Something new to think about.

[Lord Kronus]

garra_eyes

dragonmatt5

o i

However many people can be directed to new directions with discussion, so saying you cannot affect another beliefs is foolish. So can respond to logic, so can to fear, but many people can change their beliefs under the right situations.

Not to mention the fact that a belief as huge an as important as religion is likely not going to be made based on one argument or discussion. Granted, there may be one particular argument or discussion that kind of seals the deal and gets a convert to whatever religion, but chances are it's going to take a lot of different experiences to get someone to completely change their views on the origin of the universe, our purpose in life, and all the other big questions addressed by religion (not to mention all the small ones).

Sure, my discussion with an atheist my not give that person a burning desire to become Catholic. I don't expect it to. But I believe the teachings of the Catholic church are true and I believe that there is an ultimate truth out there. My goal is not to make people become Catholic. My goal is to open people up to the possibility of the "truth" presented by the Church. If it really is true and the people I'm talking to really re open to it, then yeah, they will eventually become Catholic. However, if they are open to accepting new things, but what I believe to be truth isn't really truth, they're not going to accept it and no harm done.

My arguments with people are not about what is or is not right or true. They're about what I believe to be right and true and about whether or not the person I'm talking to is even willing to consider my stance or if they plan to just ignore it.
Of course, this is all very idealistic and the difficulty comes when you turn this around.

I'll admit, there are some possibilities I am definately not open to. Maybe that will change with more prodding from individuals with those beliefs. Maybe not. I have no way of knowing. Maybe I believe in my truth simply because I am not open to the ultimate truth. Maybe there is no ultimate truth. I don't really know.

But that's kind of the tragedy of the human condition, isn't it. We can never really be sure of anything. All we can do is try to make sense of the world and try to help others do the same.

well i have to flat out disagree with you.

there is no ultimate purpose in life other than what evry other animal does. also i and most other aithisets don't care at all with what people believe is true, we belive in what is true. and what makes us different than a religious group is when new information becomes available then we will always change our minds if th new information contradicts or proves wrong something we thought was true before.
i am always open to new ideas and new discoveries

all the other questions that religion claims to answer are equally ridiculous and really only exist to attract people to them who are afraid don't know or are just plain stupid.

the reason i argue is because i want truth and not lies and slander that lead to pain suffering of others and slowign down science. all of which religion does.

[Lord Kronus]

bizarre cheshire

Lord Kronus

bizarre cheshire

Lord Kronus

bizarre cheshire

There are religions of the Left Hand Path that agree with this general concept. Just because something is a religion doesn't mean it's altruistic or believes in an afterlife of any sort.

but any relgion that belives in anything other than reality is a detriment to common sense and a fault of mankind. the only thing that works is aithism or teapot agnostic, eaplain later if you wish, since they mean common sense and a healthy understandign of reality

And there are religions that are atheistic or agnostic, which is what I was trying to point out to you.

I also have an incredibly difficult time reading what you're saying.

sorry xp

i have the tendency to not read my posts before i post them, i will try my best to do better.

anyways, then whats the point of calling them a religion. isn't it just a way of thinking that someone thought of putting a label on.

also what, if there's no god then it just seems silly, i mean even more silly.

The use of ritual and dogma. Dogma is not reserved for just the Right Hand ideas of theology. In a Left Hand religion, the dogma is in regards to the self instead of a deity.

Quote:

2: a doctrine or body of doctrines concerning faith or morals formally stated and authoritatively proclaimed by a church

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/dogma

In this case, it would be morals, not faith.

but there are no morals and faith is a terrible terrible thing, just saying.

all morals are is a colorful controlling word for common sense.

also why would aithiests need to right it down, it is common sense after all.

[Kinomi Kasuimiko]

What is the point? So, you mean, why is it so important?

Well, since one's beliefs are usually important, fundamental parts of their life, be they atheist, deist, monotheist, polytheist, etc, having to do with a moral code/standard code of what is good/bad right/wrong, when someone challenges that, it isn't something that many can easily brush off, especially when they are told what they believe in is an illusion, or that they are thinking the wrong thing, they are stupid, etc. Also, everybody likes walking through life thinking they and they alone are right and have the answer. Even agnostics sometimes feel compelled that the right answer is that there IS no right answer (contradictory statement?), so when someone tells them otherwise, they get angry/curious/confused/defensive/what have you. This goes for people from all walks of life of all different beliefs. We all want to be affirmed and approved of, not cut down and told we're wrong - therefore, some people will go about trying to shove their beliefs, no matter what they are, down the throats of others, or relentlessly argue/debate with people who may have little to no interest but to live their lives in peace, in order to hear that other person confess to them that their belief is right and true. Also, in certain faiths, you are told to openly discuss and spread knowledge about what you believe to others, so that is another reason why people discuss this topic so much.

