Welcome to Gaia! ::


Dangerous Lunatic

Link

Quote:
(PAUL JOSEPH WATSON) --- Speculation is raging that the judge in the George Zimmerman case could have been put under pressure by the Obama administration after she staged a bizarre outburst during which she interrogated Zimmerman while repeatedly silencing his lawyers.

The hostile exchange began when Judge Debra Nelson asked Zimmerman if he planned to testify.

Essentially, Judge Nelson told Zimmerman he had the “absolute right to remain silent” but then proceeded to demand he answer her questions interrogation-style while silencing his lawyers.

Defense attorney Don West twice objected to Nelson’s interrogation, prompting the judge to raised her voice and exclaim, “Your objection is overruled!” in a manner more befitting of an angry parent lecturing a child than a legal professional.

Both of Zimmerman’s lawyers appeared shocked as attorney Mark O’Mara asked under his breath, “what is going on?”

Several legal experts and observers said the outburst was unprecedented.

“I have never seen that in more than 30 years of court reporting,” tweeted journalist Kathi Belich.

Former Senatorial candidate Richard Rivette also expressed his shock at the judge’s behavior.

“This judge is an idiot. I spent five years investigating high profile capital cases defending people from the death penalty, and worked for the Federal judiciary as an independent investigator on other cases. No judge ever inquires as to whether a defendant will testify until the entire defense case is presented. If the defense rests and does not call the defendant then the judge knows there will be no testimony. If the defense calls the defendant then that’s when the judge finds out. They have to get through the entire case first. To see if it is valid after prosecution cross-examines their witnesses and experts as to whether a defendant SHOULD testify, which is decided in private not in public, and NOT on the record. By doing this, the judge has undermined a portion of Zimmerman’s credibility. He looks like he is waffling and this is normal judge/defendant questioning, which it is NOT,” said Rivette.

Respondents to the story at the National Review Online also expressed their view that Zimmerman was being railroaded.

“A fix is in from the administration to find Zimmerman guilty regardless of what it takes,” commented one.

“By demanding that Zimmerman respond to a question, after she has assured him that he has the right to remain silent, she is undermining his right to remain silent and making it appear as though he and his attorneys are not firm in their convictions. This judge is shameless,” added another.

Judge Nelson also ruled this week that Trayvon Martin’s text messages, which showed that Martin had been involved in fights before and was trying to buy or sell a gun, cannot be shown to the jury, which some suggested was another indication of an anti-Zimmerman bias.

Nelson also granted a request by prosecutors to block the defense’s attempt to show the jury a computer-animated depiction of the fight between Martin and Zimmerman.

She is also likely to allow the jury to consider lesser charges against Zimmerman in light of the prosecution’s probable failure to prove its case for second-degree murder, another indication that the state is desperate to avoid him walking free.

Judge Nelson has been very careful at every stage of the trial to dismiss evidence or testimony that could convince the jury in favor of acquitting Zimmerman.

Now some are asking the question – did Nelson’s aggressive outburst represent an attempt to prejudice the jury against Zimmerman?

Given the likelihood that Zimmerman will be acquitted, has Judge Nelson been put under pressure by the federal government to aggressively advocate for the prosecution, just as Supreme Court Justice John Roberts was apparently pressured to vote to uphold Obamacare?

Ever since President Barack Obama personally inserted himself into the controversy by declaring Trayvon Martin to be akin to the son he never had, higher-ups have constantly meddled in the case in an effort to secure a murder charge for a scenario that Zimmerman would not normally have even been arrested for under Florida’s Stand Your Ground law.

Indeed, ex-Sanford police chief Bill Lee told CNN yesterday that “he felt pressure from city officials to arrest Zimmerman to placate the public rather than as a matter of justice,” and that his investigation “provided no probable cause to arrest Zimmerman at the scene.”

It also emerged this week that the federal government encouraged and funded last year’s protests demanding the arrest of Zimmerman via the Community Relations Service, a division of the Department of Justice. Documents obtained by Judicial Watch show that the CRS was “deployed to Sanford, FL, following the Trayvon Martin shooting to help organize and manage rallies and protests against George Zimmerman,” spending millions of dollars in the process.

Given the plethora of threats by Trayvon supporters to stage violent riots if Zimmerman is acquitted, could Nelson be under pressure to secure a charge of at least manslaughter in order to avoid nationwide civil disorder?

If that’s the case, her apparent effort to prejudice the jury clearly suggests that a mistrial has taken place. Read the entire article via Infowars...

Alien Dog

17,850 Points
  • Citizen 200
  • Voter 100
  • Mark Twain 100
Given the way she's acted throughout the whole trial, I'm rather hoping it was corruption from on-high that was pressuring her into this, rather than her own personal bias against Zimmerman ( which, to be honest, personal bias is exactly what it looks to be. ).

