"War on Scientology" [NEW Articles and vids]

[Henry Dorsett Case]

UltraScreech

How can you have any opinion about it at all?

They cant be said to not believe it either. It goes both ways.

You're ignoring the difference between not having a belief in something and disbelieving in something. It's a big difference. Big semantics, strong juju. One has to know about something to disbelieve it. One does not have to know about something to not hold a belief in it. If one does not hold a belief, positive or negative, about something, one neither believes nor disbelieves that thing. Hence, it is accurate to say that those Scientologists who are not aware of the Xenu story hold neither a positive nor negative belief in it, and therefore it is valid to say that they do not believe it.

[the_faces]

Henry Dorsett Case

UltraScreech

How can you have any opinion about it at all?

They cant be said to not believe it either. It goes both ways.

You're ignoring the difference between not having a belief in something and disbelieving in something. It's a big difference. Big semantics, strong juju. One has to know about something to disbelieve it. One does not have to know about something to not hold a belief in it. If one does not hold a belief, positive or negative, about something, one neither believes nor disbelieves that thing. Hence, it is accurate to say that those Scientologists who are not aware of the Xenu story hold neither a positive nor negative belief in it, and therefore it is valid to say that they do not believe it.

The subject matter itself makes it kind of hard to hold a debate on this. It's kind of like blind belief. They believe in it because they're told to, even though they don't really KNOW what it is that they are supposed to be believing. The CoS is built on one standard rule, and that rule is "do as you're told, and don't ask questions."

[Henry Dorsett Case]

the_faces

The subject matter itself makes it kind of hard to hold a debate on this. It's kind of like blind belief. They believe in it because they're told to, even though they don't really KNOW what it is that they are supposed to be believing.

The point is that they cannot hold a belief specific to Xenu or the OT III story because they have not been exposed to either. That it is a foundation of their auditing up to this point is irrelevant; a Fellow Craft Mason cannot be said to hold a belief about the teachings of Master Masons or the Scottish Rite, because he has not experienced them, even though they are part of the reason behind his initiation and Masonic life to this point. The same goes for Scientology.

[Slutty_Eddie]

the_faces

Ok, fine, it's the belief that their religion is BASED off of. I'm sorry I worded it so poorly as to make you feel as though you had to write four paragraphs explaining how wrong I was.

I wrote those four paragraphs explaining how wrong you were NOT because I could triumph over poor wording.

I did it because those impressionable anonymouses who view that would be misinformed in 7 days when they confront IRL Scientologists. It's true that Scientology holds those views, but almost all the individuals Anonymous sees will not, they will be ENTIRELY oblivious to it and refuse to acknowledge it.

Information is free, but correct information is not. It's important for anonymous to know exactly what they're getting into. If I inform Anonymous only about "Zombie Jesus", when they confront real Christians, they will be unarmed and worse, they will be ineffective.

The truth is the only training that all Scientologists have is the ability to watch 2girls1cup while eating a sandwich, if anonymous is not strong enough to do so also, THEY WILL FAIL.

[the_faces]

Henry Dorsett Case

the_faces

The subject matter itself makes it kind of hard to hold a debate on this. It's kind of like blind belief. They believe in it because they're told to, even though they don't really KNOW what it is that they are supposed to be believing.

The point is that they cannot hold a belief specific to Xenu or the OT III story because they have not been exposed to either. That it is a foundation of their auditing up to this point is irrelevant; a Fellow Craft Mason cannot be said to hold a belief about the teachings of Master Masons or the Scottish Rite, because he has not experienced them, even though they are part of the reason behind his initiation and Masonic life to this point. The same goes for Scientology.

True, but you're not really getting what I was trying to say. I know they don't LITERALLY believe in OT III and Xenu, because, after all, how can someone believe in something they've never even heard of? I'm trying to say that followers of scientology basically start off believing in part of the full story of OT III. They just aren't given all the details. As they progress through the CoS's religious texts, they find out the full story, and once they're to the point of finding out about Xenu, they don't see it as all that crazy because they've already accepted part of the story as fact.

It's like if I told you that, a long time ago, there was a carpenter. You wouldn't find this to be all that wierd. Then I tell you that the carpenter was a very important man, a religious leader. Again, not that hard to believe. But then I tell you that this man was well known as a religious leader because he could do things that no other man could. This part is a little bit harder to swallow, but since I connected it to something you already see as fact, you might still accept it. Finally, I tell you that he could do these amazing things because he was the son of God. It's much easier to believe when you go about it in this way, rather than me just telling you the big reveal at the beginning.