It also matters because people have a lot of fears about the unknown - such as the condition after death, mortality, morality, the human condition, etc. People don't usually want many solutions to these issues - they want the ONE and only answer - the truth. Unfortunately, people don't agree on the truth, and it starts to get touchy when one person calls someone out to accuse them of believing in a lie, no matter what it is they believe. Whether their answer is that there IS no such thing as life after death, or that there is something there, for instance, the same void of the unknown and the unanswered question is being filled, or, at least they are attempting to fill it. Atheists and Theists alike - even Agnostics - don't like leaving questions unanswered. And since it is imperative to many that these particular questions have answered, you have an unending debate from all sides of the spectrum of different answers.

Hopefully, that made sense. So, no - the subjects of one's beliefs shouldn't be taken lightly, nor should one ever disrespect someone on the basis of their beliefs. Whether or not debates should ensue does depend on what you believe, but I see no reason to treat someone with less dignity than another, or to put a person down, just because they believe differently from you. It makes little sense from my perspective to do so.

[Kinomi Kasuimiko]

Oh, and Kronus -

With all due respect, honey catches more flies than vinegar.

I just thought I would put that out there, if such was your intention.

Edit: xd Oh noes! I'm a topic killer. Whoops!

[Lord Kronus]

Kinomi Kasuimiko

What is the point? So, you mean, why is it so important?

Well, since one's beliefs are usually important, fundamental parts of their life, be they atheist, deist, monotheist, polytheist, etc, having to do with a moral code/standard code of what is good/bad right/wrong, when someone challenges that, it isn't something that many can easily brush off, especially when they are told what they believe in is an illusion, or that they are thinking the wrong thing, they are stupid, etc. Also, everybody likes walking through life thinking they and they alone are right and have the answer. Even agnostics sometimes feel compelled that the right answer is that there IS no right answer (contradictory statement?), so when someone tells them otherwise, they get angry/curious/confused/defensive/what have you. This goes for people from all walks of life of all different beliefs. We all want to be affirmed and approved of, not cut down and told we're wrong - therefore, some people will go about trying to shove their beliefs, no matter what they are, down the throats of others, or relentlessly argue/debate with people who may have little to no interest but to live their lives in peace, in order to hear that other person confess to them that their belief is right and true. Also, in certain faiths, you are told to openly discuss and spread knowledge about what you believe to others, so that is another reason why people discuss this topic so much.

It also matters because people have a lot of fears about the unknown - such as the condition after death, mortality, morality, the human condition, etc. People don't usually want many solutions to these issues - they want the ONE and only answer - the truth. Unfortunately, people don't agree on the truth, and it starts to get touchy when one person calls someone out to accuse them of believing in a lie, no matter what it is they believe. Whether their answer is that there IS no such thing as life after death, or that there is something there, for instance, the same void of the unknown and the unanswered question is being filled, or, at least they are attempting to fill it. Atheists and Theists alike - even Agnostics - don't like leaving questions unanswered. And since it is imperative to many that these particular questions have answered, you have an unending debate from all sides of the spectrum of different answers.

Hopefully, that made sense. So, no - the subjects of one's beliefs shouldn't be taken lightly, nor should one ever disrespect someone on the basis of their beliefs. Whether or not debates should ensue does depend on what you believe, but I see no reason to treat someone with less dignity than another, or to put a person down, just because they believe differently from you. It makes little sense from my perspective to do so.

mostly true and i do agree on most of your points but i have to argue one. Atheists are fine with the concept of the unknown, we do not run away from something unknown, or make something up and sit happily with it, as most if not all religions do. We try to solve the problem and figure out how things work and why thing happen. we deal in truth nothign else, unfortunately this puts us in a weird place among the large groups of people who deal in delusion, because that is what religion all religion is a delusion. i am sorry but that is the truth.

[Lord Kronus]

Kinomi Kasuimiko

Oh, and Kronus -

With all due respect, honey catches more flies than vinegar.

I just thought I would put that out there, if such was your intention.

