-------------Goth Rock--------------

Faith or Pornography?

Faith.	18.7%	[ 82 ]
Pornography.	27.6%	[ 121 ]
It depends on my mood.	22.3%	[ 98 ]
I'm not sure what you are referring to?	31.4%	[ 138 ]
Total Votes:			[ 439 ]

[Sinister Kung Fu]

Akai Kenshi

Forgive me for asking a dumb question, but would it be fair to say that goth/death rock is in part characterized by the relatively sparse use of rhythm guitar? I was just listening to Christian Death and thinking about how stripped down it sounded, but then I realized that Bauhaus really doesn't use too much rhythm guitar either. It's mostly just leads, bass and drums.

That assmption is mostly accurate I'd say.

[Pein and Pleasure]

Akai Kenshi

Forgive me for asking a dumb question, but would it be fair to say that goth/death rock is in part characterized by the relatively sparse use of rhythm guitar? I was just listening to Christian Death and thinking about how stripped down it sounded, but then I realized that Bauhaus really doesn't use too much rhythm guitar either. It's mostly just leads, bass and drums.

Generally thats the defining difference between deathrock and horror punk. Deathrock and goth rock mostly use the guitar for effects like feedback or a bit of rythm while the bass is lead. When you think of great deathrock songs like Romeo's Distress (Christian Death) and Evil (.45 Grave) what most people remember aside from the lyrics is the awesome bass riff. Horror Punk bands focus on guitar and vocals, Misfits for example, you remember Danzig's vocals and the guitar riffs, notably on songs like We Are 138, Halloween, Die Die My Darling, Some Kind of Hate, and Last Caress. A more modern example would be Cinema Strange's Greensward Grey (opens with some feedback or a bit of synth and then the bassline carries the song through) and Calabrese's Vampires Don't Exist (liberal use of guitar, powerful vocals).

Deathrock = Bass and Drums

Batcave = Bass and Synth

Horror Punk = Vocals and Guitar

I know Deathrock and Batcave are generally considered the same thing but I notice a difference in general sound between the two, deathrock having a faster tempo with a bit more guitar and batcave having a slower tempo and using synthesized effects, probably because of the rise of New Wave around that time period in Britain.

[Akai Kenshi]

infernal_sin

Akai Kenshi

Forgive me for asking a dumb question, but would it be fair to say that goth/death rock is in part characterized by the relatively sparse use of rhythm guitar? I was just listening to Christian Death and thinking about how stripped down it sounded, but then I realized that Bauhaus really doesn't use too much rhythm guitar either. It's mostly just leads, bass and drums.

Generally thats the defining difference between deathrock and horror punk. Deathrock and goth rock mostly use the guitar for effects like feedback or a bit of rythm while the bass is lead. When you think of great deathrock songs like Romeo's Distress (Christian Death) and Evil (.45 Grave) what most people remember aside from the lyrics is the awesome bass riff. Horror Punk bands focus on guitar and vocals, Misfits for example, you remember Danzig's vocals and the guitar riffs, notably on songs like We Are 138, Halloween, Die Die My Darling, Some Kind of Hate, and Last Caress. A more modern example would be Cinema Strange's Greensward Grey (opens with some feedback or a bit of synth and then the bassline carries the song through) and Calabrese's Vampires Don't Exist (liberal use of guitar, powerful vocals).

Deathrock = Bass and Drums

Batcave = Bass and Synth

Horror Punk = Vocals and Guitar

I know Deathrock and Batcave are generally considered the same thing but I notice a difference in general sound between the two, deathrock having a faster tempo with a bit more guitar and batcave having a slower tempo and using synthesized effects, probably because of the rise of New Wave around that time period in Britain.

Well yeah, I meant guitar "leads" in the sense of playing high single notes instead of chords. The bass is definitely the only thing driving the song, other than the drums of course.

Interesting you should mention "Romeo's Distress," since the song right before it on Only Theatre of Pain, "Spiritual Cramp," has a lot of rhythm guitar and makes for a stark contrast.

[Super-Lawyer-Man-Man]

Akai Kenshi

infernal_sin

Akai Kenshi

Forgive me for asking a dumb question, but would it be fair to say that goth/death rock is in part characterized by the relatively sparse use of rhythm guitar? I was just listening to Christian Death and thinking about how stripped down it sounded, but then I realized that Bauhaus really doesn't use too much rhythm guitar either. It's mostly just leads, bass and drums.

