[Gaians Against Corporate] - Now with 80% more Dev opinion!

All those unhappy with the corporate style Gaia, please let the CEO know.

Dear CEO and all others at GHQ in power: I am unhappy with the way Gaia has been. Please read on to fully understand.	74.5%	[ 1086 ]
Dear CEO and all others at GHQ in power: I am one of the people who doesn't care either way.	25.5%	[ 372 ]
Total Votes:			[ 1458 ]

[Vincent Valentine-Jenova]

Alright...
I have read through both threads. And they both do have good points to them...

I can definatly see why Gaia needs to be a community. But, I can also see why everyone is upset. (I do admit, when I first read the journal entry, it made me wonder what is really going on with Gaia)
But now, the issues have defiantly been brought up with the Gaia staff. Isnt that the ultimate win here? We got their attention, and now they will hopefully bring back some of the interaction.

While I also believe in both threads when they say "Gaia was great back then." and "Gaia is better now." Because in my mind BOTH are true.
Back then it was glitchy, BUT the contact with the developers and the way the plot updates where handled. Yes, I liked the community then. But now its great as well in different ways. Gaia isnt as glitchy. And sure the plots have temp. dissapeard, but I'm hoping that they come back. But also, now we have Fleep. Who is kind of like the contact inbetween the Staff and the commuinity. I dont really remember getting a better more frequent look in to the working of Gaia before he came aboard.

But there, theres my argument... although it really isnt an argument.
Just my two cents that I'm tossing in to the ring.

Now I'm just waiting to see what DARKNGY's post to see what he is saying about this whole thing. Although I love how all of the Developers are stopping by and giving us their point of view on the whole thing as well.
Just like AlexDitto, I dont thin kthe problem is as bad as it orginally seemed anymore.

[Mizuko_Arashimoto]

Skittles Of Darkness

TheTyro

I had a strong feeling we were blowing things a bit out of proportion. Though, geez..Skittles is treating him like he doesn't know what he's talking about...I trust Fleep's judgement, I think the thread has raised an awareness about our concerns and feelings, and Fin has responded. I think things will get better. I dunno why, but it just seems so odd to have her (skittle) talking to Fleep like he's the kid or something. Fleep is right, there's a huge diversity of people who come on Gaia, who is she to say what Gaia is and what it should do? The people at Gaia have almost always decided what Gaia is and isn't, we are just along for the ride, for the most part. Lanzer and them are still there, Gaia still has the creators imput.

anyways, I think for the most part, we've done what we set out to do, Fleep was pretty clear that it's not doomsday at HQ and that it's just going through a stage. It'll figure itsel out, probably with a little more help because of what we've been saying, but nothin's "lost"

Gaia as a company, it's going to sacrifice a few things, er, or has, but I believe in Gaia as a company and am rooting for them and us. I'm betting it'll figure itself out soon, whatever that means haha.

-sighs- This is going be hard to respond to but I'll give it my best shot. Please don't think I'm a little know-it-all. Just realize I'm a concerned Gaian.

I never meant to be condecending to Fleep and I think it actually realizes that. I actually adore and respect Fleep, considering he tries his best to communicate with the users and particpate with the Gaian community.

I'm not against fin as a person, he actually seems like a great guy from reading his profile, I'm against the way he's leading the company part of Gaia the same way Neopets went. I seriously dare you to go login at Neopets (if you have an account) and see what it has become. It started out sorta like Gaia. Good features, strong community, art, etc. then came the sponsers. The sponsers asked to have features built for themselves, like that McDonald thing in the main town (can't remember the name at the moment, sorry), then came other sponsers like Nikalodian. Slowly the story plot and Neopet originality left the site as the site kept on doing things for sponsers and less and less for themselves.

Guess what though? Viacom owns Neopets and Viacom owns MTV. Little coincidence? I think not.

Viacom pushed their way onto Neopets and now they're pushing their way onto Gaia. I left Neopets for Gaia because of this. I'll leave Gaia if it happens and move on to a better site. However, Gaia is an awesome site with an awesome community and has been my internet home for almost three years now.

I see what is happening to Gaia, at first it's oh we need sponsers for the money. They get some, bigger companys notice then they start asking for too much that the site doesn't focus on it's self anymore.