Edit: xd Oh noes! I'm a topic killer. Whoops!

i am not trying to attract people. i am trying to teach them a valuable lesson, to not fall into a way of thinking that i damaging to them adn everyone they come into contact with. so strong rich flavored vinegar is what i am going to use, since quite honestly we have been using honey far too long. if we had had the guts to step up and really talk about the issiues a long time ago instead of suger coating everything then we'd not be in the situation we are today.

[bizarre cheshire]

Lord Kronus

Kinomi Kasuimiko

What is the point? So, you mean, why is it so important?

Well, since one's beliefs are usually important, fundamental parts of their life, be they atheist, deist, monotheist, polytheist, etc, having to do with a moral code/standard code of what is good/bad right/wrong, when someone challenges that, it isn't something that many can easily brush off, especially when they are told what they believe in is an illusion, or that they are thinking the wrong thing, they are stupid, etc. Also, everybody likes walking through life thinking they and they alone are right and have the answer. Even agnostics sometimes feel compelled that the right answer is that there IS no right answer (contradictory statement?), so when someone tells them otherwise, they get angry/curious/confused/defensive/what have you. This goes for people from all walks of life of all different beliefs. We all want to be affirmed and approved of, not cut down and told we're wrong - therefore, some people will go about trying to shove their beliefs, no matter what they are, down the throats of others, or relentlessly argue/debate with people who may have little to no interest but to live their lives in peace, in order to hear that other person confess to them that their belief is right and true. Also, in certain faiths, you are told to openly discuss and spread knowledge about what you believe to others, so that is another reason why people discuss this topic so much.

It also matters because people have a lot of fears about the unknown - such as the condition after death, mortality, morality, the human condition, etc. People don't usually want many solutions to these issues - they want the ONE and only answer - the truth. Unfortunately, people don't agree on the truth, and it starts to get touchy when one person calls someone out to accuse them of believing in a lie, no matter what it is they believe. Whether their answer is that there IS no such thing as life after death, or that there is something there, for instance, the same void of the unknown and the unanswered question is being filled, or, at least they are attempting to fill it. Atheists and Theists alike - even Agnostics - don't like leaving questions unanswered. And since it is imperative to many that these particular questions have answered, you have an unending debate from all sides of the spectrum of different answers.

Hopefully, that made sense. So, no - the subjects of one's beliefs shouldn't be taken lightly, nor should one ever disrespect someone on the basis of their beliefs. Whether or not debates should ensue does depend on what you believe, but I see no reason to treat someone with less dignity than another, or to put a person down, just because they believe differently from you. It makes little sense from my perspective to do so.

mostly true and i do agree on most of your points but i have to argue one. Atheists are fine with the concept of the unknown, we do not run away from something unknown, or make something up and sit happily with it, as most if not all religions do. We try to solve the problem and figure out how things work and why thing happen. we deal in truth nothign else, unfortunately this puts us in a weird place among the large groups of people who deal in delusion, because that is what religion all religion is a delusion. i am sorry but that is the truth.

Then you do not understand what delusion is. Delusions are pathological.

[Lord Kronus]

bizarre cheshire

Lord Kronus

Kinomi Kasuimiko

What is the point? So, you mean, why is it so important?

Well, since one's beliefs are usually important, fundamental parts of their life, be they atheist, deist, monotheist, polytheist, etc, having to do with a moral code/standard code of what is good/bad right/wrong, when someone challenges that, it isn't something that many can easily brush off, especially when they are told what they believe in is an illusion, or that they are thinking the wrong thing, they are stupid, etc. Also, everybody likes walking through life thinking they and they alone are right and have the answer. Even agnostics sometimes feel compelled that the right answer is that there IS no right answer (contradictory statement?), so when someone tells them otherwise, they get angry/curious/confused/defensive/what have you. This goes for people from all walks of life of all different beliefs. We all want to be affirmed and approved of, not cut down and told we're wrong - therefore, some people will go about trying to shove their beliefs, no matter what they are, down the throats of others, or relentlessly argue/debate with people who may have little to no interest but to live their lives in peace, in order to hear that other person confess to them that their belief is right and true. Also, in certain faiths, you are told to openly discuss and spread knowledge about what you believe to others, so that is another reason why people discuss this topic so much.