Though, most Gaians'll shout you down for even suggesting it, and instead keep to their deep-seated Liberal prejudices and racism.

Conservative Voter

8,800 Points
  • Forum Sophomore 300
  • Marathon 300
  • Signature Look 250
“He had Skittles that he didn’t even steal from 7-11. He legitimately bought them.” - Bernie De La Rhionda

Frankly, if the judge were unbiased, that would open up a huge door for the defense, namely the fact that Trayvon was once suspended from school for possessing stolen items and a burglary tool. I hope Mark O'Mara brings that up tomorrow before the jury, though it will piss off the judge. Mar O'Mara can say BdlR opened the door to it when he said that Trayvon didn't steal the skittles.

Also, the defense should bring up Trayvon's fighting experience too, because again, BdlR opened the door by saying only George Zimmerman knew how to fight, even though Zimmerman's trainer testified that George Zimmerman had went from a 0.5 to a 1 in terms of skill on a scale of 1 to 10, which basically means he sucked.

Whereas, the defense had evidence that Trayvon had been in a fight, and had lost the first round because he got caught in a ground and poundm but he had won the next two rounds after that.

Trayvon told a friend that he wasn't done with the guy he had defeated, because he hadn't made the guy bleed enough; only from his nose. The biased judge refused to let the defense use that evidence, even though Rachel Jeantel (DeeDee) had verified that the fight had indeed occurred in her deposition, and that Trayvon had won, just like his text messages indicated.

It should be pointed out, that the judge based her 'authentication' decision on a facebook law, which applied mostly to social networking purposes. Authentication of texts and photo's on a phone have a more lax burden of proof for authentication, and when the prosecution used information from the phone, she accepted and authenticated it. Legally speaking, you cannot authenticate only for one side. Once she determined it met the burden of proof to authenticate it for the prosecution, that opened up all other evidence on the phone to the defense.

In other words, even if there is a conviction, because the prosecutor manipulates the jurors emotions and they wont recognize the lack of evidence the prosecution has, the decision to deny the defense the ability to use that evidence is a reversible offense, and any conviction will be overturned.

So if Mark O'Mara brings up that illegally excluded evidence tomorrow, and she again wont let him use it, then that will only strengthen the defenses case when it comes to overcoming any conviction.

Yuki_Windira's Husband

Invisible Hunter

13,800 Points
  • Perfect Attendance 400
  • Marathon 300
  • Forum Sophomore 300
So much even for pretending that they're trying to give him a fair trial.

Alien Dog

17,850 Points
  • Citizen 200
  • Voter 100
  • Mark Twain 100
JamesWN
So much even for pretending that they're trying to give him a fair trial.


When were they even pretending this was anything more than a dog-and-pony show to appease the masses?

Blessed Phantom

5,600 Points
  • Gender Swap 100
  • Signature Look 250
  • Friendly 100
A baseless suggestion from a site with an strong and obvious right-wing bias? Seems legit.

Yuki_Windira's Husband

Invisible Hunter

13,800 Points
  • Perfect Attendance 400
  • Marathon 300
  • Forum Sophomore 300
Versus the sites that spew left-wing bullshit left and right all over this board? No room to talk there. stare

Alien Dog

17,850 Points
  • Citizen 200
  • Voter 100
  • Mark Twain 100
Goldgato
A baseless suggestion from a site with an strong and obvious right-wing bias? Seems legit.


Baseless? I'd say the way the judge has been acting, and the fact that DC has already proven an unhealthy interest in this case forms some basis for this suggestion.

Blessed Phantom

5,600 Points
  • Gender Swap 100
  • Signature Look 250
  • Friendly 100
Keltoi Samurai
Goldgato
A baseless suggestion from a site with an strong and obvious right-wing bias? Seems legit.


Baseless? I'd say the way the judge has been acting, and the fact that DC has already proven an unhealthy interest in this case forms some basis for this suggestion.


Taking an interest in a case doesn't translate into interference. There's been no evidence that anyone in Obama's administration, much less Obama himself, has attempted to tamper with this case, so yes it is a baseless suggestion. I'm not sure I've even seen a motive mentioned for any alleged intervention. I don't even think the president has any power he could exert that could be counted as pressure. So unless you're suggesting that he went out of his way to ask her nicely to please give Zimmerman a hard time, I'm not sure what you mean by pressure.

Besides that, the judge has plenty of reasons to behave the way she has without "being pressured into it by the president" being at the top of the list. Personal bias would be the obvious one, but judges have been known to base their courtroom conduct on expected public reaction. She could even be feeling pressured by local officials. Maybe she's just off her meds. All of this makes significantly more sense than the suggestion that the president is pressuring her into acting the way she has, a suggestion which is not supported by actual evidence, so yes, it is a baseless suggestion. It is not rooted in either logic or facts.
Government involvement? There was a story making rounds about DOJ involvement that was interesting but I won't delv that way. Personal bias? Uh, duh. Our society marked Zimmy guilty of murder FAR before any hard evidence was brought to light. Hell, the moment I heard that stupid term "white hispanic" I knew at some point this case was going to get tainted and Zimmerman would be found guilty from something just to placate minorities. Hell, the DA even admited it as the reason charges were filed!

