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sure. I hope that isn't 4th edition, though...

Whatever editions work are fine with me. I saw something about those but I was like 'Damn, this must be referring to the different story prompts. Don't have one of those so ******** it I'm just gonna wing this.' And so I did, and still don't know what editions do. emotion_awesome


goody. well, I can help you with a 3.5e Character. smile PM me some background info, personality and a picture.

Woo hoo~! I will get to that, thou probably on Thursday because that's when I'll have the most time to get everything together with the half day of classes and all.

And I can use the same one for multiple editions, right? Because I found out literally just today that I have a friend who plays, but the catch is they have the 4th edition. Words cannot describe how sure I was that if I could have seen it, the universe had rearranged itself for a moment into one big troll face. Seriously. gonk


for your sanity and soul, I implore you to avoid that 4the game.... eek

What's so torturous about it, dare I ask? burning_eyes


lack of suspension of disbelief, plus it's more of a simplified tactical game than a Tabletop RPG..... think WoW but with dice and figurines....
I never really viewed the idea of light and dark side as a philosophical view more than a religious one. And if anyone ever played KOTOR2, you'll know that the concept is very deep and complicated.
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I never really viewed the idea of light and dark side as a philosophical view more than a religious one. And if anyone ever played KOTOR2, you'll know that the concept is very deep and complicated.

Whether or not it is deep and complicated all depends on definition and interpretation. If you define "Dark Side" as anything evil and destructive then many Sith Realists actually become light siders because, although they may refer to it as the "dark side" their intention is not evil nor destructive. Their goals are, in fact, very similar to the Jedi counterpart.

If you interpret something as light or dark based on intention then you have a very simple view. Is the intention good? Yes? Light side. Is the intention bad? Yes? Dark side. Good intention could be giving money to a beggar, your hope is that he will be able to eat and as such it is a light side act, so even if he gets mugged later your action was still "light side." If you refuse to give him money because you know it will cost him his life, that too is light side. If you refuse out of greed or agree to give the money so he'll die, that's dark side.

The complication and deepness comes in from lack of understanding and great understanding of different perspectives, opinions, and definitions, all clashing. In some cases a child may have a better understanding of the difference between light and dark sides than an adult because they don't complicate it. In some cases a child can't have a better understanding than an adult until/unless they can connect to and understand the Force.
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I never really viewed the idea of light and dark side as a philosophical view more than a religious one. And if anyone ever played KOTOR2, you'll know that the concept is very deep and complicated.

Whether or not it is deep and complicated all depends on definition and interpretation. If you define "Dark Side" as anything evil and destructive then many Sith Realists actually become light siders because, although they may refer to it as the "dark side" their intention is not evil nor destructive. Their goals are, in fact, very similar to the Jedi counterpart.

If you interpret something as light or dark based on intention then you have a very simple view. Is the intention good? Yes? Light side. Is the intention bad? Yes? Dark side. Good intention could be giving money to a beggar, your hope is that he will be able to eat and as such it is a light side act, so even if he gets mugged later your action was still "light side." If you refuse to give him money because you know it will cost him his life, that too is light side. If you refuse out of greed or agree to give the money so he'll die, that's dark side.

The complication and deepness comes in from lack of understanding and great understanding of different perspectives, opinions, and definitions, all clashing. In some cases a child may have a better understanding of the difference between light and dark sides than an adult because they don't complicate it. In some cases a child can't have a better understanding than an adult until/unless they can connect to and understand the Force.

You essentially took the concept right from the second KOTOR. If you are charitable, does that mean it goes to good? Maybe the man gets mugged as you say (Completely ripped off of the game for that matter), he could use it for evil things or he could be lazy with it. I really don't view the dark side as an evil side to chose. If I had to compare it, I would compare it the the American republican. It can range anywhere from true independence and thriving to being so evil as to sending soldiers to die just so you can afford to buy 20 more mansions that you'll never use. But in the end, it is by no means black and white.
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goody. well, I can help you with a 3.5e Character. smile PM me some background info, personality and a picture.

Woo hoo~! I will get to that, thou probably on Thursday because that's when I'll have the most time to get everything together with the half day of classes and all.