It also matters because people have a lot of fears about the unknown - such as the condition after death, mortality, morality, the human condition, etc. People don't usually want many solutions to these issues - they want the ONE and only answer - the truth. Unfortunately, people don't agree on the truth, and it starts to get touchy when one person calls someone out to accuse them of believing in a lie, no matter what it is they believe. Whether their answer is that there IS no such thing as life after death, or that there is something there, for instance, the same void of the unknown and the unanswered question is being filled, or, at least they are attempting to fill it. Atheists and Theists alike - even Agnostics - don't like leaving questions unanswered. And since it is imperative to many that these particular questions have answered, you have an unending debate from all sides of the spectrum of different answers.

Hopefully, that made sense. So, no - the subjects of one's beliefs shouldn't be taken lightly, nor should one ever disrespect someone on the basis of their beliefs. Whether or not debates should ensue does depend on what you believe, but I see no reason to treat someone with less dignity than another, or to put a person down, just because they believe differently from you. It makes little sense from my perspective to do so.

mostly true and i do agree on most of your points but i have to argue one. Atheists are fine with the concept of the unknown, we do not run away from something unknown, or make something up and sit happily with it, as most if not all religions do. We try to solve the problem and figure out how things work and why thing happen. we deal in truth nothign else, unfortunately this puts us in a weird place among the large groups of people who deal in delusion, because that is what religion all religion is a delusion. i am sorry but that is the truth.

Then you do not understand what delusion is. Delusions are pathological.

Delusion
a.something that is falsely or delusively believed or propagated b: a persistent false psychotic belief regarding the self or persons or objects outside the self that is maintained despite indisputable evidence to the contrary ; also : the abnormal state marked by such beliefs

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/delusion

it perfectly defines religion in every way.

[bizarre cheshire]

Lord Kronus

bizarre cheshire

Lord Kronus

Kinomi Kasuimiko

What is the point? So, you mean, why is it so important?

Well, since one's beliefs are usually important, fundamental parts of their life, be they atheist, deist, monotheist, polytheist, etc, having to do with a moral code/standard code of what is good/bad right/wrong, when someone challenges that, it isn't something that many can easily brush off, especially when they are told what they believe in is an illusion, or that they are thinking the wrong thing, they are stupid, etc. Also, everybody likes walking through life thinking they and they alone are right and have the answer. Even agnostics sometimes feel compelled that the right answer is that there IS no right answer (contradictory statement?), so when someone tells them otherwise, they get angry/curious/confused/defensive/what have you. This goes for people from all walks of life of all different beliefs. We all want to be affirmed and approved of, not cut down and told we're wrong - therefore, some people will go about trying to shove their beliefs, no matter what they are, down the throats of others, or relentlessly argue/debate with people who may have little to no interest but to live their lives in peace, in order to hear that other person confess to them that their belief is right and true. Also, in certain faiths, you are told to openly discuss and spread knowledge about what you believe to others, so that is another reason why people discuss this topic so much.

It also matters because people have a lot of fears about the unknown - such as the condition after death, mortality, morality, the human condition, etc. People don't usually want many solutions to these issues - they want the ONE and only answer - the truth. Unfortunately, people don't agree on the truth, and it starts to get touchy when one person calls someone out to accuse them of believing in a lie, no matter what it is they believe. Whether their answer is that there IS no such thing as life after death, or that there is something there, for instance, the same void of the unknown and the unanswered question is being filled, or, at least they are attempting to fill it. Atheists and Theists alike - even Agnostics - don't like leaving questions unanswered. And since it is imperative to many that these particular questions have answered, you have an unending debate from all sides of the spectrum of different answers.

Hopefully, that made sense. So, no - the subjects of one's beliefs shouldn't be taken lightly, nor should one ever disrespect someone on the basis of their beliefs. Whether or not debates should ensue does depend on what you believe, but I see no reason to treat someone with less dignity than another, or to put a person down, just because they believe differently from you. It makes little sense from my perspective to do so.

mostly true and i do agree on most of your points but i have to argue one. Atheists are fine with the concept of the unknown, we do not run away from something unknown, or make something up and sit happily with it, as most if not all religions do. We try to solve the problem and figure out how things work and why thing happen. we deal in truth nothign else, unfortunately this puts us in a weird place among the large groups of people who deal in delusion, because that is what religion all religion is a delusion. i am sorry but that is the truth.

Then you do not understand what delusion is. Delusions are pathological.

Delusion
something that is falsely or delusively believed or propagated b: a persistent false psychotic belief regarding the self or persons or objects outside the self that is maintained despite indisputable evidence to the contrary ; also : the abnormal state marked by such beliefs

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/delusion

it perfectly defines religion in every way.