My prediction; there is ZERO evidence that Zimmerman had planned intent to kill Martin so the murder charge is DoA (as far as I see it). If they find him guilty, I'd be interested to see what piece of evidence proved without reasonable doubt that Zimmerman had intent to kill (in this day an age, just OWNING a gun is a reason apparently).

While evidence suggests strongly that Martin was the aggressor, we don't know, nor have any conclusive evidence who made the first aggressive action (I don't count following. It is niether aggressive, nor illegal). So the self-defense plea is up in the air.

With the judge allowing the charges for manslaughter, this is the most likely outcome (even though manslaughter charges were not formally filed).
Goldgato
Keltoi Samurai
Goldgato
A baseless suggestion from a site with an strong and obvious right-wing bias? Seems legit.


Baseless? I'd say the way the judge has been acting, and the fact that DC has already proven an unhealthy interest in this case forms some basis for this suggestion.


Taking an interest in a case doesn't translate into interference. There's been no evidence that anyone in Obama's administration, much less Obama himself, has attempted to tamper with this case, so yes it is a baseless suggestion. I'm not sure I've even seen a motive mentioned for any alleged intervention. I don't even think the president has any power he could exert that could be counted as pressure. So unless you're suggesting that he went out of his way to ask her nicely to please give Zimmerman a hard time, I'm not sure what you mean by pressure.

Besides that, the judge has plenty of reasons to behave the way she has without "being pressured into it by the president" being at the top of the list. Personal bias would be the obvious one, but judges have been known to base their courtroom conduct on expected public reaction. She could even be feeling pressured by local officials. Maybe she's just off her meds. All of this makes significantly more sense than the suggestion that the president is pressuring her into acting the way she has, a suggestion which is not supported by actual evidence, so yes, it is a baseless suggestion. It is not rooted in either logic or facts.


Source showing political interference.

(CNN) -- The George Zimmerman investigation was hijacked "in a number of ways" by outside forces, said the former police chief of Sanford, Florida.

Bill Lee, who testified Monday in Zimmerman's second-degree murder trial, told CNN's George Howell in an exclusive interview that he felt pressure from city officials to arrest Zimmerman to placate the public rather than as a matter of justice.

"It was (relayed) to me that they just wanted an arrest. They didn't care if it got dismissed later," he said. "You don't do that."

When Sanford police arrived on the scene on February 26, 2012, after Zimmerman fatally shot unarmed 17-year-old Trayvon Martin, they conducted a "sound" investigation, and the evidence provided no probable cause to arrest Zimmerman at the scene, he said.

It had nothing to do with Florida's controversial "Stand Your Ground" law, he said; from an investigative standpoint, it was purely a matter of self-defense.
Ex-police chief: I upheld my oath
Ex-police chief speaks about Zimmerman
Why did prosecutor, defense use a dummy?
Zimmerman trial standoff over evidence

Zimmerman told police he killed Martin after the teen attacked him. While the evidence at the time corroborated that claim, the ex-chief said, Lee's lead investigator made a recommendation that Zimmerman be charged with manslaughter.

Justice Dept. 'peacekeepers' worked 'Trayvon' rallies, group claims

It was a matter of protocol, Lee said. Arresting Zimmerman based on the evidence at hand would have been a violation of Zimmerman's Fourth Amendment rights, he said. Thus, the Sanford police presented a "capias request" to the state's attorney, asking that the prosecutor determine whether it was a "justifiable homicide," issue a warrant for arrest or present the case to a grand jury.

"The police department needed to do a job, and there was some influence -- outside influence and inside influence -- that forced a change in the course of the normal criminal justice process," Lee said. "With all the influence and the protests and petitions for an arrest, you still have to uphold your oath."

"That investigation was taken away from us. We weren't able to complete it," he said.

One example involved the 911 tapes, in which neighbors implored dispatchers to send police as a voice in the background screamed for help.

The Sanford police intended to release the tapes once the probe was over, Lee said, because you can't publicize evidence amid an investigation.

Instead, the mayor told him on March 16 the tapes had been released to Martin's family and the public. The family was asked to help identify voices, Lee said, but if police were in charge of the investigation, they wouldn't have presented evidence to a group.

"It should be done individually so there's no influence on the other people in the room," he said. "Then, there's no questions that can be brought up about how (an identification) was obtained or whether it was influenced."
I'm happy that at the end of the day I can walk away with my integrity.
Ex-Sanford Police Chief Bill Lee

Releasing the evidence to the public was problematic, as well, because it created the potential for someone to concoct a "story about what they observed when they really didn't observe it," he said.