I'm not against Fleep, I'm not against fin, I'm not against sponsers, I'm not against the cashshop. I'm against big companies trying to take over our world. I ran from that when it happened too much to Neopets.

Look at what's happening! Gaia hasn't updated something Gaian it quite some time until now. Pinball, I love pinball. It's so... Gaian. heart

Fleep says the company doesn't know who it is. Well perhaps Gaia the company doesn't know who it is but the community sure does. Gaia is Gaia. If I wanted to watch videos I'll go to Youtube, if I wanted to play hardcore games and explore 3D worlds I'll go to WoW or play Morrowind, if I wanted to be all about profiling or journaling I'd go to LJ or MySpace, if I wanted chat I'd go to IMVU or if I want to see ads I'd go to Neopets.

Gaia is Gaia. No don't get me wrong, I love additional features but too much is too much espeically when they start neglecting the old features for new one after new one.

Why can't we expand without all the millions of features? Why can't we expand in ways that doesn't include trying to be everything the net as to offer?

Lets look at what we have that is Gaian by nature:
Forums
Guilds
Arenas
Maps
Towns
Games
Journals
Profiles
Shops
Battle System
Cinemas
Events
Storyline
NPCs
Quests

That's a lot to expand on without all the millions of trimmings.

So why not expand on Gaian related quests? Why not use the maps more for more shops, quests, storylines, events? Why not give us engaging events? Why not continue to update the house, flower, tattoo and fishing shops? Even the piercing and jewelry shop don't get much items. Why not expand there? Why not ask which sponsers we'd love and make their quest far more engaging while not taking away the plot? Why not update the mini comic more often? Why not make more Gaian items for real life? Update the forums? Why not more communication about important things like the malware and botting problems?

I'm glad, extremely glad though fin mentioned we were getting an arena update. I'm excited about that! I'm excited about the guild update! I'm excited about the BS!

I'm not excited though if things continue to be neglected like the storyline or Gaian related quests while sponsers rule the annoucements.

I come here for Gaia not sponsers.

As a user, I'd appreciate more Gaian things other then avatar clothes.

And I'm definitly wondering why Fleep keeps on going on about Gaia doesn't know who she is. That's a problem.

Gaia as a company should not sacrifice Gaia. Gaia related things are the main feature right? Why not expand those? Keep the users engaged in a Gaian world?

If Gaia isn't going be Gaia then yes I'll be packing my bags.

A huge diversity doesn't mean Gaia has to go all out with tons of features. Profiles, journals, ways you can do things on the forums and the way you dress your avvie is enough to 'express' yourself. Gaian related things though bring all those people together because that's the one interest the have in common for sure.

Take Gaian related things away and you take away Gaia.

I am scared that the higher ups and even Fleep don't realize that. That's why I'm concerned and that's why I'm here discussing the recent events.

I hope fin, Lanzer, Fleep and all the rest of the staff realize they need to think about why they're expanding Gaia and if they're really going benefit the community with certain expansions. Like another user said in this thread, changing and expanding for the heck of it because it is change is not worth the price. (or something like that. =p)

I said it before, but I'll say it again. You go girl!!

And yes, I read the whole thing. sweatdrop

[Caeli]

Skittles Of Darkness

-sighs- This is going be hard to respond to but I'll give it my best shot. Please don't think I'm a little know-it-all. Just realize I'm a concerned Gaian.

I never meant to be condecending to Fleep and I think it actually realizes that. I actually adore and respect Fleep, considering he tries his best to communicate with the users and particpate with the Gaian community.

I'm not against fin as a person, he actually seems like a great guy from reading his profile, I'm against the way he's leading the company part of Gaia the same way Neopets went. I seriously dare you to go login at Neopets (if you have an account) and see what it has become. It started out sorta like Gaia. Good features, strong community, art, etc. then came the sponsers. The sponsers asked to have features built for themselves, like that McDonald thing in the main town (can't remember the name at the moment, sorry), then came other sponsers like Nikalodian. Slowly the story plot and Neopet originality left the site as the site kept on doing things for sponsers and less and less for themselves.

Guess what though? Viacom owns Neopets and Viacom owns MTV. Little coincidence? I think not.

