Let's talk about MONEY! Oh yeah, we're going there...

Money?

Money! Gimme! *makes grabby hands*	33.6%	[ 130 ]
Money is evil! *makes warding off evil hand gesture*	17.6%	[ 68 ]
Monkeys? I like monkeys! Oh wait, you said money...	27.6%	[ 107 ]
Eh, doesn't affect me, but I love poll gold!	21.2%	[ 82 ]
Total Votes:			[ 387 ]

[Lei_Trigar]

siskataya

Lei_Trigar

siskataya

I have a suggestion; How about you guys release a special Soul-Bound version of all the items at a much lower price? Just hear me out;

Because personally, if they were meant to be for Club Verge members only it would make sense that they should only be used by them. Oh, but people really, really hate soul-bound items because the main reason why people buy from the Cash shop is to make some quick gold and having soul-binding the items would deter people from buying them, which is why I suggest making a Soul-Bound version at much lower price, like instead of $1k for the bundle, maybe have it at $150, I believe those who really want the items and not just to sell them would buy them and use. I know I would.

I just feel $1k for a bundle is really kinda pushing it too far.

Also, I know you've been busy, but have you gotten my PMs and is there an update on my Alchemy situation?

Heya! Firstly, just an FYI - I'm still waiting on feedback for your alchemy crafting question! Since we are talking, I thought I'd just get this info to you here XD

And thank you for the post and the suggestion! I appreciate your pricing feedback and your very interesting idea to soul-bind items but charge less for them. Normally I cringe when I hear soul-bound because it tends to ruffle feathers, but this might be an interesting way of doing things. I'll let the team know! biggrin

Oh good, I hope it gets sorted soon. 3nodding

Thanks, I think they should at least try it to see how well it does. I believe if they did this and really gave us a soul-bound version of the bundle at around $150 I'll join the Club to get them. XD And if they sell better then expected then they should give us a special soul-bound versions.

Also, I've been hearing a lot of talk about the non-cash users rewards focusing on; Years on site, Posts made, and other things but nothing about the Achievement Points. Did they not like the idea of using them like that? Or do they have another plan for them?

Also, while we're talking about Achievements, are we ever going to get the 'promised' Game Achievements? For zOMG! (like the Kill Badges, something I've been asking for for years now sad ), Fishing, Pinball, Tiles, etc. You know it'll make them popular once again if there are some nice Achievements/Titles to get from them. wink

[RafiCat]

I look forward to seeing what rewards we poor but active gaians will get!

And I would still be interested in seeing some statistics on how many gaians spend large amounts of cash. I'm just curious.

[Semper Tigris]

I just want to put in some two-cents real quick. (Disclosure: I only read the OP and none of the replies).
Personally, I don't care what Gaia does with the cash shop(s), because I choose not to spend my money on the site - so I really don't have a leg to stand on to complain. But I think one of the major issues a lot of users face is that there's just been so many in such a short time that it's hard to keep up.
Also, I keep hearing a lot of talk about how things/features/etc aren't really explained and that leads to buttloads of confusion and complaining. I get that, as a site and a business, you can't tell us every single detail, but maybe more explanations would be helpful in the future? As far as I can tell, you, Sisky, are one of the only staff members who really comes out of the woodwork to tell us what's going on. (Sort of unrelated, but I think more explanations would also stem the hoards of comments that are along the lines of "Gaia makes enough money, blah blah, ads and stuff are enough, blah blah" when it's clear that ads aren't producing enough as evidenced by the recent layoffs.)

[Chibi Halo]

azndreams

Chibi Halo

Sadly though with so many young people here they rarely will want to listen about how a business works or even care at how the ongoing costs make for some of the decisions. It's like when you lived with your parents and they paid for everything and then when you got your own house/apt you realized damn food, electricity and everything else I need to survive actually costs money. How did my parents do it and such.

True there are going to be some who won't really want to hear about real world issues because they either just don't understand or want to escape all that stuff. Some people seem to have their fingers in their ears when it comes to the business side of things. However, for the ones who spend the majority of their time here and in the SF debating about these things a refresher course may be in order so they can at least understand why it has to be done.

[iron kibby]

Personally I am fine with all these incentives.
What I want to know is whether a proportion of the income of these schemes will be effectively used in order to change the longevity and demographics (by this I mean new or old members) of the Gaia population.

I believe that people would generally be much happier with whatever you are choosing to do with respect to expensive items if they were ensured that the Gaia team is also actually doing something to increase its userbase and repopulate its forums with new members. This is the only thing that worries me, and Gaia could be doing a lot but I certainly don't know about it - if this is the case I think we should be made aware.

