School shooting: In which N. America becomes a police state.

[LadyBramante]

Tadpole Jackson

Free men do not ask permission to bear arms.

those nations, therefore, are not as 'free' as you claim.

How free are corpses?

About 8,000 Americans lose all their 'freedoms' each year when they're shot dead.
Many more are crippled. That's a pretty big loss of 'freedoms'.
And their families, their dependants: are they more or less free after having a husband or father or mother shot?

The 'freedom' of idiots to ruin and end other people's lives doesn't rank very highly in my book.

If you were really into symmetry, the huge number of 'free men' who rot away 2/3 of their lives in jail after shooting someone might be some sort of balance.
But I say that two negatives add to make a bigger loss.

[Ban]

Tadpole Jackson

Free men do not ask permission to bear arms.

those nations, therefore, are not as 'free' as you claim.

Sorry, you're just affirming the consequent. The argument is unconvincing.

[Pipebracket]

LadyBramante

Tadpole Jackson

Free men do not ask permission to bear arms.

those nations, therefore, are not as 'free' as you claim.

How free are corpses?

About 8,000 Americans lose all their 'freedoms' each year when they're shot dead.
Many more are crippled. That's a pretty big loss of 'freedoms'.
And their families, their dependants: are they more or less free after having a husband or father or mother shot?

The 'freedom' of idiots to ruin and end other people's lives doesn't rank very highly in my book.

If you were really into symmetry, the huge number of 'free men' who rot away 2/3 of their lives in jail after shooting someone might be some sort of balance.
But I say that two negatives add to make a bigger loss.

And? they ******** up, or got ******** up.

The right to bear arms is not permission to engage in wanton destruction, don't pretend that it is.

[LadyBramante]

Tadpole Jackson

The right to bear arms is not permission to engage in wanton destruction, don't pretend that it is.

The 'right to bear arms' is, however permission to tool up for wanton destruction. And if I wait until you've got your finger on the trigger and my kids in your sights, its a bit late to do anything about it.

What do you think that the right to 'Life, Liberty and the Pursuit of Happiness' consists of?

Is it a right that you have more of when the idiots in your county are all capable of spraying your house with bullets ? I think not.

[LadyBramante]

Tadpole Jackson

LadyBramante

How free are corpses?

About 8,000 Americans lose all their 'freedoms' each year when they're shot dead.
Many more are crippled. That's a pretty big loss of 'freedoms'.
And their families, their dependants: are they more or less free after having a husband or father or mother shot?

The 'freedom' of idiots to ruin and end other people's lives doesn't rank very highly in my book.

If you were really into symmetry, the huge number of 'free men' who rot away 2/3 of their lives in jail after shooting someone might be some sort of balance.
But I say that two negatives add to make a bigger loss.

And? they ******** up, or got ******** up.

...

My, your sociopathic lack of concern makes you sound like a hard man. *sarcasm*
No - it makes you sound like a defective person who isn't worth talking to.

[Death Magnificent]

Celebrez la Folie

I both understand and don't understand at all why people try to compare mass shootings like this and say things like "oh, well, the U.S. has been killing thousands of children overseas, is that not important enough of an issue?"

That's honestly just stupid to say really, because YES, OF COURSE we want to stop drone strikes, air raids, and in general the war overseas. YES, WE AS CIVILIANS REALIZE THE WAR IS BAD. WE DON'T LIKE. That doesn't mean that one issue has jack s**t to do with the other. It's just a cheap way to try to justify our indifference to the problems at hand or somehow make the events that happened seem less significant.

Both issues are valid, but they aren't comparable in the slightest. In this case, there have been ATLEAST four separate mass shootings during Obama's presidency alone, and that's using a LOOSE DEFINITION OF THE PHRASE. What this mean for us is either

A) We can just chalk it up to "bad luck" and continue living in a stupor of self-delusion

or

B) We can recognize that something is clearly wrong with the systems in play.

