Market Place 2% Closing Fee

"A 2% closing fee will be deducted from the final amount of this action when the item sells."

Gaia should KEEP the 2% deduction on market-transactions. (In favor)	72.4%	[ 207 ]
Gaia should DIS-BAND the 2% deduction on market-transactions. (Against)	27.6%	[ 79 ]
Total Votes:			[ 286 ]

[Shu Omega]

The fee doesn't bother me nor it really affects me much.
Gaia can crank the marketplace to 25% fee if they wanted to, I'll still sell my items high and avoid the fee. The higher the fee, people would just raise their item(s) prices even higher.

[TylerHyperFace]

Well, it's unsettling hearing how many people actually want an increased tax burning_eyes
Srsly?
If this is where it's going, I'm actually terrified of Gaia's future economic state.
Thank the heavens democracy doesn't actually exist pirate

I still think a few of you are missing out on the main point here: Inflation doesn't happen when there's a tax/stagnation happen because of the tax..

Basic college programs offer macro, and then an optional micro-economics course (if you haven't already had/payed attention in courses that may have been offered before-hand..)
Unless you've taken up art or science, theater or pre-career programs, history or- (let's actually stop there..) you might've had a macro, and then the more aspiring of us might've taken micro-economics.. I can't say I know for sure, but I imagine anyone who's been through business/commerce of any-sort should have the basic grasp/understanding of it aswell, only less theory/rules, more hands-on? (I wouldn't know; I was the first option of the latter)

The fact that yes, money does come up from the roots out of "nowhere" is prevalent in both worlds, though virtually, you don't have an exponential growth of population. There's no guarantee that the amount of people using Gaia will constantly increase, let alone ensure it'll multiply in correlation with how fast our population is growing outside of this virtual world/site. For every death you see/hear about, the source fails to inform you that along with the reported death on news, there were another 5-6 people born at that very moment.

I'm confident enough on the premiss above alone, and while excluding other variables that the tax situation is not responsible for "inflation management/regulating".

[TylerHyperFace]

Frozen Mist

The fee kind of forces people to be more flexible. I like it.

As for older items, I've always pushed for re-releases. I don't like the way people currently try to manipulate things.

The tax rate itself is fine, 5% would be crazy. 2% is already nearly a 500k loss when you're looking at something 10-20m. It's just enough of a gap to keep things stable.
If you up that to 5%... you'd be looking at nearly a mil gap between MP and the exchange.
It'd make the mp so much more dead.

What they need to do is update the older gold sinks. Casinos, for instance, could make a huge difference if they increase what we're allowed to bet!

I'm in agreement to your suggestion about having modifications made to other goldsinks..

It's another issue that along with the tax, I'm trying to make apparent.
As previously posted/stated somewhere in one of my responses, there are many ways to make gold on this site; Marketing is only one of the many ways people do it. I don't know why it's the only one that's being punished as hard as it is..

[JulieKablooie]

Well let's say to avoid the 2% closing fee, you go to the exchange. They often offer less than what you'd make with the 2% fee, unless its an item worth over a million gold. I see people offering 1.4million on something listed 2-2.2 million in the marketplace. Definitely more of a loss than the 2%.

The 2% hasn't been around forever, so I'm going to safely say it's been ultimately beneficial, not detrimental, to our economy since its birth. 3nodding

[Shu Omega]

JujuJubilee

Well let's say to avoid the 2% closing fee, you go to the exchange. They often offer less than what you'd make with the 2% fee, unless its an item worth over a million gold. I see people offering 1.4million on something listed 2-2.2 million in the marketplace. Definitely more of a loss than the 2%.

The 2% hasn't been around forever, so I'm going to safely say it's been ultimately beneficial, not detrimental, to our economy since its birth. 3nodding

That doesn't happen in the exchange really often. I see people want close to the market value and get the must profit out of it. I don't know, maybe I came in the exchange in a facepalm bad time.

[JulieKablooie]

Zero Tenshi

JujuJubilee

Well let's say to avoid the 2% closing fee, you go to the exchange. They often offer less than what you'd make with the 2% fee, unless its an item worth over a million gold. I see people offering 1.4million on something listed 2-2.2 million in the marketplace. Definitely more of a loss than the 2%.

The 2% hasn't been around forever, so I'm going to safely say it's been ultimately beneficial, not detrimental, to our economy since its birth. 3nodding

That doesn't happen in the exchange really often. I see people want close to the market value and get the must profit out of it. I don't know, maybe I came in the exchange in a facepalm bad time.

