US Lawmakers consider NAFTA repeal

[Wendigo]

Comrade Texada Wolf

so its basically


but replace British with American EU with NAFTA and the Far-right White nationalist with the....Centre-left?

I'm all for giving jobs to Mexicans - they just have to conform to the labor standards regarding health, safety and pay that we set for our own workers.

It's NAFTA supporters who want Mexicans enslaved in sweat shops.

[N3bu]

Wendigo

Comrade Texada Wolf

so its basically


but replace British with American EU with NAFTA and the Far-right White nationalist with the....Centre-left?

I'm all for giving jobs to Mexicans - they just have to conform to the labor standards regarding health, safety and pay that we set for our own workers.

It's NAFTA supporters who want Mexicans enslaved in sweat shops.

Depends which Nafta supporters you talk to. Some Free Trade advocate just think the fact that they actually have jobs at all, is better then them not. Of course the same Free Trade advocates also belief that free trade can, does and shoudl be used totransfer wealth into the poorer countries.

But of course, Free Trade ( as well as the WTO and NAFTA) is just an easy target for anti-trade idealists of any agenda to spread fear. Often they also hide behind the bad conditions of poor countries to justify their position, like they somehow think they have a better idea. But of course, that's just my belief. I'm sure my position as a supporter of free-trade means it's completely wrong and irrelevant.

[Wendigo]

Here's the problem, right?

White Wolf of Nebu

to transfer wealth into the poorer countries

Mission accomplished - more money has moved into the country than there was before. Congratulations!

Now, who owns it?

[N3bu]

Wendigo

Here's the problem, right?

White Wolf of Nebu

to transfer wealth into the poorer countries

Mission accomplished - more money has moved into the country than there was before. Congratulations!

Now, who owns it?

I do understand your point.

But I don't understand why this is a mark against Free Trade. It's obviously a problem that should be fixed, but I don't see how the solution is to starve developing economies of jobs and money.

I mean, what use is impovrishing the nation further? It won't stamp out corruption, or inequality issues.

[Amongst_many]

White Wolf of Nebu

Wendigo

Here's the problem, right?

White Wolf of Nebu

to transfer wealth into the poorer countries

Mission accomplished - more money has moved into the country than there was before. Congratulations!

Now, who owns it?

I do understand your point.

But I don't understand why this is a mark against Free Trade. It's obviously a problem that should be fixed, but I don't see how the solution is to starve developing economies of jobs and money.

I mean, what use is impovrishing the nation further? It won't stamp out corruption, or inequality issues.

If it was only free trade, it's more like "Give us all your things with no taxes, we'll keep subsidizing and generally not caring on our side, thanks"

[Steven Hawkings]

Wendigo

Here's the problem, right?

White Wolf of Nebu

to transfer wealth into the poorer countries

Mission accomplished - more money has moved into the country than there was before. Congratulations!

Now, who owns it?

But neoliberalism solved those issues now the wealthy will invest their money in open market (closes in their mind)....to none of their own and the government will reduce themselves not to spend.

[Amongst_many]

Steven Hawkings

Wendigo

Here's the problem, right?

White Wolf of Nebu

to transfer wealth into the poorer countries

Mission accomplished - more money has moved into the country than there was before. Congratulations!

Now, who owns it?

But neoliberalism solved those issues now the wealthy will invest their money in open market (closes in their mind)....to none of their own and the government will reduce themselves not to spend.

It's a good thing they have the IMF to "convince" third world countries to cooperate

[Steven Hawkings]

Amongst_many

Steven Hawkings

Wendigo

Here's the problem, right?

White Wolf of Nebu

to transfer wealth into the poorer countries

Mission accomplished - more money has moved into the country than there was before. Congratulations!

Now, who owns it?

But neoliberalism solved those issues now the wealthy will invest their money in open market (closes in their mind)....to none of their own and the government will reduce themselves not to spend.

It's a good thing they have the IMF to "convince" third world countries to cooperate

We all know the wealthy are not about profit and would invest in barley educated labor to barley any infrastructure....It's what its not about.....money, profits or investors that would make are dreamland look bad. I'm sure they would take the time to help others as they have helped them self.

[Amongst_many]

Steven Hawkings

Amongst_many

Steven Hawkings

Wendigo

Here's the problem, right?

White Wolf of Nebu

to transfer wealth into the poorer countries

Mission accomplished - more money has moved into the country than there was before. Congratulations!

Now, who owns it?

