Premarital Sex - Sin?

[Deoridhe]

Flemavenger

Deoridhe

Flemavenger

Since "love" is not arguable in a court of law, we suddenly are required to legalize *****]
So you missed the fact that people under certain ages are unable to legally consent?

According to the current laws, but major liberal activist groups, such as the ACLU and AMBLA, are working hard to change that.

Evidence that the ACLU is attempting to alter consent laws, please.

Flemavenger

Deoridhe

Flemavenger

Certainly premarital sex brings momentary fleeting "happiness"/pleasure, but it also causes lots of unhappiness. Things like STDs and unwanted pregnancies, abortions all come to mind.

Those occur within marriage as well.

Because in marriage (well, faithful marriage) a person's sex partners are limited to one, the rate of spreading STDs is exponentially shortened. Unwanted pregnancies may occur, but then again, people should not be having sex unless they are willing to accept responsibility for the fact that a child is a possible outcome of their actions. Abortion is an irresponsible solution for an unwanted pregnancy.

Yes, faithful marriages... something like 60-70% of men and 40% of women have affairs, isn't that the current numbers in the USA? As for your commentaty on abortion, that's a personal opinion on your part. Personally, I find bringing a child you don't want into the world and raising it knowing that it is unwanted is cruel.

Flemavenger

Taking this one step further, when pregnancies occur outside of marriage, or even in cohabitation, there are negative consequences for the child. I googled some terms and this was the first site that came up. It has some interesting statistics relating to the problematic impact on modern society because of social acceptance for immoral sexual activity, be it adultery or fornication.
http://christianparty.net/children.htm
The statistic I was looking for in the Google was this:

Quote:

78% of the nation's jail and prison inmates grew up in a fatherless household, even though only 15% of today's adult population grew up fatherless.

Wait, you say "even in cohabitation" and then you cite "fatherless" research?

Talk about moving the bar. And a red herring. And dishonest debate.

Flemavenger

It is for these reasons that God created the family unit, to raise righeous children.

Which god?

Flemavenger

As the family unit is destroyed by the decreasing marriage population, every aspect of society is severely harmed.

Evidence for this claim, please, especially the "every aspect" part.

[Deep Vermillion]

Flemavenger

Yet you ignore the fact that 78% of inmates grew up fatherless? I never said that fatherless children are destined to go to prison. It should however raise an eyebrow that such are large percentage of inmates were fatherless. 78% versus 15% is a huge contrast.

I don't think anyone is arguing that it's not best for children to have two parents who can see to their emotional and physical needs, but leaving out that it's still a relatively small number who go to prison (regardless of proportion) seems to sensationalize it, which makes the argument appear weaker.

I'm certainly not surprised that children from troubled homes grow up statistically more likely to get in trouble. However, implying that most fatherless children are in prison (I'm not saying you were implying that, but rather that the article was by making a huge deal about the 78% and how - apparently - ALL fatherless kids are "20 times more likely" to commit crimes, regardless of other social factors) is simply not true.

[Deoridhe]

Deep Vermillion

I don't think anyone is arguing that it's not best for children to have two parents who can see to their emotional and physical needs,

I'd argue that it's better for three or four adults to do the same, personally.

[Allegro]

Deoridhe

Deep Vermillion

I don't think anyone is arguing that it's not best for children to have two parents who can see to their emotional and physical needs,

I'd argue that it's better for three or four adults to do the same, personally.

Well, I have my own thoughts on this, but that's a different topic entirely.

[alili5133]

Le Soleil Neigeux

Nine Lotus Petals Falling

I say if two willing adults want to have sex then there is nothing wrong with it. Why would there be? After all marriage is nothing more than a ceremony. Most of the marriages in history, yes, even in the bible, were made not for love but for political and monetary reasons. What really matters is not the ceremony but the relationship. Two loving people having sex is a beautiful thing, whether they are married or not. Marriage is just a legal binding of the two people.

Good point. -But as for the Bible, does it approve or disprove of sex before marriage? Does it even mention it at all?

It doesn't. It just says that you can't have sex with another person if you are married. That's it.

[No No Raja]

Flemavenger

Marriage has everything to do with it, because it shows commitment. It shows that you love the person and see them as a companion you wish to stay with the rest of your life.

See, this is where I would ask for proof or if this is another opinionated statement.

Flemavenger

To not get married shows just the opposite, that you are not willing to put forth the commitment and you still see the relationship as a temporary test.

There was a girl a couple posts back who had seven partners before her husband. She doesn't regret any one of them.

