"WoW is not a real success" - cites Gaia CEO Craig Sherman.

[Buki]

x Katalyst x

I rarely post in this forum, or any for that matter, but on this I have to disagree. Having played World of Warcraft since the month of it's release, and also having played, EQ, EQ2, City of Heroes and Villians, D&D Online, Ragnarok, Lord of the Rings Online, FlyFF, Fiesta, Maple Story and Dream of Mirror Online, I can safely say NONE, not ONE of those games comes even remotely close to being as good as WoW.

While EQ2 is an amazing game, the fact that you can run through zone after zone and not see one other player kills it. There is no socialization at all. Why? The sheer lack of players.

City of Heroes/Villians is also amazing for it's own reasons, but running the same missions over and over again gets boring, quickly.

D&D Online was just a big joke. Same with LOTRO.

FlyFF, MapleStory, Fiesta, and Dream of Mirror don't even compare. They are all fun, and cool, you get to whack little mushrooms in the head, but seriously? With the insane amount of lvls in these games, and games like it, how is this fun? Grinding and grinding for hours on end, and for what? So you and the 2 other players with enough time to reach lvl 3,573 can stand around and look oh so cool in your Cosmic Armor or something. *Edit* Also, none of these games are actually FREE to play. They all have a cash shop, and to get anywhere in the game, you need to spend all the money you can in it.

WoW is popular because it targets lots of people. Casuals, Hardcore players, PvPers, and just about everything in between.

Also, did I mention that almost ever single one of the games I have mentioned has tons and tons of loading screens. Between every zone and city. WoW has very few.

Should I also mention how much it actually cost to MAKE World of Warcraft?

i didn't realize it until you mentioned that. o_o
i've also heard warhammer is going on a similar route as WoW as far as gameplay from people who got to test it. also WoW isn't advertised "everywhere" much. i haven't seen a commercial in a while or seen an ad.

i still play it whenever i can. i prefer seeing hand painted texture models over photorealistic ones. and i find WoW orcs more visually appealing than warhammer orcs 3nodding

[JT Cool]

Alt F4

JT Cool

Alt F4

Wurmie

Alt F4

But WoW is a horrible game.

Apparently lots...and lots of people around the world disagree. 3nodding

WoW is like a gateway MMO, like a gateway drug would be. The people who play WoW have not tapped into the hundreds of more interesting and cultivating underground MMOs out there, but eventually they will.

WoW is extremely bland, the community is just crap, the game mechanics suck, and the graphics are horrific. Not to mention, I've played some free MMOs that were very out there, interesting, and a LOT better than WoW.

WoW is just like it's name, it's a total SHOCK that it's this ungodly popular. Why? it's the only MMO that's really advertised. You don't see Archlord and Final Fantasy 11 being over-advertised, despite them being pretty much better overall games.

Who are you trying to convince here?

Of cousre the people who play WoW will eventually move on to bigger and better things. There are lots of online games such as WoW for them not to do that. Although, at the moment (and it has been this way for quite some time), WoW is still the best there is.

I'm not a fan of it, and I agree with you about the graphics and such. Even the game play is rather boring, but to say that WoW is not more of a success than Gaia is just being a denial (Not saying that you said that, I'm just speaking in general here).

WoW is as large as it is because it's been so largely advertised. If you're a person seeking an adventure but don't know how to find it you're told on TV, in magazines, everywhere. Generally the more intuitive MMOs are underground, and therefore they do not have the funds for such mass advertisement, which is why you only hear about WoW in commercials and such.

If Gaia was advertised in the same way WoW was, do you think it would be as big as WoW?

Maybe, maybe not.

And I don't really see why you said that (unless I'm missing something here) as it only further proves my point.

No matter how hidden a MMO is, if it's really good, it can become popular within a matter of days. How do you think WoW got so popular in the first place? Basically, my point here is that if there are lots of MMOs that are better than WoW out there, then WoW would cease to exist. No matter how heavily you advertise something, if it's lame in comparison to others in the same industry its wasted cash.

[PrincessNeko]

Antiq

Ok, the very fact that Mr. Sherman responded here to attempt to clarify what he meant, and the fact that staff in general are responding to these recent threads about Gaia's direction, means that it is an issue to them. If it wasn't, they wouldn't bother and it would be "suck it up guyz". The fact that it is an issue is, to me, the most important thing. When anything we have to say ceases to be that, then we really have something to fret about. The rest is just details. Mr. Sherman is still on a learning curve about Gaia as we know it, just like a new user takes quite a while to really get to know Gaia. He appears to be open to every kind of feedback, so let's corrupt teach him. Might be better than slice and dice.