No, it doesn't. Take a look at the definition of psychotic. It means affected by psychosis.

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/psychotic

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psychosis

Can you prove that there are pathological connections between psychiatric delusion and religion?

[Lord Kronus]

bizarre cheshire

Lord Kronus

bizarre cheshire

Lord Kronus

Kinomi Kasuimiko

What is the point? So, you mean, why is it so important?

Well, since one's beliefs are usually important, fundamental parts of their life, be they atheist, deist, monotheist, polytheist, etc, having to do with a moral code/standard code of what is good/bad right/wrong, when someone challenges that, it isn't something that many can easily brush off, especially when they are told what they believe in is an illusion, or that they are thinking the wrong thing, they are stupid, etc. Also, everybody likes walking through life thinking they and they alone are right and have the answer. Even agnostics sometimes feel compelled that the right answer is that there IS no right answer (contradictory statement?), so when someone tells them otherwise, they get angry/curious/confused/defensive/what have you. This goes for people from all walks of life of all different beliefs. We all want to be affirmed and approved of, not cut down and told we're wrong - therefore, some people will go about trying to shove their beliefs, no matter what they are, down the throats of others, or relentlessly argue/debate with people who may have little to no interest but to live their lives in peace, in order to hear that other person confess to them that their belief is right and true. Also, in certain faiths, you are told to openly discuss and spread knowledge about what you believe to others, so that is another reason why people discuss this topic so much.

It also matters because people have a lot of fears about the unknown - such as the condition after death, mortality, morality, the human condition, etc. People don't usually want many solutions to these issues - they want the ONE and only answer - the truth. Unfortunately, people don't agree on the truth, and it starts to get touchy when one person calls someone out to accuse them of believing in a lie, no matter what it is they believe. Whether their answer is that there IS no such thing as life after death, or that there is something there, for instance, the same void of the unknown and the unanswered question is being filled, or, at least they are attempting to fill it. Atheists and Theists alike - even Agnostics - don't like leaving questions unanswered. And since it is imperative to many that these particular questions have answered, you have an unending debate from all sides of the spectrum of different answers.

Hopefully, that made sense. So, no - the subjects of one's beliefs shouldn't be taken lightly, nor should one ever disrespect someone on the basis of their beliefs. Whether or not debates should ensue does depend on what you believe, but I see no reason to treat someone with less dignity than another, or to put a person down, just because they believe differently from you. It makes little sense from my perspective to do so.

mostly true and i do agree on most of your points but i have to argue one. Atheists are fine with the concept of the unknown, we do not run away from something unknown, or make something up and sit happily with it, as most if not all religions do. We try to solve the problem and figure out how things work and why thing happen. we deal in truth nothign else, unfortunately this puts us in a weird place among the large groups of people who deal in delusion, because that is what religion all religion is a delusion. i am sorry but that is the truth.

Then you do not understand what delusion is. Delusions are pathological.

Delusion
something that is falsely or delusively believed or propagated b: a persistent false psychotic belief regarding the self or persons or objects outside the self that is maintained despite indisputable evidence to the contrary ; also : the abnormal state marked by such beliefs

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/delusion

it perfectly defines religion in every way.

No, it doesn't. Take a look at the definition of psychotic. It means affected by psychosis.

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/psychotic

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psychosis

Can you prove that there are pathological connections between psychiatric delusion and religion?

you are depertly trying to twist words aren't you, fine, i was using it as more of a comparison not a literal definition, i am sorry.

heres what i difine religion as..

a. something that is falsely or delusively believed or propagated b: a persistent false belief regarding the self or persons or objects outside the self that is maintained despite indisputable evidence to the contrary ; also : the abnormal state marked by such beliefs

still works fine if we leave in the bit about phycosis since it is difined as

fundamental derangement of the mind (as in schizophrenia) characterized by defective or lost contact with reality especially as evidenced by delusions, hallucinations, and disorganized speech and behavior

and that seems to work rather well with religious state of mind but please use whichever makes ou happy.

[l i t h i u m b l o o m]

Kronus: Can you prove that all religions are completely false? You can't prove god/gods doesn't/don't exist, so that part's out. As morality isn't objective, you can't prove those parts false. Really, you're only left with those religions which make false statements about the observable world that must be taken literally, and there aren't a whole lot of those.

