Welcome to Gaia! ::


Liberal Bibliophile

34,100 Points
  • Bookworm 100
  • I Voted! 25
  • Elocutionist 200
We should be shamed by the responses to the child refugees on the US border

Quote:
In the United States, it seems that childhood is a privilege afforded to only certain people. We only recently ended juvenile executions and still practice juvenile life without parole; we are a country that lets children go without food and water; we are a nation that purports to welcome "your tired, your poor, your huddled masses yearning to breathe free" – only to stack up the juvenile poor like cord wood in euphemistically-named government "detention centers" before bussing them back to whatever violent place from whence they fled.

And we call ourselves the "home of the brave".

There is a crisis at the US-Central America border, where over 52,000 unaccompanied migrant children have been taken into state custody since last October. There is a crisis of courage at the US capital in Washington, where hundreds of unabashed politicians have taken the last three weeks to muster responses as vile as these:

Quote:
Earlier this week, Texas governor Rick Perry announced that he would deploy 1,000 National Guard troops to the border to attempt to prevent more children from crossing it.
President Obama requested $3.7bn dollars in emergency funding that would, in part, hire more immigration judges to expedite deportation proceedings against the children.
House Republicans are proposing a repeal of the Bush-era law that allows child refugees to be placed in the custody of resident relatives until they have to appear for a hearing, and instead would force them to remains in the state's custody until they see an immigration judge or agree to "voluntary" deportation.
Senator John McCain, the Republican party's 2008 candidate for president, suggested removing "planeloads of these young people" to send a message to their parents.


Arguing for the mass removal – by the planeload – of underage refugees seeking asylum from systemic violence is a brutal response to a humanitarian crisis involving children. But simply putting the migrants before immigration judges more quickly – to expedite our kicking them out as fast as inhumanely possible – is by no means to insure that their needs will be adequately met, as children or as refugees.

Unlike in domestic legal proceedings in juvenile criminal and family courts – where children have the right to lawyers and, in some cases, court-appointed guardians ad litem – children in immigration proceedings are not provided court-appointed counsel. That means that, if and when these kids do get to see a judge, they may not have an adult to help them make their case. Earlier this month, the ACLU filed a nationwide, class-action lawsuit on behalf of the thousands of children put in this situation, charging that the government violated both Constitutional due process and a immigration law requiring a "full and fair hearing".

Imagine a five-year-old who doesn't speak English representing him- or herself in an adversarial legal process. Then imagine that that courtroom – despite domestic and international law – does not even need to prioritize the best interest of the child.

All 50 states have statutes that require courts to consider the "best interest of the child" when making decisions about their custody or placement in domestic court proceedings. The statutes vary by state, but they are all meant to prioritize the health, safety, physical and emotional well-being of children, so that the state doesn't knowingly send a child into a dangerous situation. International law has a similar standard, as outlined by the United Nations Conventions on the Rights of the Child (CRC):

In all actions concerning children, whether undertaken by public or private social welfare institutions, courts of law, administrative authorities or legislative bodies, the best interests of the child shall be a primary consideration.

The idea of affording children special protection is so uncontroversial that the CRC has been ratified by more countries than any human rights treaty in history (though not yet by the United States). However, the "best interest of the child" standard is not binding in immigration court. The well-being of a child facing deportation proceedings is not prioritized the same way as a child holding a US passport – youth, innocence, and dependence notwithstanding. It's almost as if the young people at the border are not children in the eyes of US law.

But the principle, however ineptly or unjustly applied in some US family courts, of "best interest of the child" – that young people deserve care and protection precisely because they are young – falls apart when it is applied selectively. To recognize the childhood of a kid in one courtroom while turning our backs on those in another is not only logically inconsistent, but morally.

Much of the border debate has centered around whether or not the children will "have their day in court" – a phrase that evokes justice and due process. But a day in court is not the be-all, end-all of justice. A child, alone and traumatized, standing in a courtroom with no representation hardly resembles due process. By chipping away at special protections for young refugees, rather than building them up, the United States is doing more than denying these children legal status and safety – it is denying their childhood itself.