While I am more likely to agree with teaching rather than chopping someone's head off, at the same time, I really don't see the possibility of getting Mr. CEO to see things our way. Plain and simple, Gaia has really pushed to become more of a business game. Granted, they do still listen. This is why I'm still hanging around (though I did take off after the MTV store was announced then returned after seeing how the admins weren't bombarding the site with MTV crap).

I don't think it's likely to stay this way, though, the moment Gaia hits the point where it won't need users who care about the quality of the site. I think it still needs a bit more energy from its loyal users before it can really take off...

[Overslept]

I've always known Craig had chronic foot in mouth disease. This doesn't surprise me.

[Antiq]

PrincessNeko

Antiq

Ok, the very fact that Mr. Sherman responded here to attempt to clarify what he meant, and the fact that staff in general are responding to these recent threads about Gaia's direction, means that it is an issue to them. If it wasn't, they wouldn't bother and it would be "suck it up guyz". The fact that it is an issue is, to me, the most important thing. When anything we have to say ceases to be that, then we really have something to fret about. The rest is just details. Mr. Sherman is still on a learning curve about Gaia as we know it, just like a new user takes quite a while to really get to know Gaia. He appears to be open to every kind of feedback, so let's corrupt teach him. Might be better than slice and dice.

While I am more likely to agree with teaching rather than chopping someone's head off, at the same time, I really don't see the possibility of getting Mr. CEO to see things our way. Plain and simple, Gaia has really pushed to become more of a business game. Granted, they do still listen. This is why I'm still hanging around (though I did take off after the MTV store was announced then returned after seeing how the admins weren't bombarding the site with MTV crap).

I don't think it's likely to stay this way, though, the moment Gaia hits the point where it won't need users who care about the quality of the site. I think it still needs a bit more energy from its loyal users before it can really take off...

I just had an odd vision of celebrity deathmatch.......

[PrincessNeko]

Antiq

PrincessNeko

Antiq

Ok, the very fact that Mr. Sherman responded here to attempt to clarify what he meant, and the fact that staff in general are responding to these recent threads about Gaia's direction, means that it is an issue to them. If it wasn't, they wouldn't bother and it would be "suck it up guyz". The fact that it is an issue is, to me, the most important thing. When anything we have to say ceases to be that, then we really have something to fret about. The rest is just details. Mr. Sherman is still on a learning curve about Gaia as we know it, just like a new user takes quite a while to really get to know Gaia. He appears to be open to every kind of feedback, so let's corrupt teach him. Might be better than slice and dice.

While I am more likely to agree with teaching rather than chopping someone's head off, at the same time, I really don't see the possibility of getting Mr. CEO to see things our way. Plain and simple, Gaia has really pushed to become more of a business game. Granted, they do still listen. This is why I'm still hanging around (though I did take off after the MTV store was announced then returned after seeing how the admins weren't bombarding the site with MTV crap).

I don't think it's likely to stay this way, though, the moment Gaia hits the point where it won't need users who care about the quality of the site. I think it still needs a bit more energy from its loyal users before it can really take off...

I just had an odd vision of celebrity deathmatch.......

Funny, 'cause in my head, it was a claymation beheading... razz

[Antiq]

PrincessNeko

Antiq

PrincessNeko

Antiq

Ok, the very fact that Mr. Sherman responded here to attempt to clarify what he meant, and the fact that staff in general are responding to these recent threads about Gaia's direction, means that it is an issue to them. If it wasn't, they wouldn't bother and it would be "suck it up guyz". The fact that it is an issue is, to me, the most important thing. When anything we have to say ceases to be that, then we really have something to fret about. The rest is just details. Mr. Sherman is still on a learning curve about Gaia as we know it, just like a new user takes quite a while to really get to know Gaia. He appears to be open to every kind of feedback, so let's corrupt teach him. Might be better than slice and dice.

While I am more likely to agree with teaching rather than chopping someone's head off, at the same time, I really don't see the possibility of getting Mr. CEO to see things our way. Plain and simple, Gaia has really pushed to become more of a business game. Granted, they do still listen. This is why I'm still hanging around (though I did take off after the MTV store was announced then returned after seeing how the admins weren't bombarding the site with MTV crap).