But neoliberalism solved those issues now the wealthy will invest their money in open market (closes in their mind)....to none of their own and the government will reduce themselves not to spend.

It's a good thing they have the IMF to "convince" third world countries to cooperate

We all know the wealthy are not about profit and would invest in barley educated labor to barley any infrastructure....It's what its not about.....money, profits or investors that would make are dreamland look bad. I'm sure they would take the time to help others as they have helped them self.

Take Iceland for instance, the benevolent bankers would never make the entire people of the country pay for all the money they lost by juggling it around from private bank to bank. They are fully committed to their neoliberal ideals and are willing to accept the loss from the risk and at no point are they pulling their strings with gordon brown to kick them out of the global financial system cause they're butthurt.

[Disa Uniflora]

Amongst_many

Steven Hawkings

Amongst_many

Steven Hawkings

Wendigo

Here's the problem, right?

White Wolf of Nebu

to transfer wealth into the poorer countries

Mission accomplished - more money has moved into the country than there was before. Congratulations!

Now, who owns it?

But neoliberalism solved those issues now the wealthy will invest their money in open market (closes in their mind)....to none of their own and the government will reduce themselves not to spend.

It's a good thing they have the IMF to "convince" third world countries to cooperate

We all know the wealthy are not about profit and would invest in barley educated labor to barley any infrastructure....It's what its not about.....money, profits or investors that would make are dreamland look bad. I'm sure they would take the time to help others as they have helped them self.

Take Iceland for instance, the benevolent bankers would never make the entire people of the country pay for all the money they lost by juggling it around from private bank to bank. They are fully committed to their neoliberal ideals and are willing to accept the loss from the risk and at no point are they pulling their strings with gordon brown to kick them out of the global financial system cause they're butthurt.

I'd love to fly to Iceland right now and hug 93% of its population.

[AnarchoPhiliac]

Amongst_many

White Wolf of Nebu

Wendigo

Here's the problem, right?

White Wolf of Nebu

to transfer wealth into the poorer countries

Mission accomplished - more money has moved into the country than there was before. Congratulations!

Now, who owns it?

I do understand your point.

But I don't understand why this is a mark against Free Trade. It's obviously a problem that should be fixed, but I don't see how the solution is to starve developing economies of jobs and money.

I mean, what use is impovrishing the nation further? It won't stamp out corruption, or inequality issues.

If it was only free trade, it's more like "Give us all your things with no taxes, we'll keep subsidizing and generally not caring on our side, thanks"

That's pretty much the biggest problem there is. I'm all for free trade, but the trade agreements must also set a level playing field for all nations who sign it. Hence why labour and environmental standards should be included in trade agreements, such as NAFTA. Not to mention that there should be either a limit on subsidies and the import and export of subsidized goods.

You would also need more labour mobility as well via worker's visas and a more liberal immigration system. I mean, why allow only capital and entrepreneurship to flow across borders? Why not also labour?

[Wendigo]

White Wolf of Nebu

I do understand your point.

But I don't understand why this is a mark against Free Trade. It's obviously a problem that should be fixed, but I don't see how the solution is to starve developing economies of jobs and money.

I mean, what use is impovrishing the nation further? It won't stamp out corruption, or inequality issues.

I want trade. I love trade. Trade is great. We should trade with our nearest neighbors the most.

But trade is not an end to itself. When trading with an impoverished country, one hopes not just to provide jobs filling one's own needs, but also to improve the stability of the local economy. Or I would, anyway, call it a quirk. We aren't doing that. We're making the local economy dependent on our own, in particular on producing the things that we consume, and therefore on producing the things that we consume more cheaply than any competing country could. If we ACTUALLY brought well-paying jobs with jobs security to the average Mexican, Mexico would become absolutely ******** useless to us for this purpose, because there would be no takers on working long hours in an unsafe factory for low pay.

[Demon Kagerou]

Wendigo

It's interesting that you bring up agriculture, given how weakly the Mexican agricultural sector performs competing against American firms for price or quantity. That's where a lot of illegal immigration has been coming from - out-of-work farmers looking for jobs that can support them.

Not to mention the humongous, verminous pits of pig waste that we like to spread around the countryside, and the no effect whatsoever they have on public health.

That reminds me...

How else would we get in a position where our interest in corn as fuel results in a 400% price increase for Mexicans?

This sort of economic policy sets everyone up for a kind of mass famine, not unlike those farmers were susceptible to once they took to monoculture over diversified crops.