Um NO never

[Ayamae Akahana]

Moth Feathers

Ayamae Akahana

Moth Feathers

Ayamae Akahana

Moth Feathers

Rosalina Thorne

Ouch. Sorry about me being wrong...

No, it's okay. Fish are also one of the most misunderstood animals. xD

To be honest, a gold fish is a horrible idea, they're meant to be pond fish. They need heavy filtration, they're nasty, dirty, ammonia creating little buggers. BUT, the most easy animal to care for in the history of ever is a betta. Seriously, it is incredibly hard to kill a betta. You put him in a little glass bowl with some pretty rocks, you get a net and a canister of food, you change his water every month, bada boom. Easiest pet in the world. HOWEVER, if you don't want a pet, you need to be firm with him and tell him NO I DON'T WANT A PET, I DON'T LIKE ANIMALS. If you're not a pet person, you need to make sure he realizes that.

You can't put a Betta in a bowl. Bowls are for soup, not fish. I like calling fish bowls 'torture chambers', because that's what it is.

Honestly, I really dislike the Betta's image as an 'easy' pet, because it's not true, and they most certainly are /not/ the easiest pet in the world. They need a heater and a filter and their tanks regularly siphoned. They need a varied diet not just of pellets but of live or frozen food. They need their water parameters checked regularly. Just getting a measily 5 gallon tank all set up and cycled for a Betta can cost upwards of 80 dollars, even assuming that the tank and hood was for free.

Fish are actually HARD pets to take care of. You're creating a miniature ecosystem within a tank, you have to set up /everything/, versus terrestrial animals who breathe our atmosphere and we don't need to set up every aspect of their lives.

I've had like 10 bettas over the course of my life, and they've all been perfectly fine in bowls. <.< My current betta is in a two gallon bowl. They get about 90% of their air from the surface of the tank, and about 10% from the surrounding water. And as long as you keep them in a warmer room, room temperature water is fine. And I've always fed mine regular pellets, and they've been perfectly fine. They live nice, perfectly healthy long lives. My record lifespan for a betta is 5 years. My current one is 2 years, and he's still going perfectly strong. So either I have incredibly good freakin' luck with bettas, or I'm actually doing something right.

Or it could be testament to the fact Bettas are hardy fish and that they're able to survive in spite of poor care, not because of.

Bettas require at least 2.5 gallon /tanks/ because that's the smallest size that can be safely heated. It has absolutely nothing to do with oxygenation (for some reason people always seem to think that, I have no clue why).
Room temperature is not fine. Bettas are tropical fish and need temperatures 75-79. Remember, water is cooler than ambient temperatures; if your room is 75 degrees, the water temperature can be as low as 72. In order to keep a Betta tank at the proper temperature via ambient air alone, you'd need your room to constantly be in the 80s. Can I say 'ouch' when it comes to the heating bill?

Plus, ambient temp depending on whether it's daytime or nighttime, the placement of any windows and the position of the sun shining through those windows, even stuff like the color of the walls (white reflects, black absorbs) or if any fans are going. Fish thrive on stable temperatures and you can't get any more stable of a temperature than having a heater in the tank, which automatically adjusts to the proper temp no matter the ambient temperature in the room.

Not to mention, sick Bettas need even more heat, up in the lower 80s. Are you going to keep your room 85 degrees whenever your fish gets sick?

Heaters are good things. Bettas are tropical fish, they need heaters. Even a heater set on low is great.

Do you know how many people I know who feed junk food like Science Diet and Purina to their dogs and cats and end up with a 'oh, he's healthy!' animal? Listen, we do not know everything about Betta nutrition. We don't even know everything about human nutrition! Be realistic, can a pellet provide ALL of a fish's nutritional needs? No.
Not to mention, even the best pellets contain not-so-good ingredients like wheat and soybean, totally unnatural parts of a Betta's diet. Bettas should have a varied diet just like any other animal.

Poor care? I really don't think so. He's an active, healthy fish, his bowl is kept clean, he never goes hungry. How dare you tell me that I am a poor fish owner. This fish is the picture of health, has NEVER gotten sick under my care, and is perfectly well-adjusted. You haven't seen the fish, you don't know how the fish is fairing (which is QUITE well, in my opinion, THANK YOU) and I'm done having this discussion.