Viacom pushed their way onto Neopets and now they're pushing their way onto Gaia. I left Neopets for Gaia because of this. I'll leave Gaia if it happens and move on to a better site. However, Gaia is an awesome site with an awesome community and has been my internet home for almost three years now.

I see what is happening to Gaia, at first it's oh we need sponsers for the money. They get some, bigger companys notice then they start asking for too much that the site doesn't focus on it's self anymore.

I'm not against Fleep, I'm not against fin, I'm not against sponsers, I'm not against the cashshop. I'm against big companies trying to take over our world. I ran from that when it happened too much to Neopets.

Look at what's happening! Gaia hasn't updated something Gaian it quite some time until now. Pinball, I love pinball. It's so... Gaian. heart

Fleep says the company doesn't know who it is. Well perhaps Gaia the company doesn't know who it is but the community sure does. Gaia is Gaia. If I wanted to watch videos I'll go to Youtube, if I wanted to play hardcore games and explore 3D worlds I'll go to WoW or play Morrowind, if I wanted to be all about profiling or journaling I'd go to LJ or MySpace, if I wanted chat I'd go to IMVU or if I want to see ads I'd go to Neopets.

Gaia is Gaia. No don't get me wrong, I love additional features but too much is too much espeically when they start neglecting the old features for new one after new one.

Why can't we expand without all the millions of features? Why can't we expand in ways that doesn't include trying to be everything the net as to offer?

Lets look at what we have that is Gaian by nature:
Forums
Guilds
Arenas
Maps
Towns
Games
Journals
Profiles
Shops
Battle System
Cinemas
Events
Storyline
NPCs
Quests

That's a lot to expand on without all the millions of trimmings.

So why not expand on Gaian related quests? Why not use the maps more for more shops, quests, storylines, events? Why not give us engaging events? Why not continue to update the house, flower, tattoo and fishing shops? Even the piercing and jewelry shop don't get much items. Why not expand there? Why not ask which sponsers we'd love and make their quest far more engaging while not taking away the plot? Why not update the mini comic more often? Why not make more Gaian items for real life? Update the forums? Why not more communication about important things like the malware and botting problems?

I'm glad, extremely glad though fin mentioned we were getting an arena update. I'm excited about that! I'm excited about the guild update! I'm excited about the BS!

I'm not excited though if things continue to be neglected like the storyline or Gaian related quests while sponsers rule the annoucements.

I come here for Gaia not sponsers.

As a user, I'd appreciate more Gaian things other then avatar clothes.

And I'm definitly wondering why Fleep keeps on going on about Gaia doesn't know who she is. That's a problem.

Gaia as a company should not sacrifice Gaia. Gaia related things are the main feature right? Why not expand those? Keep the users engaged in a Gaian world?

If Gaia isn't going be Gaia then yes I'll be packing my bags.

A huge diversity doesn't mean Gaia has to go all out with tons of features. Profiles, journals, ways you can do things on the forums and the way you dress your avvie is enough to 'express' yourself. Gaian related things though bring all those people together because that's the one interest the have in common for sure.

Take Gaian related things away and you take away Gaia.

I am scared that the higher ups and even Fleep don't realize that. That's why I'm concerned and that's why I'm here discussing the recent events.

I hope fin, Lanzer, Fleep and all the rest of the staff realize they need to think about why they're expanding Gaia and if they're really going benefit the community with certain expansions. Like another user said in this thread, changing and expanding for the heck of it because it is change is not worth the price. (or something like that. =p)

I will agree with you there. I am not against Gaia as a Corporate entitity, what I am against is the lack of communication from both sides. If you want to staff to give you feedback then you must provide feedback. Not the immature "OMG u suck!!!" or "OMG this item sux the developers can't do anything right", that helps no one.


No I don't like all the sponserships and I don't like that Lanzer has taken a back seat to it all.

I would like to have all the cool features and stability, and also not lose our community.