I dunno, I mean, using my example, most will leave if the owner wants anymore than 1.7mil, in my experience. So even if it's not as dramatic as I said first, the deal typically ends with more of a loss than the 2%. But I suppose most of the time exchange is for high priced or hard to sell items so bleh. lol

[TylerHyperFace]

JujuJubilee

Zero Tenshi

JujuJubilee

Well let's say to avoid the 2% closing fee, you go to the exchange. They often offer less than what you'd make with the 2% fee, unless its an item worth over a million gold. I see people offering 1.4million on something listed 2-2.2 million in the marketplace. Definitely more of a loss than the 2%.

The 2% hasn't been around forever, so I'm going to safely say it's been ultimately beneficial, not detrimental, to our economy since its birth. 3nodding

That doesn't happen in the exchange really often. I see people want close to the market value and get the must profit out of it. I don't know, maybe I came in the exchange in a facepalm bad time.

I dunno, I mean, using my example, most will leave if the owner wants anymore than 1.7mil, in my experience. So even if it's not as dramatic as I said first, the deal typically ends with more of a loss than the 2%. But I suppose most of the time exchange is for high priced or hard to sell items so bleh. lol

I'm having 1.8mil offers on my March 2004 letters: I'm not convinced about what everyone's saying about the low-offers/down-balling in the thread-community:
If I'm not getting what I want, I'm simply no accepting anything neutral

What I'm not so down with, is the fact that I'm doing transactions manually, just because I'm losing such a huge amount on stuff that's worth anything more than 500k gonk

It's a shame, really.. But I suppose it's the only way it'll get done =[

[Parexus]

I'll sell my more expensive items in the Exchange if I'm in a hurry. Generally I'll get better offers there. If I were to sell my Angelic Sash in the MP right now for 33400k (33,400,000) I would lose 668k (668,000).

I always sell my items in the Marketplace, I don't mind the tax.

[Einrick]

Frozen Mist

The fee kind of forces people to be more flexible. I like it.

As for older items, I've always pushed for re-releases. I don't like the way people currently try to manipulate things.

The tax rate itself is fine, 5% would be crazy. 2% is already nearly a 500k loss when you're looking at something 10-20m. It's just enough of a gap to keep things stable.
If you up that to 5%... you'd be looking at nearly a mil gap between MP and the exchange.
It'd make the mp so much more dead.

What they need to do is update the older gold sinks. Casinos, for instance, could make a huge difference if they increase what we're allowed to bet!

This, with mentioning one other thing. The higher the tax, the less likely people are going to vend a high-end item. If everyone stopped vending items over 20m because the tax jumped up to 5% (or more) then you'd see that sudden decrease in the total gold removed because those items are no longer sold. One should not assume that everyone will act exactly the same after making changes.

And the casinos are supposed to be a gold sink? eek Nobody told me!! I guess my better-than-1:1 results at blackjack are kind of an oddity, then. sweatdrop

This Isnt Sparta

I'd just like to say that I love your avatar. 3nodding NiGHTS is a game I like to play whenever I want time to relax and just fly around.

[Frozen Mist]

Einrick

Frozen Mist

The fee kind of forces people to be more flexible. I like it.

As for older items, I've always pushed for re-releases. I don't like the way people currently try to manipulate things.

The tax rate itself is fine, 5% would be crazy. 2% is already nearly a 500k loss when you're looking at something 10-20m. It's just enough of a gap to keep things stable.
If you up that to 5%... you'd be looking at nearly a mil gap between MP and the exchange.
It'd make the mp so much more dead.

What they need to do is update the older gold sinks. Casinos, for instance, could make a huge difference if they increase what we're allowed to bet!

This, with mentioning one other thing. The higher the tax, the less likely people are going to vend a high-end item. If everyone stopped vending items over 20m because the tax jumped up to 5% (or more) then you'd see that sudden decrease in the total gold removed because those items are no longer sold. One should not assume that everyone will act exactly the same after making changes.

And the casinos are supposed to be a gold sink? eek Nobody told me!! I guess my better-than-1:1 results at blackjack are kind of an oddity, then. sweatdrop

This Isnt Sparta

I'd just like to say that I love your avatar. 3nodding NiGHTS is a game I like to play whenever I want time to relax and just fly around.