Also, sometimes it's just better to test the waters. You don't have to deal with messy divorce procedures or torn families later.

Flemavenger

Even cohabitating couples who do stay together all their lives will still have a different mindset from one of complete trust and commitment because of the signal that is sent by not getting married.

And this is where I add another thing to my list of "things that society has ******** up."

See, people can say all they want that certain things are more "accepted." But in their hearts, they always harbor prejudices by seeing couples living together as amoral fornicators.

It is my belief that it is the pressure sent from THAT that makes it different. It's a horrible mindset.

But even then, I believe people can prevail over those stereotypes. And I have faith society one day will, too.

Quote:

Flemavenger

Things like STDs and unwanted pregnancies, abortions all come to mind.

Flemavenger

Protection does little to prevent STDs. The comparison you usually here is that the HIV virus vs. a condom is like throwing a handful of golf balls at a vollyball net.

Christ, you have to use MULTIPLE methods. Spermicidal lubricants and good-quality rubber condoms come to mind. Birth control pills.

Flemavenger

All too often, when premarital pregnancies occur, it is because of a lack of love, and a confusion of "lust" for "love". Because of this, often the partners do not "stand by you no matter what" and tend to disappear.

In teenage couples, yes, and maybe some adults because males are usually pricks when it comes to things like that. You know, maybe if the guy stood with her and ******** owned up to his mistake, there would be no need for an abortion because of the moral support and *le gasp* might even bring them CLOSER together!!!

Flemavenger

However, having the family unit controlled by righteous parents leads to a good, law abiding society with a strong economy, while the increase of divorce rates, premarital sex, single-parents, and cohabitation leads to just the opposite.

People are what make the difference, not family.

People thinking for themselves rather than follow what they're told is right and wrong. People deciding for themselves what is right and wrong.

This has to come from inside YOU. It can't come from a family.

Flemavenger

This is an opinionated statement. I do not have statistics to support myself on this one.

Then you will understand when I say it has no place in the ED.

[Elvendra]

Personally I do not see why one of the most natural things in the world to do should be restricted by a piece of paper that basically says that the government recognises you as a couple.
But then I do not see the point in marriage, period.

[Elvendra]

Lady_Amalthea

Le Soleil Neigeux

captain blue x

u must be marreid to ur wife to have sex if ur not its called fornication. must be marreid i dont support noone.its a sin to have sex before look it up in exodus 20:its in the ten commendments...

Actually premarital sex isn't mentioned in the Ten Commandments... The only mention of sex at all is in verse 14, "You shall not commit adultery." (NIV)

Adultery is defined as, "Voluntary sexual intercourse between a married person and someone other than his or her lawful spouse.: (Dictionary.com)

How is adultery any different from pre-marital sex? Both are the same since both involve you cheating on your spouse, since Biblically we are told that sex unites you with someone forever and that someone should only be your spouse

If they are the same then how come you can't divorce due to "pre-marital sex"?

[maenad nuri]

You know, I believe that same study took a look at divorce rates. Oddly enough, it was highest in the south among Evangelical Christians. That always amused me, just thought I'd share.

My fiancee had sex before me. I don't care. They were before me. I am the one he is with now. The one that he is making the commitment too.

And why not embrace the many ways relationships take hold? All people are not alike.

[Black Carpathia]

Flemavenger

Black Carpathia

If you're mature and responsible about it you can have sex with who ever you want, provided there's consent, regardless of marraige or love.

Several religions frown upon sex before marraige. But ultimatly, it's your choice. It doesn't matter what anyone says aslong as you're happy.

The problem is, to argue the point you are making is to say that anyone can have sex as long as there is consent and "love".

If you would read what I wrote again you would see that I said you can have sex regardless of weather you love the person your doing or not.

Flemavenger

Since "love" is not arguable in a court of law, we suddenly are required to legalize *****.

Where the hell di you come up with that?

A child cannot legally consent to sex, therefore, child molestation is and will be illegal.

Flemavenger

Certainly premarital sex brings momentary fleeting "happiness"/pleasure,

Explain how the Pleasure and happines one get from making love to their fiance, or anyother person they love and want to be with for the rest of their life but aren't married to is "fleeting"

You seem like one of those people who thinks Premarital sex = Promiscuity. You can have sex with one person for your whole life and not be married to them.

Flemavenger

but it also causes lots of unhappiness. Things like STDs and unwanted pregnancies, abortions all come to mind.

You do know those could happen In marraige?