HOWEVER,

AND I STRESS THIS MORE THAN ANYTHING ELSE

GUNS AREN'T THE (ONLY) PROBLEM. THEY ARE JUST A CONTRIBUTING FACTOR.

Honestly, I think the biggest change that I would make to the current gun regulations is the addition of psychological screenings to be taken ANYTIME someone needs a gun FOR ANY REASON. Also, it would help to restrict what guns that citizens can purchase legally to hunting rifles, shotguns, and handguns. There is literally no reason that anyone ABSOLUTELY NEEDS to own an assault rifle. It's just unnecessary, let's be honest.


Idunno, that's my soap-box stood on.

How come we have so many all of a sudden? Weird.

You're right, the two issues are linked. Without our 2nd Amendment rights, we can't enact meaningful political change. Raw killing power is not a politically wise thing to hand over all at once to one's esteemed rulers.

You cannot expect us to be able to properly survive other, better-armed humans with antiquated weapons like those. You're killing me here. Also, I don't trust those arrogant, pompous ******** from the mental health community for two reasons. One, the human mind is far too complex to simply come to understand completely. Two. in science, to understand something is to understand also how it can be manipulated or controlled, and make no mistake, that is world-changing s**t.

You never know. One day you may find yourself wishing that you had an "assault rifle".

[Death Magnificent]

Ban

Death Magnificent

They have distinctive haircuts, wear sunglasses, official or military-type uniforms, pack pistols and assault rifles, have some strange dogmatic belief in laws penned by corrupt politicians which none of us had any input on, and will ******** with you for everything they can.

Just going to point out that a strange dogmatic belief in laws that none of us had input on is pretty much the definition of Constitutionalism.

Quote:

Interesting. Still, my rights were guaranteed.

Quote:

Death Magnificent

I'm sorry that you and a good chunk of ignorant Americans think it's batshit crazy to think that you should be able to defend your rights with force. Law is enforced with force, and are rights not the same as laws? Hypothetically, one wouldn't be wrong.

Yes, you would be. You can defend your life and property against an immediate threat, just by legal tradition, but if you feel the law has violated some constitutional rule, the proper forum is the court system. Just as police and executive power are the proper institutions for enforcing law, not individual citizens.

******** federalism 101, here.

Well, legally, if the masked men kicking my door down turn out to be government agents, whether local police or alphabet boys, there will be no self-defence acquittal for killing them. Also, the proper forum is responsible for creating corporate personhood, encouraging the sale of democracy, letting Bush & Pals do whatever they wanted, allowing outright lies to be sold as news... They pretty much always disappoint.

Quote:

Death Magnificent

Isn't that also what those old rich guys what ran out the English said to do in the event that we weren't being properly represented, or that our rights were being altered or violated?

Seriously, you guys need to need to learn your early American history. Those dudes thought of themselves as Englishmen, by and large. Most of them viewed the use of force as a very last resort, and were trying to get intervention by Parliament right up until the King declared the Congress traitors. Pretty much the politicians who actually declared us independent did so after their own lives were threatened by the British Crown.

p***y-a** Englishmen.

[Pipebracket]

LadyBramante

Tadpole Jackson

The right to bear arms is not permission to engage in wanton destruction, don't pretend that it is.

The 'right to bear arms' is, however permission to tool up for wanton destruction. And if I wait until you've got your finger on the trigger and my kids in your sights, its a bit late to do anything about it.

What do you think that the right to 'Life, Liberty and the Pursuit of Happiness' consists of?

Is it a right that you have more of when the idiots in your county are all capable of spraying your house with bullets ? I think not.

And my right to not ******** die because somebody decides they want my TV and oh hell after they broke in they didn't want any witnesses, or hey that guy wants my wallet but ******** it let's knife the guy, trumps your right to feel safe.

[Pipebracket]

LadyBramante

Tadpole Jackson

LadyBramante

How free are corpses?

About 8,000 Americans lose all their 'freedoms' each year when they're shot dead.
Many more are crippled. That's a pretty big loss of 'freedoms'.
And their families, their dependants: are they more or less free after having a husband or father or mother shot?

