My Argument Against the Argument Against Christianity

[Abdul Salaam]

Mainerd

True Christians are true to their biblical beliefs. They will not persecute anyone due to lifestyle, ethnicity, or sexual orientation., God states that everyone regardless of these things, should be treated with the same kindness that your closest friends be treated with.

How do you think this ties in with Biblical Verses such as

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1 Corinthians 5:11-13
But now I am writing to you not to associate with anyone who calls himself a Christian (Greek a brother) who is sexually immoral, or greedy, or an idolater, or verbally abusive, or a drunkard, or a swindler. Do not even eat with such a person. For what do I have to do with judging those outside? Are you not to judge those inside? But God will judge those outside. Remove the evil person from among you.

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As a secondary point, if God wants to eradicate and Punish Sin, and gives us guidelines on how to deal with Sin , are we really in any wrong when we copy Gods attitudes and actions?

[Just Another Face -GM-]

God damn it, no. I will not be content being pagebottomed and ignored.

Just Another Face -GM-

-cracks knuckles-

Mainerd

---------BEWARE: LONG------------

You must be new here.

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First of all, no unjustified, or snarky remarks, please be civilized.

You're the one asserting a rant against a rant that I hadn't seen recently. But go ahead.

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Allow me to begin by stating three points:

Good. In a debate, it's good to define your terms.

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1.) I am 16 years of age, so not a lot of credibility here.

Well, no, I had studied Christianity, Judaism, Paganism, Hinduism and a fist full of other religions by sixteen. No sweat there.

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2.) I am certainly NO scientist, and do not have the full perspective from other religious views.

Honestly. You're at a net gain with the age not affecting your score, and this being a +1

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3.) I am biased, arguing from the Christian perspective, and leaving you to argue from either scientific, or other religious standpoint.

And this puts you in a negative. One, you admit a bias. Noble, but no excuse. Two, science isn't a religion. Now, this might be a semantic disagreement, so I'll give the benefit of the doubt, and say you've broken even.

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Anyways, I figure if God was created by man, man would have created a God that allowed immoral behavior that man would condone (I.E. adultery, do what feels good)

Now that all depends on who made him. Now, it's entirely possible that a totally pure but intelligent, crafty, somewhat nefarious individual or individuals created this God, endowed 'Him' with their morals, and then spread the story.

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How could God let this happen?

Well that was a stumble in the train of thought.

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God has given us all the gift of free-will,

Well, now you're assuming a basic biological function with a higher purpose. All animals have free will. It's to a matter of degree, and a degree of understanding repercussions.

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meaning we have the ability to lust,

Well, no, that's biology.

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persecute unjustly,

Sociology.

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also referred to as "h8ing"

No.

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(an action commonly performed by h8rs.)

No.

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and If God did not give us free will, we would be like mindless robots,

Except we wouldn't notice. You'll note, there is supposedly a divine plan that outlines every event in the universe forever and ever. If we grant the God premise, and the God makes Man premise, then we have to decide on which hypothesis we follow next. Free Will can not co-exist with Divine Plan.

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unable to make decisions on our own.

Because God already has plans for us, which means he knows best, and which means he also maliciously allows some people to become godless atheists or drug addicts, allows people to be raped and beaten and tortured or murdered... Whoops.

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God would rather see us make the choice on our own to follow his ways,

How do you know that?

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rather than force us,

Because constant threats of discrimination, alienation, excommunication and damnation into eternal hellfire isn't 'force'.

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just like our fathers shouldn't force us to work for any one career our whole lives, same concept.

Except that some do.

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But since God has given us free will,

How do you know God hasn't decided everything already, and that you only think you have Free Will because it makes your mind more easily malleable and controllable?

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it is human nature to abuse it,

Read : Biology, Sociology, Anthropology.

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and make wrong to others,

Except, from an Anthropological standpoint, cave folks often helped one another out, to extremes. Until, eventually, the concept of ownership came along, which was usually accompanied by, well, the Sky Father told me to have this land. And this property. And these cows. And you people.

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even by holding something against others we are either hurting them,

I'm sorry for hurting you, racists.

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or ourselves.

I'm sorry me, for having a problem with child molesters.

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Often by holding a grudge, we also sometimes feel the need for vengeance.

You left trying to make a point a while ago, kid. You're just proselytizing. Reel'er in, kid, or this'll just be a good ol' Ray Comfort snoozer.

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Although vengeance may be thrilling for the moment,

To who? There are a number of people who I despise for one reason or another, but I've never felt the need to exact vengeance. Some religion of peace.