Martin family attorney Jasmine Rand said she doesn't believe playing the tapes to a room full of people "makes any difference to the outcome of the case."

"We have to remember that that was played for the family in a private room because they were hearing the last moments of their son's life as he cried for help," Rand told CNN's Erin Burnett on Wednesday night. "And I think Sybrina Fulton (Martin's mother) got up and walked out of that room. She didn't sit in there and talk to everybody, because she had a visceral reaction when she heard her son yell for help and she couldn't help him because she knew he was dead."

Lee was placed on paid leave March 22, 2012, after the Sanford City Commission expressed a lack of confidence in him. The same commission rejected his resignation in a 3-2 vote a month later, with dissenting commissioners questioning the fairness of Lee's losing his job.

Two months later, Lee was sacked. City Manager Norton Bonaparte said in a news release, "The police chief needs to have the trust and respect of the elected officials and the confidence of the entire community."

Lee believes lack of confidence did play a role in his dismissal, he told CNN, but he also believes Bonaparte faced political pressure and terminated him "without cause," which was permitted under his employment contract.

"I upheld my oath," Lee said. "I'm happy that at the end of the day I can walk away with my integrity."
Zimmerman trial runs late into night
Manslaughter more likely?
Preparing for Zimmerman verdict
Legal panel: Judge won't allow animation

Asked whether he would do things differently given the opportunity, the 30-year veteran of law enforcement said there always are things he could change in hindsight, but he stands by the investigation.

At every turn in the 40-minute interview with CNN's Howell, Lee doggedly defended his investigators, saying race never played a role in any decision and that his officers "conducted an unbiased review."

Investigators knew letting Zimmerman walk free for 46 days was an unpopular decision -- and they took abuse for it -- "but they performed professionally. That's the mark of a strong police department."

Lee took issue with the media casting his department as apathetic or lackadaisical in the case.

"A lot of the information that was given out as fact was misinformation," he said. "It was reported in some media that we didn't conduct an investigation for two weeks, but yet in that same media they would show a photograph of a crime scene with crime scene tape, with patrol cars and blue lights and investigators on the scene."

Lee shrugged off the notion that he was hired to clean up racism and other problems in the department. His goal upon becoming chief was to improve professionalism and trust, and he set several goals, all of which were met during his 10-month tenure, he said.

One of his greatest regrets, he said, is that the Zimmerman investigation ultimately shattered his childhood dream to be police chief of the community where he was raised.

"It's a dream of a vision that is going to be unrealized," he said. "I'm at peace with it on most days. I'm a man of faith. But it stings.

In a relationship with Delle42

Agile Fatcat

5,900 Points
  • Battle: Rogue 100
  • Battle: Counterstrike 150
  • Battle: Level Up 200
Goldgato
A baseless suggestion from a site with an strong and obvious right-wing bias? Seems legit.
My sentiments exactly.

Blessed Phantom

5,600 Points
  • Gender Swap 100
  • Signature Look 250
  • Friendly 100
YahuShalum
Goldgato
Keltoi Samurai
Goldgato
A baseless suggestion from a site with an strong and obvious right-wing bias? Seems legit.


Baseless? I'd say the way the judge has been acting, and the fact that DC has already proven an unhealthy interest in this case forms some basis for this suggestion.


Taking an interest in a case doesn't translate into interference. There's been no evidence that anyone in Obama's administration, much less Obama himself, has attempted to tamper with this case, so yes it is a baseless suggestion. I'm not sure I've even seen a motive mentioned for any alleged intervention. I don't even think the president has any power he could exert that could be counted as pressure. So unless you're suggesting that he went out of his way to ask her nicely to please give Zimmerman a hard time, I'm not sure what you mean by pressure.

Besides that, the judge has plenty of reasons to behave the way she has without "being pressured into it by the president" being at the top of the list. Personal bias would be the obvious one, but judges have been known to base their courtroom conduct on expected public reaction. She could even be feeling pressured by local officials. Maybe she's just off her meds. All of this makes significantly more sense than the suggestion that the president is pressuring her into acting the way she has, a suggestion which is not supported by actual evidence, so yes, it is a baseless suggestion. It is not rooted in either logic or facts.


Source showing political interference.

(CNN) -- The George Zimmerman investigation was hijacked "in a number of ways" by outside forces, said the former police chief of Sanford, Florida.

Bill Lee, who testified Monday in Zimmerman's second-degree murder trial, told CNN's George Howell in an exclusive interview that he felt pressure from city officials to arrest Zimmerman to placate the public rather than as a matter of justice.

"It was (relayed) to me that they just wanted an arrest. They didn't care if it got dismissed later," he said. "You don't do that."

When Sanford police arrived on the scene on February 26, 2012, after Zimmerman fatally shot unarmed 17-year-old Trayvon Martin, they conducted a "sound" investigation, and the evidence provided no probable cause to arrest Zimmerman at the scene, he said.