[the_faces]

Slutty_Eddie

the_faces

Ok, fine, it's the belief that their religion is BASED off of. I'm sorry I worded it so poorly as to make you feel as though you had to write four paragraphs explaining how wrong I was.

I wrote those four paragraphs explaining how wrong you were NOT because I could triumph over poor wording.

I did it because those impressionable anonymouses who view that would be misinformed in 7 days when they confront IRL Scientologists. It's true that Scientology holds those views, but almost all the individuals Anonymous sees will not, they will be ENTIRELY oblivious to it and refuse to acknowledge it.

Information is free, but correct information is not. It's important for anonymous to know exactly what they're getting into. If I inform Anonymous only about "Zombie Jesus", when they confront real Christians, they will be unarmed and worse, they will be ineffective.

The truth is the only training that all Scientologists have is the ability to watch 2girls1cup while eating a sandwich, if anonymous is not strong enough to do so also, THEY WILL FAIL.

Ok, that makes sense. I was just a little peeved when I first read your response because I thought it was getting kind of technical. At any rate, I really hope that the majority of anon wouldn't be so dumb as to go into this without at least reading up on the CoS. Unfortunately, I don't think that's the case. Time will tell...

[Slutty_Eddie]

the_faces

I really hope that the majority of anon wouldn't be so dumb as to go into this without at least reading up on the CoS. Unfortunately, I don't think that's the case. Time will tell...

I don't think Anonymous will go totally uninformed, I'm just fearful that Anonymous will go in without preparing themselves for the counter-attack the CoS will have.

I'm quite afraid that when CoS counter-protesters come out and start screaming, "You *****, you rapists, you child molesters", that anonymous will be unprepared and do something they shouldn't do.

I'm also more afraid that the anonymouses that do try to retaliate will do so with something totally ineffective.

The CoS raid is "gaia-raid" big, and they will be VERY prepared.

[the_faces]

Slutty_Eddie

the_faces

I really hope that the majority of anon wouldn't be so dumb as to go into this without at least reading up on the CoS. Unfortunately, I don't think that's the case. Time will tell...

I don't think Anonymous will go totally uninformed, I'm just fearful that Anonymous will go in without preparing themselves for the counter-attack the CoS will have.

I'm quite afraid that when CoS counter-protesters come out and start screaming, "You *****, you rapists, you child molesters", that anonymous will be unprepared and do something they shouldn't do.

I'm also more afraid that the anonymouses that do try to retaliate will do so with something totally ineffective.

The CoS raid is "gaia-raid" big, and they will be VERY prepared.

The big problem is that a lot of anon will be going into this simply to try and get some kind of enjoyment out of it. While some of us really do see the CoS as a major threat, we're probably going to get pulled down along with the stupid ones who go into battle with nothing more than a pocket full of memes and a negative attitude.

One person does something stupid, thirty will suffer. I don't think it's a stretch to assume that at least one in thirty anon will do something stupid or illegal next sunday.

Also, just wondering, does it strike you as odd that anon seems to be in agreement that there is no way we could possibly take down something as big as gaia, and yet we continue to think that we stand a chance against an organized religion?

[Pseudo-Onkelos]

the_faces

One person does something stupid, thirty will suffer. I don't think it's a stretch to assume that at least one in thirty anon will do something stupid or illegal next sunday.

Anonymous, who has been keeping up on the recent video (Code of Conduct) provided by Anonymous should know what is expected from them.

the_faces

Also, just wondering, does it strike you as odd that anon seems to be in agreement that there is no way we could possibly take down something as big as gaia, and yet we continue to think that we stand a chance against an organized religion?

I don't know where you heard that from, but Gaia is not a threat.

[the_faces]

John Calvin

Anonymous, who has been keeping up on the recent video (Code of Conduct) provided by Anonymous should know what is expected from them.

Yes, but not all will follow. That's just the nature of anonymous. We don't all think alike, and there are going to be people who decide not to follow the guilelines, or people who get taken in by the Scientologists' attempts to arouse us.

John Calvin

I don't know where you heard that from, but Gaia is not a threat.

You misunderstood me. I'm not saying gaia is a threat. It's just that we've discussed raiding gaia several times, but have always decided against it, agreeing that we wouldn't be able to take down such a large website. I just find it amusing that anon doesn't think it can stand up against a website like gaia, but anon does think they can defeat an entire religion.