And I can use the same one for multiple editions, right? Because I found out literally just today that I have a friend who plays, but the catch is they have the 4th edition. Words cannot describe how sure I was that if I could have seen it, the universe had rearranged itself for a moment into one big troll face. Seriously. gonk


for your sanity and soul, I implore you to avoid that 4the game.... eek

What's so torturous about it, dare I ask? burning_eyes


lack of suspension of disbelief, plus it's more of a simplified tactical game than a Tabletop RPG..... think WoW but with dice and figurines....

Oh dear, that sounds tragic, and definitely more tedious. gonk
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I never really viewed the idea of light and dark side as a philosophical view more than a religious one. And if anyone ever played KOTOR2, you'll know that the concept is very deep and complicated.

Whether or not it is deep and complicated all depends on definition and interpretation. If you define "Dark Side" as anything evil and destructive then many Sith Realists actually become light siders because, although they may refer to it as the "dark side" their intention is not evil nor destructive. Their goals are, in fact, very similar to the Jedi counterpart.

If you interpret something as light or dark based on intention then you have a very simple view. Is the intention good? Yes? Light side. Is the intention bad? Yes? Dark side. Good intention could be giving money to a beggar, your hope is that he will be able to eat and as such it is a light side act, so even if he gets mugged later your action was still "light side." If you refuse to give him money because you know it will cost him his life, that too is light side. If you refuse out of greed or agree to give the money so he'll die, that's dark side.

The complication and deepness comes in from lack of understanding and great understanding of different perspectives, opinions, and definitions, all clashing. In some cases a child may have a better understanding of the difference between light and dark sides than an adult because they don't complicate it. In some cases a child can't have a better understanding than an adult until/unless they can connect to and understand the Force.

You essentially took the concept right from the second KOTOR. If you are charitable, does that mean it goes to good? Maybe the man gets mugged as you say (Completely ripped off of the game for that matter), he could use it for evil things or he could be lazy with it. I really don't view the dark side as an evil side to chose. If I had to compare it, I would compare it the the American republican. It can range anywhere from true independence and thriving to being so evil as to sending soldiers to die just so you can afford to buy 20 more mansions that you'll never use. But in the end, it is by no means black and white.


I'm aware my example was ripped from the game. That was intentional. Since you mentioned it I thought it would be a good one, but I'm not entirely sure if you caught my point. My point was that it may end at intention. If you intend to do good and attempt to do so it is a light side act. If you intend to do bad and attempt to do so it is a dark side act.

The American Republican may send those soldiers to war because he feels it is the right thing to do, in which case it is a light side act. In the same war a Republican may agree to send those troops into battle for personal profit, thus a dark side act. On the flip side, let's say a Democrat protests the war only because he is not profiting, that would also be a dark side act. If the Democrat protests the soldiers being sent because, regardless of the cause, he believes war is wrong and desires peace than it is a light side act.

In truth it may not be black and white. Personally I don't really believe in a light or dark side at all. To me there is simply The Force. It's how we use it that matters. It's how we behave and what we intend to do which determines the difference between light and dark, good or evil.
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Well, being a Jedi myself I would have to say I'm not much into Sith Realism. Its a perfectly respectable path for those drawn to it, however.
Chieftain Twilight's avatar

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goody. well, I can help you with a 3.5e Character. smile PM me some background info, personality and a picture.

Woo hoo~! I will get to that, thou probably on Thursday because that's when I'll have the most time to get everything together with the half day of classes and all.

And I can use the same one for multiple editions, right? Because I found out literally just today that I have a friend who plays, but the catch is they have the 4th edition. Words cannot describe how sure I was that if I could have seen it, the universe had rearranged itself for a moment into one big troll face. Seriously. gonk


for your sanity and soul, I implore you to avoid that 4the game.... eek

What's so torturous about it, dare I ask? burning_eyes


lack of suspension of disbelief, plus it's more of a simplified tactical game than a Tabletop RPG..... think WoW but with dice and figurines....

