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Reluctant Samurai's avatar

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N3bu

Google doesn't run ISP services.


Yes, they do.

http://www.google.com/tisp/

https://fiber.google.com/about/

Aside from that, they own assloads of spectrum and they make or otherwise provide the software for a near majority of devices.

But what I was saying was that if they end up assisting with making this happen, as in helping to create the public networks, they'll have all the access they need.

Quote:
And unless your using Android on your phone, there are certain complexities tracking users in a free wireless network, I doubt they'll be able to link you to any real searches.


Not really. Especially not for Google.
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Telecom giants already have total access to your personal information. (And share it practically at will with the government, for the record. There are certain provisions of the P.A.T.R.I.O.T. Act which facilitate this.) I say the benefits of a single government standard outweigh the drawbacks of its being government-run.

Like for example, one is likely to have seen one of these before:

http://www.blogcdn.com/www.engadget.com/media/2009/10/mapforthat.jpg

These guys use the same technology for the same purpose, broadcast over the same frequencies, to devices built by the same manufacturers. Innovation, no.

Pointless redundancy which adds no fault-tolerance for the consumer, yes.
Reluctant Samurai
N3bu

Google doesn't run ISP services.


Yes, they do.

http://www.google.com/tisp/

https://fiber.google.com/about/

Aside from that, they own assloads of spectrum and they make or otherwise provide the software for a near majority of devices.

But what I was saying was that if they end up assisting with making this happen, as in helping to create the public networks, they'll have all the access they need.

Quote:
And unless your using Android on your phone, there are certain complexities tracking users in a free wireless network, I doubt they'll be able to link you to any real searches.


Not really. Especially not for Google.

tisp is an april fools joke and Google Fibre is an experimental fibre network only deployed in Kansas City.

What are you referring to with Spectrum?

Actually it is really hard for Google. Assuming Google is tapping the lines and intercepting all wireless packets, unless they have specific Google software on the target device that can't match those packets with an individual device, notable because every time you move to a different WiFi location your address changes completely, as far as packets are concerned you look like a completely different device.
Reluctant Samurai's avatar

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N3bu
Reluctant Samurai
N3bu

Google doesn't run ISP services.


Yes, they do.

http://www.google.com/tisp/

https://fiber.google.com/about/

Aside from that, they own assloads of spectrum and they make or otherwise provide the software for a near majority of devices.

But what I was saying was that if they end up assisting with making this happen, as in helping to create the public networks, they'll have all the access they need.

Quote:
And unless your using Android on your phone, there are certain complexities tracking users in a free wireless network, I doubt they'll be able to link you to any real searches.


Not really. Especially not for Google.

tisp is an april fools joke and Google Fibre is an experimental fibre network only deployed in Kansas City.

What are you referring to with Spectrum?

Actually it is really hard for Google. Assuming Google is tapping the lines and intercepting all wireless packets, unless they have specific Google software on the target device that can't match those packets with an individual device, notable because every time you move to a different WiFi location your address changes completely, as far as packets are concerned you look like a completely different device.


Hahahahahaha. Oh God, I'm retarded.

But I was talking about the gobs of wireless spectrum that Google owns the rights too that could potentially be used in some effect toward this end.

And specific Google software is pretty much just what I'm talking about. Google having a hand in providing the network could help drive users to their products, so on so forth, creating an absolute glut of ripe data. Imagine having to sign in with unique user just to gain access, s**t like that.
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N3bu
Actually it is really hard for Google. Assuming Google is tapping the lines and intercepting all wireless packets, unless they have specific Google software on the target device that can't match those packets with an individual device, notable because every time you move to a different WiFi location your address changes completely, as far as packets are concerned you look like a completely different device.
As far as the network you connect to is concerned, the MAC address broadcast by your NIC hasn't changed.
Wendigo
N3bu
Actually it is really hard for Google. Assuming Google is tapping the lines and intercepting all wireless packets, unless they have specific Google software on the target device that can't match those packets with an individual device, notable because every time you move to a different WiFi location your address changes completely, as far as packets are concerned you look like a completely different device.
As far as the network you connect to is concerned, the MAC address broadcast by your NIC hasn't changed.

Oh yeah, I forgot about the MAC address. I guess you can query it, still... that's pretty..ugh.
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N3bu
Wendigo
N3bu
Actually it is really hard for Google. Assuming Google is tapping the lines and intercepting all wireless packets, unless they have specific Google software on the target device that can't match those packets with an individual device, notable because every time you move to a different WiFi location your address changes completely, as far as packets are concerned you look like a completely different device.
As far as the network you connect to is concerned, the MAC address broadcast by your NIC hasn't changed.

