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When does a religious symbol cease to be the sum of its parts ex. two sticks, and become something much more?
What does this mean when applied to acts such as cross burning? are these acts sacreligious, or merely ignorant, or apathetic, to the meaning of such symbols to others?
Symbols are just that. symbols. They have significance and meaning to those who understand them, but no more value than what they are as art or materiels.

A church has a wooden cross, ususally, but they ascribe no actuall value to the cross... what is valuable is teh atonement it symbolifies.
AyanamiRei
Symbols are just that. symbols. They have significance and meaning to those who understand them, but no more value than what they are as art or materiels.

A church has a wooden cross, ususally, but they ascribe no actuall value to the cross... what is valuable is teh atonement it symbolifies.


Yeah I would have to agree here. The only reason symbols have significance is because people give them value and significance. Without that value, a symbol is meaningless.

It's rather interesting though, that cultures all around the world insist upon having symbols. In religion, politics, and so many other area- they make a statement. But how they were chosen to make that statement is a whole other history in its itself.
Bian_Isaura


Yeah I would have to agree here. The only reason symbols have significance is because people give them value and significance. Without that value, a symbol is meaningless.

It's rather interesting though, that cultures all around the world insist upon having symbols. In religion, politics, and so many other area- they make a statement. But how they were chosen to make that statement is a whole other history in its itself.

Symbols also cross language barriers, usually. You may not understand what some one is saying but a symbol can send a message that requires niether literacy nor comprehension of another language....

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Actually, as a pagan, I would have to say that symbols are more than just symbols. The act of having faith in them gives them a power

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sorry, meant to press preview, not submit

but that power is a psychological and spiritual power. Thus, only someone who believes in the symbol feels this power.
Fiddlers Green
Bian_Isaura


Yeah I would have to agree here. The only reason symbols have significance is because people give them value and significance. Without that value, a symbol is meaningless.

It's rather interesting though, that cultures all around the world insist upon having symbols. In religion, politics, and so many other area- they make a statement. But how they were chosen to make that statement is a whole other history in its itself.

Symbols also cross language barriers, usually. You may not understand what some one is saying but a symbol can send a message that requires niether literacy nor comprehension of another language....


That's what I was about to say. The purpose of symbols really belongs to the illiterate. It was so that the masses could know where to worship, signs and so on. In ancient times, people wore symbols into battle so that you would know their regiment and country they fought so that they knew who to attack. A symbol you knew was from your country? Don't attack him. Otherwise, free game.
Fidenonarmis
When does a religious symbol cease to be the sum of its parts ex. two sticks, and become something much more?
What does this mean when applied to acts such as cross burning? are these acts sacreligious, or merely ignorant, or apathetic, to the meaning of such symbols to others?


well, a symbol can be either cultural or universal. in the case of a cultural symbol, it only has meaning within a certian context or situation, as with religious symbols such as the cross. a universal symbol has deeper meaning around the world, in nearly every culture, such as trees and fire and water. a simple sign (one-dimensional meaning) becomes a symbol when it takes on a deeper meaning than the obvious one. for example, a tree is a tree. but when you look at it as something that represents life and growth, it becomes a symbol. it really depends on one's perspective when something can become a symbol, and in the same way burning such symbols really only offends those who understand what they mean. non-christians probably don't care very much when crosses are burned, because they don't have deeper meaning to them. to christians, cross-burning is burning something which represents the suffering and life-giving sacrifice of their lord, and therefore it means a lot more to them and cuts deeper.

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I agree with Reagun.
Symbols have power when people have faith in them. The power can be felt by those who believe in the symbol, and in those who are being affected by it.

In myth about vampires, for example, the cross was such a strong symbol and so many people had faith in it, that it had the power to actually purify the corruption within them. Now, I know that's merely a literary and mythological refrence, but I think it get's the point across.

Also, people have been using sygils and symbols in magic for ages... Not to mention the symbols we are all using right now, words written for all to see, have power in themselves as well. I've read that "No book has the power of a burned book" and I can see that in a couple ways. For one, burning or banning books sensationalizes them, and there will always be people who read it just to see what the stir is about, or maybe even to add to the stir themselves. But secondly, and more importantly, it's been seen that when you write words down, burning them can activate them in several ways. For one, it can spread the words and their meanings on the wind and can spread their power. It can also cause a feeling of purification to come over you...

How to tie this up... Well, yeah, symbols have power. The more faith in the symbol, the more number of people who have faith in the symbol, the more power it has.
vpshinra
Fiddlers Green
Bian_Isaura


Yeah I would have to agree here. The only reason symbols have significance is because people give them value and significance. Without that value, a symbol is meaningless.

It's rather interesting though, that cultures all around the world insist upon having symbols. In religion, politics, and so many other area- they make a statement. But how they were chosen to make that statement is a whole other history in its itself.

Symbols also cross language barriers, usually. You may not understand what some one is saying but a symbol can send a message that requires niether literacy nor comprehension of another language....


That's what I was about to say. The purpose of symbols really belongs to the illiterate. It was so that the masses could know where to worship, signs and so on. In ancient times, people wore symbols into battle so that you would know their regiment and country they fought so that they knew who to attack. A symbol you knew was from your country? Don't attack him. Otherwise, free game.


i disagree. a symbol can have meaning for a literate person as well. in fact, symbols take on more meaning for the well-read and informed. with more knowledge, one can get a greater perspective and understanding of the various meanings buried in a symbol. the ignorant can reall yonly understand symbols on a one-dimensional basis, taking it in as a mere illustration rather than a masterpiece. symbols require understanding, which is wrought from education.

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I'm reviving this topic to ask a question.

Do you think that the majority of people who use religious symbols do so because they need to feel unified with the other members of their group, or do you think that they use symbols because they truly have faith in the power of the symbol?

I ask, because it seems to me that many people who call themselves Pagan use the pentacle or pentagram without much thought into what it truly means.

Maybe I'm looking too deeply into this...
SlaineWildfire
I'm reviving this topic to ask a question.

Do you think that the majority of people who use religious symbols do so because they need to feel unified with the other members of their group, or do you think that they use symbols because they truly have faith in the power of the symbol?

I ask, because it seems to me that many people who call themselves Pagan use the pentacle or pentagram without much thought into what it truly means.

Maybe I'm looking too deeply into this...


Great question, Slaine. I hesistate to give any answers on this without doing a survey, because the truth to this matter isn't one that is self-evident to me. I think it could go either way, depending on the person. Maybe you should construct a survey question here and in another forum?

Part of it is probably for unity with the faith. People gather around their symbols when they form their groups. That gathering itself might be what gives the symbols thier power. If people did not draw to the symbols, they would have no power. So perhaps the first causes the second... people use symbols to feel unified and that unification gives the symbols power?
I have to go with the belief that most, but not all people merely see it as the heraldry of their faith. The rest of us (few, tho I think we are), believe that some symbols, like some words, hold power and represent something more than just a logo for a religion...
A symbol has all the power and meaning you attach to it.

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Newski
A symbol has all the power and meaning you attach to it.

Combined with the power and meaning that others attch to it.

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