It had nothing to do with Florida's controversial "Stand Your Ground" law, he said; from an investigative standpoint, it was purely a matter of self-defense.
Ex-police chief: I upheld my oath
Ex-police chief speaks about Zimmerman
Why did prosecutor, defense use a dummy?
Zimmerman trial standoff over evidence

Zimmerman told police he killed Martin after the teen attacked him. While the evidence at the time corroborated that claim, the ex-chief said, Lee's lead investigator made a recommendation that Zimmerman be charged with manslaughter.

Justice Dept. 'peacekeepers' worked 'Trayvon' rallies, group claims

It was a matter of protocol, Lee said. Arresting Zimmerman based on the evidence at hand would have been a violation of Zimmerman's Fourth Amendment rights, he said. Thus, the Sanford police presented a "capias request" to the state's attorney, asking that the prosecutor determine whether it was a "justifiable homicide," issue a warrant for arrest or present the case to a grand jury.

"The police department needed to do a job, and there was some influence -- outside influence and inside influence -- that forced a change in the course of the normal criminal justice process," Lee said. "With all the influence and the protests and petitions for an arrest, you still have to uphold your oath."

"That investigation was taken away from us. We weren't able to complete it," he said.

One example involved the 911 tapes, in which neighbors implored dispatchers to send police as a voice in the background screamed for help.

The Sanford police intended to release the tapes once the probe was over, Lee said, because you can't publicize evidence amid an investigation.

Instead, the mayor told him on March 16 the tapes had been released to Martin's family and the public. The family was asked to help identify voices, Lee said, but if police were in charge of the investigation, they wouldn't have presented evidence to a group.

"It should be done individually so there's no influence on the other people in the room," he said. "Then, there's no questions that can be brought up about how (an identification) was obtained or whether it was influenced."
I'm happy that at the end of the day I can walk away with my integrity.
Ex-Sanford Police Chief Bill Lee

Releasing the evidence to the public was problematic, as well, because it created the potential for someone to concoct a "story about what they observed when they really didn't observe it," he said.

Martin family attorney Jasmine Rand said she doesn't believe playing the tapes to a room full of people "makes any difference to the outcome of the case."

"We have to remember that that was played for the family in a private room because they were hearing the last moments of their son's life as he cried for help," Rand told CNN's Erin Burnett on Wednesday night. "And I think Sybrina Fulton (Martin's mother) got up and walked out of that room. She didn't sit in there and talk to everybody, because she had a visceral reaction when she heard her son yell for help and she couldn't help him because she knew he was dead."

Lee was placed on paid leave March 22, 2012, after the Sanford City Commission expressed a lack of confidence in him. The same commission rejected his resignation in a 3-2 vote a month later, with dissenting commissioners questioning the fairness of Lee's losing his job.

Two months later, Lee was sacked. City Manager Norton Bonaparte said in a news release, "The police chief needs to have the trust and respect of the elected officials and the confidence of the entire community."

Lee believes lack of confidence did play a role in his dismissal, he told CNN, but he also believes Bonaparte faced political pressure and terminated him "without cause," which was permitted under his employment contract.

"I upheld my oath," Lee said. "I'm happy that at the end of the day I can walk away with my integrity."
Zimmerman trial runs late into night
Manslaughter more likely?
Preparing for Zimmerman verdict
Legal panel: Judge won't allow animation

Asked whether he would do things differently given the opportunity, the 30-year veteran of law enforcement said there always are things he could change in hindsight, but he stands by the investigation.

At every turn in the 40-minute interview with CNN's Howell, Lee doggedly defended his investigators, saying race never played a role in any decision and that his officers "conducted an unbiased review."

Investigators knew letting Zimmerman walk free for 46 days was an unpopular decision -- and they took abuse for it -- "but they performed professionally. That's the mark of a strong police department."

Lee took issue with the media casting his department as apathetic or lackadaisical in the case.

"A lot of the information that was given out as fact was misinformation," he said. "It was reported in some media that we didn't conduct an investigation for two weeks, but yet in that same media they would show a photograph of a crime scene with crime scene tape, with patrol cars and blue lights and investigators on the scene."

Lee shrugged off the notion that he was hired to clean up racism and other problems in the department. His goal upon becoming chief was to improve professionalism and trust, and he set several goals, all of which were met during his 10-month tenure, he said.

One of his greatest regrets, he said, is that the Zimmerman investigation ultimately shattered his childhood dream to be police chief of the community where he was raised.

"It's a dream of a vision that is going to be unrealized," he said. "I'm at peace with it on most days. I'm a man of faith. But it stings.