Oh yeah, I forgot about the MAC address. I guess you can query it, still... that's pretty..ugh.
If we're talking about a cell phone in particular, there are quite a number of little identifiers involved. SIM card, for example, is fully designed to act as a unique feature of your particular phone as compared to any other phone of your phone's make and model. Actually connecting to a cell network requires broadcasting a straight-line distance to every compatible cell tower in range, which would enable triangulation - as you may have heard. Never mind that the device is increasingly likely nowadays to incorporate rudimentary GPS hardware for various reasons.

I mean, there are all kinds of reasons to be uneasy about the window into your life that some of these things can open. But that's more of a reason, let's say, to forego use of a cellphone than to restrict cell phones to any particular provider, none of which is particularly worthy of absolute trust.
Wendigo
N3bu
Wendigo
N3bu
Actually it is really hard for Google. Assuming Google is tapping the lines and intercepting all wireless packets, unless they have specific Google software on the target device that can't match those packets with an individual device, notable because every time you move to a different WiFi location your address changes completely, as far as packets are concerned you look like a completely different device.
As far as the network you connect to is concerned, the MAC address broadcast by your NIC hasn't changed.

Oh yeah, I forgot about the MAC address. I guess you can query it, still... that's pretty..ugh.
If we're talking about a cell phone in particular, there are quite a number of little identifiers involved. SIM card, for example, is fully designed to act as a unique feature of your particular phone as compared to any other phone of your phone's make and model. Actually connecting to a cell network requires broadcasting a straight-line distance to every compatible cell tower in range, which would enable triangulation - as you may have heard. Never mind that the device is increasingly likely nowadays to incorporate rudimentary GPS hardware for various reasons.

I mean, there are all kinds of reasons to be uneasy about the window into your life that some of these things can open. But that's more of a reason, let's say, to forego use of a cellphone than to restrict cell phones to any particular provider, none of which is particularly worthy of absolute trust.

While that's true, my main argument was that Internet address systems are usually far less permanent and unique as they are often not hardware based but instead flexible logical systems, like your IP.

I imagine there are also laws against using hardware addresses to isolate personal information to a particular person, essentially spying on them, at least without a warrant.
If you do not want free wifi, then you can always use Ethernet. It's faster anyway.
N3bu
Actually it is really hard for Google. Assuming Google is tapping the lines and intercepting all wireless packets, unless they have specific Google software on the target device that can't match those packets with an individual device, notable because every time you move to a different WiFi location your address changes completely, as far as packets are concerned you look like a completely different device.

You mean like Google Web Search, Chrome, Plus, Youtube, Analytics, and Location Services? Google already knows what network you're on and where that is, often without you having to use any Google applications (due to analytics being included in website frameworks that others use), and unless you make a serious effort to anonymize yourself to Google, it has a profile on all your devices, and probably you as their owner, as well.

Do you not understand that tracking everything you do is Google's main business?
They're trying to fill us with radiation so they don't have to feed us when we get old
God Emperor Akhenaton
If you do not want free wifi, then you can always use Ethernet. It's faster anyway.

Did you know that every connected device is a live A/V stream straight to the government's information-sorting headquarters in Utah?
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N3bu

While that's true, my main argument was that Internet address systems are usually far less permanent and unique as they are often not hardware based but instead flexible logical systems, like your IP.

I imagine there are also laws against using hardware addresses to isolate personal information to a particular person, essentially spying on them, at least without a warrant.
Oh, but that's just subnetting. The ISP still knows what machine goes to what gateway, and what MAC was assigned what IP. Otherwise you wouldn't actually be getting those packets out and back. They'd be going to the next guy assigned your IP, or the last guy assigned your IP. Maybe the last guy who had your IP would be downloading you a whole passel of donkey porn.

No laws against the ISP telling this information to the government, no. There are certain laws telling them when they must, and they tend to cooperate. One hand washes the other, you know.

EDIT: Well, for clarity's sake...they know what IP address range they've assigned your location, what private networks you make on the other end of the router through which they communicate all traffic to and from your network are no nevermind to them.
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Lord Cameron
It would be the mark of the beast system and you'll need a chip to access your free internet and answer your free obama phones.

Or... you know, you could go private and quit your whinging?
But then you couldn't begrudge your neighbour his free phone. Right?
And that's what it's about.
You want your shitty public service phone that serves only to line the pockets of the rich with even more money rather than a tax funded (because that's Socialism and anything that serves the goals of Society first must be 100% evil and avoided at all costs) network that will run at mid to peak efficiency.
Fine.
Stick with it.
Don't use the evil free service.
CuAnnan
Lord Cameron
It would be the mark of the beast system and you'll need a chip to access your free internet and answer your free obama phones.

Or... you know, you could go private and quit your whinging?

Uh, not if the spectrum is taken up by "free" Wi-Fi.

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