For me Gaia is about posting or making virtual gold for someone else it may be towns, so each member must decide for themselves when Gaia is not Gaia to them anymore

[Pritchard]

AlexDitto

And I can't wait to read DARKNGY's post. Too bad journals are down... until they're up then, I'll wait in baited breath, but I want to say a big

Yo! DARKNRGY posted his journal entry on the forums smile

[Mizuko_Arashimoto]

Juno

If you really think about it, are sponsors even that bad? You get an announcement, a free item. Sometimes even entirely features come out of it, like Gaia Scion Cars. I think maybe what you guys want more is not necessarily the removal of sponsors (which, honestly, is probably not an option) but more-so more frequent updates on Gaia-centric features. 3nodding

Yes, we do want more Gaia-centric features, and yeah the Gaia Rally, and our new NPC (Sam), are cool, but we don't wanna see the sponsors taking over the site with features of their own. Like the whole little Mtv world on here, and basically creating the rally for Scion. Maybe I'm wrong about that last part, but we don't need Mtv or any other big company plugging their crap in our world, with a feature (and shop) created especially for them.

[Anna Corinne Von Helson]

Mizuko_Arashimoto

Juno

If you really think about it, are sponsors even that bad? You get an announcement, a free item. Sometimes even entirely features come out of it, like Gaia Scion Cars. I think maybe what you guys want more is not necessarily the removal of sponsors (which, honestly, is probably not an option) but more-so more frequent updates on Gaia-centric features. 3nodding

Yes, we do want more Gaia-centric features, and yeah the Gaia Rally, and our new NPC (Sam), are cool, but we don't wanna see the sponsors taking over the site with features of their own. Like the whole little Mtv world on here, and basically creating the rally for Scion. Maybe I'm wrong about that last part, but we don't need Mtv or any other big company plugging their crap in our world, with a feature (and shop) created especially for them.

Yeah, when I picture Gaia, I see a world all on it's own. Devoid of our companies. I go on Gaia as a break from the real world. I'm all about supporting the sponsors, but I don't think Gaia (the world) needs it's own Scion or MTV stores. And I hate using the "LOL Neopets!!!!" card, but I am a 8+ year member of that site so I saw it's rise and fall, and Neopets corporate takeover started out just this way and I hope so much that Gaia doesn't follow down that same path. >_>

[stellacadente]

eek Wow, has this discussion gotten a lot of attention! eek

I agree with Cid's newest edit: You don't have to be against Gaia to be concerned about its direction. You don't have to be pro-corporate to be pro-Gaia. It's not a battlefield or even a chess match. We shouldn't fight each other, or Gaia.

As I said in the guild, I'm not even "anti-corporate." But Gaia isn't Chrysler*, and users can and should have a lot of say, because we have a lot of involvement in this site. It doesn't even matter if you give Gaia real $$ or not, most users feel like they have a big stake in this place.

Fin/Craig Sherman and Lanzer have both now acknowledged that Gaia needs to work on its communication with users. I would also add that Gaia needs to figure out how it will proceed with what's known as "customer expectation management."
As in, how to say "Hey peeps, I know we said there'd be an Easter event, but we just can't pull it off successfully with 6 squillion things going on." And saying that before the GCD and SF (and even the CB and GD!) blow up with emo-osity.

I'm sure this discussion, on both sides, has created a lot of "stimulating" discussions in Gaia HQ. I don't think we should stop, not in the least.


*Chrysler, like Gaia, is a privately held corporation. It does not have to disclose financial information to the public like Procter&Gamble, Google or Microsoft do. Nor does it trade stocks on an exchange, like the NYSE or the NASDAQ.

[stellacadente]

Skittles of Darkness]And I'm definitly wondering why Fleep keeps on going on about Gaia doesn't know who she is. That's a prob

of3xwdun:0="Skittles of Darkness]And I'm definitly wondering why Fleep keeps on going on about Gaia doesn't know who she is. That's a problem.

It sure is. It's a potentially fatal problem, sponsors or not. And it's obvious Gaia needs some in-house marketing expertise. I just wish I did not have this aversion to living in California (esp. Silicon Valley...housing prices: eek burning_eyes xp ) or I swear, I'd show up at HQ with a marketing plan and my laptop!

[Jumping Jehosaphat]

stellacadente

Skittles of Darkness]And I'm definitly wondering why Fleep keeps on going on about Gaia doesn't know who she is. That's a prob

of3xwdun:1="Skittles of Darkness]And I'm definitly wondering why Fleep keeps on going on about Gaia doesn't know who she is. That's a problem.