I'm not sure what point you're trying to make, because this only supports what I already said: there is no evidence that Obama, his administration, or any other federal agent intervened in the proceedings. In this article, Lee mentions a number of local sources that he felt pressured by, which I already acknowledged as a possibility, but he mentions exactly zero sources of pressure beyond that.
Goldgato
YahuShalum
Goldgato
Keltoi Samurai
Goldgato
A baseless suggestion from a site with an strong and obvious right-wing bias? Seems legit.


Baseless? I'd say the way the judge has been acting, and the fact that DC has already proven an unhealthy interest in this case forms some basis for this suggestion.


Taking an interest in a case doesn't translate into interference. There's been no evidence that anyone in Obama's administration, much less Obama himself, has attempted to tamper with this case, so yes it is a baseless suggestion. I'm not sure I've even seen a motive mentioned for any alleged intervention. I don't even think the president has any power he could exert that could be counted as pressure. So unless you're suggesting that he went out of his way to ask her nicely to please give Zimmerman a hard time, I'm not sure what you mean by pressure.

Besides that, the judge has plenty of reasons to behave the way she has without "being pressured into it by the president" being at the top of the list. Personal bias would be the obvious one, but judges have been known to base their courtroom conduct on expected public reaction. She could even be feeling pressured by local officials. Maybe she's just off her meds. All of this makes significantly more sense than the suggestion that the president is pressuring her into acting the way she has, a suggestion which is not supported by actual evidence, so yes, it is a baseless suggestion. It is not rooted in either logic or facts.


Source showing political interference.

(CNN) -- The George Zimmerman investigation was hijacked "in a number of ways" by outside forces, said the former police chief of Sanford, Florida.

Bill Lee, who testified Monday in Zimmerman's second-degree murder trial, told CNN's George Howell in an exclusive interview that he felt pressure from city officials to arrest Zimmerman to placate the public rather than as a matter of justice.

"It was (relayed) to me that they just wanted an arrest. They didn't care if it got dismissed later," he said. "You don't do that."

When Sanford police arrived on the scene on February 26, 2012, after Zimmerman fatally shot unarmed 17-year-old Trayvon Martin, they conducted a "sound" investigation, and the evidence provided no probable cause to arrest Zimmerman at the scene, he said.

It had nothing to do with Florida's controversial "Stand Your Ground" law, he said; from an investigative standpoint, it was purely a matter of self-defense.
Ex-police chief: I upheld my oath
Ex-police chief speaks about Zimmerman
Why did prosecutor, defense use a dummy?
Zimmerman trial standoff over evidence

Zimmerman told police he killed Martin after the teen attacked him. While the evidence at the time corroborated that claim, the ex-chief said, Lee's lead investigator made a recommendation that Zimmerman be charged with manslaughter.

Justice Dept. 'peacekeepers' worked 'Trayvon' rallies, group claims

It was a matter of protocol, Lee said. Arresting Zimmerman based on the evidence at hand would have been a violation of Zimmerman's Fourth Amendment rights, he said. Thus, the Sanford police presented a "capias request" to the state's attorney, asking that the prosecutor determine whether it was a "justifiable homicide," issue a warrant for arrest or present the case to a grand jury.

"The police department needed to do a job, and there was some influence -- outside influence and inside influence -- that forced a change in the course of the normal criminal justice process," Lee said. "With all the influence and the protests and petitions for an arrest, you still have to uphold your oath."

"That investigation was taken away from us. We weren't able to complete it," he said.

One example involved the 911 tapes, in which neighbors implored dispatchers to send police as a voice in the background screamed for help.

The Sanford police intended to release the tapes once the probe was over, Lee said, because you can't publicize evidence amid an investigation.

Instead, the mayor told him on March 16 the tapes had been released to Martin's family and the public. The family was asked to help identify voices, Lee said, but if police were in charge of the investigation, they wouldn't have presented evidence to a group.

"It should be done individually so there's no influence on the other people in the room," he said. "Then, there's no questions that can be brought up about how (an identification) was obtained or whether it was influenced."
I'm happy that at the end of the day I can walk away with my integrity.
Ex-Sanford Police Chief Bill Lee

Releasing the evidence to the public was problematic, as well, because it created the potential for someone to concoct a "story about what they observed when they really didn't observe it," he said.

Martin family attorney Jasmine Rand said she doesn't believe playing the tapes to a room full of people "makes any difference to the outcome of the case."

"We have to remember that that was played for the family in a private room because they were hearing the last moments of their son's life as he cried for help," Rand told CNN's Erin Burnett on Wednesday night. "And I think Sybrina Fulton (Martin's mother) got up and walked out of that room. She didn't sit in there and talk to everybody, because she had a visceral reaction when she heard her son yell for help and she couldn't help him because she knew he was dead."

Lee was placed on paid leave March 22, 2012, after the Sanford City Commission expressed a lack of confidence in him. The same commission rejected his resignation in a 3-2 vote a month later, with dissenting commissioners questioning the fairness of Lee's losing his job.