In my experience people are always happier if they know that what they have paid for will somehow come back to them in some form. I don't think this is much to ask for nor counter-intuitive considering increasing Gaia's longevity and changing its demographics for the better can only be good for it as a business anyway.

This is something which I feel so many businesses miss the point on. People are happier if you are transparent with them.

[Shannon Kyra Liannanon]

...
I still don't like it. That PM everyone got is just a pusher for Gaia to grab more money. What, couldn't have sent out an announcement instead?
There are people saying that Gaia's doing this because they plan to shut down after getting a ton of money. That's why they focus on those that spend their money and ignore what made Gaia what it, to be frank, was. Not is, not since all the money pushing and people complaining enough so they Gaia has to fold their freaking hand through selling an item in the MP and then complain because they mispriced and the item gets picked up by an experienced vendor.
The MP is supposed mimic the real world. Their hands don't get held for them in the real world.
And then they get mad and start dropping names, which, if I remember correctly, is against ToS
At least the guilds are nice, though they desperately need an update and a half
I bought Cash Cards every once in a while on my original account. Guess what? Despite the claims of Wal-Mart, Target, etc. holding them, I HAVEN'T SEEN ANY. There's no mention of the cards that have multiple games of any carrying Gaia. My Internet cannot handle YT, so why should it handle your videos?

Tl;dr
Gaia has become another money grubbing place, and is getting more and more obvious about it. And it bends over backward for the whiners, which leads onto hate threads and all that

[hinotoriii]

I understand everything that's been posted, I really do. A business needs to succeed in order to keep going, that much is simple. But ... there are still things that I haven't wrapped my head around.

I usually don't spend money on Gaia, honestly. The first and only time I have was, actually, today. I saw the deal with the teal box, and I thought it was a good offer. So, I decided to donate the minimum five dollars to get that teal box. I ended up getting 3 of the circus tickets, and I was happy because I thought it was a great deal in a) saving a bit of GC from the videos I watch to get GC and b) I got a chance at playing with that chance item when I otherwise might not have considered it.

Those sorts of deals I think are worthwhile. Like some of the other cash offers here.

But some of Club Verges prices ...

I get it's new. I get it's elite. I get it's a reward. But the prices are a lot if you consider the vast age range on this site. Yes Gaia is something you should enjoy, and I absolutely respect those that do pay those top prices for their own enjoyment, because if they enjoy it and have the money around then they should buy them if they like them. But paying some of those top prices all at once for one item -- sometimes even the members that donate and get into that club can't do that even if they wanted. Some members would rather put that money towards bills and other payments, and the younger age range that are in school might not be able to save up too much at once for one item. Times are difficult and money doesn't come easily for some people or families, and I think the frustration is sometimes that people been invited into this elite group, and now can't pay for some of the items they want in there.

I'm interested to see what deals may come from the future of the club, but right now I just feel that some of the prices are just -- not quite at the right price.

I also think the frustration from those that don't spend a cent on Gaia is that the focus right now does seem to be those cash items. I know, I know you've mentioned that there are new, free rewards in the process for members, and those to reward on account age and just simply being a member, but you have to see it from our consumer point of view. People haven't seen that right now. They've seen sales and they've seen this new Club, and they've seen new updates for other GC related items -- but they haven't seen any of these free items yet. And for some people (not myself as I truly do believe they're on there way) but for them not seeing is more or less 'oh it's a thing that doesn't exist'. Younger members might not understand why there's a long wait, or why those GC items are coming out now and the non-paying members still have yet to be rewarded -- and that's no ones fault but it is down to different perspectives.

You guys that work or talk alongside Gaia hear news about whats in the pipeline and what you want to work on. The customers don't. The customers know when it happens, and as always, they react how they do. That's the difference. And I know it must be as frustrating to the moderators who do have to come out and calm down threads that get too heated, but players just get a bit frustrated too because they don't understand what's going on. They might feel neglected and forgotten, and it takes posts to say 'no, we do have things ready for you. You just need to wait and see' for them to even know that there is a reward for simply logging into the site for them.

[Troll Djinn]

I like the idea of club verge had been suggesting something similar since flynn started the cash shop all those years back. Not even gonna comment about the price you can ask as a company whatever you want for the items you make an thats fine by me. Company's need to make money!

I also don't really spend much if any money on gaia [mostly cause I have to pay for things at university] If had the cash i'd support this site more often. Enjoy it here so much and have been here longer then i've been in America.