Oh dear, that sounds tragic, and definitely more tedious. gonk


sad but true.... iii-_-
Chieftain Twilight's avatar

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Well, being a Jedi myself I would have to say I'm not much into Sith Realism. Its a perfectly respectable path for those drawn to it, however.


would you be willing to talk to us more about Jediism? smile
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for your sanity and soul, I implore you to avoid that 4the game.... eek

What's so torturous about it, dare I ask? burning_eyes


lack of suspension of disbelief, plus it's more of a simplified tactical game than a Tabletop RPG..... think WoW but with dice and figurines....

Oh dear, that sounds tragic, and definitely more tedious. gonk


sad but true.... iii-_-

Indeed...and on a somewhat related note, aren't there character sheets to fill out and whatnot? Do they change based on the edition? I've seen people with them before, but I've not actually used one. I've been trying to make heads or tails of them lately because I figure I'll need them to document my skills and things, hence my taking forever to respond to the PM, haha.

Given their intimidating look however, I'll probably need a bit of help there as well. XD
Chieftain Twilight's avatar

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I never really viewed the idea of light and dark side as a philosophical view more than a religious one. And if anyone ever played KOTOR2, you'll know that the concept is very deep and complicated.

Whether or not it is deep and complicated all depends on definition and interpretation. If you define "Dark Side" as anything evil and destructive then many Sith Realists actually become light siders because, although they may refer to it as the "dark side" their intention is not evil nor destructive. Their goals are, in fact, very similar to the Jedi counterpart.

If you interpret something as light or dark based on intention then you have a very simple view. Is the intention good? Yes? Light side. Is the intention bad? Yes? Dark side. Good intention could be giving money to a beggar, your hope is that he will be able to eat and as such it is a light side act, so even if he gets mugged later your action was still "light side." If you refuse to give him money because you know it will cost him his life, that too is light side. If you refuse out of greed or agree to give the money so he'll die, that's dark side.

The complication and deepness comes in from lack of understanding and great understanding of different perspectives, opinions, and definitions, all clashing. In some cases a child may have a better understanding of the difference between light and dark sides than an adult because they don't complicate it. In some cases a child can't have a better understanding than an adult until/unless they can connect to and understand the Force.

You essentially took the concept right from the second KOTOR. If you are charitable, does that mean it goes to good? Maybe the man gets mugged as you say (Completely ripped off of the game for that matter), he could use it for evil things or he could be lazy with it. I really don't view the dark side as an evil side to chose. If I had to compare it, I would compare it the the American republican. It can range anywhere from true independence and thriving to being so evil as to sending soldiers to die just so you can afford to buy 20 more mansions that you'll never use. But in the end, it is by no means black and white.


I'm aware my example was ripped from the game. That was intentional. Since you mentioned it I thought it would be a good one, but I'm not entirely sure if you caught my point. My point was that it may end at intention. If you intend to do good and attempt to do so it is a light side act. If you intend to do bad and attempt to do so it is a dark side act.

The American Republican may send those soldiers to war because he feels it is the right thing to do, in which case it is a light side act. In the same war a Republican may agree to send those troops into battle for personal profit, thus a dark side act. On the flip side, let's say a Democrat protests the war only because he is not profiting, that would also be a dark side act. If the Democrat protests the soldiers being sent because, regardless of the cause, he believes war is wrong and desires peace than it is a light side act.

In truth it may not be black and white. Personally I don't really believe in a light or dark side at all. To me there is simply The Force. It's how we use it that matters. It's how we behave and what we intend to do which determines the difference between light and dark, good or evil.


I would think that there is no Light Side or Dark Side either, but neither do our intentions or actions fall into Good or Evil, Light Side or Dark Side. leastways not in the definitions that people have as standards.

see, I believe that all moral statements are merely statements of emotion. you call something bad, wrong or evil because you don't like it, or because you feel squicky about it. but The Force doesn't give a rat's a** about whether it is "right" or "wrong". those definitions are meaningless to the cosmos.

in the end, Evil is a subjective term relative to what one deems malevolent and Good is a subjective term relative to what one deems benevolent.

the concept fewer people tend to discuss is the difference between Lawful and Chaotic on teh Alignment Scale (a system not even present in Star Wars). Lawful Alignments tend to view morality as dependent on imposed Order and Structure. rigid rules prevent disaster and thereby bring prosperity to all (or leastways to a majority), making it righteous. you could be Lawful Good or Lawful Evil and still have the same basic idea of what's right.

