevant; how can somebody who is not sound of mind seriously debate a subject, and make a responsible decision? You're unfit to even make the decision if you're not entirely sane, wouldn't you think?

Um...and you're qualified to judge my mental state...how? Did I miss some kind of discussion in which you identified yourself as a medical professional or even someone who's taken a few psychology courses?

You're right, honey, I'm going to quit feeding the troll. Nice catching up with you.

Truly was great. Good luck with the crazy. I missed you!

Wow. Just wow. Yuki is one of the few religious people I respect. She doesn't force her opinions or views on people. And in regards to some christian people I've seen she is really quite tame. She is really rather quite sane.

Awww, thanks heart

You're welcome. heart I remember seeing you in other threads and agreeing with you on more than one occasion. As far as I remember I have never seen you go apeshit with some religious view. I usually remember those who do. Some people take things a little too far with religion. burning_eyes Or even non-religious views. It goes both ways. But when you actually don't go too far and are civil, and make sense then I can respect a person. It's like seriously people; you may not agree but please be civil.

[dark_beauty_moe15]

I'm totally against abortion. I don't believe killing a life of a child is right at all.
An unborn child deserves to be born and see and experience the world.
I love babies and they deserve to live and breath like the rest of us do.
Parents are just CRAZY choosing abortion now and days.
It is their decision, but they can always think of adoption instead or taking the life of a baby.

...We are all entitled to our opinions, and this is my view on abortion.

[Blitzkrieg Beauty]

Yuki Cross Zero

SummonMoreZiggurats

I don't quite understand all the hate here against men paying child support. You did half the deed here, really. There's no reason that a woman should both have to birth the child, and take full responsibility while you run along elsewhere. You know how hard it is to raise a child? Not only does the woman take responsibility for actually raising the child, but a lot of the time child support isn't paid anyway, which gets into a lot of tangled work. All it's asking is that a man puts some of his money, not even his time into it.

It just dumps the whole load on the woman. Really, I completely agree with child support. If I get a girl pregnant, I should always be held partially accountable in some way. It would be unjust for anything else to happen in that situation.

The hate isn't against men paying child support, really. If both the man and the woman agree on keeping the child, then of course both should pitch in, because it IS both their accountability - and as either Rot_Crow or Blitzkrieg said, it would be a good idea for men to be accountable to help pay for the pregnancy. However, what if the woman wants to keep it and the man wants it put up for adoption? If she makes a decision like that without consulting him, then no, it's not fair for him to pay child support.

You worded it much better than I could.

I don't think he should get off the hook completely, but if she completely goes against his wishes, he shouldn't be screwed.

But, like I said, this should be decided very early in the pregnancy.

[Satil]

Yuki Cross Zero

Blitzkrieg Beauty

Masturbating_Rot_Crow

Blitzkrieg Beauty

Yuki Cross Zero

dhayzi

^ I know it's not aimed at me, but I would say that, so long as the woman or baby aren't harmed in the process, she should give birth and then hand over all legal rights to the father.

I'd agree with that too. I find it very hypocritical that a woman will force the father into paying child support for eighteen years, but will scream that it's "barbaric" to have her go through nine months of pregnancy and then hand the kid over.

Yes, but forking over a certain amount of money every month isn't anywhere near as straining as a pregnancy and birth.

What happens if the woman has complications that ruin her life, or even dies in childbirth with a child she doesn't want but is forced to keep because the father does?
A lot of times pregnancy turns into a massive surgery, too.

I wish there was a way for men to get out of paying child support for children they don't want, but there isn't, and in no way is paying your bills comparable to pregnancy.

I wonder if the mother could exempt the father from paying child support. Do you think they could sign a legal agreement that would supersede the regular court way of doing things?

There probably is a way around it, but I'm sure it's extensive and complicated.

I think a man should be responsible for helping out financially with whatever the woman chooses to do while she's pregnant. Like, pay for part (or half) of an abortion, help pay for prenatal care, and help pay for the actual birth.
But, after that, he should be able to get out of paying child support. Of course this should be concluded a long time before the child is born.