The only thing thats ever had me raise my eyebrow and not try to support the sites plan was the recent teal box. Two out of three of the items are fantastic ideas,but that gold I can just see people abusing the 5$ system who have multiple accounts. I've explained in previous threads how it could happen and why it worries me. Though its the same fear many of us seem to have about the teal box.

I guess what i'm trying to say is I understand what the site is doing and that it needs money its business 101, but with the way certain features are being released so quickly one after the other. I can see why some gaians are screaming "the sky is falling".

[fairy pastry]

"We're not money-grubbing, honest!" says Gaia, after the megasale, the release of Club Verge, and the ridiculous incentives you're offering to first-time GC buyers. Nestled between these has been the release/update of several EIs, the Fluff pack, as well as the August bundle. I am probably forgetting some.

We had ONE gold update in between all of that. One.

We would probably not be so pissed if we weren't constantly saying "give us a break with the GCash! Give us some more gold items!" and getting more GCash trash shoved down our throats.

We need gold SINKS. Our economy is in the metaphorical shitter. Offering a first-time cash buyer the choice of 500,000 gold for 500 GCash is so astronomically stupid that I am having a hard time wrapping my head around how someone thought it was a good idea. In fact, you would think someone on Gaia staff who is active in the forums would stop and say "wait, wait, this isn't going to work."

Several staff members are active on the forums. You (general Gaia staff, not just you personally) know what the Gaia economy is like. You're here reading our threads every day. There are constant complaints about inflation. Did you all think we were going to be happy about several million more GG getting injected in to an already swollen river of mountains and valleys and oceans of WHY. WHY.

This makes us feel like you don't listen. Like you don't care.

You can't say that Gaia's not attempting to perform grabby-hands on our wallets when we have almost nothing to support an opposing opinion.

[iTsunayoshi Sawada]

fairy pastry

"We're not money-grubbing, honest!" says Gaia, after the megasale, the release of Club Verge, and the ridiculous incentives you're offering to first-time GC buyers. Nestled between these has been the release/update of several EIs, the Fluff pack, as well as the August bundle. I am probably forgetting some.

We had ONE gold update in between all of that. One.

We would probably not be so pissed if we weren't constantly saying "give us a break with the GCash! Give us some more gold items!" and getting more GCash trash shoved down our throats.

We need gold SINKS. Our economy is in the metaphorical shitter. Offering a first-time cash buyer the choice of 500,000 gold for 500 GCash is so astronomically stupid that I am having a hard time wrapping my head around how someone thought it was a good idea. In fact, you would think someone on Gaia staff who is active in the forums would stop and say "wait, wait, this isn't going to work."

Several staff members are active on the forums. You (general Gaia staff, not just you personally) know what the Gaia economy is like. You're here reading our threads every day. There are constant complaints about inflation. Did you all think we were going to be happy about several million more GG getting injected in to an already swollen river of mountains and valleys and oceans of WHY. WHY.

This makes us feel like you don't listen. Like you don't care.

You can't say that Gaia's not attempting to perform grabby-hands on our wallets when we have almost nothing to support an opposing opinion.

And no sooner than this thread was made, was the first time buyer bonus pushed out. And Sisky says they're NOT money-grubbing? Oops, that seems to say otherwise. And the removal of the randomized shops landing page also counteracts what Sisky says. It's really funny how many people have chosen to kiss a** in this thread and say "thanks for clearing this up/putting my mind at ease with this thread" when this thread doesn't do s**t.

Nothing was justified in the opening post. neutral I also like how she stopped replying after a while too, when opinions started to get negative. Same with another Admin I was talking to in another thread, when I brought up Club Verge and why it was a bad idea.

What should have REALLY been put in the first post, is the honest truth: "Look, we're opening club verge, we're going to push cash purchases, if you don't like it then ******** leave and stop bitching. We don't care, we're doing what we want regardless."

[Tansee]

iTsunayoshi Sawada

It's really funny how many people have chosen to kiss a** in this thread and say "thanks for clearing this up/putting my mind at ease with this thread" when this thread doesn't do s**t.

I noticed that myself. It's sad in a way, because she's really just a mouthpiece for the management. Sort of like a Presidential press secretary who's forced to sugar-coat and put the best spin possible on all the crappy decisions being made. Anyway, it's Friday, so maybe she can go out after work and get drunk somewhere.

[fairy pastry]

Tansee

Pan would have said that, because he cared about things like the Gaia economy. But he's gone now, and the ones who are left don't care. They probably want the gold to become worthless so more people will buy Gaia Cash. I think that's all part of the new strategy. It's all about the money now, and anything that gets in the way of that gets tossed aside.