however, a Chaotic Alignment is one who values freedom and dynamic energies. they understand that the Universe is kept in balance by way of change, destruction, death, violence, passion and conflict. they know that the Natural Order is Chaos itself. Trickster Gods, such as Loki or Coyote or even Eris -- there many others of course -- are often viewed as unrecognized heroes by Chaotic Alignments. Discord from MLP:FiM is one good example. without the antics of the Trickster Gods (the disasters of the world) the goodness not only has no meaning but also cannot become better.

in fact, the HIndu Religion worships Shiva, Lord of Destruction, as one of the highest Gods because of this very concept of Chaos being the Natural Order. it keeps the natural cycles going.

Order without Chaos is stagnant, and therefore cannot exist let alone thrive.
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for your sanity and soul, I implore you to avoid that 4the game.... eek

What's so torturous about it, dare I ask? burning_eyes


lack of suspension of disbelief, plus it's more of a simplified tactical game than a Tabletop RPG..... think WoW but with dice and figurines....

Oh dear, that sounds tragic, and definitely more tedious. gonk


sad but true.... iii-_-

Indeed...and on a somewhat related note, aren't there character sheets to fill out and whatnot? Do they change based on the edition? I've seen people with them before, but I've not actually used one. I've been trying to make heads or tails of them lately because I figure I'll need them to document my skills and things, hence my taking forever to respond to the PM, haha.

Given their intimidating look however, I'll probably need a bit of help there as well. XD


yes, they change according to the edition. but you dodn't need a standardized Character Sheet. as long as the information is recorded for the character according to the edition that you play then any format is fine.

in short, just record the information and your character sheet is that information itself.
Lord Alucard Ere Casanova's avatar

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I never really viewed the idea of light and dark side as a philosophical view more than a religious one. And if anyone ever played KOTOR2, you'll know that the concept is very deep and complicated.

Whether or not it is deep and complicated all depends on definition and interpretation. If you define "Dark Side" as anything evil and destructive then many Sith Realists actually become light siders because, although they may refer to it as the "dark side" their intention is not evil nor destructive. Their goals are, in fact, very similar to the Jedi counterpart.

If you interpret something as light or dark based on intention then you have a very simple view. Is the intention good? Yes? Light side. Is the intention bad? Yes? Dark side. Good intention could be giving money to a beggar, your hope is that he will be able to eat and as such it is a light side act, so even if he gets mugged later your action was still "light side." If you refuse to give him money because you know it will cost him his life, that too is light side. If you refuse out of greed or agree to give the money so he'll die, that's dark side.

The complication and deepness comes in from lack of understanding and great understanding of different perspectives, opinions, and definitions, all clashing. In some cases a child may have a better understanding of the difference between light and dark sides than an adult because they don't complicate it. In some cases a child can't have a better understanding than an adult until/unless they can connect to and understand the Force.

You essentially took the concept right from the second KOTOR. If you are charitable, does that mean it goes to good? Maybe the man gets mugged as you say (Completely ripped off of the game for that matter), he could use it for evil things or he could be lazy with it. I really don't view the dark side as an evil side to chose. If I had to compare it, I would compare it the the American republican. It can range anywhere from true independence and thriving to being so evil as to sending soldiers to die just so you can afford to buy 20 more mansions that you'll never use. But in the end, it is by no means black and white.


I'm aware my example was ripped from the game. That was intentional. Since you mentioned it I thought it would be a good one, but I'm not entirely sure if you caught my point. My point was that it may end at intention. If you intend to do good and attempt to do so it is a light side act. If you intend to do bad and attempt to do so it is a dark side act.

The American Republican may send those soldiers to war because he feels it is the right thing to do, in which case it is a light side act. In the same war a Republican may agree to send those troops into battle for personal profit, thus a dark side act. On the flip side, let's say a Democrat protests the war only because he is not profiting, that would also be a dark side act. If the Democrat protests the soldiers being sent because, regardless of the cause, he believes war is wrong and desires peace than it is a light side act.