The 'freedom' of idiots to ruin and end other people's lives doesn't rank very highly in my book.

If you were really into symmetry, the huge number of 'free men' who rot away 2/3 of their lives in jail after shooting someone might be some sort of balance.
But I say that two negatives add to make a bigger loss.

And? they ******** up, or got ******** up.

...

My, your sociopathic lack of concern makes you sound like a hard man. *sarcasm*
No - it makes you sound like a defective person who isn't worth talking to.

Am i supposed to have an emotional reaction to numbers on a page?

Am i supposed to feel some kind of association guilt because i own guns and guns hurt them?

Should i feel association guilt because i drink alcohol and people are killed by drunk drivers?

Here's an idea, ban alcohol, surely people will stop drinking it, and drunk driving deaths will become a thing of the past!


OH WAIT.

[LadyBramante]

Tadpole Jackson

And my right ... trumps your right to feel safe.

Seriously, you are trolling aren't you ?

What makes you more important than the rest of us?

I appreciate you have a right to a rich fantasy life, but when you start acting out and endangering the community by bringing in your killin' toys, it isn't all about you any more.

Maybe I can believe your assurances that you, personally, spent all that money on somethin' you hope you'll never use. And if you do use it, of course you'll use it safely and righteously.

Maybe I can believe your assurances that nobody else - not a burglar, not a family member, not a pawnshop guy will ever get hold of that expensive and dangerous artifact you just brought into my apartment building.

But the statistics show that the gun-saturated US of A has three times the murder rate of the other nations of the developed world. And 68% of those murders - mostly stupid domestic murders - are carried out with your superfluous 'self-defense' hand guns.

So it looks like we can't fully rely on those assurances from all the gun-throbbers of America.

[Death Magnificent]

It is not smart to give one group all the guns. Simple precaution.

[Pipebracket]

LadyBramante

Tadpole Jackson

And my right ... trumps your right to feel safe.

Seriously, you are trolling aren't you ?

What makes you more important than the rest of us?

I appreciate you have a right to a rich fantasy life, but when you start acting out and endangering the community by bringing in your killin' toys, it isn't all about you any more.

Maybe I can believe your assurances that you, personally, spent all that money on somethin' you hope you'll never use. And if you do use it, of course you'll use it safely and righteously.

Maybe I can believe your assurances that nobody else - not a burglar, not a family member, not a pawnshop guy will ever get hold of that expensive and dangerous artifact you just brought into my apartment building.

But the statistics show that the gun-saturated US of A has three times the murder rate of the other nations of the developed world. And 68% of those murders - mostly stupid domestic murders - are carried out with your superfluous 'self-defense' hand guns.

So it looks like we can't fully rely on those assurances from all the gun-throbbers of America.

i noticed you snipped out the part about my right to not be dead.

my right to life is more important than your feelings.

And, as it happens, I spent a lot of money on guns that I use ALL THE TIME, because as it so happens, shooting is fun!

As it also happens, if you can see that I have guns, if I make you aware of the fact that I have guns, I would bet that stands to reason that I don't plan to use them on you.

[Wendigo]

LadyBramante

all the gun-throbbers of America.

I like you.

[Pipebracket]

Wendigo

LadyBramante

all the gun-throbbers of America.

I like you.

Wait, if we can be diminutivized because we enjoy something...

does that mean i can accuse you of pissing your pants at the sight of a terrifying gun?

[Wendigo]

Tadpole Jackson

Wendigo

LadyBramante

all the gun-throbbers of America.

I like you.

Wait, if we can be diminutivized because we enjoy something...

does that mean i can accuse you of pissing your pants at the sight of a terrifying gun?

You can accuse me, sure. You might be disappointed by how hard it is to offend me by doing things like that. I'd probably just suggest that you engage in another vulgar bodily function with 'em.

Kind of a silly thing to say, anyway, I got the rifle-shooting merit badge, yanno. Took me a whole summer at scout camp.