Quotable Prophet

The problem is they're wanting to claim refugee status based on an issue that many Americans also face but don't receive any such benefits for. If they want to come as refugees, we have a process for that. Hopping the border is not it.

They've also broken the law in their hopping the border to come here, but apparently that issue spotlight tends to get neglected in favor of calling the people angry over the matter racist, xenophobic, inhuman, unfeeling, and all sorts of nasty names. Because it's not like we could be legitimately angry about the open and willful breaking of our laws. That's just silly.

Oh, and how many of those people actually went to their court hearings to argue this status? Anybody want to guess?
Nobody Famous
The problem is they're wanting to claim refugee status based on an issue that many Americans also face but don't receive any such benefits for. If they want to come as refugees, we have a process for that. Hopping the border is not it.

They've also broken the law in their hopping the border to come here, but apparently that issue spotlight tends to get neglected in favor of calling the people angry over the matter racist, xenophobic, inhuman, unfeeling, and all sorts of nasty names. Because it's not like we could be legitimately angry about the open and willful breaking of our laws. That's just silly.

Oh, and how many of those people actually went to their court hearings to argue this status? Anybody want to guess?


I don't know what's more silly; expecting refugees fleeing a country to wait around when they're clearly in danger or expecting children to grasp and be able to navigate the legal system when children in your own country aren't expected to do that.

Quotable Prophet

LetTheEaglesSoar
Nobody Famous
The problem is they're wanting to claim refugee status based on an issue that many Americans also face but don't receive any such benefits for. If they want to come as refugees, we have a process for that. Hopping the border is not it.

They've also broken the law in their hopping the border to come here, but apparently that issue spotlight tends to get neglected in favor of calling the people angry over the matter racist, xenophobic, inhuman, unfeeling, and all sorts of nasty names. Because it's not like we could be legitimately angry about the open and willful breaking of our laws. That's just silly.

Oh, and how many of those people actually went to their court hearings to argue this status? Anybody want to guess?


I don't know what's more silly; expecting refugees fleeing a country to wait around when they're clearly in danger or expecting children to grasp and be able to navigate the legal system when children in your own country aren't expected to do that.


And yet somehow they're able to grasp how to make the trip to another country and what to say to try to stay.

Again, they're trying to claim refugee status for issues with gangs. What exactly are the people in Chicago getting for that issue?
Nobody Famous
LetTheEaglesSoar
Nobody Famous
The problem is they're wanting to claim refugee status based on an issue that many Americans also face but don't receive any such benefits for. If they want to come as refugees, we have a process for that. Hopping the border is not it.

They've also broken the law in their hopping the border to come here, but apparently that issue spotlight tends to get neglected in favor of calling the people angry over the matter racist, xenophobic, inhuman, unfeeling, and all sorts of nasty names. Because it's not like we could be legitimately angry about the open and willful breaking of our laws. That's just silly.

Oh, and how many of those people actually went to their court hearings to argue this status? Anybody want to guess?


I don't know what's more silly; expecting refugees fleeing a country to wait around when they're clearly in danger or expecting children to grasp and be able to navigate the legal system when children in your own country aren't expected to do that.


And yet somehow they're able to grasp how to make the trip to another country and what to say to try to stay.

Again, they're trying to claim refugee status for issues with gangs. What exactly are the people in Chicago getting for that issue?


Quote:
Applying for Asylum Status

How you apply for asylum status depends on whether you are at a U.S. border or entry point (such as an airport) or already in the country.

Applying at U.S. Borders and Entry Points. If you're at the U.S. border or airport and have a valid visa or entry document, it's best to use that to enter, without raising the issue of your need for asylum. If, however, the U.S. officials don't want to let you in, you can explain that you fear returning to your home country and ask to apply for asylum.

At that point, things will move very quickly. You may be put into a detention facility while you wait to be sent to a "credible fear" hearing with a USCIS asylum officer, which usually happens within a day or two. The officer does not have the power to approve your request for asylum -- only to decide whether you truly seem to be afraid of persecution and, therefore, deserve to have a judge hear your case. However, the officer has the power to deny people's requests and send them home without further appeals.

If you convince the asylum officer that you have a credible fear of persecution, you'll get no more than seven days to prepare to see an immigration judge -- which can make it very hard to find an attorney and properly prepare your case.