Two months later, Lee was sacked. City Manager Norton Bonaparte said in a news release, "The police chief needs to have the trust and respect of the elected officials and the confidence of the entire community."

Lee believes lack of confidence did play a role in his dismissal, he told CNN, but he also believes Bonaparte faced political pressure and terminated him "without cause," which was permitted under his employment contract.

"I upheld my oath," Lee said. "I'm happy that at the end of the day I can walk away with my integrity."
Zimmerman trial runs late into night
Manslaughter more likely?
Preparing for Zimmerman verdict
Legal panel: Judge won't allow animation

Asked whether he would do things differently given the opportunity, the 30-year veteran of law enforcement said there always are things he could change in hindsight, but he stands by the investigation.

At every turn in the 40-minute interview with CNN's Howell, Lee doggedly defended his investigators, saying race never played a role in any decision and that his officers "conducted an unbiased review."

Investigators knew letting Zimmerman walk free for 46 days was an unpopular decision -- and they took abuse for it -- "but they performed professionally. That's the mark of a strong police department."

Lee took issue with the media casting his department as apathetic or lackadaisical in the case.

"A lot of the information that was given out as fact was misinformation," he said. "It was reported in some media that we didn't conduct an investigation for two weeks, but yet in that same media they would show a photograph of a crime scene with crime scene tape, with patrol cars and blue lights and investigators on the scene."

Lee shrugged off the notion that he was hired to clean up racism and other problems in the department. His goal upon becoming chief was to improve professionalism and trust, and he set several goals, all of which were met during his 10-month tenure, he said.

One of his greatest regrets, he said, is that the Zimmerman investigation ultimately shattered his childhood dream to be police chief of the community where he was raised.

"It's a dream of a vision that is going to be unrealized," he said. "I'm at peace with it on most days. I'm a man of faith. But it stings.


I'm not sure what point you're trying to make, because this only supports what I already said: there is no evidence that Obama, his administration, or any other federal agent intervened in the proceedings. In this article, Lee mentions a number of local sources that he felt pressured by, which I already acknowledged as a possibility, but he mentions exactly zero sources of pressure beyond that.
Oh I'm just showing there was a political reason to charge Zimmerman. I don't care who did it, it was done though and there should be impeachment of any public representative that did push for it.

Blessed Phantom

5,600 Points
  • Gender Swap 100
  • Signature Look 250
  • Friendly 100
YahuShalum
Goldgato
YahuShalum
Goldgato
Keltoi Samurai
Goldgato
A baseless suggestion from a site with an strong and obvious right-wing bias? Seems legit.


Baseless? I'd say the way the judge has been acting, and the fact that DC has already proven an unhealthy interest in this case forms some basis for this suggestion.


Taking an interest in a case doesn't translate into interference. There's been no evidence that anyone in Obama's administration, much less Obama himself, has attempted to tamper with this case, so yes it is a baseless suggestion. I'm not sure I've even seen a motive mentioned for any alleged intervention. I don't even think the president has any power he could exert that could be counted as pressure. So unless you're suggesting that he went out of his way to ask her nicely to please give Zimmerman a hard time, I'm not sure what you mean by pressure.

Besides that, the judge has plenty of reasons to behave the way she has without "being pressured into it by the president" being at the top of the list. Personal bias would be the obvious one, but judges have been known to base their courtroom conduct on expected public reaction. She could even be feeling pressured by local officials. Maybe she's just off her meds. All of this makes significantly more sense than the suggestion that the president is pressuring her into acting the way she has, a suggestion which is not supported by actual evidence, so yes, it is a baseless suggestion. It is not rooted in either logic or facts.


Source showing political interference.

(CNN) -- The George Zimmerman investigation was hijacked "in a number of ways" by outside forces, said the former police chief of Sanford, Florida.

Bill Lee, who testified Monday in Zimmerman's second-degree murder trial, told CNN's George Howell in an exclusive interview that he felt pressure from city officials to arrest Zimmerman to placate the public rather than as a matter of justice.

"It was (relayed) to me that they just wanted an arrest. They didn't care if it got dismissed later," he said. "You don't do that."

When Sanford police arrived on the scene on February 26, 2012, after Zimmerman fatally shot unarmed 17-year-old Trayvon Martin, they conducted a "sound" investigation, and the evidence provided no probable cause to arrest Zimmerman at the scene, he said.

It had nothing to do with Florida's controversial "Stand Your Ground" law, he said; from an investigative standpoint, it was purely a matter of self-defense.
Ex-police chief: I upheld my oath
Ex-police chief speaks about Zimmerman
Why did prosecutor, defense use a dummy?
Zimmerman trial standoff over evidence

Zimmerman told police he killed Martin after the teen attacked him. While the evidence at the time corroborated that claim, the ex-chief said, Lee's lead investigator made a recommendation that Zimmerman be charged with manslaughter.