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it only results in more hatred,

Like when Hammurabi, acting as a God, said 'An eye for an eye', or when Jesus said 'I come not with open arms, but with a sword.' Vengeance? Nah.

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therefore more vengeance. and thus the cycle begins.

You're starting to notice why many of us left Hhristianity.

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There would be no hatred in the world, nor would their be sickness if it were not for sin resulting from free-will.

So then God intentionally gave us something to ******** us all in the a**?

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I'm sure we all know the story, In Genesis, God creates the first man and woman, Adam and Eve, and Satan, under the guise of a serpent, dupes Eve into eating a fruit from the Tree of Knowledge, where God has commanded Adam and Eve not to partake.

Oh, you mean the story where God puts a tree that can grant unending, expansive knowledge and slaps it down in Adam and Eve's living room, and then says, no. Do not take this. And being that God is the only sentient voice they've heard, he then puts another talking creature right next to them, with the ability to speak their language, who is known at being good enough at deception that he managed to convince a full half of the angels of heaven into defecting to his team? He puts that guy against two imbeciles, and then gets pissy at the dipshits for listening to the only other voice they'd ever heard. Mature. Also, interesting, that the Christian creation story says that the tree of KNOWLEDGE is evil. Hrm.

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Whether you believe this is true or not, is none of my business,

Yet clearly you want to make it your business.

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however all evil on earth, (sickness, natural disasters) can be traced back to free will, and disobedience to God.

Indeed, all sickness came from disobeying God. or. you know. Germs.

I especially like when God had a natural disaster befall Sodom and Gomorrah. Two angels stroll up to Lot, but are attacked by rapists. And how does Lot defend them? By throwing his two virgin daughters to be raped and tortured. He then packs them all up and they leave the cities before God blows up everyone they have ever known and loved, and because Lot's wife had the audacity to, I dunno, mourn a massive population of the world, several of which were their friends and neighbors, welp, sorry, table salt.

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O HAI! Just making sure you're still awake.

Cute, chuckles. We've got a ways to go.

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Cristians are freaks/jerks/elitist snobs

Well, yeah, sometimes.

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Quote-Unquote Christians, who claim to have faith in God and have accepted Jesus as their savior, yet gossip about people behind their backs, are predjudiced against other minorities (LGBT, ect) and are narrow minded.

Okay, I am responding to this point by point. I haven't read this already. But I'm almost certain you're about to present a No True Scotsman. But I'll stop if I'm wrong.

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If you think TRUE believers in Christ are like any of these things, please refer yourself to my previous section. HUMAN NATURE. God created all people the same, and he certainly does not wish for his own followers to attack others due to their ethnicity, lifestyle, sexual orientation, ect. However, the Bible does not condone homosexuality. I'd rather not get into it much, on risk of offending someone's beliefs,

And because it would weaken my already tumultuous credibility.

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so I'll just say this. True Christians are true to their biblical beliefs. They will not persecute anyone due to lifestyle, ethnicity, or sexual orientation.,

So, they would be true to their biblical beliefs, and would never persecute people, as it says to do so in the bible. Like how if a man lay with a man, it's an abomination, he must be put to death? Or how you can tell that people are to be slaves by the color of their skin? Or we could take a stroll through Leviticus and discuss all the lifestyles that are punishable by death.

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God states that everyone regardless of these things, should be treated with the same kindness that your closest friends be treated with.

Except that that didn't originate with the Bible. See, most things didn't. Actually, that predates Christianity and Judaism by a longshot, as early as 1800 BCE, with, once again, Hammurabi's law.

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Once, I was speaking to one of my friends in school, and he made an unjustified remark that I admit it was slightly offended by, although I wouldn't say it surprised me.

Okay?

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He described Christians as *ahem* "Crackheads."

Why? Christians are increasingly becoming more irrational and more hateful by the year. Seriously, it's getting bad. A girl, either early this year or late last year, petitioned with her state to have a prayer banner removed from a public school, because it is infringing on the separation of Church and State, and shows a bias toward Christians. She won. She was then bombarded with hate, threats of violence, rape, murder, the whole nine. Had to change schools, had to change all forms of contact. And you know why? Because Christians threatened her. So yeah, it's becoming the rule more and more, and less and less the exception.

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Sad people, sad.

Well, you could always make a positive step forward instead of ranting on the internet.

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The most sensible people I know are Christian,

The most sensible people I know are Atheists. See, there is this tricky thing about 'sensibility' when it doesn't rely on out-and-out evidence. It tends to favor the people who agree with you.

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(not saying any of you are or have the potential to be less sensible btw)

I'm not, not saying it, either.