[Moth Feathers]

Ayamae Akahana

Moth Feathers

Ayamae Akahana

Moth Feathers

Ayamae Akahana

To be honest, a gold fish is a horrible idea, they're meant to be pond fish. They need heavy filtration, they're nasty, dirty, ammonia creating little buggers. BUT, the most easy animal to care for in the history of ever is a betta. Seriously, it is incredibly hard to kill a betta. You put him in a little glass bowl with some pretty rocks, you get a net and a canister of food, you change his water every month, bada boom. Easiest pet in the world. HOWEVER, if you don't want a pet, you need to be firm with him and tell him NO I DON'T WANT A PET, I DON'T LIKE ANIMALS. If you're not a pet person, you need to make sure he realizes that.

You can't put a Betta in a bowl. Bowls are for soup, not fish. I like calling fish bowls 'torture chambers', because that's what it is.

Honestly, I really dislike the Betta's image as an 'easy' pet, because it's not true, and they most certainly are /not/ the easiest pet in the world. They need a heater and a filter and their tanks regularly siphoned. They need a varied diet not just of pellets but of live or frozen food. They need their water parameters checked regularly. Just getting a measily 5 gallon tank all set up and cycled for a Betta can cost upwards of 80 dollars, even assuming that the tank and hood was for free.

Fish are actually HARD pets to take care of. You're creating a miniature ecosystem within a tank, you have to set up /everything/, versus terrestrial animals who breathe our atmosphere and we don't need to set up every aspect of their lives.

I've had like 10 bettas over the course of my life, and they've all been perfectly fine in bowls. <.< My current betta is in a two gallon bowl. They get about 90% of their air from the surface of the tank, and about 10% from the surrounding water. And as long as you keep them in a warmer room, room temperature water is fine. And I've always fed mine regular pellets, and they've been perfectly fine. They live nice, perfectly healthy long lives. My record lifespan for a betta is 5 years. My current one is 2 years, and he's still going perfectly strong. So either I have incredibly good freakin' luck with bettas, or I'm actually doing something right.

Or it could be testament to the fact Bettas are hardy fish and that they're able to survive in spite of poor care, not because of.

Bettas require at least 2.5 gallon /tanks/ because that's the smallest size that can be safely heated. It has absolutely nothing to do with oxygenation (for some reason people always seem to think that, I have no clue why).
Room temperature is not fine. Bettas are tropical fish and need temperatures 75-79. Remember, water is cooler than ambient temperatures; if your room is 75 degrees, the water temperature can be as low as 72. In order to keep a Betta tank at the proper temperature via ambient air alone, you'd need your room to constantly be in the 80s. Can I say 'ouch' when it comes to the heating bill?

Plus, ambient temp depending on whether it's daytime or nighttime, the placement of any windows and the position of the sun shining through those windows, even stuff like the color of the walls (white reflects, black absorbs) or if any fans are going. Fish thrive on stable temperatures and you can't get any more stable of a temperature than having a heater in the tank, which automatically adjusts to the proper temp no matter the ambient temperature in the room.

Not to mention, sick Bettas need even more heat, up in the lower 80s. Are you going to keep your room 85 degrees whenever your fish gets sick?

Heaters are good things. Bettas are tropical fish, they need heaters. Even a heater set on low is great.

Do you know how many people I know who feed junk food like Science Diet and Purina to their dogs and cats and end up with a 'oh, he's healthy!' animal? Listen, we do not know everything about Betta nutrition. We don't even know everything about human nutrition! Be realistic, can a pellet provide ALL of a fish's nutritional needs? No.
Not to mention, even the best pellets contain not-so-good ingredients like wheat and soybean, totally unnatural parts of a Betta's diet. Bettas should have a varied diet just like any other animal.

Poor care? I really don't think so. He's an active, healthy fish, his bowl is kept clean, he never goes hungry. How dare you tell me that I am a poor fish owner. This fish is the picture of health, has NEVER gotten sick under my care, and is perfectly well-adjusted. You haven't seen the fish, you don't know how the fish is fairing (which is QUITE well, in my opinion, THANK YOU) and I'm done having this discussion.

I'm just saying, fish don't belong in bowls. Bowls aren't a suitable environment for them, as I've explained- they can't be safely heated.
I'm glad he's fairing well despite living in a bowl, but I'm simply stating, it's far from the ideal habitat. Fish do not belong in bowls, bowls are for soup. I explained /why/ bowls aren't ideal, is anything I said factually inaccurate?

Go ahead and keep your fish in bowls. But it's far from the ideal environment. Don't take my word for it, why don't you chat with some of our local fishy people like Vanilla_exee, 11 Cardinal 11, Akari_32, Eizoryu? They all own fish, most of them have owned Bettas before, and they all keep their guys in 2.5 gallon tanks (or bigger), most of them also live in planted tanks, and they give their guys varied diets (especially Vanilla, lol).