Justice Dept. 'peacekeepers' worked 'Trayvon' rallies, group claims

It was a matter of protocol, Lee said. Arresting Zimmerman based on the evidence at hand would have been a violation of Zimmerman's Fourth Amendment rights, he said. Thus, the Sanford police presented a "capias request" to the state's attorney, asking that the prosecutor determine whether it was a "justifiable homicide," issue a warrant for arrest or present the case to a grand jury.

"The police department needed to do a job, and there was some influence -- outside influence and inside influence -- that forced a change in the course of the normal criminal justice process," Lee said. "With all the influence and the protests and petitions for an arrest, you still have to uphold your oath."

"That investigation was taken away from us. We weren't able to complete it," he said.

One example involved the 911 tapes, in which neighbors implored dispatchers to send police as a voice in the background screamed for help.

The Sanford police intended to release the tapes once the probe was over, Lee said, because you can't publicize evidence amid an investigation.

Instead, the mayor told him on March 16 the tapes had been released to Martin's family and the public. The family was asked to help identify voices, Lee said, but if police were in charge of the investigation, they wouldn't have presented evidence to a group.

"It should be done individually so there's no influence on the other people in the room," he said. "Then, there's no questions that can be brought up about how (an identification) was obtained or whether it was influenced."
I'm happy that at the end of the day I can walk away with my integrity.
Ex-Sanford Police Chief Bill Lee

Releasing the evidence to the public was problematic, as well, because it created the potential for someone to concoct a "story about what they observed when they really didn't observe it," he said.

Martin family attorney Jasmine Rand said she doesn't believe playing the tapes to a room full of people "makes any difference to the outcome of the case."

"We have to remember that that was played for the family in a private room because they were hearing the last moments of their son's life as he cried for help," Rand told CNN's Erin Burnett on Wednesday night. "And I think Sybrina Fulton (Martin's mother) got up and walked out of that room. She didn't sit in there and talk to everybody, because she had a visceral reaction when she heard her son yell for help and she couldn't help him because she knew he was dead."

Lee was placed on paid leave March 22, 2012, after the Sanford City Commission expressed a lack of confidence in him. The same commission rejected his resignation in a 3-2 vote a month later, with dissenting commissioners questioning the fairness of Lee's losing his job.

Two months later, Lee was sacked. City Manager Norton Bonaparte said in a news release, "The police chief needs to have the trust and respect of the elected officials and the confidence of the entire community."

Lee believes lack of confidence did play a role in his dismissal, he told CNN, but he also believes Bonaparte faced political pressure and terminated him "without cause," which was permitted under his employment contract.

"I upheld my oath," Lee said. "I'm happy that at the end of the day I can walk away with my integrity."
Zimmerman trial runs late into night
Manslaughter more likely?
Preparing for Zimmerman verdict
Legal panel: Judge won't allow animation

Asked whether he would do things differently given the opportunity, the 30-year veteran of law enforcement said there always are things he could change in hindsight, but he stands by the investigation.

At every turn in the 40-minute interview with CNN's Howell, Lee doggedly defended his investigators, saying race never played a role in any decision and that his officers "conducted an unbiased review."

Investigators knew letting Zimmerman walk free for 46 days was an unpopular decision -- and they took abuse for it -- "but they performed professionally. That's the mark of a strong police department."

Lee took issue with the media casting his department as apathetic or lackadaisical in the case.

"A lot of the information that was given out as fact was misinformation," he said. "It was reported in some media that we didn't conduct an investigation for two weeks, but yet in that same media they would show a photograph of a crime scene with crime scene tape, with patrol cars and blue lights and investigators on the scene."

Lee shrugged off the notion that he was hired to clean up racism and other problems in the department. His goal upon becoming chief was to improve professionalism and trust, and he set several goals, all of which were met during his 10-month tenure, he said.

One of his greatest regrets, he said, is that the Zimmerman investigation ultimately shattered his childhood dream to be police chief of the community where he was raised.

"It's a dream of a vision that is going to be unrealized," he said. "I'm at peace with it on most days. I'm a man of faith. But it stings.


I'm not sure what point you're trying to make, because this only supports what I already said: there is no evidence that Obama, his administration, or any other federal agent intervened in the proceedings. In this article, Lee mentions a number of local sources that he felt pressured by, which I already acknowledged as a possibility, but he mentions exactly zero sources of pressure beyond that.
Oh I'm just showing there was a political reason to charge Zimmerman. I don't care who did it, it was done though and there should be impeachment of any public representative that did push for it.


Sure, I never said that there wasn't any political pressure involved in this case, just that there's no reason to suggest that political pressure came from any source except locally.

Quick Reply

Submit
Manage Your Items
Other Stuff
Get GCash
Offers
Get Items
More Items
Where Everyone Hangs Out
Other Community Areas
Virtual Spaces
Fun Stuff
Gaia's Games
Mini-Games
Play with GCash
Play with Platinum