User Image - Blocked by "Display Image" Settings. Click to show.

The murder rate is pretty ******** high. Honduras where a lot of these refugees are from has a murder rate of 90.4. The United States as a whole is sitting at 4.8 The worst state is Louisiana at 11.0. District of Columbia is 21.8

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_intentional_homicide_rate#Mexico

http://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/ucr/crime-in-the-u.s/2010/crime-in-the-u.s.-2010/tables/table-8/10tbl08il.xls

Chicago is about 15 from the last one I cared to google search.

I don't think you could handle living in a country with 5 times Chicago's murder rate.
What should be shamed are the people who took their children on this dangerous journey.These kids have crossed deserts and swam oceans to get here and God knows how many kids didn't make it. Such behavior should be discouraged.

Liberal Bibliophile

34,100 Points
  • Bookworm 100
  • I Voted! 25
  • Elocutionist 200
God Emperor Baldur
What should be shamed are the people who took their children on this dangerous journey.These kids have crossed deserts and swam oceans to get here and God knows how many kids didn't make it. Such behavior should be discouraged.

These kids are often coming here unaccompanied by relatives.
kiironobara
God Emperor Baldur
What should be shamed are the people who took their children on this dangerous journey.These kids have crossed deserts and swam oceans to get here and God knows how many kids didn't make it. Such behavior should be discouraged.

These kids are often coming here unaccompanied by relatives.

How can they be "unaccompanied" by anyone? That is a contradiction in of itself. If you meant accompanied by relatives, then they are purposely endangering their children. If you meant their relatives sent them on the journey, basically telling them to ******** off, then even more shame to them.

Liberal Bibliophile

34,100 Points
  • Bookworm 100
  • I Voted! 25
  • Elocutionist 200
God Emperor Baldur
kiironobara
God Emperor Baldur
What should be shamed are the people who took their children on this dangerous journey.These kids have crossed deserts and swam oceans to get here and God knows how many kids didn't make it. Such behavior should be discouraged.

These kids are often coming here unaccompanied by relatives.

How can they be "unaccompanied" by anyone? That is a contradiction in of itself. If you meant accompanied by relatives, then they are purposely endangering their children. If you meant their relatives sent them on the journey, basically telling them to ******** off, then even more shame to them.

Many of these children are fleeing violence or gangs which kidnapped them.
kiironobara
God Emperor Baldur
kiironobara
God Emperor Baldur
What should be shamed are the people who took their children on this dangerous journey.These kids have crossed deserts and swam oceans to get here and God knows how many kids didn't make it. Such behavior should be discouraged.

These kids are often coming here unaccompanied by relatives.

How can they be "unaccompanied" by anyone? That is a contradiction in of itself. If you meant accompanied by relatives, then they are purposely endangering their children. If you meant their relatives sent them on the journey, basically telling them to ******** off, then even more shame to them.

Many of these children are fleeing violence or gangs which kidnapped them.

And that somehow excuses making these kids trek deserts where they are statistically way more likely to die?

Lord Elwrind's Queen

Dangerous Fairy

55,065 Points
  • Waffles! 25
  • Team Poison Master 250
  • Winged 100
God Emperor Baldur
kiironobara
God Emperor Baldur
What should be shamed are the people who took their children on this dangerous journey.These kids have crossed deserts and swam oceans to get here and God knows how many kids didn't make it. Such behavior should be discouraged.

These kids are often coming here unaccompanied by relatives.

How can they be "unaccompanied" by anyone? That is a contradiction in of itself. If you meant accompanied by relatives, then they are purposely endangering their children. If you meant their relatives sent them on the journey, basically telling them to ******** off, then even more shame to them.


Ever stop to think that a lot of these kids simply ran away? On their own?

Some of the kids are brought up by their parents and then sent through the border. (interview with a mother)
But yeah. They are all trying to escape their situation down there Because if they dont join the gangs, they will get killed. Not that they might not get killed anyway, but you know...
The situation is SO bad, that local law enforcement kind of disappears come sun down and even during the day does not get involved. That is how violent the gangs are and how deadly the situation is. There are reporters and agents from our country down there NOW investigating all of this at the places where it's all happening. Sending the immigrant children back is a death sentence. Literally!
Also, the gangs are all tied to the drug cartels.