[haIIoweenie]

Learn to spell. heart

[PKMN133]

@Moth Feathers:
I adore you smile

[Moth Feathers]

CeeBeater

@Moth Feathers:
I adore you smile

D'aww, thank you, I appreciate it.
Any particular reason why? xD

[Henrika]

Moth Feathers

You can't put a Betta in a bowl. Bowls are for soup, not fish. I like calling fish bowls 'torture chambers', because that's what it is.

Honestly, I really dislike the Betta's image as an 'easy' pet, because it's not true, and they most certainly are /not/ the easiest pet in the world. They need a heater and a filter and their tanks regularly siphoned. They need a varied diet not just of pellets but of live or frozen food. They need their water parameters checked regularly. Just getting a measily 5 gallon tank all set up and cycled for a Betta can cost upwards of 80 dollars, even assuming that the tank and hood was for free.

Fish are actually HARD pets to take care of. You're creating a miniature ecosystem within a tank, you have to set up /everything/, versus terrestrial animals who breathe our atmosphere and we don't need to set up every aspect of their lives.

I think the misconception of bettas being "easy" is because they are a great 'starter fish' not a 'starter pet'. Big difference there, but I think people get confused.

[Moth Feathers]

Henrika

Moth Feathers

You can't put a Betta in a bowl. Bowls are for soup, not fish. I like calling fish bowls 'torture chambers', because that's what it is.

Honestly, I really dislike the Betta's image as an 'easy' pet, because it's not true, and they most certainly are /not/ the easiest pet in the world. They need a heater and a filter and their tanks regularly siphoned. They need a varied diet not just of pellets but of live or frozen food. They need their water parameters checked regularly. Just getting a measily 5 gallon tank all set up and cycled for a Betta can cost upwards of 80 dollars, even assuming that the tank and hood was for free.

Fish are actually HARD pets to take care of. You're creating a miniature ecosystem within a tank, you have to set up /everything/, versus terrestrial animals who breathe our atmosphere and we don't need to set up every aspect of their lives.

I think the misconception of bettas being "easy" is because they are a great 'starter fish' not a 'starter pet'. Big difference there, but I think people get confused.

True, I'll agree on that. But even then, many of the people who claim Bettas to be good starter fish are the ones who keep them in bowls and seem to be completely ignorant on how they require heaters, filters, a cycled tank, a varied diet...just like other fish.
I don't mind Bettas being known as starter fish but just because they're hardy does not warrant lack of care, unfortunately which is what many people do not understand.

[radical SATIRICAL]

Ayamae Akahana

Poor care? I really don't think so. He's an active, healthy fish, his bowl is kept clean, he never goes hungry. How dare you tell me that I am a poor fish owner. This fish is the picture of health, has NEVER gotten sick under my care, and is perfectly well-adjusted. You haven't seen the fish, you don't know how the fish is fairing (which is QUITE well, in my opinion, THANK YOU) and I'm done having this discussion.

While a Betta can live in a bowl, it shouldn't. I know that Moth Feathers has pretty much covered everything perfectly ( Moth, I love your posts. ) but I want to weigh in. Technically you or any human could live in a closet ( or a coffin ) and still be relatively healthy at a quick glance, assuming you're getting enough clean air, food and water. The thing is would you be happy living in such a small, confining environment?

I'm not going to lie and say that I didn't start out thinking the same way you did. When I was younger I'd kept a few Betta's in bowls. They all lived for at least 2 years, They were "active" and never got sick, the bowls were always clean and they always had food. It wasn't until I really started taking my fish keeping hobby seriously that I picked up a book and started to search the internet, and I realized that I could have improved their quality of life ten-fold.

I didn't have heaters or filters to start. I'd assumed that since I had been able to keep the fish alive without them initially, it didn't need those things but in reality, they do. I currently have two gorgeous male crowntail Bettas and they are both in fairly roomy, heated and filtered tanks. My Betta Cas went from a temporary holding bowl ( while I waited for the tank to finish cycling ) to a 5 gal. tank and while he was healthy before I put him in, it was clear he wasn't happy. Once he got settled into his proper environment he literally changed color and became ten times more active. I'm not attempting to say that you're a bad pet owner but I would highly suggest that you look into communities like this. Even if you're dead set on keeping up with the current care, these are things that you should at least have in the back of your mind.