Well.. it was. You buy tokens for 1g a pop. Even if you win tickets, you only get gold other people already had for those. So the tickets recycle gold (and tax it), whereas the tokens take it out of the system completely. But i think everyone gets tokens for free from dc etc?? I still buy mine from the casino, iunno... XD

[Einrick]

Frozen Mist

Well.. it was. You buy tokens for 1g a pop. Even if you win tickets, you only get gold other people already had for those. So the tickets recycle gold (and tax it), whereas the tokens take it out of the system completely. But i think everyone gets tokens for free from dc etc?? I still buy mine from the casino, iunno... XD

Gold gets tokens, tokens get tickets, tickets get items. I mean, I suppose the casino could be considered a gold sink, but only as much as any other gold shop is. sweatdrop

And I haven't bought tokens from the casino in years. I have over 70k tokens, all bought off the marketplace and all for less than 1g each - I'm sure that all of them were free DC grants, at that. Perhaps I'm odd, but it doesn't see to be sinking much of my gold out of the system. rofl

[TylerHyperFace]

Einrick

Frozen Mist

Well.. it was. You buy tokens for 1g a pop. Even if you win tickets, you only get gold other people already had for those. So the tickets recycle gold (and tax it), whereas the tokens take it out of the system completely. But i think everyone gets tokens for free from dc etc?? I still buy mine from the casino, iunno... XD

Gold gets tokens, tokens get tickets, tickets get items. I mean, I suppose the casino could be considered a gold sink, but only as much as any other gold shop is. sweatdrop

And I haven't bought tokens from the casino in years. I have over 70k tokens, all bought off the marketplace and all for less than 1g each - I'm sure that all of them were free DC grants, at that. Perhaps I'm odd, but it doesn't see to be sinking much of my gold out of the system. rofl

Which is exactly the reason I'm complaining crying
It's not like I get fish-bait in DCs either..

emo

[seabrume]

I agree with the other users who stated that the tax is too low.

Frankly, as you came back, so could other seemingly "dead" accounts. There is no way for Gaia to discount any amount of gold in the economy as gone forever (save for banned accounts, which mostly hold botted gold). So those "millions, billions and trillions" are still considered active.

And, if you have an issue with losing a measly 2% on a sale, go to the Exchange forum. The fact of the matter is, the value of your item is the MP value -2%, not the face-value of the item. Exchangers will almost never match the MP price because they are trying to buy low there and sell high on the MP for common items (aka items valued less than 1 mil). Most rare and expensive items are automatically just sold in the Exchange forum anyways, due to the tax ('03/'04 MCs, rare RIG items).

If it still bothers you that you're being taxed a whopping 2%, put a little note in your sig or your MP store saying you'll do a private sale for a 1% discount on the price. You get more, they pay less. Everyone wins.

[TylerHyperFace]

II HazelSkye II

I agree with the other users who stated that the tax is too low.

Frankly, as you came back, so could other seemingly "dead" accounts. There is no way for Gaia to discount any amount of gold in the economy as gone forever (save for banned accounts, which mostly hold botted gold). So those "millions, billions and trillions" are still considered active.

And, if you have an issue with losing a measly 2% on a sale, go to the Exchange forum. The fact of the matter is, the value of your item is the MP value -2%, not the face-value of the item. Exchangers will almost never match the MP price because they are trying to buy low there and sell high on the MP for common items (aka items valued less than 1 mil). Most rare and expensive items are automatically just sold in the Exchange forum anyways, due to the tax ('03/'04 MCs, rare RIG items).

If it still bothers you that you're being taxed a whopping 2%, put a little note in your sig or your MP store saying you'll do a private sale for a 1% discount on the price. You get more, they pay less. Everyone wins.

Having accounts banned would do the trick, not only in actual gold, but item-value aswell..

And as I've said/grumbled about already, yes, it seems like I'll be having to resort to manually setting up trade transactions for higher-priced items, because I don't want to lose an insane amount of gold to a sale.

What's funny is, even through using methods like the exchange forums, your so-called inflation problem is still maintained

[Cold Earl Grey]

I remember a whooooooole lotta griping about the tax when it was first implemented, but I am, and always was, all for it, and other proposed gold sinks (like Denier Cri). Gold is just too much more easy to accumulate now than even two or three years ago.

/Shrug/. And yes, personally selling your items on the exchange might seem like a pain, but at least it's a choice, right?