I don't think it's likely to stay this way, though, the moment Gaia hits the point where it won't need users who care about the quality of the site. I think it still needs a bit more energy from its loyal users before it can really take off...

I just had an odd vision of celebrity deathmatch.......

Funny, 'cause in my head, it was a claymation beheading... razz

Oh dear! rofl Remind me not to piss you off!

[Kaenai]

I'm not sure a link to his post is enough to dispel the rumor that fin is a complete moron. Perhaps a partial quote edited into the first post might be better?

Is that misquote a cause for concern? Maybe - depends on your perspective, and whether you actually went to page 6 to see his post. But when it's been explained already, it doesn't make sense to be all up in arms. Besides, you know half the people who might post often skim rather than read. xP

My opinion on this is that, no, Gaia Battle will NOT be as big as WoW, and rightfully so. Gaia is a niche, and has a niche market. More people will probably join after Battle's done, but not in those numbers.

Besides that, I don't think there's a comparison between what Gaia is and what WoW is. It's like trying to compare office furniture to hair spray. There's no correlation at all.

[Chibi Halo]

I can understand where he's coming from. The things he goes to are with companies that have been in the gaming business a lot longer than Gaia has. They're not even ready to be considered an MMORPG like WoW, Maplestory, or Pirates of the Caribbean Online. There's a whole new world of MMORPGs out there, the free to play world. Games like Guild Wars which costs you money to own but not to play will only have the revenue from the purchase of the game itself. After that, there's no more money to be had unless they come out with an expansion you have to buy. Gaia's trying to have a totally free product here, free to get and free to play. It's a new step in the MMO world. There are tons of games that are totally free but they don't get the recognition or the size we could possibly get when the Battle System comes out. Where will WoW be when it's as old as Gaia is? Right now it's only two or three years old. Will it have staying power? I think Fin is ambitious in thinking that someday Gaia's MMO could be the WoW of the free to play MMO world. Though, the first hurdle they have to face is competitors like Maplestory and Guild Wars.

[The Vorpal Blade]

This bothers me on so many levels.

Why does any CEO of a company feel the need to publicly bash another company's (rather obvious) success? Is that the way he wants to portray Gaia and its community?

Of *COURSE* WOW is a success! Not only does it draw in teenagers, but there are thousands and thousands of adults giving up their hard earned paychecks to play it every single month! How is that not a success? The owners of that company are probably living in mansions and have twelve cars or something!

I'm so disappointed in Gaia right now that I can't even begin to tell you.

Who owns this site anymore? Don't the original owners have any sort of leash on this kind of bad behavior? *ugh*

[PrincessNeko]

The Vorpal Blade

This bothers me on so many levels.

Why does any CEO of a company feel the need to publicly bash another company's (rather obvious) success? Is that the way he wants to portray Gaia and its community?

Of *COURSE* WOW is a success! Not only does it draw in teenagers, but there are thousands and thousands of adults giving up their hard earned paychecks to play it every single month! How is that not a success? The owners of that company are probably living in mansions and have twelve cars or something!

I'm so disappointed in Gaia right now that I can't even begin to tell you.

Who owns this site anymore? Don't the original owners have any sort of leash on this kind of bad behavior? *ugh*

The first poster should seriously quote fin's reply on Page 6 so that the entire situation could be brought to light.

[Deathiversary]

I think I need proof of what he said at that MMO con or whatever.

People tend to misconstrue words for their own argument AND indirect quotes make things even more of a cause for concern.

[thermoplastick]

Doesn't Gaia only have 4-5 million members? And not all of them are active either. And not all of them are teens. D;
DUN GO PICKEN FITES, MR. CEO. D<

[Spirrow]

I think what he's trying to say is, when something comes around that captures the imagination of the 80 million or so teens who WANT to play an MMO, that will be a big success. I have no interest in WoW, but I love MMOs. I used to play FF11, but even that was lackluster at times. Once we get a game that merges concepts like WoW with the Sims, I think we'll see something huge.

[Sharing Heartbeats]

BWAHAHAHA

That's funny as hell. The Blizzard company's main target isn't teens, it's mostly college-aged folk.

He's being cocky as hell saying WoW isn't a real success. WoW is one of Blizzard's biggest (if not THE biggest) money-makers. It has more subscribers than EQ, EQII, Anarchy Online, or any of the infinite other MMORPGs.

It's a hell of a lot more successful than Gaia Online. Under his management, Gaia will never even have a chance of surpassing the success of WoW.