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and they are some of the happiest people on Earth.

I'm actually a lot happier and a lot less stressed out since I ditched Christendom.

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Nowadays, most people harbor timidness and hostility as everyday defenses,

...They do? Who the fu-...oh wait. Highschool. Right.

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but in such a mean world, who wouldn't?

Adults? People who aren't into petty s**t?

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everyone is guilty of it at some point, after all, no one living and I mean NO ONE is perfect.

Correct.

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But just because someone is strong enough to still be friendly, compassionate, kind, or jubilant, does NOT make them a crackhead,

That is not why your friend called them crackheads, and you know it. Because, A.) Threats of rape over a poster, and B.) you just described pot smokers.

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they are just gifted, and made strong, and EVERYONE has the power to find happiness, whether it's by accepting Jesus and following the path of the Lord, or by discovering whatever makes you truly happy.

True.

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Alright, I have a feeling the more I type the less anyone will want to read, and 2:15 AM is pretty late for me to chill on the internet. Hope to see an epic conflagration of replies, peace be with you all.

None of that was an argument to dissuade the arguments against Christianity. They were preemptive moves that were largely hollow and meaningless. I get that it comes from a sincere place, but nothing you said counters any major argument as to why Christianity is bad.

[Twisted Rainbow Insanity]

I have a quite of few problems with your argument. A lot of what you are saying, we all already know. In fact, you haven't even pinpointed a lot of the main reasons why people don't like Christianity. For example, the fact that many people are indoctrinated into it from birth. Care to defend yourself on that one?
Another problem I have is the fact that Christians see homosexuality as wrong because it says so in the bible. The bible says a lot of things. But there are things in the bible other Christians don't pay attention to such as how slavery is encouraged, how God has condoned killing plenty of times, or how a lady must be stoned to death if she is not a virgin on her wedding day. If you want to agree that homosexuality is wrong because of the bible then you must agree with these things too, since they also, promote hate. Homosexuality is not a sin. All they are doing is loving differently than you. Do you honestly think God would be angry at any kind of love? Not everything in the bible is accurate and if you claim to be a good Christian then you must recognize that.

[Twisted Rainbow Insanity]

Just Another Face -GM-

God damn it, no. I will not be content being pagebottomed and ignored.

Just Another Face -GM-

-cracks knuckles-

Mainerd

---------BEWARE: LONG------------

You must be new here.

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First of all, no unjustified, or snarky remarks, please be civilized.

You're the one asserting a rant against a rant that I hadn't seen recently. But go ahead.

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Allow me to begin by stating three points:

Good. In a debate, it's good to define your terms.

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1.) I am 16 years of age, so not a lot of credibility here.

Well, no, I had studied Christianity, Judaism, Paganism, Hinduism and a fist full of other religions by sixteen. No sweat there.

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2.) I am certainly NO scientist, and do not have the full perspective from other religious views.

Honestly. You're at a net gain with the age not affecting your score, and this being a +1

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3.) I am biased, arguing from the Christian perspective, and leaving you to argue from either scientific, or other religious standpoint.

And this puts you in a negative. One, you admit a bias. Noble, but no excuse. Two, science isn't a religion. Now, this might be a semantic disagreement, so I'll give the benefit of the doubt, and say you've broken even.

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Anyways, I figure if God was created by man, man would have created a God that allowed immoral behavior that man would condone (I.E. adultery, do what feels good)

Now that all depends on who made him. Now, it's entirely possible that a totally pure but intelligent, crafty, somewhat nefarious individual or individuals created this God, endowed 'Him' with their morals, and then spread the story.

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How could God let this happen?

Well that was a stumble in the train of thought.

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God has given us all the gift of free-will,

Well, now you're assuming a basic biological function with a higher purpose. All animals have free will. It's to a matter of degree, and a degree of understanding repercussions.

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meaning we have the ability to lust,

Well, no, that's biology.

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persecute unjustly,

Sociology.

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also referred to as "h8ing"

No.

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(an action commonly performed by h8rs.)

No.

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and If God did not give us free will, we would be like mindless robots,

Except we wouldn't notice. You'll note, there is supposedly a divine plan that outlines every event in the universe forever and ever. If we grant the God premise, and the God makes Man premise, then we have to decide on which hypothesis we follow next. Free Will can not co-exist with Divine Plan.

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unable to make decisions on our own.

Because God already has plans for us, which means he knows best, and which means he also maliciously allows some people to become godless atheists or drug addicts, allows people to be raped and beaten and tortured or murdered... Whoops.

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God would rather see us make the choice on our own to follow his ways,

How do you know that?