There may be some left who still care, but their voices may be drowned out by the higher-ups - which is kind of really, really sad. I would encourage them to speak up. I really would. And if they're too scared: We've got your back, dude.

iTsunayoshi Sawada

And no sooner than this thread was made, was the first time buyer bonus pushed out. And Sisky says they're NOT money-grubbing? Oops, that seems to say otherwise. And the removal of the randomized shops landing page also counteracts what Sisky says. It's really funny how many people have chosen to kiss a** in this thread and say "thanks for clearing this up/putting my mind at ease with this thread" when this thread doesn't do s**t.

Nothing was justified in the opening post. neutral I also like how she stopped replying after a while too, when opinions started to get negative. Same with another Admin I was talking to in another thread, when I brought up Club Verge and why it was a bad idea.

What should have REALLY been put in the first post, is the honest truth: "Look, we're opening club verge, we're going to push cash purchases, if you don't like it then ******** leave and stop bitching. We don't care, we're doing what we want regardless."

It really is a gigantic ******** of stupid. I find myself wondering if Gaia staff is being put under pressure by management to try to sugar-coat all of this and settle us down. I would like to hear from the CEO, himself. I would like to hear his justification for this and for him to stop hiding behind the staff that we know and love - because of course we're going to take it easier on Sisky. Of course we're going to be more willing to wave our hands and say "it's okay, thanks for clearing it up!" Because she is a familiar "face" (so to speak,) and it is because of that familiarity that we are able to accept her explanation and forget the facts.

Sisky should NOT be here doing this. She should not have to suffer the barrage of negative emotions and thoughts. It isn't her place, unless these ideas were hers all along.

Where are the people responsible for this storm of dumb?

[iTsunayoshi Sawada]

Tansee

iTsunayoshi Sawada

It's really funny how many people have chosen to kiss a** in this thread and say "thanks for clearing this up/putting my mind at ease with this thread" when this thread doesn't do s**t.

I noticed that myself. It's sad in a way, because she's really just a mouthpiece for the management. Sort of like a Presidential press secretary who's forced to sugar-coat and put the best spin possible on all the crappy decisions being made. Anyway, it's Friday, so maybe she can go out after work and get drunk somewhere.

It was sickening how many people were willing to just bend over and accept such a weak "justification" of Gaia's recent actions. And while I DID offer suggestions in my initial post, I see that was ignored because I criticized various things first. If Gaia wants to ignore my opinions and suggestions and only listen to those who are kissing a** or supporting this bullshit, let them. It won't be enough to keep this site running.

These recent events have pissed off too many people, and many have already quit or are threatening to quit. Gaia can't afford to sit by and throw out weak excuses to cover their actions or act like people need to just shut up and accept it. The more people that leave, the higher the cash prices are going to hike. And then what? More and more people are going to quit as a result, because even high spenders have limits.

[iTsunayoshi Sawada]

fairy pastry

It really is a gigantic ******** of stupid. I find myself wondering if Gaia staff is being put under pressure by management to try to sugar-coat all of this and settle us down. I would like to hear from the CEO, himself. I would like to hear his justification for this and for him to stop hiding behind the staff that we know and love - because of course we're going to take it easier on Sisky. Of course we're going to be more willing to wave our hands and say "it's okay, thanks for clearing it up!" Because she is a familiar "face" (so to speak,) and it is because of that familiarity that we are able to accept her explanation and forget the facts.

Sisky should NOT be here doing this. She should not have to suffer the barrage of negative emotions and thoughts. It isn't her place, unless these ideas were hers all along.

Where are the people responsible for this storm of dumb?

I highly doubt the CEO will show himself. He doesn't even bother to dress up his avatar or show himself on the site. As far as I'm concerned, he's just milking this site for money without really realizing the consequences. Either that or he just hates the site and wants to bring it down, in which case he's doing a fine job. *shrugs*

Sisky might be a familiar face to most but she isn't to me, and that's maybe why I don't feel put to rest with this thread. Either that or I just can't force myself to look past these events, because I see what's really going on and it bothers me. I can't sit by idly and watch this happen, I can't accept it. And yeah, people can tell me "mind your business" but maybe I care about this site and hate to see it go down this path. This is my home. And each day, it starts to feel less and less like my home, and it scares me. I'm not opposed to change. Gaia has changed in the 9 years I've been here, and I've welcomed all of it. But this is not good change, this is harmful change.

But I don't think it matters anymore. We can riot, we can act out, we can raise our voices and protest until the cows come home. I don't think we're going to change anything, because I think management is set in their ways and unwilling to change.