Flemavenger

Waiting until you are married and knowing that your spouse has also waited for you brings a great degree of true happiness, not pleasure.

Proof of this? Any proof at all?

I personally would be overjoyed and truely happy at the fact that someone had decided to spend their life with me, regardless of wether or not they were a virgin.

[Captain Saeta]

stressed sweatdrop stressed sweatdrop

OK, folks- you can argue whether premarital sex is moral or not, you can argue if it should be legal or not, you can throw as many statistics out there as you like- the question posed by the OP was whether or not premarital sex was a SIN, something forbidden by GOD. I've seen little mention of this on this thread. Make a new, GENERAL "Premarital Sex (good or bad)?" thread or else turn the conversation back to the OP's question. If you don't believe in God, then don't respond- it only makes since that you'd disagree with something you didn't believe in. rolleyes

[Captain Saeta]

alili5133

Le Soleil Neigeux

Nine Lotus Petals Falling

I say if two willing adults want to have sex then there is nothing wrong with it. Why would there be? After all marriage is nothing more than a ceremony. Most of the marriages in history, yes, even in the bible, were made not for love but for political and monetary reasons. What really matters is not the ceremony but the relationship. Two loving people having sex is a beautiful thing, whether they are married or not. Marriage is just a legal binding of the two people.

Good point. -But as for the Bible, does it approve or disprove of sex before marriage? Does it even mention it at all?

It doesn't. It just says that you can't have sex with another person if you are married. That's it.

It mentions fornication specifically in Paul's letters (using greek words that, to MY knowledge, translate to just about that). I've also discussed the more common term "sexual immorality" in a previous post in this thread.

[Icysnowgirl]

VampireHunter_G

stressed sweatdrop stressed sweatdrop

OK, folks- you can argue whether premarital sex is moral or not, you can argue if it should be legal or not, you can throw as many statistics out there as you like- the question posed by the OP was whether or not premarital sex was a SIN, something forbidden by GOD. I've seen little mention of this on this thread. Make a new, GENERAL "Premarital Sex (good or bad)?" thread or else turn the conversation back to the OP's question. If you don't believe in God, then don't respond- it only makes since that you'd disagree with something you didn't believe in. rolleyes

Le Soleil Neigeux

It's the general consensus that premarital sex is a sin. However, no one has ever explained to me why... In my biblical studies, I haven't been able to find any outward mention of premarital sex and it's moral standing at all.

Just wondering about the general opinion on sex outside of marriage.

Is it wrong? Why?
What makes it ok?
Should the topic be concerned with religion at all?

If you have a viewpoint, please support it! 3nodding

[Priestess Acadia]

Flemavenger

Certainly premarital sex brings momentary fleeting "happiness"/pleasure, but it also causes lots of unhappiness. Things like STDs and unwanted pregnancies, abortions all come to mind.

I had premarital sex, and my husband had premarital sex, both with each other and with other people... We do not have STDs and nobody got pregnant.

Also, marriage doesn't make you impervious to STDs or unwanted pregnancies... I could get pregnant tomorrow, and I'm married, and it would be an unwanted pregnancy.

As long as people act responsibly and take precautions, if married or not married, they can protect themselves. But to say people shouldn't have premarital sex could give you an STD or make you pregnant when you don't want to be you're setting up false expectations since both things can occur in a marriage. And if your reason for not having sex before marriage is preventing those things, you might as well advocate not having sex at all, since there's always a risk of STDs or unwanted pregnancy.

Quote:

Waiting until you are married and knowing that your spouse has also waited for you brings a great degree of true happiness, not pleasure.

It wouldn't have brought me a "great degree of true happiness." In fact, if my husband was a virgin, I wouldn't have married him. Thinking back to some of my prior relationships, if I had married them without having sex first, I'd surely be divorced by now.

My husband and I weren't virgins on our wedding night, and we're perfectly happy together. If it's important to you to be a virgin when you get married, fine, but to say that because you didn't have sex, you'll be happier, that's the worst kind of lying to yourself. You'll have to work just as hard, you'll have the same struggles and problems that everybody else has, and what'll carry you through is how you deal with them, not who you had sex with 10 years before.

Flemavenger

According to the current laws, but major liberal activist groups, such as the ACLU and AMBLA, are working hard to change that.

That's absolutely untrue, and if it is true, you should show some proof. Really, this trend of making a statement that's obviously false, being called out on it, and then saying that it's all about to change because of the "evil liberals" (insert evil laugh here) is just retarded.