I really wouldn't refuse any of the advice or knowledge that's been offered by other posters. They all mean well and really, they are right about everything they're saying.

[PKMN133]

Moth Feathers

CeeBeater

@Moth Feathers:
I adore you smile

D'aww, thank you, I appreciate it.
Any particular reason why? xD

Cause you have an amazing passion for animals 3nodding

[Ayamae Akahana]

radical SATIRICAL

Ayamae Akahana

Poor care? I really don't think so. He's an active, healthy fish, his bowl is kept clean, he never goes hungry. How dare you tell me that I am a poor fish owner. This fish is the picture of health, has NEVER gotten sick under my care, and is perfectly well-adjusted. You haven't seen the fish, you don't know how the fish is fairing (which is QUITE well, in my opinion, THANK YOU) and I'm done having this discussion.

While a Betta can live in a bowl, it shouldn't. I know that Moth Feathers has pretty much covered everything perfectly ( Moth, I love your posts. ) but I want to weigh in. Technically you or any human could live in a closet ( or a coffin ) and still be relatively healthy at a quick glance, assuming you're getting enough clean air, food and water. The thing is would you be happy living in such a small, confining environment?

I'm not going to lie and say that I didn't start out thinking the same way you did. When I was younger I'd kept a few Betta's in bowls. They all lived for at least 2 years, They were "active" and never got sick, the bowls were always clean and they always had food. It wasn't until I really started taking my fish keeping hobby seriously that I picked up a book and started to search the internet, and I realized that I could have improved their quality of life ten-fold.

I didn't have heaters or filters to start. I'd assumed that since I had been able to keep the fish alive without them initially, it didn't need those things but in reality, they do. I currently have two gorgeous male crowntail Bettas and they are both in fairly roomy, heated and filtered tanks. My Betta Cas went from a temporary holding bowl ( while I waited for the tank to finish cycling ) to a 5 gal. tank and while he was healthy before I put him in, it was clear he wasn't happy. Once he got settled into his proper environment he literally changed color and became ten times more active. I'm not attempting to say that you're a bad pet owner but I would highly suggest that you look into communities like this. Even if you're dead set on keeping up with the current care, these are things that you should at least have in the back of your mind.

I really wouldn't refuse any of the advice or knowledge that's been offered by other posters. They all mean well and really, they are right about everything they're saying.

Did I not just say earlier that I was done here? Cuz I think I did. And also, he's very active, has plenty of space, and is healthy, so bugger off. >.< He has TWO GALLONS OF WATER that is ALL HIS. burning_eyes It's not like I"m keeping him in a frigging cup.

[Latrans]

Ayamae Akahana

radical SATIRICAL

Ayamae Akahana

Poor care? I really don't think so. He's an active, healthy fish, his bowl is kept clean, he never goes hungry. How dare you tell me that I am a poor fish owner. This fish is the picture of health, has NEVER gotten sick under my care, and is perfectly well-adjusted. You haven't seen the fish, you don't know how the fish is fairing (which is QUITE well, in my opinion, THANK YOU) and I'm done having this discussion.

While a Betta can live in a bowl, it shouldn't. I know that Moth Feathers has pretty much covered everything perfectly ( Moth, I love your posts. ) but I want to weigh in. Technically you or any human could live in a closet ( or a coffin ) and still be relatively healthy at a quick glance, assuming you're getting enough clean air, food and water. The thing is would you be happy living in such a small, confining environment?

I'm not going to lie and say that I didn't start out thinking the same way you did. When I was younger I'd kept a few Betta's in bowls. They all lived for at least 2 years, They were "active" and never got sick, the bowls were always clean and they always had food. It wasn't until I really started taking my fish keeping hobby seriously that I picked up a book and started to search the internet, and I realized that I could have improved their quality of life ten-fold.

I didn't have heaters or filters to start. I'd assumed that since I had been able to keep the fish alive without them initially, it didn't need those things but in reality, they do. I currently have two gorgeous male crowntail Bettas and they are both in fairly roomy, heated and filtered tanks. My Betta Cas went from a temporary holding bowl ( while I waited for the tank to finish cycling ) to a 5 gal. tank and while he was healthy before I put him in, it was clear he wasn't happy. Once he got settled into his proper environment he literally changed color and became ten times more active. I'm not attempting to say that you're a bad pet owner but I would highly suggest that you look into communities like this. Even if you're dead set on keeping up with the current care, these are things that you should at least have in the back of your mind.