Also, if the father isn't notified about the pregnancy, he shouldn't be held accountable for it against his will.

If you can't take care of a child by yourself, rethink having one. It's that simple.

You can actually choose to have the father's name removed/not put on the birth certificate at all, which exempts him from ANY involvement in the child's life - meaning, no visits, no custody, no payments, no ANYTHING.

That's not true. My friend refused to sign the birth certificate and at the time didn't even know if the kid was his. After they court ordered him to have a paternity test then they took him to court and are not trying to garnish a ridiculous amount of his wages for child support. If you can prove he's the father- he's stuck.

Also, I agree that every relationship should involve the "worst case scenario" discussion before the p***s and v****a ever meet. My husband and I started having sex at 17 and he agreed he would pay for an abortion should the unthinkable happen, and I would agree to have one. End of discussion. It's not that bad to talk about.

[volley15]

SummonMoreZiggurats

volley15

Wow. Just wow. Yuki is one of the few religious people I respect. She doesn't force her opinions or views on people. And in regards to some christian people I've seen she is really quite tame. She is really rather quite sane.

I've been wrong.

I find that people who are so quick to throw the troll label are never worth taking seriously.

Which is why people really need to be careful with how they word things and how sarcastic or not it sounds to the reader. Perceptions can lead to troll labels being thrown around.

[june barcarole]

volley15

Yuki Cross Zero

volley15

SummonMoreZiggurats

Yuki Cross Zero

SummonMoreZiggurats

Me? Aggressive? But I'm just so cuddly. You like cuddling, right?

And I've been discussing the topic for awhile today if you look back. Just saw your name, and of course as an old buddy wanted to catch up! That's not so bad, right? biggrin And if I were seeking a little attention, wouldn't you just be handing that over to me? I think you being crazy is entirely relevant; how can somebody who is not sound of mind seriously debate a subject, and make a responsible decision? You're unfit to even make the decision if you're not entirely sane, wouldn't you think?

Um...and you're qualified to judge my mental state...how? Did I miss some kind of discussion in which you identified yourself as a medical professional or even someone who's taken a few psychology courses?

You're right, honey, I'm going to quit feeding the troll. Nice catching up with you.

Truly was great. Good luck with the crazy. I missed you!

Wow. Just wow. Yuki is one of the few religious people I respect. She doesn't force her opinions or views on people. And in regards to some christian people I've seen she is really quite tame. She is really rather quite sane.

Awww, thanks heart

You're welcome. heart I remember seeing you in other threads and agreeing with you on more than one occasion. As far as I remember I have never seen you go apeshit with some religious view. I usually remember those who do. Some people take things a little too far with religion. burning_eyes Or even non-religious views. It goes both ways. But when you actually don't go too far and are civil, and make sense then I can respect a person. It's like seriously people; you may not agree but please be civil.

Haha, I know what you mean. Strangely, it seems like some people feel threatened in their own beliefs when others don't agree with them - see, gay marriage. "My heterosexual marriage can't function if GAY PEOPLE are allowed to get married!!! For some reason, hetero marriage only works if no one can copy it!!" It's kind of baffling sweatdrop It's overall easier just to believe what you believe and respect other people's views as well.

[For The Overmind]

Blitzkrieg Beauty

I don't see anything wrong with child support.

But, I do see something wrong with trapping men into paying for a child for the rest of their lives. Especially when you see those ridiculous amounts some men have to pay.

Of course it's only wishful thinking, and it's probably never going to happen.

But frankly, it's not his call. I think if a woman's going through that to birth the child, keep it, etc, it's kind of the father's responsibility to chip in and make it possible for her to actually make a place for the child

However, it would be much better if the system were more flexible, that is true. It should not be a lifelong thing, and should allow a little more slack for the two individuals to work with. But as you said, it's unlikely much will change. Even so, I think having the system as flawed as it is, is better than anybody getting a shot at dismantling it.