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rather than force us,

Because constant threats of discrimination, alienation, excommunication and damnation into eternal hellfire isn't 'force'.

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just like our fathers shouldn't force us to work for any one career our whole lives, same concept.

Except that some do.

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But since God has given us free will,

How do you know God hasn't decided everything already, and that you only think you have Free Will because it makes your mind more easily malleable and controllable?

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it is human nature to abuse it,

Read : Biology, Sociology, Anthropology.

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and make wrong to others,

Except, from an Anthropological standpoint, cave folks often helped one another out, to extremes. Until, eventually, the concept of ownership came along, which was usually accompanied by, well, the Sky Father told me to have this land. And this property. And these cows. And you people.

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even by holding something against others we are either hurting them,

I'm sorry for hurting you, racists.

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or ourselves.

I'm sorry me, for having a problem with child molesters.

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Often by holding a grudge, we also sometimes feel the need for vengeance.

You left trying to make a point a while ago, kid. You're just proselytizing. Reel'er in, kid, or this'll just be a good ol' Ray Comfort snoozer.

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Although vengeance may be thrilling for the moment,

To who? There are a number of people who I despise for one reason or another, but I've never felt the need to exact vengeance. Some religion of peace.

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it only results in more hatred,

Like when Hammurabi, acting as a God, said 'An eye for an eye', or when Jesus said 'I come not with open arms, but with a sword.' Vengeance? Nah.

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therefore more vengeance. and thus the cycle begins.

You're starting to notice why many of us left Hhristianity.

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There would be no hatred in the world, nor would their be sickness if it were not for sin resulting from free-will.

So then God intentionally gave us something to ******** us all in the a**?

Quote:

I'm sure we all know the story, In Genesis, God creates the first man and woman, Adam and Eve, and Satan, under the guise of a serpent, dupes Eve into eating a fruit from the Tree of Knowledge, where God has commanded Adam and Eve not to partake.

Oh, you mean the story where God puts a tree that can grant unending, expansive knowledge and slaps it down in Adam and Eve's living room, and then says, no. Do not take this. And being that God is the only sentient voice they've heard, he then puts another talking creature right next to them, with the ability to speak their language, who is known at being good enough at deception that he managed to convince a full half of the angels of heaven into defecting to his team? He puts that guy against two imbeciles, and then gets pissy at the dipshits for listening to the only other voice they'd ever heard. Mature. Also, interesting, that the Christian creation story says that the tree of KNOWLEDGE is evil. Hrm.

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Whether you believe this is true or not, is none of my business,

Yet clearly you want to make it your business.

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however all evil on earth, (sickness, natural disasters) can be traced back to free will, and disobedience to God.

Indeed, all sickness came from disobeying God. or. you know. Germs.

I especially like when God had a natural disaster befall Sodom and Gomorrah. Two angels stroll up to Lot, but are attacked by rapists. And how does Lot defend them? By throwing his two virgin daughters to be raped and tortured. He then packs them all up and they leave the cities before God blows up everyone they have ever known and loved, and because Lot's wife had the audacity to, I dunno, mourn a massive population of the world, several of which were their friends and neighbors, welp, sorry, table salt.

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O HAI! Just making sure you're still awake.

Cute, chuckles. We've got a ways to go.

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Cristians are freaks/jerks/elitist snobs

Well, yeah, sometimes.

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Quote-Unquote Christians, who claim to have faith in God and have accepted Jesus as their savior, yet gossip about people behind their backs, are predjudiced against other minorities (LGBT, ect) and are narrow minded.

Okay, I am responding to this point by point. I haven't read this already. But I'm almost certain you're about to present a No True Scotsman. But I'll stop if I'm wrong.

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If you think TRUE believers in Christ are like any of these things, please refer yourself to my previous section. HUMAN NATURE. God created all people the same, and he certainly does not wish for his own followers to attack others due to their ethnicity, lifestyle, sexual orientation, ect. However, the Bible does not condone homosexuality. I'd rather not get into it much, on risk of offending someone's beliefs,

And because it would weaken my already tumultuous credibility.

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so I'll just say this. True Christians are true to their biblical beliefs. They will not persecute anyone due to lifestyle, ethnicity, or sexual orientation.,

So, they would be true to their biblical beliefs, and would never persecute people, as it says to do so in the bible. Like how if a man lay with a man, it's an abomination, he must be put to death? Or how you can tell that people are to be slaves by the color of their skin? Or we could take a stroll through Leviticus and discuss all the lifestyles that are punishable by death.

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God states that everyone regardless of these things, should be treated with the same kindness that your closest friends be treated with.