In truth it may not be black and white. Personally I don't really believe in a light or dark side at all. To me there is simply The Force. It's how we use it that matters. It's how we behave and what we intend to do which determines the difference between light and dark, good or evil.


I would think that there is no Light Side or Dark Side either, but neither do our intentions or actions fall into Good or Evil, Light Side or Dark Side. leastways not in the definitions that people have as standards.

see, I believe that all moral statements are merely statements of emotion. you call something bad, wrong or evil because you don't like it, or because you feel squicky about it. but The Force doesn't give a rat's a** about whether it is "right" or "wrong". those definitions are meaningless to the cosmos.

in the end, Evil is a subjective term relative to what one deems malevolent and Good is a subjective term relative to what one deems benevolent.

the concept fewer people tend to discuss is the difference between Lawful and Chaotic on teh Alignment Scale (a system not even present in Star Wars). Lawful Alignments tend to view morality as dependent on imposed Order and Structure. rigid rules prevent disaster and thereby bring prosperity to all (or leastways to a majority), making it righteous. you could be Lawful Good or Lawful Evil and still have the same basic idea of what's right.

however, a Chaotic Alignment is one who values freedom and dynamic energies. they understand that the Universe is kept in balance by way of change, destruction, death, violence, passion and conflict. they know that the Natural Order is Chaos itself. Trickster Gods, such as Loki or Coyote or even Eris -- there many others of course -- are often viewed as unrecognized heroes by Chaotic Alignments. Discord from MLP:FiM is one good example. without the antics of the Trickster Gods (the disasters of the world) the goodness not only has no meaning but also cannot become better.

in fact, the HIndu Religion worships Shiva, Lord of Destruction, as one of the highest Gods because of this very concept of Chaos being the Natural Order. it keeps the natural cycles going.

Order without Chaos is stagnant, and therefore cannot exist let alone thrive.


I didn't realize I had spoken wrong until now. I said I don't believe in light or dark, but I believe in light and dark. Yeah, makes sense....

What I meant to imply is that our own judgement of our actions depicts their nature. If I do something and feel good about it I will call it a good act because I believed it was right. If I feel bad about something then we know it was wrong for the same reason. Nobody's judgement should matter aside from our own when deciding if we were right or wrong and our own feelings about our actions, be it guilt, shame, or pride, is perhaps the surest sign of whether it was right or wrong.

In that case I would call "good" actions the actions we can be proud of ourselves for, light side based on Star Wars based myth of good and evil. In the same way I would call the actions we feel guilty or ashamed of dark side or evil.

I also understand my use of terminology here is different from many others and "dark siders" or Sith realists are not evil. Neither do I believe any individual is inherently evil.

Now I remember why I got distracted from my last post... It is very hard to focus on typing while a baby is screaming. There's not even anything wrong with him, he just likes to scream. He'll scream while playing with his toys and then he'll laugh.
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I never really viewed the idea of light and dark side as a philosophical view more than a religious one. And if anyone ever played KOTOR2, you'll know that the concept is very deep and complicated.

Whether or not it is deep and complicated all depends on definition and interpretation. If you define "Dark Side" as anything evil and destructive then many Sith Realists actually become light siders because, although they may refer to it as the "dark side" their intention is not evil nor destructive. Their goals are, in fact, very similar to the Jedi counterpart.

If you interpret something as light or dark based on intention then you have a very simple view. Is the intention good? Yes? Light side. Is the intention bad? Yes? Dark side. Good intention could be giving money to a beggar, your hope is that he will be able to eat and as such it is a light side act, so even if he gets mugged later your action was still "light side." If you refuse to give him money because you know it will cost him his life, that too is light side. If you refuse out of greed or agree to give the money so he'll die, that's dark side.

The complication and deepness comes in from lack of understanding and great understanding of different perspectives, opinions, and definitions, all clashing. In some cases a child may have a better understanding of the difference between light and dark sides than an adult because they don't complicate it. In some cases a child can't have a better understanding than an adult until/unless they can connect to and understand the Force.

