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Blackrose_Knight's avatar

Devoted Pirate


Pretty sure it was birth rates, I'm at work so I can't check the graph, but I think I found better stats anyway, straight from the CDC:

http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/databriefs/db46.pdfYup, this one is birth rate. I was under the impression that pregnancy rate was about static around the country, but birth rates were higher in red states (as per your linked graph, which is now favorited btw!) as for abortion outlooks.

I haven't found a break down of pregnancy v birthrate for state, so I am currently unsupported. I think i heard it on NPR or something. I will keep looking tho.
Desideraht's avatar

Dapper Phantom

Bienaimee R
S/he's [...] s/he [...] his/her

Hitch is a boy.
Thank you.
I don't know if these people have just never seen a gay person before or what, but my gender is not a confusing matter. My avatar is clearly male and so am I.

I'm pretty sure this person keeps twisting my gender as some sort of "insult".
Desideraht's avatar

Dapper Phantom

Hitch Slap
Hitch Slap
Also if you think one is insecure for making sure they can commit to this person in body, mind, and heart then imagine how insecure they must be when sex is "scheduled" on their honeymoon.
I just want to point out that it doesn't need to be 'scheduled.' You don't *need* to have sex on your honeymoon if you don't feel ready. Most people do feel ready at that point (maybe nervous, but ready if they didn't rush into things), but some don't, and they don't need to have sex right after. They can wait.
Though if they're never ready, even after marriage, I imagine it's not going to last long (unless the other person is an asexual...)
So you're saying marry someone knowing there is a chance you could divorce because they might get cold feet on sex? It's just yet another reason I want everything in my relationship to be established before marriage...

It's not cold feet. But if you want to wait a week after marriage, that's fine. But it would be extremely odd if that happened.
You said there's a chance they might not ever be ready (you used asexuality as an example). Obviously that would have in part to do with poor communication but I could certainly see someone getting cold feet for a number of reasons, which is yet another reason I would want to address sex before marriage. Now let's be clear; sex is very important to me in a relationship. It is one of my deepest expressions of intimacy to my partner. Also, I just like myself a good ******** once in a while. If sex is not very important to someone, then they don't necessarily need to have the same precautions I have before marrying someone.
Desideraht's avatar

Dapper Phantom

Hitch Slap
Hitch Slap
Well how long is later? Like, until she's "comfortable"? What if she never is comfortable? I still think he should have resolved that before they started dating.

I also feel like she already felt guilty on her own because she refused and still refuses to tell him anything. You cannot fully blame another person for your own reactions to things.

Not necessarily. I mean, obviously it's not going to be comfortable topic any time soon, and if it's really weighing his heart down, he'd have to talk about it eventually. But it shouldn't have been when she immediately told him. That's something he should have brought up later, when she wasn't as emotionally hurting and he wasn't as emotionally hurting. Then he could talk to her calmly without hurting her as much and been much more reasonable. Like you said, it would have been better if it was resolved before dating, but it sounds like she didn't tell him until after they started. I don't understand why it bothers him so much, but he is allowed to be angry over whatever he wants to be angry about. I just think the whole situation could have been handled much more tactically. On both sides.

P.S. I read your post about blocking and other stuff. I'm not blocking you. I may not respect what you had to say much, but you're not harassing me. I rarely block people, because even if I don't like what they say, they have a right to say it. Ignoring it is not the answer, and it's something I hate (I've been blocked because people didn't like what they were hearing from me before, and it's stupid.) Also, I agree with you, religion and 'risks' aren't solid reasons to remain a virgin. I do think it needs to be a personal choice, what you want, not what others say you should do. It's what I want, and while I am influenced by those reasons, they aren't THE reason.
I'm avoiding the post itself because I really don't want to talk about religion. That isn't what this thread is, and because I love religion as a whole, I really don't like hearing people hating on it. You don't have to like it, or respect it, you just shouldn't be a d**k about it. It's a sensitive topic, and I get that you don't like it, so I know where this will go if I respond back to you.
This still feels kind of sexist though. Like, the issue I have is that if a guy did the same thing, he would have to tell his girlfriend right away. How "DARE" he dodge the subject like a "TYPICAL MAN!" But when a girl does something shitty, we have to "wait" to ask her about it? That's just kind of messed up. I just don't like the double standards.