[Lord Kronus]

l i t h i u m b l o o m

Kronus: Can you prove that all religions are completely false? You can't prove god/gods doesn't/don't exist, so that part's out. As morality isn't objective, you can't prove those parts false. Really, you're only left with those religions which make false statements about the observable world that must be taken literally, and there aren't a whole lot of those.

the burden of proof is not mine my friend it belongs to all of you. you all have to prove that god exists, or else it/she/he whatever doesn't, you have to prove that an afterlife exists or it doesn't. you have to prove that things written in the gospels or dogmas of various religions actually happened, or they didn't. unless something is reinforced by evidence or proven by facts then it is not true or doesn't exist.

at this particular moment not a single religion has doesn't this so yes they are as of now all false. period.

as far as morality goes, for the most part it is inherent by our evolution, i will explain more if you wish or go back a few posts and i think i already had.

and finally there are a lot of contradictions and a lot of terrible things religion already does. think about it.

[Wumbo Ragamuffin]

Lord Kronus

all the other questions that religion claims to answer are equally ridiculous and really only exist to attract people to them who are afraid don't know or are just plain stupid.

Proof for both statements please. Thanks in advance.

Quote:

the reason i argue is because i want truth and not lies and slander that lead to pain suffering of others and slowing down science. all of which religion does.

Proof that the mere concept of religion leads to pain, suffering, impediment of science, and that all of it is lies and slander. Those are some pretty big claims sir!
Also, your definition of religion is blatantly biased, and only begs the question.
I would also ask, that you try a bit more to make sure that your spelling and grammar is correct. a mistake here and there is OK, but some of your posts are a little hard to read for us ED regulars who have certain medical problems. Thanks again in advance.

[bizarre cheshire]

Wumbo Ragamuffin

Lord Kronus

all the other questions that religion claims to answer are equally ridiculous and really only exist to attract people to them who are afraid don't know or are just plain stupid.

Proof for both statements please. Thanks in advance.

Quote:

the reason i argue is because i want truth and not lies and slander that lead to pain suffering of others and slowing down science. all of which religion does.

Proof that the mere concept of religion leads to pain, suffering, impediment of science, and that all of it is lies and slander. Those are some pretty big claims sir!
Also, your definition of religion is blatantly biased, and only begs the question.
I would also ask, that you try a bit more to make sure that your spelling and grammar is correct. a mistake here and there is OK, but some of your posts are a little hard to read for us ED regulars who have certain medical problems. Thanks again in advance.

That's because his definition for religion is just the definition for delusion from Merriem-Webster with a different word attached.

[l i t h i u m b l o o m]

Lord Kronus

the burden of proof is not mine my friend it belongs to all of you. you all have to prove that god exists, or else it/she/he whatever doesn't, you have to prove that an afterlife exists or it doesn't. you have to prove that things written in the gospels or dogmas of various religions actually happened, or they didn't. unless something is reinforced by evidence or proven by facts then it is not true or doesn't exist.

No, that's not the way it works. You were the first one in this thread to state god doesn't exist. If we could pull claims from anywhere, no one would ever have to prove anything because there's undoubtedly someone who's made a claim contrary to yours previously. If you state, "God does not exist", you must prove it or look like an idiot for stating something you can't prove.

Quote:

at this particular moment not a single religion has doesn't this so yes they are as of now all false. period.

Yes, because all religions include both an afterlife and deity rolleyes

Quote:

as far as morality goes, for the most part it is inherent by our evolution, i will explain more if you wish or go back a few posts and i think i already had.

Really? So I evolved to think I can do pretty much whatever I want to? People of other religions evolved to think harming any living thing is horrible, despite the fact that such sentiments would have resulted in our ancestors going extinct? Your argument vaguely works when speaking of morality in general, but not when it comes to moral codes imposed by religions.

Quote:

and finally there are a lot of contradictions and a lot of terrible things religion already does. think about it.

Contradictions? Where? Name a contradiction from each and every religion. And what terrible things? Wars? Oh, I'm sorry, those are started over resources, politics, land, and us being the aggressive creatures we are. Religion is only a rallying cry. Atrocities? Oh, that's right. Most of the time, if they are truly religiously-motivated, it's due to a misunderstanding of religious text and is only perpetrated by the most extreme and otherwise idiotic of people, the sort who would do horrible things even if they were non-religious. So, what "horrible things" are you talking about?

Nevermind that bad /=/ false.