It sure is. It's a potentially fatal problem, sponsors or not. And it's obvious Gaia needs some in-house marketing expertise. I just wish I did not have this aversion to living in California (esp. Silicon Valley...housing prices: eek burning_eyes xp ) or I swear, I'd show up at HQ with a marketing plan and my laptop!

All of Cali is expensive. I had a job interview in San Luis Obispo, and they told me to live outside of the city if I got the job (which I didn't) due to the extreme prices. I don't think there is anywhere you can live unless you have a ton of cash or a roommate.

But I would take on that burden to work at Gaia....

[Pavlovs Puppy]

Do people understand just what itr mean to have corporate sponsors? Gaia may have needed cash to expand Lanzer's vision but the minute ypu sign that sponsorship and get corporate cash you 've sold your soul to the devil,

Sponsors expect a return, be it product coverage, a slot in the game, a whole world or just a number of users to target. Viacom is an entertainment giant so wants its movie trailers in our cinema. MTV want to push their TV shows and get a tie in virtual world so they build one here.

Name in the frame is what its all about.

Maybe now Gaia Corporation are on a damage limitation exercise and trying jard on the PR front but that's all it is - a front. The behind the scenes machinations to bring product to our eyeballs will continue.

Placating the masses is not the same as a change of direction.

[Kiiwi Kisses]

i think bad

[Antiq]

Mandrax

Do people understand just what itr mean to have corporate sponsors? Gaia may have needed cash to expand Lanzer's vision but the minute ypu sign that sponsorship and get corporate cash you 've sold your soul to the devil,

Sponsors expect a return, be it product coverage, a slot in the game, a whole world or just a number of users to target. Viacom is an entertainment giant so wants its movie trailers in our cinema. MTV want to push their TV shows and get a tie in virtual world so they build one here.

Name in the frame is what its all about.

Maybe now Gaia Corporation are on a damage limitation exercise and trying jard on the PR front but that's all it is - a front. The behind the scenes machinations to bring product to our eyeballs will continue.

Placating the masses is not the same as a change of direction.

It's not ViacomOnline yet. When it is, I'll say I should have listened to Mandrax and accept your "told you so", but for the moment I'll be optmistic biggrin

[Azure Sielhart]

Even though Gaia isn't what many would probably refer to as "crap" or a piece of you-know-what, I still believe Gaia could be better.

Skittles hit it on the spot. I want Gaia-centric stuff. I don't need all of this superfluous and excessive feature that has a sponsor plastered on it or things that take away what's Gaian.

I too, didn't come here for sponsors, came here to get away and immerse myself in the world of Gaia. And when I'm saying Gaia I'm not saying that in my opinion stupid MTV Hills trash. It will remain trash in my eyes as long as it has it's nasty stuff on Gaia.

Yes, I know MONEY, the thing that seems to be the main focus of the users and it's higher ups. Users focus on the fact whether Gaia really needs money or not and how Gaia needs money but isn't getting it. I'm saying this because I think Gaia is truly starting to lose it's way if money is going to be it's only thing in mind while trying to pump out "stuff" to do even though we have plenty that could be expanded. I'm not saying money isn't an important factor to think about, I'm just stating that the focus on it may become so great that it will end up only as another commercial website.

Other than that, I'm still going to fight for what is Gaian and consists of mainly Gaia. I mean come on admins, devs, and Mr. Sherman, do you even know what makes Gaia so fun and unique anymore? Or are you just saying you're creating a ton of stuff for us despite that may not even correlate to it being Gaia-centric. Battle System - but a lot of things are going neglected and you are bringing in sponsors that piss the heck out of some people. You had better hope that this Battle System was worth all of the neglect and expanding you could have done instead on things that are already here.

[RyanJakobi]

Mandrax

Sponsors expect a return, be it product coverage, a slot in the game, a whole world or just a number of users to target. Viacom is an entertainment giant so wants its movie trailers in our cinema. MTV want to push their TV shows and get a tie in virtual world so they build one here.

Well, I'll tell you one thing right now. If we get a quest that involves Rugrats of any kind, I am cashing in and leaving.

I HATE those bassids. mad