Yeah, I've only blocked like 2 people, and they are people who are continually antagonistic. I like a good argument, not a bunch of name calling.

The personal choice one makes is personal, and doesn't need justification. I just get annoyed when that justification doesn't make much sense at all.

I feel that religion poisons everything it touches. That's the short version. It makes people choose ignorance over knowledge, and obedience over creativity.

I don't know why you're getting that sexist vibe from me. I don't think any man needs to explain his previous sexual encounters to me, and if he does, I'm not going to feel like he wronged me because he had sex before. The only thing I'd want him to tell me is if he has had sex so that if we do get intimate, we know that we need to use protection until he's been tested, even for the minimal risk things. But he could tell me that on his own time. I'm not going to pry unless he wants more intimacy. I think the same should apply to me. A man can expect to hear my 'past sexual encounters (I've had none, but they'd still want to know if I had), but I would only tell them when I wanted to.
Eh, if the justification doesn't make sense, it doesn't matter. It's still, to some extent, a personal decision. If they actually stick to it, they probably actually wanted it, even if they said they were doing it for other reasons.
Religion doesn't do that, at least not to everyone. I'm studying as a scientist (veterinary medicine is my goal), and am a bit of a Philosopher. I also like to think I'm quite creative. There's benefits to being a liberal theist (or atheist) or an agnostic theist (or atheist). You learn to be a part of your faith while still being open to the world. That's why, as a Christian, I adore religions of all kinds. I think they're important to the world, for culture and the pursuit of knowledge. Stop it you >:(
I'm getting that vibe from a lot of people lately. It seems like it's just generally accepted that it's okay for girls to sleep around, or date other guys, or be "confused " in ways that if a guy did it, he'd be a monster.

Personally, I ask my partner about sexual history not just for medical reasons (because I would want them to get tested regardless of their answer), but also because if I am having sex with someone, I love them and want to understand them. So if they lie to me, or leave something out, or won't tell me how they really felt about it, that is a trust issue for me. And I would certainly not have sex with them until they resolved that issue.

See, we may have to agree to disagree on that. I find it very, very annoying and stupid when a person has faulty, ridiculous justification for something that honestly doesn't even need justification. They should not need to claim to religion, morals, traditions, or weirdo explanations about so-called "safety". All they have to do is say they aren't ready. NO ONE would EVER make fun of them for saying that. People (adults, anyway) get made fun of for being virgins usually because they have really dumb reasons for it. As for kids picking on each other in high school, that has nothing to do with anyone's "reasons" although someone who is loudly religious about their virginity, and/OR stands up on a soapbox about it is making themselves a target.

Personally I just don't think it's everyone's business if you're a virgin (or not). I don't get why virgins complain about being made fun of when they choose to expose themselves. I was a virgin until I was 19 years old and I NEVER got made fun of for it. Ever. I heard people talk trash about virgins in general, but no one came up to me about it. It's honestly because I never really talked about it and never made myself a target to be made fun of. My "reasons" were SOLELY because I did not want to have sex with someone unless I thought they were the "right one", and I hadn't found that person yet.

If a person states stupid reasons for being a virgin, sticks to it, and yes, clearly "actually wanted it", it just doens't make their EXCUSES less annoying to me. As I said before, this goes without needing justification, so it kind of just looks ridiculous when people try to justify it. It only DOESN'T look ridiculous with justification when their justification actually makes some sort of logical sense. I HAVE seen virgins use REASONABLE justification, such as "I can't risk getting pregnant" or "I haven't found the right person yet" etc. etc.

I am not going to argue with the religious aspect of your post. I am simply going to say that while I know religious people can be creative, smart, and all of those great things, it is my personal observation that their faith OFTEN stunts theor potential. It is not a 100% of the time thing.
Inscriven's avatar

Liberal Sex Symbol

Drifting through Infinity

If people want to take that up on their own volition, then that's fine. But the way it is culturally pressured on society is very destructive. It's not a coincidence in the least that significantly more teen pregnancies happen in conservative states who force abstinence only education than more liberal ones that offer safe sex ed.
Embracing conservative values is the key to reducing teen pregnancies (and teen sex, in general, which is a problem that your average liberal chooses to ignore in favor of preventing a few of the issues that arise from teen sex, namely pregnancies and STDs). I love how you restrict your perspective to America to reach your conclusions, a country where sex is so pervasive in entertainment and media (the extremely liberal media) that I find it laughable that you'd think faulty sex ed. is the reason behind all or most of America's problems regarding teen sex.