Except that that didn't originate with the Bible. See, most things didn't. Actually, that predates Christianity and Judaism by a longshot, as early as 1800 BCE, with, once again, Hammurabi's law.

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Once, I was speaking to one of my friends in school, and he made an unjustified remark that I admit it was slightly offended by, although I wouldn't say it surprised me.

Okay?

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He described Christians as *ahem* "Crackheads."

Why? Christians are increasingly becoming more irrational and more hateful by the year. Seriously, it's getting bad. A girl, either early this year or late last year, petitioned with her state to have a prayer banner removed from a public school, because it is infringing on the separation of Church and State, and shows a bias toward Christians. She won. She was then bombarded with hate, threats of violence, rape, murder, the whole nine. Had to change schools, had to change all forms of contact. And you know why? Because Christians threatened her. So yeah, it's becoming the rule more and more, and less and less the exception.

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Sad people, sad.

Well, you could always make a positive step forward instead of ranting on the internet.

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The most sensible people I know are Christian,

The most sensible people I know are Atheists. See, there is this tricky thing about 'sensibility' when it doesn't rely on out-and-out evidence. It tends to favor the people who agree with you.

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(not saying any of you are or have the potential to be less sensible btw)

I'm not, not saying it, either.

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and they are some of the happiest people on Earth.

I'm actually a lot happier and a lot less stressed out since I ditched Christendom.

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Nowadays, most people harbor timidness and hostility as everyday defenses,

...They do? Who the fu-...oh wait. Highschool. Right.

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but in such a mean world, who wouldn't?

Adults? People who aren't into petty s**t?

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everyone is guilty of it at some point, after all, no one living and I mean NO ONE is perfect.

Correct.

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But just because someone is strong enough to still be friendly, compassionate, kind, or jubilant, does NOT make them a crackhead,

That is not why your friend called them crackheads, and you know it. Because, A.) Threats of rape over a poster, and B.) you just described pot smokers.

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they are just gifted, and made strong, and EVERYONE has the power to find happiness, whether it's by accepting Jesus and following the path of the Lord, or by discovering whatever makes you truly happy.

True.

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Alright, I have a feeling the more I type the less anyone will want to read, and 2:15 AM is pretty late for me to chill on the internet. Hope to see an epic conflagration of replies, peace be with you all.

None of that was an argument to dissuade the arguments against Christianity. They were preemptive moves that were largely hollow and meaningless. I get that it comes from a sincere place, but nothing you said counters any major argument as to why Christianity is bad.

[Pseudo-Onkelos]

Mainerd

God has given us all the gift of free-will,

Chapter, passage, and/or verse, please?

Mainerd

If God did not give us free will, we would be like mindless robots, unable to make decisions on our own.

I'm sorry to tell you then, but you're a mindless robot because free will is an illusion, at least according to Stephen Hawking. (Grand Design, p. 32) Yay for quantum mechanics.

Mainerd

God creates the first man and woman, Adam and Eve, and Satan, under the guise of a serpent, dupes Eve into eating a fruit from the Tree of Knowledge, where God has commanded Adam and Eve not to partake.

Satan as the serpent is a later interpretation, but that's not what the text says. Read through Genesis 3 and tell me where it says the serpent is Satan.

I don't care for the rest.

[Masturbating_Rot_Crow]

Let's break it down, bitches.

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Anyways, I figure if God was created by man, man would have created a God that allowed immoral behavior that man would condone (I.E. adultery, do what feels good)

You don't need a God to excuse you, you need a God to control you. People who are scared or generally have low IQs need someone to tell you what to do in order to actually listen to sound judgement. God gives them someone to follow when their parents are old / dead and their government isn't stable or existent. Makes perfect sense when you think of piles of people in the middle east in ancient times bumbling about, trying to have some sense of order. How else do you get everyone to behave the way you want them to without the threat of magical punishment? If you say "I don't want you doing that. You're not allowed" back then, people would just band together and stab you. So you say "He who makes the rain clouds will bring a plague upon you that will wither your testicles and eat your eyeballs."

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How could God let this happen?

Pretty easy if there is no God. Frankly, if there is a higher being, it makes a lot more sense if he created a few things to cause the bing bang and then just sat back, not even aware what was going on, or caring.

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God has given us all the gift of free-will, meaning we have the ability to lust, persecute unjustly, also referred to as "h8ing" (an action commonly performed by h8rs.) and If God did not give us free will, we would be like mindless robots, unable to make decisions on our own

. And if there was a God, that would make perfect sense if he wanted you to do very specific things and not other things and he genuinely cared if you did them.