Generally thats the defining difference between deathrock and horror punk. Deathrock and goth rock mostly use the guitar for effects like feedback or a bit of rythm while the bass is lead. When you think of great deathrock songs like Romeo's Distress (Christian Death) and Evil (.45 Grave) what most people remember aside from the lyrics is the awesome bass riff. Horror Punk bands focus on guitar and vocals, Misfits for example, you remember Danzig's vocals and the guitar riffs, notably on songs like We Are 138, Halloween, Die Die My Darling, Some Kind of Hate, and Last Caress. A more modern example would be Cinema Strange's Greensward Grey (opens with some feedback or a bit of synth and then the bassline carries the song through) and Calabrese's Vampires Don't Exist (liberal use of guitar, powerful vocals).

Deathrock = Bass and Drums

Batcave = Bass and Synth

Horror Punk = Vocals and Guitar

I know Deathrock and Batcave are generally considered the same thing but I notice a difference in general sound between the two, deathrock having a faster tempo with a bit more guitar and batcave having a slower tempo and using synthesized effects, probably because of the rise of New Wave around that time period in Britain.

Well yeah, I meant guitar "leads" in the sense of playing high single notes instead of chords. The bass is definitely the only thing driving the song, other than the drums of course.

Interesting you should mention "Romeo's Distress," since the song right before it on Only Theatre of Pain, "Spiritual Cramp," has a lot of rhythm guitar and makes for a stark contrast.

Yeah, I've sort of noticed Spiritual Cramp as different from most other Goth-Rock/Deathrock songs because of the high amounts of rhythm guitar. It's a bit weird but I think I like it more than a lot of other Christian Death songs because of it, even if it still isn't my favorite.

[Akai Kenshi]

Super-Lawyer-Man-Man

Yeah, I've sort of noticed Spiritual Cramp as different from most other Goth-Rock/Deathrock songs because of the high amounts of rhythm guitar. It's a bit weird but I think I like it more than a lot of other Christian Death songs because of it, even if it still isn't my favorite.

Oh, I love it, but I like a lot of hard rock too.

Unrelated: Is Gaiman on record saying that Robert Smith, Bowie, and Peter Murphy were inspirations for Dream's human form? The Wikipedia article seems to think that they were.

[Pein and Pleasure]

Super-Lawyer-Man-Man

Akai Kenshi

infernal_sin

Akai Kenshi

Forgive me for asking a dumb question, but would it be fair to say that goth/death rock is in part characterized by the relatively sparse use of rhythm guitar? I was just listening to Christian Death and thinking about how stripped down it sounded, but then I realized that Bauhaus really doesn't use too much rhythm guitar either. It's mostly just leads, bass and drums.

Generally thats the defining difference between deathrock and horror punk. Deathrock and goth rock mostly use the guitar for effects like feedback or a bit of rythm while the bass is lead. When you think of great deathrock songs like Romeo's Distress (Christian Death) and Evil (.45 Grave) what most people remember aside from the lyrics is the awesome bass riff. Horror Punk bands focus on guitar and vocals, Misfits for example, you remember Danzig's vocals and the guitar riffs, notably on songs like We Are 138, Halloween, Die Die My Darling, Some Kind of Hate, and Last Caress. A more modern example would be Cinema Strange's Greensward Grey (opens with some feedback or a bit of synth and then the bassline carries the song through) and Calabrese's Vampires Don't Exist (liberal use of guitar, powerful vocals).

Deathrock = Bass and Drums

Batcave = Bass and Synth

Horror Punk = Vocals and Guitar

I know Deathrock and Batcave are generally considered the same thing but I notice a difference in general sound between the two, deathrock having a faster tempo with a bit more guitar and batcave having a slower tempo and using synthesized effects, probably because of the rise of New Wave around that time period in Britain.

Well yeah, I meant guitar "leads" in the sense of playing high single notes instead of chords. The bass is definitely the only thing driving the song, other than the drums of course.

Interesting you should mention "Romeo's Distress," since the song right before it on Only Theatre of Pain, "Spiritual Cramp," has a lot of rhythm guitar and makes for a stark contrast.