Liberal Bibliophile

34,100 Points
  • Bookworm 100
  • I Voted! 25
  • Elocutionist 200
God Emperor Baldur
kiironobara
God Emperor Baldur
kiironobara
God Emperor Baldur
What should be shamed are the people who took their children on this dangerous journey.These kids have crossed deserts and swam oceans to get here and God knows how many kids didn't make it. Such behavior should be discouraged.

These kids are often coming here unaccompanied by relatives.

How can they be "unaccompanied" by anyone? That is a contradiction in of itself. If you meant accompanied by relatives, then they are purposely endangering their children. If you meant their relatives sent them on the journey, basically telling them to ******** off, then even more shame to them.

Many of these children are fleeing violence or gangs which kidnapped them.

And that somehow excuses making these kids trek deserts where they are statistically way more likely to die?

Really? So you're saying we have thousands of bodies in the desert waiting to be discovered, as opposed to the mass graves that are known to exist in their home nations as a result of gangs and other sorts of violence? Please provide these "statistics" that state they are more likely to die.

Yeah, I'm gonna go ahead and suggest you actually research this issue. Kind of tired of feeding you information only to have you forget it the next time a thread is made regarding the issue.
Nyadriel
God Emperor Baldur
kiironobara
God Emperor Baldur
What should be shamed are the people who took their children on this dangerous journey.These kids have crossed deserts and swam oceans to get here and God knows how many kids didn't make it. Such behavior should be discouraged.

These kids are often coming here unaccompanied by relatives.

How can they be "unaccompanied" by anyone? That is a contradiction in of itself. If you meant accompanied by relatives, then they are purposely endangering their children. If you meant their relatives sent them on the journey, basically telling them to ******** off, then even more shame to them.


Ever stop to think that a lot of these kids simply ran away? On their own?

Some of the kids are brought up by their parents and then sent through the border. (interview with a mother)
But yeah. They are all trying to escape their situation down there Because if they dont join the gangs, they will get killed. Not that they might not get killed anyway, but you know...
The situation is SO bad, that local law enforcement kind of disappears come sun down and even during the day does not get involved. That is how violent the gangs are and how deadly the situation is. There are reporters and agents from our country down there NOW investigating all of this at the places where it's all happening. Sending the immigrant children back is a death sentence. Literally!
Also, the gangs are all tied to the drug cartels.

You know what else is also dangerous? Trekking the ocean. Do you think the odds there are any better? We are only departing the kids we know of that made it to the US.

Quotable Prophet

LetTheEaglesSoar
Nobody Famous
LetTheEaglesSoar
Nobody Famous
The problem is they're wanting to claim refugee status based on an issue that many Americans also face but don't receive any such benefits for. If they want to come as refugees, we have a process for that. Hopping the border is not it.

They've also broken the law in their hopping the border to come here, but apparently that issue spotlight tends to get neglected in favor of calling the people angry over the matter racist, xenophobic, inhuman, unfeeling, and all sorts of nasty names. Because it's not like we could be legitimately angry about the open and willful breaking of our laws. That's just silly.

Oh, and how many of those people actually went to their court hearings to argue this status? Anybody want to guess?


I don't know what's more silly; expecting refugees fleeing a country to wait around when they're clearly in danger or expecting children to grasp and be able to navigate the legal system when children in your own country aren't expected to do that.


And yet somehow they're able to grasp how to make the trip to another country and what to say to try to stay.

Again, they're trying to claim refugee status for issues with gangs. What exactly are the people in Chicago getting for that issue?


Quote:
Applying for Asylum Status

How you apply for asylum status depends on whether you are at a U.S. border or entry point (such as an airport) or already in the country.

Applying at U.S. Borders and Entry Points. If you're at the U.S. border or airport and have a valid visa or entry document, it's best to use that to enter, without raising the issue of your need for asylum. If, however, the U.S. officials don't want to let you in, you can explain that you fear returning to your home country and ask to apply for asylum.

