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Chwisty's avatar

Wheezing Junior

I'm an old sign maker/has been. I used to own a joint Asian sign shop and the worst we had was cleavage with no bra showing and topless males and maybe Polynesian outfits. I'm excluding the co-owner/co-creator of course but she was absent for most of the shop's lifetime.
Anyway, I quit signmaking because I had no interest. There was an increase in signmakers clashing with graphic artists in the same forum, so my shop was usually thrown under the popularity of other shops. Also, there were lots of hatred for sign makers in general because people grouped us together as sluts, and lots of graphic artists didn't like us because we didn't belong in the PG. And those who were um...more sexy got more attention ;3;
Now my friends are gone. I don't know anyone, and I feel outcasted. Maybe I will rejuvenate my shop when the subforum is made. Glad to see a petition I signed going into action.
If girls have to have clothing over them, not just bras anymore, but now full on shirts, it is highly sexist for guys to be allowed to go around without a shirt on.

The main purpose of cleavage signs and showing a lot of cleavage via only wearing a bra purposely is to arouse sexual thoughts, which Gaia wants banned, which is perfectly fine to do.

However, as a female, I see a shirtless man, and so long as they are remotely in shape, it is quite attractive to me, in a sexual manner.

With male signs showing their chest, this is the purpose of them, and most pictures that males post of themselves on here where they don't have shirts on are NOT to show off how in shape they are, but to get a reaction from females who would be attracted to their shirtless form.

This is EXACTLY THE SAME as females in bras trying to stimulate the thoughts of males.

I get wanting to remove the enhanced sexuality of the female form in just a bra from the site, but doing so without removing the exact same content that males show off is extremely appalling, sexist and completely unfair to the entire gaian public.

If females are going to be prevented from 'showing what they have', males better be too.
Prosaiche's avatar

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Titgasm
If girls have to have clothing over them, not just bras anymore, but now full on shirts, it is highly sexist for guys to be allowed to go around without a shirt on.

The main purpose of cleavage signs and showing a lot of cleavage via only wearing a bra purposely is to arouse sexual thoughts, which Gaia wants banned, which is perfectly fine to do.

However, as a female, I see a shirtless man, and so long as they are remotely in shape, it is quite attractive to me, in a sexual manner.

With male signs showing their chest, this is the purpose of them, and most pictures that males post of themselves on here where they don't have shirts on are NOT to show off how in shape they are, but to get a reaction from females who would be attracted to their shirtless form.

This is EXACTLY THE SAME as females in bras trying to stimulate the thoughts of males.

I get wanting to remove the enhanced sexuality of the female form in just a bra from the site, but doing so without removing the exact same content that males show off is extremely appalling, sexist and completely unfair to the entire gaian public.

If females are going to be prevented from 'showing what they have', males better be too.



I'm not arguing, but I barely see your point.
Just due for the fact that males, in public, can openly not wear shirts. In shape or not. It's not a sexual thing, nor as explicit as a female's body parts.
A female chest IS a sexual part, as a males chest has, well, nothing.
lol

(again, not arguing, just posting a simple opinion)
I kind of agree with Titgasm... But then again i never really understood the point of signs to begin with

anyway, nobody mind me, I just clicked join a friend in forums, and thought I would see what was going on and post as well ninja
In most countries and in some states in the USA, females are legally allowed to be topless in public.

The main point of this, is the sexual attractiveness of a females cleavage, as depicted in a bra. Females are highly sexually attractive when they show off their breasts in a bra only, and it is perfectly fine for gaia to want to rid the site of this sort of thing. However, Males, being shirtless, are just as sexually attractive, and show far more skin than a woman in a bra.

The issue presented to gaia is not that the breasts are a sexual body part, but the sexual attractiveness that breasts produces as well as the explicit thoughts that they inspire. These same exact thoughts are created by a male who is topless. A topless male inspires sexually explicit thoughts and arouses individuals in the same manner that a female in a bra does.

Gaia is implementing a sexually biased double standard in preventing females from expressing this form of their sexuality while allowing males to show more skin, be just as sexually explicit and get away scott free.

Also, shirtless males, if underage, is considered the male form of child porn, which was another major factor in gaia’s removal of the bra pictures. They aren’t covering themselves from the male standpoint, only the female standpoint.

This double standard is not only unfair, but appalling. This is a de-facto way of taking away a sexual equality by preventing females from being as sexually open with them as males are allowed to be.

It is perfectly fine for gaia to want the sexual explicit photos and thoughts off their site, but by only removing the female aspect and not the male aspect; not only are they not removing the sexual nature of this problem, but they are sexually discriminating against one sex, enacting a double standard and overall not doing right by the entire population of gaians.

Either remove the sexual nature in both sexes pictures, or remove nothing. Don’t place double standards and sexual discrimination on your users; it is horrible business and horrible ethics.
Titgasm
In most countries and in some states in the USA, females are legally allowed to be topless in public.

The main point of this, is the sexual attractiveness of a females cleavage, as depicted in a bra. Females are highly sexually attractive when they show off their breasts in a bra only, and it is perfectly fine for gaia to want to rid the site of this sort of thing. However, Males, being shirtless, are just as sexually attractive, and show far more skin than a woman in a bra.

The issue presented to gaia is not that the breasts are a sexual body part, but the sexual attractiveness that breasts produces as well as the explicit thoughts that they inspire. These same exact thoughts are created by a male who is topless. A topless male inspires sexually explicit thoughts and arouses individuals in the same manner that a female in a bra does.

Gaia is implementing a sexually biased double standard in preventing females from expressing this form of their sexuality while allowing males to show more skin, be just as sexually explicit and get away scott free.