Yeah, I've sort of noticed Spiritual Cramp as different from most other Goth-Rock/Deathrock songs because of the high amounts of rhythm guitar. It's a bit weird but I think I like it more than a lot of other Christian Death songs because of it, even if it still isn't my favorite.

I think thats because they weren't going for a defined sound, they basically made their own though I'm not sure if they meant to or not. They obviously didn't want to be constrained to a specific sound, almost everything changes from Only Theatre of Pain to the album Catastrophe Ballet, my friend Bert wasn't even sure if it was Rozz singing for awhile because he changed his vocal style almost entirely during that album which is more Batcave than Deathrock....of course it was created in Britain sooo...yeah. I think they just liked to experiment with whatever sounded good, I don't think Christian Death was trying to stick at one sound at all because if you've only got one fanbase you can only get so big or so good.

[Pein and Pleasure]

Akai Kenshi

Super-Lawyer-Man-Man

Yeah, I've sort of noticed Spiritual Cramp as different from most other Goth-Rock/Deathrock songs because of the high amounts of rhythm guitar. It's a bit weird but I think I like it more than a lot of other Christian Death songs because of it, even if it still isn't my favorite.

Oh, I love it, but I like a lot of hard rock too.

Unrelated: Is Gaiman on record saying that Robert Smith, Bowie, and Peter Murphy were inspirations for Dream's human form? The Wikipedia article seems to think that they were.

I never really seen any Sandman anywhere around here, but he does resemble Robert in the hair. I like Gaiman's books, especially Good Omens.

[A Kiss Goodbye]

Soulbutter

A Kiss Goodbye

My first show, though... Well, from the time I was born until I was 5 (and Jerry Garcia died) I would tour around America with my mom and The Grateful Dead.

I use to do that too, lol.

I don't recall this, but evidently I used to dance with the Spinners all the time.

Even without that memory, I loved that time of my life. It was magical, especially considering how young I was.

[Akai Kenshi]

infernal_sin

Akai Kenshi

Super-Lawyer-Man-Man

Yeah, I've sort of noticed Spiritual Cramp as different from most other Goth-Rock/Deathrock songs because of the high amounts of rhythm guitar. It's a bit weird but I think I like it more than a lot of other Christian Death songs because of it, even if it still isn't my favorite.

Oh, I love it, but I like a lot of hard rock too.

Unrelated: Is Gaiman on record saying that Robert Smith, Bowie, and Peter Murphy were inspirations for Dream's human form? The Wikipedia article seems to think that they were.

I never really seen any Sandman anywhere around here, but he does resemble Robert in the hair. I like Gaiman's books, especially Good Omens.

We were talking about Neil Gaiman a little bit earlier, about his compilation CD and his contributions to the goth scene.

[A Kiss Goodbye]

In response to the Christian Death discussion:

I don't know if Christian Death is a good band to use in deciphering the major differences between gothrock and deathrock. Rozz's projects and songs all varied so much from one another. I mean, compare Hour of the Wolf to Spiritual Cramp to Stairs to Romeo's Distress to Deathwish.

Then compare all of that to Shadow Project's entire From the Heart album.

I honestly always thought that gothrock and deathrock were very interchangable, at least via a few select groups. I mean, there will always be the obviously deathrock and obviously gothrock groups, but look at bands like Death Cult, Corpus Delecti, Christian Death, Siouxsie and the Banshees, etc. It's all very subjective.

[Super-Lawyer-Man-Man]

infernal_sin

Super-Lawyer-Man-Man

Akai Kenshi

infernal_sin

Akai Kenshi

Forgive me for asking a dumb question, but would it be fair to say that goth/death rock is in part characterized by the relatively sparse use of rhythm guitar? I was just listening to Christian Death and thinking about how stripped down it sounded, but then I realized that Bauhaus really doesn't use too much rhythm guitar either. It's mostly just leads, bass and drums.

Generally thats the defining difference between deathrock and horror punk. Deathrock and goth rock mostly use the guitar for effects like feedback or a bit of rythm while the bass is lead. When you think of great deathrock songs like Romeo's Distress (Christian Death) and Evil (.45 Grave) what most people remember aside from the lyrics is the awesome bass riff. Horror Punk bands focus on guitar and vocals, Misfits for example, you remember Danzig's vocals and the guitar riffs, notably on songs like We Are 138, Halloween, Die Die My Darling, Some Kind of Hate, and Last Caress. A more modern example would be Cinema Strange's Greensward Grey (opens with some feedback or a bit of synth and then the bassline carries the song through) and Calabrese's Vampires Don't Exist (liberal use of guitar, powerful vocals).