I really wouldn't refuse any of the advice or knowledge that's been offered by other posters. They all mean well and really, they are right about everything they're saying.

Did I not just say earlier that I was done here? Cuz I think I did. And also, he's very active, has plenty of space, and is healthy, so bugger off. >.< He has TWO GALLONS OF WATER that is ALL HIS. burning_eyes It's not like I"m keeping him in a frigging cup.

1: Filters are considered by most aquarists to be a unnecessary thing for a tank, regardless of species.
2: This is the internet. You can't make us leave.

[Henrika]

Moth Feathers

Henrika

Moth Feathers

You can't put a Betta in a bowl. Bowls are for soup, not fish. I like calling fish bowls 'torture chambers', because that's what it is.

Honestly, I really dislike the Betta's image as an 'easy' pet, because it's not true, and they most certainly are /not/ the easiest pet in the world. They need a heater and a filter and their tanks regularly siphoned. They need a varied diet not just of pellets but of live or frozen food. They need their water parameters checked regularly. Just getting a measily 5 gallon tank all set up and cycled for a Betta can cost upwards of 80 dollars, even assuming that the tank and hood was for free.

Fish are actually HARD pets to take care of. You're creating a miniature ecosystem within a tank, you have to set up /everything/, versus terrestrial animals who breathe our atmosphere and we don't need to set up every aspect of their lives.

I think the misconception of bettas being "easy" is because they are a great 'starter fish' not a 'starter pet'. Big difference there, but I think people get confused.

True, I'll agree on that. But even then, many of the people who claim Bettas to be good starter fish are the ones who keep them in bowls and seem to be completely ignorant on how they require heaters, filters, a cycled tank, a varied diet...just like other fish.
I don't mind Bettas being known as starter fish but just because they're hardy does not warrant lack of care, unfortunately which is what many people do not understand.

Absolutely, I should clarify that I meant that they are a good first fish to have if you have no idea how to set up filters, lighting or how to water test etc. You can sort of figure it out with them before accidentally killing other fish with far more specialized needs.

[Asshatting]

Moth Feathers

Rosalina Thorne

If he won't listen to you, tell him to get you a goldfish. They're cheap, and aside from needing to clean its tank once in a while, they're pretty low-maintenance.

No!

Fish are one of /the/ highest maintenance pets you can get, not to mention one of the most expensive to care for.
A single goldfish requires at least a 30 gallon tank with a /strong/ filter, and even then a 30 gallon tank is really too small and would need to have frequent water changes in order to maintain it.

They're not that high maintenance. I have 10 goldfish in a large tank, probably 36 gallons or so and it has only been cleaned twice this entire year. The water is pretty clear still, but our filter is top notch.

Before that, I had 6 goldfish in a smaller tank with a sub par flilter. I doubt the tank was even 15 gallons. None died in that span of 5 months. I bought four more when I bought the large tank from a yard sale. The thing about goldfish are that they are hardy little fish. They require almost no maintenance. Our koi fish in the back pond are even more hardy. They still outdoors all winter and don't get fed again until late march.

[xlove_buttonx]

Just tell him that you don't want one right now and that you appreciate his being so thoughtful. you really would just like some furniture or appliances. Even a fish is a nice solution like someone pointed out. If you are not interested, you do not need to have an animal that could go to a home of someone who really wants one.

[Mistress of Rain]

Asshatting

Moth Feathers

Rosalina Thorne

If he won't listen to you, tell him to get you a goldfish. They're cheap, and aside from needing to clean its tank once in a while, they're pretty low-maintenance.

No!

Fish are one of /the/ highest maintenance pets you can get, not to mention one of the most expensive to care for.
A single goldfish requires at least a 30 gallon tank with a /strong/ filter, and even then a 30 gallon tank is really too small and would need to have frequent water changes in order to maintain it.

They're not that high maintenance. I have 10 goldfish in a large tank, probably 36 gallons or so and it has only been cleaned twice this entire year. The water is pretty clear still, but our filter is top notch.

Before that, I had 6 goldfish in a smaller tank with a sub par flilter. I doubt the tank was even 15 gallons. None died in that span of 5 months. I bought four more when I bought the large tank from a yard sale. The thing about goldfish are that they are hardy little fish. They require almost no maintenance. Our koi fish in the back pond are even more hardy. They still outdoors all winter and don't get fed again until late march.

Umm.... you do know 2 goldfish require a 30 gallon tank.... 10 in a 36 is way OVER STOCKING the tank.

I don't know much about fish but the little bit i do know says that it is overstocking.