Also, shirtless males, if underage, is considered the male form of child porn, which was another major factor in gaia’s removal of the bra pictures. They aren’t covering themselves from the male standpoint, only the female standpoint.

This double standard is not only unfair, but appalling. This is a de-facto way of taking away a sexual equality by preventing females from being as sexually open with them as males are allowed to be.

It is perfectly fine for gaia to want the sexual explicit photos and thoughts off their site, but by only removing the female aspect and not the male aspect; not only are they not removing the sexual nature of this problem, but they are sexually discriminating against one sex, enacting a double standard and overall not doing right by the entire population of gaians.

Either remove the sexual nature in both sexes pictures, or remove nothing. Don’t place double standards and sexual discrimination on your users; it is horrible business and horrible ethics.


All that being said, A) How many guys on this site even sell topless signs? I mean, if its not an issue, why make a rule about it. From what i got in your previous post, the topless guys in pics on the site are just trying to get girls to notice them. i don't see how that is quite the same as selling pics of yourself to other people
B) I still don't entirely get the whole signs thing. Somebody please explain it to me

Side note: I'm not trying to be rude, I just kind of dumb as a brick, i need a little explaining
It isn't just about signs, it is about images in general; more than you'd think do it.

Why create a rule when it isn't a problem yet? Hmm.. ok. Well.. See, no offense, but that is a horrible way of looking at it.

It is like saying, lets not make a law against murder, even though it is wrong and bound to happen, but it hasn't happened yet, so lets just ignore the possibilty and let people get off scott free when it begins to happen.

You make rules to prevent people from partaking in a specific behavior, regardless of if that behavior has already occured on a large scale or not.
so its the principle of the matter then?

Because honestly I'm having a really tough time thinking of somebody with your views would really want to show topless pictures of yourself at all, let alone on a site like this.

that just seems like a bad idea to me. If a guy goes shirtless someplace, how many people are going to bother him? Probably very few to none. If a girl, especially one with a large bust, were to go around topless, there is going to be attention drawn, and not all of it is going to be wanted if any. So why so adement on being allowed to do something that you probably don't want to do anyway is all I'm asking
(still wanting an explanation on the signs deal though)
Prosaiche's avatar

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so its the principle of the matter then?

Because honestly I'm having a really tough time thinking of somebody with your views would really want to show topless pictures of yourself at all, let alone on a site like this.

that just seems like a bad idea to me. If a guy goes shirtless someplace, how many people are going to bother him? Probably very few to none. If a girl, especially one with a large bust, were to go around topless, there is going to be attention drawn, and not all of it is going to be wanted if any. So why so adement on being allowed to do something that you probably don't want to do anyway is all I'm asking
(still wanting an explanation on the signs deal though)



The whole deal with signs is like having "fans".
Sort of like how you can become a fan of something on facebook?
Some people like the art aspect of it, or the fetish part to it (like feet signs).

If you have any more questions, feel free to quote me back and I'll try to help.
Lhetto29's avatar

Business Tycoon

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siskataya
IMPORTANT NOTE:
Since these rules are a bit of a change for everyone, we want to give you all time to make sure that your sign shops, request threads, and contests contain/request only content that is considered appropriate for Gaia. You have until Friday, April 22nd, 2011 to review your shop/thread to make sure that all personal images and signs being created, sold, or used as entries in a contest meet with the new rule revisions.

Thanks!
Gaia Online Admin Team
Miseria Saint's avatar

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So, I have a question... A Federal Judge ruled that teenage girls have a constitutional right to take pictures in their lingerie. I bring this up because I assume that this was who you were trying to protect when you created the new rules on the site.
Here is the question, because this is a Federal case and not a State one, can we have lingerie signs back now that it is apparently legal and all?

xDDDD
Prosaiche's avatar

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Miseria Saint
So, I have a question... A Federal Judge ruled that teenage girls have a constitutional right to take pictures in their lingerie. I bring this up because I assume that this was who you were trying to protect when you created the new rules on the site.
Here is the question, because this is a Federal case and not a State one, can we have lingerie signs back now that it is apparently legal and all?

xDDDD

as far as i read... wasn't all of that just pertaining to her school?
X3

but yea. i actually think lingerie is alright, as long as it's not too revealing. some see through shirts are worst some some bustiers/lingerie ive seen


and had a small ban for
siskataya's avatar

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Miseria Saint
So, I have a question... A Federal Judge ruled that teenage girls have a constitutional right to take pictures in their lingerie. I bring this up because I assume that this was who you were trying to protect when you created the new rules on the site.
Here is the question, because this is a Federal case and not a State one, can we have lingerie signs back now that it is apparently legal and all?

xDDDD



Unfortunately, no - we will be keeping the new rules we have in place. We don't think such images are appropriate for Gaia members to be taking of themselves or their friends, and feel it in the best interest of the community to keep with our newly revised rules. Thanks for raising this issue though, and hope you understand why we feel this is the best policy.

Take care biggrin
Sisky
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Hey gang!

Just an update for you all! After much ado (and I appreciate your patience with this process!), we've finally gotten the Signs sub-forum of personalized graphics live. Over the next few days, we will be moving threads that contain signs into this sub-forum. This can take some time as there are lots of threads, but we'll try and get this done as quickly as possible.

As well, the new rules are effectively in place, and any content that is not considered appropriate will be addressed. There has been extra time given to allow members to transition their shops over to meet the new rules, so we aren't expecting to find many violations. That said, if we do, we will take appropriate action.

Thanks again for the patience and the input during this process. We are glad to have such a creative and passionate group of sign makers, purchasers, and community citizens on Gaia.

Take care and have a fantastic week! 3nodding
Sisky
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