Deathrock = Bass and Drums

Batcave = Bass and Synth

Horror Punk = Vocals and Guitar

I know Deathrock and Batcave are generally considered the same thing but I notice a difference in general sound between the two, deathrock having a faster tempo with a bit more guitar and batcave having a slower tempo and using synthesized effects, probably because of the rise of New Wave around that time period in Britain.

Well yeah, I meant guitar "leads" in the sense of playing high single notes instead of chords. The bass is definitely the only thing driving the song, other than the drums of course.

Interesting you should mention "Romeo's Distress," since the song right before it on Only Theatre of Pain, "Spiritual Cramp," has a lot of rhythm guitar and makes for a stark contrast.

Yeah, I've sort of noticed Spiritual Cramp as different from most other Goth-Rock/Deathrock songs because of the high amounts of rhythm guitar. It's a bit weird but I think I like it more than a lot of other Christian Death songs because of it, even if it still isn't my favorite.

I think thats because they weren't going for a defined sound, they basically made their own though I'm not sure if they meant to or not. They obviously didn't want to be constrained to a specific sound, almost everything changes from Only Theatre of Pain to the album Catastrophe Ballet, my friend Bert wasn't even sure if it was Rozz singing for awhile because he changed his vocal style almost entirely during that album which is more Batcave than Deathrock....of course it was created in Britain sooo...yeah. I think they just liked to experiment with whatever sounded good, I don't think Christian Death was trying to stick at one sound at all because if you've only got one fanbase you can only get so big or so good.

Yes, I can agree that Christian Death was mostly based on trying individual sounds and finding what sounded best but they seem to have stuck with the same sound as a whole, bass and drums and in Rozz's case vocals as well. Most of the songs follow under these individual sounds but they try and use them differently in each song so it still makes Spiritual Cramp sound different from most of the others because of the prominent guitar instead of bass.

[GilAskan]

Akai Kenshi

Super-Lawyer-Man-Man

Yeah, I've sort of noticed Spiritual Cramp as different from most other Goth-Rock/Deathrock songs because of the high amounts of rhythm guitar. It's a bit weird but I think I like it more than a lot of other Christian Death songs because of it, even if it still isn't my favorite.

Oh, I love it, but I like a lot of hard rock too.

Unrelated: Is Gaiman on record saying that Robert Smith, Bowie, and Peter Murphy were inspirations for Dream's human form? The Wikipedia article seems to think that they were.

Having read the entire series myself, I'm pretty damn positive that Morpheus' is based on Gaiman himself. In fact, in volume two of the Sandman, Gaiman uses a doctored photograph of himself to represent Morpheus in Rose's dream sequence.

[Lucretia My Reflection]

GilAskan

Akai Kenshi

Super-Lawyer-Man-Man

Yeah, I've sort of noticed Spiritual Cramp as different from most other Goth-Rock/Deathrock songs because of the high amounts of rhythm guitar. It's a bit weird but I think I like it more than a lot of other Christian Death songs because of it, even if it still isn't my favorite.

Oh, I love it, but I like a lot of hard rock too.

Unrelated: Is Gaiman on record saying that Robert Smith, Bowie, and Peter Murphy were inspirations for Dream's human form? The Wikipedia article seems to think that they were.

Having read the entire series myself, I'm pretty damn positive that Morpheus' is based on Gaiman himself. In fact, in volume two of the Sandman, Gaiman uses a doctored photograph of himself to represent Morpheus in Rose's dream sequence.

But you can still also tell the influnces that other people have on the character, primarily people in Goth-Rock history.

[Ether-Eating Eskimo]

NO offense, really, but you are getting kinda off-topic. I just don't want the thread to be chatterboxed. :F

Sorry.

But erm... what is Sandman? rofl

Anyway, regarding my Sisters question... I have the song First and Last and Always and absolutely LOVE it. I also like Temple of Love a bit. First and Last and Always is one of my favorite songs ever though.