At that point, things will move very quickly. You may be put into a detention facility while you wait to be sent to a "credible fear" hearing with a USCIS asylum officer, which usually happens within a day or two. The officer does not have the power to approve your request for asylum -- only to decide whether you truly seem to be afraid of persecution and, therefore, deserve to have a judge hear your case. However, the officer has the power to deny people's requests and send them home without further appeals.

If you convince the asylum officer that you have a credible fear of persecution, you'll get no more than seven days to prepare to see an immigration judge -- which can make it very hard to find an attorney and properly prepare your case.


User Image - Blocked by "Display Image" Settings. Click to show.

The murder rate is pretty ******** high. Honduras where a lot of these refugees are from has a murder rate of 90.4. The United States as a whole is sitting at 4.8 The worst state is Louisiana at 11.0. District of Columbia is 21.8

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_intentional_homicide_rate#Mexico

http://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/ucr/crime-in-the-u.s/2010/crime-in-the-u.s.-2010/tables/table-8/10tbl08il.xls

Chicago is about 15 from the last one I cared to google search.

I don't think you could handle living in a country with 5 times Chicago's murder rate.


You're missing out on a big part of that process. For them to convince anybody of anything and gain asylum status, it's required for them to go to their court dates to argue that point and to apply for asylum. But, oh! What do you know? THEY DON'T. So yeah, not buying the refugee excuse.

In addition, reports are constantly coming in that the real reason they're coming here isn't so much the gang war that has apparently been going on for years and didn't warrant a mass exodus of this magnitude, but because they want the rights and benefits of living in the US and due to the belief that they can simply show up and be free to stay. Where did you think the "permissos" statements came from?

And it especially doesn't help when more illegal immigrants show up in droves to protest "unfair treatment" of being deported for having broken laws, hopped the border, and demanding rights that they actually don't have right to, having not gone through any of the processes required to become actual citizens. For your statements that I wouldn't survive there, I wouldn't even have the opportunity to attempt what they've done, as I'd have been arrested immediately and shipped to jail if I attempted anything similar to what these people are doing.

Lord Elwrind's Queen

Dangerous Fairy

55,065 Points
  • Waffles! 25
  • Team Poison Master 250
  • Winged 100
God Emperor Baldur
Nyadriel
God Emperor Baldur
kiironobara
God Emperor Baldur
What should be shamed are the people who took their children on this dangerous journey.These kids have crossed deserts and swam oceans to get here and God knows how many kids didn't make it. Such behavior should be discouraged.

These kids are often coming here unaccompanied by relatives.

How can they be "unaccompanied" by anyone? That is a contradiction in of itself. If you meant accompanied by relatives, then they are purposely endangering their children. If you meant their relatives sent them on the journey, basically telling them to ******** off, then even more shame to them.


Ever stop to think that a lot of these kids simply ran away? On their own?

Some of the kids are brought up by their parents and then sent through the border. (interview with a mother)
But yeah. They are all trying to escape their situation down there Because if they dont join the gangs, they will get killed. Not that they might not get killed anyway, but you know...
The situation is SO bad, that local law enforcement kind of disappears come sun down and even during the day does not get involved. That is how violent the gangs are and how deadly the situation is. There are reporters and agents from our country down there NOW investigating all of this at the places where it's all happening. Sending the immigrant children back is a death sentence. Literally!
Also, the gangs are all tied to the drug cartels.

You know what else is also dangerous? Trekking the ocean. Do you think the odds there are any better? We are only departing the kids we know of that made it to the US.


How about a little more love and compassion and a lot less prejudice. Huh?
Personally, I think they should be sent elsewhere rather than back to their homes if they are not allowed to stay. They are JUST children, for God's sakes! They are not bringing that violence with them! Unless accompanied by gang members who are still gang members and not ones that are trying to escape (problem here is that there is no escaping the gangs once you have joined because the gangs dont let you. But some are trying anyway and think that coming here will help them to escape)

Quick Reply

Submit
Manage Your Items
Other Stuff
Get GCash
Offers
Get Items
More Items
Where Everyone Hangs Out
Other Community Areas
Virtual Spaces
Fun Stuff
Gaia's Games
Mini-Games
Play with GCash
Play with Platinum