East Asian countries and countries in the Mediterranean have among the lowest teen pregnancy rates in the world. Not surprisingly, they also happen to be places where conservative values are still the strongest.

Yes, my view is Americentric because that's the country I am focused on. East asian countries are a whole different issue because they have completely different dynamics and situations like the Japanese age crisis, or the Chinese artificial limits on reproduction that cannot be compared to the West. The EU however, has lower pregnancy rates, lower accident rates, and lower drug abuse rates than the United States despite being more liberal in their laws.The conservative view that if you pretend sex does not exist they won't have it is demonstratably false in statistical evidence. People love sex, they are naturally attracted to it, and will have it regardless of whatever draconian rules people put on it. The liberal perspective is an acceptance of that reality, and attempt to mitigate damage to the greater society.

The "liberal media" is a bullshit myth. The media in the US is controlled by five companies, Fox News being the most obviously politically biased one, while the others lean less to the right. MSNBC caters to the left because it's an underserved demographic. Clear Channel, the biggest radio corp in the US is controlled by a private holding company once under the control of Mitt Romney. Newscorp and all the different media properties owned by Murdoch like the WSJ are all strongly right leaning in accordance to Murdoch's ideology, and they are even interfering in UK politics as well.

The more the far right wing pushes "conservative values" the more the resistance will get. Because that word is a code word for "fundamental christian viewpoints" that moderate christians will balk at, and non-Christians will raise hell over.
Since issues with your sex life can ruin a marriage I can't help but wonder if people that have sex after marriage are more likely to divorce or not, since they didn't experience any sex life issues before their marriage.

There was a few studies done a few years ago...will try n find them in my books that showed people who live together and sleep together before marriage have a higher rate of divorce. The thing is though when the studies are looked at more closely I don't think they show what the people wanted them to. The fact is people who live and sleep together before marriage tend to be less religious and less religious people also tend to not care as much about the stigma of divorce while those who are religious avoid divorce b/c it tends to go against their beliefs.

So it's more about the feelings towards each other than the rate of divorces that should be taken in consideration?
I can also see why people don't get divorced because of others reasons, too, such as children or money issues.

I guess what I was actually trying to say is that I wonder if people who have sex after marriage have a higher risk of "falling out of love" or not. I can see how it might not be an issue if sex isn't such an important part of their lives though, which might be the case if they've decided to even not engage in it until after getting married.

What I was saying was that there were studies done that answered your question. They all said that those who wait to have sex until after marriage are LESS likely to fall out of love or divorce. Actually, most people (not all but most) who wait until marriage consider it a very important parts of their lives as they do not consider it to be a "sport" or just something you do etc.

So it was also about love? Sorry, I just worded my first post quite weird. I meant love all in all, to be honest, not just actually divorce. But I'm glad you took the time to answer it, since it's quite interesting in itself how something most people think is the case might not actually be the case.

So how come married couples that take it just as "something you do" are more likely to divorce? Does it have anything to do with their sex lives, something else or both? I'm not planning on getting married myself, I'm just curious.

IF someone chooses to believe those particular studies it is believed that couples who just take it as something you do are more likely to divorce because of differences in values and the fact that most who believe this way also have no problem with divorce.

Makes sense. The studies might have some truth in them, at least.
Yes. At my school ,all the girls are getting pregnant by no good guys. im like one of the few virgins that go there, and on random moments girls may ask me do i have a boyfriend or am i a virgin because they see how nice my body is shaped and how pretty they think i am. (I dont really think im pretty i think im the typical Plain Jane) lol And i'll always say no xD
@gngrsnaps THANKYOU FOR THE TIP!! <3333333333
Milady Alluca's avatar

Girl-Crazy Capitalist

I've never gotten any flack for being a virgin, I'm almost nineteen and have never even dated, not because of religion or morals or anything, just didn't do it. Thing is I never really drew attention to it and I didn't hang around people where that sort of thing came up often in conversation - friends I hang with just don't talk about personal sexual things really. I'm not ashamed of it, but I'm not proud of it either, it's just my current set of reality. I don't know when I'll have sex but I do know it'll be when I want to and feel ready for it and that's just that.

Until then there's always the healthy and stress relieving alternative of masturbation so yay, no one's losing.

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