You essentially took the concept right from the second KOTOR. If you are charitable, does that mean it goes to good? Maybe the man gets mugged as you say (Completely ripped off of the game for that matter), he could use it for evil things or he could be lazy with it. I really don't view the dark side as an evil side to chose. If I had to compare it, I would compare it the the American republican. It can range anywhere from true independence and thriving to being so evil as to sending soldiers to die just so you can afford to buy 20 more mansions that you'll never use. But in the end, it is by no means black and white.


I'm aware my example was ripped from the game. That was intentional. Since you mentioned it I thought it would be a good one, but I'm not entirely sure if you caught my point. My point was that it may end at intention. If you intend to do good and attempt to do so it is a light side act. If you intend to do bad and attempt to do so it is a dark side act.

The American Republican may send those soldiers to war because he feels it is the right thing to do, in which case it is a light side act. In the same war a Republican may agree to send those troops into battle for personal profit, thus a dark side act. On the flip side, let's say a Democrat protests the war only because he is not profiting, that would also be a dark side act. If the Democrat protests the soldiers being sent because, regardless of the cause, he believes war is wrong and desires peace than it is a light side act.

In truth it may not be black and white. Personally I don't really believe in a light or dark side at all. To me there is simply The Force. It's how we use it that matters. It's how we behave and what we intend to do which determines the difference between light and dark, good or evil.


I would think that there is no Light Side or Dark Side either, but neither do our intentions or actions fall into Good or Evil, Light Side or Dark Side. leastways not in the definitions that people have as standards.

see, I believe that all moral statements are merely statements of emotion. you call something bad, wrong or evil because you don't like it, or because you feel squicky about it. but The Force doesn't give a rat's a** about whether it is "right" or "wrong". those definitions are meaningless to the cosmos.

in the end, Evil is a subjective term relative to what one deems malevolent and Good is a subjective term relative to what one deems benevolent.

the concept fewer people tend to discuss is the difference between Lawful and Chaotic on teh Alignment Scale (a system not even present in Star Wars). Lawful Alignments tend to view morality as dependent on imposed Order and Structure. rigid rules prevent disaster and thereby bring prosperity to all (or leastways to a majority), making it righteous. you could be Lawful Good or Lawful Evil and still have the same basic idea of what's right.

however, a Chaotic Alignment is one who values freedom and dynamic energies. they understand that the Universe is kept in balance by way of change, destruction, death, violence, passion and conflict. they know that the Natural Order is Chaos itself. Trickster Gods, such as Loki or Coyote or even Eris -- there many others of course -- are often viewed as unrecognized heroes by Chaotic Alignments. Discord from MLP:FiM is one good example. without the antics of the Trickster Gods (the disasters of the world) the goodness not only has no meaning but also cannot become better.

in fact, the HIndu Religion worships Shiva, Lord of Destruction, as one of the highest Gods because of this very concept of Chaos being the Natural Order. it keeps the natural cycles going.

Order without Chaos is stagnant, and therefore cannot exist let alone thrive.


I didn't realize I had spoken wrong until now. I said I don't believe in light or dark, but I believe in light and dark. Yeah, makes sense....

What I meant to imply is that our own judgement of our actions depicts their nature. If I do something and feel good about it I will call it a good act because I believed it was right. If I feel bad about something then we know it was wrong for the same reason. Nobody's judgement should matter aside from our own when deciding if we were right or wrong and our own feelings about our actions, be it guilt, shame, or pride, is perhaps the surest sign of whether it was right or wrong.

In that case I would call "good" actions the actions we can be proud of ourselves for, light side based on Star Wars based myth of good and evil. In the same way I would call the actions we feel guilty or ashamed of dark side or evil.

I also understand my use of terminology here is different from many others and "dark siders" or Sith realists are not evil. Neither do I believe any individual is inherently evil.

Now I remember why I got distracted from my last post... It is very hard to focus on typing while a baby is screaming. There's not even anything wrong with him, he just likes to scream. He'll scream while playing with his toys and then he'll laugh.


babies are quite adorable, though they can be very annoying at times. ^_^ congratulations on your kid, my friend.

I will say that I like the idea of being responsible for one's own perceptions and decisions. always be true to yourself, that's key.
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