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God would rather see us make the choice on our own to follow his ways, rather than force us, just like our fathers shouldn't force us to work for any one career our whole lives, same concept.

Except when I didn't perfectly follow what my dad said, he chalked it up to being an individual person or as a fault on him for the way he raised me. He sure as s**t didn't throw me in a torture chamber or say "every single thing you have ever done that I was against was wrong, you weren't supposed to do it, it was all on you, I had no hand in it, and now you're forever a bad person unless you do exactly as I say." Of course, my dad isn't abusive.

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But since God has given us free will, it is human nature to abuse it, and make wrong to others, even by holding something against others we are either hurting them, or ourselves. Often by holding a grudge, we also sometimes feel the need for vengeance. Although vengeance may be thrilling for the moment, it only results in more hatred, therefore more vengeance. and thus the cycle begins.

OR sometimes I think your God's "Morals" are a bunch of hateful horse s**t. And for reasons I don't get, your God supposedly is all-wise and all-knowing but can't grasp the idea of individualism and non-absolutes.

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There would be no hatred in the world,

If every single person thought exactly the same way with no other ideas, which goes against the idea of free will. How can you possibly be so involved with free will when all choices but one very particular path in life is wrong? That completely goes against everything free will stands for.

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nor would their be sickness if it were not for sin resulting from free-will.

Except sickness is actually a series of creatures that you say your God made. What does our free will have to do with micro-biotic life? Unless you're going to tell me germs aren't real.

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I'm sure we all know the story, In Genesis, God creates the first man and woman, Adam and Eve,

who did all kinds of things that we're not supposed to do even before they were kicked out of paradise.

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and Satan, under the guise of a serpent,

No, check your sources. The serpent is not Satan. The serpent is either Crowley or a snake just being his snake self, depending who you ask.

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dupes Eve into eating a fruit from the Tree of Knowledge

Which God could have stopped at any time, since he knew it was going to happen. Still, knowing full-well what would happen, he put the snake in Eden, he gave it the ability to talk, he didn't stop it from duping Eve, he didn't put a fence around the tree or simply not make the tree, and he didn't swoop down like Admiral Ackbar and yell "It's a trap!" and stop Eve. This God of yours is supposed to be all-knowing, and yet he set Eve up for failure. He can't blame that on free will; he knew and he let it happen. He always knew. How could He get angry, especially when he KNEW she was tricked and He allowed it? How could he possibly give them the option to do this and then get mad when they did? That would be like setting a banana on the floor by your toddler, right there in reach, and then saying "No touch" but letting the banana sit there. And then getting mad if the toddler went towards the banana. You know what I do if I don't want people in something? I don't jam it under their noses. I put it away. And if I KNOW they will take it if I leave it out? I don't give them the option. I don't leave out my good wine in front of friends at social situations and get mad if they drink it, and I certainly don't think God has a leg to stand on here, especially if he knew what would happen. Also, why didn't God want us to have knowledge? Isn't there something inherently WRONG about that? Your God was grooming Adam and Eve like a *****. The Bible itself says Adam and Eve were innocent like children (and don't get me started on the BS that is innocent children). So God takes two mentally stunted adults, sits them in their playpen with a toy they're not supposed to touch, and idly sits by when an older kid tells them it's okay, and then gets mad at his child-like people? If he was a daycare worker God would be fired. He'd never be hired because he clearly failed child development, and common sense 101.

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where God has commanded Adam and Eve not to partake.

Because he's grooming them. Ew.

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Whether you believe this is true or not, is none of my business, however all evil on earth, (sickness, natural disasters) can be traced back to free will, and disobedience to God.

Uh-huh. And how, pray tell, does free will cause climate change? Clouds to turn into tornadoes? Earthquakes? Johnny had sex with Marsha and that's what caused a mud slide? How do you rationalize this? It makes no sense what-so-ever, unless someone is doing a Jedi mind-trick to force waves to hit into Japan. The Planeteers have a lot to explain for.

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O HAI! Just making sure you're still awake.

Not only am I awake, I might have a tumor. That's what wrapping my head around this is doing. I read your free will = hook worms and now I have cancer.

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Cristians are freaks/jerks/elitist snobs

Maybe Christians with an H cover a lot of demographics, from nice people to hateful bigots. Don't blame the ultra-confusing nonsensical religion, blame the person. After all, free will allowed them to be this stupid. They had the will to go "what the hell am I doing? I'm being an a*****e!"

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Quote-Unquote Christians, who claim to have faith in God and have accepted Jesus as their savior, yet gossip about people behind their backs, are predjudiced against other minorities (LGBT, ect) and are narrow minded.