[Zeo Proctor]

the_faces

John Calvin

I don't know where you heard that from, but Gaia is not a threat.

You misunderstood me. I'm not saying gaia is a threat. It's just that we've discussed raiding gaia several times, but have always decided against it, agreeing that we wouldn't be able to take down such a large website. I just find it amusing that anon doesn't think it can stand up against a website like gaia, but anon does think they can defeat an entire religion.

Hasn't gaia been raided once before?

[Pseudo-Onkelos]

the_faces

Yes, but not all will follow. That's just the nature of anonymous. We don't all think alike, and there are going to be people who decide not to follow the guilelines, or people who get taken in by the Scientologists' attempts to arouse us.

If there are people who don't think that they'll be able to abide by the guidelines, then they shouldn't be there. That is what Anonymous clearly pointed out. They said that if you wish to do something stupid, save it for another day. This guideline already acts as a forewarning, as the notice was posted up just yesterday.

the_faces

You misunderstood me. I'm not saying gaia is a threat. It's just that we've discussed raiding gaia several times, but have always decided against it, agreeing that we wouldn't be able to take down such a large website. I just find it amusing that anon doesn't think it can stand up against a website like gaia, but anon does think they can defeat an entire religion.

I never said that you said that Gaia was a threat. Nevertheless, Anonymous will expose the gross human rights violations committed by the Church of Scientology. I don't know if you are even aware of this, because clearly, it doesn't seem like you are.

[the_faces]

Zeo Proctor

the_faces

John Calvin

I don't know where you heard that from, but Gaia is not a threat.

You misunderstood me. I'm not saying gaia is a threat. It's just that we've discussed raiding gaia several times, but have always decided against it, agreeing that we wouldn't be able to take down such a large website. I just find it amusing that anon doesn't think it can stand up against a website like gaia, but anon does think they can defeat an entire religion.

Hasn't gaia been raided once before?

Anon hasn't raided gaia as a whole, no. Anytime we've tried to raid Gaia it's been half-assed, as only one out of about four anon is dumb enough to think it's possible. And usually, the ones who do try give up shortly after they start.

[Henry Dorsett Case]

the_faces

Anon hasn't raided gaia as a whole, no. Anytime we've tried to raid Gaia it's been half-assed, as only one out of about four anon is dumb enough to think it's possible. And usually, the ones who do try give up shortly after they start.

I wonder if that 25% would change their minds if they came to realize that Gaia isn't just some website owned by a couple kids that skyrocketed out of control into some huge internet sensation, that Gaia has a financial backing bigger than Anonymous could hope to shell out...and that Gaia Interactive, Inc. refuses to worry about this website being raided.

[the_faces]

Henry Dorsett Case

the_faces

Anon hasn't raided gaia as a whole, no. Anytime we've tried to raid Gaia it's been half-assed, as only one out of about four anon is dumb enough to think it's possible. And usually, the ones who do try give up shortly after they start.

I wonder if that 25% would change their minds if they came to realize that Gaia isn't just some website owned by a couple kids that skyrocketed out of control into some huge internet sensation, that Gaia has a financial backing bigger than Anonymous could hope to shell out...and that Gaia Interactive, Inc. refuses to worry about this website being raided.

Most of the time they do change their minds after attempting to raid gaia. It's completely pointless and unnecessary to try.

John Calvin

If there are people who don't think that they'll be able to abide by the guidelines, then they shouldn't be there. That is what Anonymous clearly pointed out. They said that if you wish to do something stupid, save it for another day. This guideline already acts as a forewarning, as the notice was posted up just yesterday.

I am aware of what this notice said. But are you really stupid enough to think that that's going to stop anyone who might make a scene from coming?

John Calvin

I never said that you said that Gaia was a threat. Nevertheless, Anonymous will expose the gross human rights violations committed by the Church of Scientology. I don't know if you are even aware of this, because clearly, it doesn't seem like you are.

First off, the exact phrase was "I don't know where you heard that from, but Gaia is not a threat." I'm not really sure how else to take this, so please elaborate on what you meant.

Second, Scientology needs to be taken down. I agree with this. But thinking that anonymous will automatically win just by trying isn't practical. Also, accusing me of being unaware of the situation simply because I don't agree with you is ******** stupid. Please provide factual backings for your arguments from here on out, or kindly shut the ******** up.