Yeah, some are, because bigots like having big books of magic to explain away all their stupid ideas. Unfortunately for them, less and less people believe in the magic, or have come up with their own magic, and that means the days of scaring people with faceless Gods and pointing to lightning as your proof are on their way out.

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If you think TRUE believers in Christ are like any of these things, please refer yourself to my previous section

In which God is in an abusive relationship with man? You do see that, right? God shoes textbook examples of abuse, physical, mental, emotional, even sexual at times. God is a creepy ********.

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HUMAN NATURE. God created all people the same, and he certainly does not wish for his own followers to attack others due to their ethnicity, lifestyle, sexual orientation, ect

Except what is touted as his own book often tells you to do just that. Some of your biblical heroes are simply hailed for how many people of another culture they could kill. Some of your biblical heroes raped and had tons of hookers and beat and killed and sold off their own children, etc. Your God condones things in the Bible that would get you the death penalty in a few states.

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However, the Bible does not condone homosexuality.

And I don't condone bigots, especially big ones that burn people for loving people He apparently created them to love. Your God is a ******** closet homo, if you ask me. He doth protest way too much.

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I'd rather not get into it much, on risk of offending someone's beliefs, so I'll just say this. True Christians are true to their biblical beliefs.

In which if your brother dies you should take over his wife regardless how she feels about it and rape her in his honor, only make sure you give that girl a cream pie, or else you're bad.

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They will not persecute anyone due to lifestyle, ethnicity, or sexual orientation., God states that everyone regardless of these things, should be treated with the same kindness that your closest friends be treated with.

Even if he kills them all the time, and then sends those he loves so much into ETERNAL torture. I don't know how you guys pull the wool over your eyes on that one. Think of your SO. Now say they did something really bad, like hit a kid with their car and you can't be with them anymore. Would you really be cool with having them set on fire? Forever?
Forever.
I want you to think about how long forever is. Can you think of anyone who deserves that kind of thing forever? I can't. Not even Hitler wracked up enough points for eternity.
Now say someone was going to set your SO on fire because they were caught kissing someone of the same gender. No, there is no way you can get me to swallow that one. It's wrong. Period.

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Once, I was speaking to one of my friends in school, and he made an unjustified remark that I admit it was slightly offended by, although I wouldn't say it surprised me. He described Christians as *ahem* "Crackheads."

No, silly. Christians are not addicted to a physical substance. If he wanted to use a simile on the ultra-faithful, someone who always obeys orders no matter how stupid or immoral, no matter how many differing opinions, no matter how much evidence contrary or how many times their leader has committed open hypocrisy and performed the worst crimes that they themselves are forbidden to do would be the ticket. Sadly, I can't think of anyone like that. Hitler followers might have been pretty close, but even they had their limits. It would be not a bad estimate to say that some people, like Hitler followers or many people under the control of dictators, are just devoted to cover their own asses out of fear. And what the ******** kind of sick, twisted worship is that? So now your God is also Machiavelli.

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Sad people, sad.

It is sad. It's sad that Christians are up for so much abuse and still call it love. I call it Stockholm Syndrome.

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The most sensible people I know are Christian, (not saying any of you are or have the potential to be less sensible btw) and they are some of the happiest people on Earth.

Happy? Yes? Sensible? Not that many. The Cheasters I do find sensible, at times (but why they don't drop the religion entirely is beyond me. Probably that fear-thing, or else it's like when you're comforted by a childhood food that was never even that good, but you grew up with it so you like it well enough), but the ultra-religious I often find are not even sensible if we're talking ironically. It's just too far off the radar to be anything but ******** up.

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Nowadays, most people harbor timidness and hostility as everyday defenses, but in such a mean world, who wouldn't?

To be perfectly honest, I don't. I use cautious optimism as much as I humanly can. Be aware of the risks, the problems, the things that are not working, need to be changed or need to be done away with, but also understand that the world is not inherently bad. Still, Christianity, and many religions for that matter, are one of those things I think can certainly be bad / risky / dangerous / broken, and therefore I steer clear of it. The world isn't a bad place because it has vipers, just you know, stay the ******** away from those vipers.

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everyone is guilty of it at some point, after all, no one living and I mean NO ONE is perfect

Damn right. Best to know that everyone is weak at some point to better understand how that will influence you.

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But just because someone is strong enough to still be friendly, compassionate, kind, or jubilant, does NOT make them a crackhead

This makes it sound like only Christians are happy. I dearly hope that's not what you're suggesting. I also think a lot of the religious people DO put on a front when they're in public, the better to make other's feel broken and come to their side. Remember, religion is about control, and if everyone thinks just like you it's easier to get them all to do what you like. Less confrontation when everyone agrees.

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they are just gifted, and made strong, and EVERYONE has the power to find happiness,

And I found it all on my own, without deities. Does that mean I'm stronger than they are because I didn't have to have happiness pointed out to me, or handed to me? Or told what it looks like/ feels like?

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whether it's by accepting Jesus and following the path of the Lord, or by discovering whatever makes you truly happy.

Though you should have a lot more reasons than just Jesus, like, I dunno, just about everything good in life.

[svnoyi inali]

This is my argument against your argument.

I know this only brings an argument against Jesus but considering half the bible
is about Jesus I think it proves that the christian faith is just a copy of other religions of the time.

[Pseudo-Onkelos]

svnoyi inali

This is my argument against your argument.

I know this only brings an argument against Jesus but considering half the bible
is about Jesus I think it proves that the christian faith is just a copy of other religions of the time.

Zeitgeist? Really? It's been overthrown.

[Kashkee]

Mainerd

I Shall Grant You NoMercy

Dose that mean you hate gays, abortion,woman, and free will?

I do my absolute best to hate no one. I love free will, because it means we're not a mindless robots programmed for one purpose. Men and Women are both beautiful in God's eyes, I don't believe that one should be treated with any less compassion or respect than the other. As for abortions, I have close friends that are admirable people that had them, in one case, because this person was RAPED against her will, and she had no control over herself getting pregnant, and her family, being in a desparate financial situation, let alone her, being 14 at the time, could not support a baby. Although for my own ethical reasons, I believe that their are alternatives to abortion, such as adoption, foster care, ect. Plus, if we as humans cared about what was moral, rather than what makes us feel good, we would be able to prevent more loss of potential human greatness, just think, that unborn infant could have been the next Einstien or Ghandi.

To that argument I just say no. Stop right there. Because the pendulum swings both ways, sir. That same human life could also have been the next Hitler or whatever. Most likely it would just become another number to the mass of unwanted children in the foster care system. Those children grow up unwanted and unloved, then people wonder why a lot of them become criminals and the scum of society.

So, would you rather have a child grow up in an exploited system of the state where they more than likely would never be wanted, or just not exist? Would you want a child to live like that?

[Wonkiphant]

Reported for encouraging bestiality and necrophilia.
mad

[svnoyi inali]

Pseudo-Onkelos

svnoyi inali

This is my argument against your argument.

I know this only brings an argument against Jesus but considering half the bible
is about Jesus I think it proves that the christian faith is just a copy of other religions of the time.

Zeitgeist? Really? It's been overthrown.

Whether it be Zeitgeist or not you can't overlook the qualities
of Gods that were born long before Jesus Christ.
I only used this video because it was a much faster way to get the point of my argument across.
It was simply me being lazy.

Do research and you will find a lot of this has proof in it.
When I first saw this video I did my research thinking "Well it can't really be true that Christians blatantly copied other religions of the time."
However, I came to find that while most of these deities were born somewhere between 3000 bc and the earliest being 500 bc. (I think. . .) that Christianity did copy it.
The best guess anyone can make, be it a christian or not, is that Jesus was born sometime around the year 400 bc.
A long time after these myths and legends had already been about.

Edited: Sorry I forgot about Dionysus.

[Missus Drake]

Good for you for trying to bring about a civil discussion about religion, but it's just not going to happen here.

It can be hard to be a Christian on the internet, people get pretty bold when they have anonymity to hide behind. Keep on keeping on, brother.

[Pseudo-Onkelos]

svnoyi inali

Whether it be Zeitgeist or not you can't overlook the qualities
of Gods that were born long before Jesus Christ.

And?

svnoyi inali

I only used this video because it was a much faster way to get the point of my argument across.
It was simply me being lazy.

What point? That it has no relevance to the thread at hand?

svnoyi inali

Do research and you will find a lot of this has proof in it.

Now that just isn't true.

svnoyi inali

When I first saw this video I did my research thinking "Well it can't really be true that Christians blatantly copied other religions of the time."
However, I came to find that while most of these deities were born somewhere between 3000 bc and the earliest being 800 bc. (I think. . .) that Christianity did copy it.
The best guess anyone can make, be it a christian or not, is that Jesus was born sometime around the year 400 bc.
A long time after these myths and legends had already been about.

Then you're gullible. This doesn't even concern me, however, as I'm not a Christian, and there are already numerous sites where Zeitgeist has been refuted.