[Gaians Against Corporate] - Now with 80% more Dev opinion!

All those unhappy with the corporate style Gaia, please let the CEO know.

Dear CEO and all others at GHQ in power: I am unhappy with the way Gaia has been. Please read on to fully understand.	74.5%	[ 1086 ]
Dear CEO and all others at GHQ in power: I am one of the people who doesn't care either way.	25.5%	[ 372 ]
Total Votes:			[ 1458 ]

[Kaenai]

[- DB -]

An example of what I'm trying to say is, such as at my job. I hate that the company I work for didn't want us having a bunch of empty containers sitting out on the floor (waiting to be switched with full ones) They thought it was too cluttered and made a mess. I showed them a way that I can place the empty containers that they were both out of the way, and made my job more efficient which helps them profit in the end.

then perhaps Gaia should have a user council of sorts. I think that's the best way to see what the users really want. the poll works, but how many opinions are really read? how many suggestions in a 65+ page thread actually go unnoticed? How often, in Site Feedback, do threads with actual suggestions and topics get knocked down off the first page in favor of threads that say things simplistically, like "OMGILUV(X-FEATURE)!!!1!ELEVENTY2!"

There needs to be a consistent way to reach out to the users, and Ask the Admin just isn't cutting it anymore.

[sandvich]

I apologize for this, I posted this on page 8, right when that mild flamefest was going on and I'm worried that this was skipped over.
I wouldn't have posted this if I didn't want feedback. sweatdrop

So sorry! At the very least I'm bumping up the thread. whee I don't normally repost what I've already written but this isn't an ordinary topic.

[ Admiral Suzie ]

I was nearly done reading Arrowchan's M-M-M-MONSTER POST on page 3 when I realized something.

No one respects this website. At least not anymore.
Yes, duh, people are mean on teh internets lol but I've been around here long enough to know that the level of complaining and bitchiness that is reflected, at least in the GCD, is new. When I started to post in this forum around 2005 or 2006 it wasn't like this at all. We were all so busy enjoying ourselves, coming up with new ideas for the plots, for items and for every damn thing this site does that if something went wrong only newer users or trolls were the ones complaining.

Now I dunno exactly when it started up, and I don't know exactly how it ties into the changes Gaia has gone through but if anyone is going to start behaving themselves and being polite as they were and as they should be then I think Gaia needs to make the first step instead of us. We all know what happens when someone makes a thread to discuss/whine/b***h or rant about how rude we are. There is just no way we can convince the forum to be more constructive instead of complaining all the time.

I think that it would be more beneficial if we had an announcement or something from Lanzer (because we all see him as the head of Gaia, even if it's not the case anymore) that mentioned the problems Gaia is going through, apologizes for any heartbreak that it caused and asks us for a second chance. Or something. Something that shows humility and sincerity and gives us all hope for the future of Gaia.
If Gaia could earn more respect from it's users I think that would be a huge step in the right direction to fix this site, to make it less corporate and more friendly and fun and everything it was when I joined 4 years ago. We would be so much more able to provide the necessary feedback to bring this website back to what it once was.

Honestly I feel a bit embarrassed to still post here, even though I still love the site too much to leave. I don't like to tell my friends I use Gaia, because I know that Gaia no longer as enjoyable as it was and should be.

[Gamine]

Kaenai

[- DB -]

An example of what I'm trying to say is, such as at my job. I hate that the company I work for didn't want us having a bunch of empty containers sitting out on the floor (waiting to be switched with full ones) They thought it was too cluttered and made a mess. I showed them a way that I can place the empty containers that they were both out of the way, and made my job more efficient which helps them profit in the end.

then perhaps Gaia should have a user council of sorts. I think that's the best way to see what the users really want. the poll works, but how many opinions are really read? how many suggestions in a 65+ page thread actually go unnoticed? How often, in Site Feedback, do threads with actual suggestions and topics get knocked down off the first page in favor of threads that say things simplistically, like "OMGILUV(X-FEATURE)!!!1!ELEVENTY2!"

There needs to be a consistent way to reach out to the users, and Ask the Admin just isn't cutting it anymore.

It's a good idea in theory, but I'm still vehemently opposed to it..no matter how good a cross-section of users they think they get for such a council and no matter how objective they will claim to be, they will still be riddled with personal bias. I do not want other users speaking for me.
Site Feedback can be a mess at times, but I think it's the best system we have. Everybody gets a voice.

[[- DB -]]

Kaenai

then perhaps Gaia should have a user council of sorts. I think that's the best way to see what the users really want. the poll works, but how many opinions are really read? how many suggestions in a 65+ page thread actually go unnoticed? How often, in Site Feedback, do threads with actual suggestions and topics get knocked down off the first page in favor of threads that say things simplistically, like "OMGILUV(X-FEATURE)!!!1!ELEVENTY2!"

There needs to be a consistent way to reach out to the users, and Ask the Admin just isn't cutting it anymore.

A decent suggestion, though such things would be difficult to work out, who would be the council, etc etc. etc. However until something like that comes into effect, you could always take the baby steps of discussing things in said "actual suggestions". Working down out hostility towards change and working with each other first, to get the big wigs to listen. Kind of hard to care what we want, when even we can't even figure it out, ay?

[Yen Quest]

Although it is easy to point out the problem, and probably the same in finding the solution, I am disappointed that I can't do both most of the time. The hard part is to get the other side to listen and follow the idea.

Problem:
There's too many things that create elitism. Elitism is one thing that's bringing our community down. If we want to fix this, we should also be aware of having too much fairness/equality.
Solution: ???

If arguement/debates aren't going to help solve the problem, please don't let it drag out (take it to pms at least).

[China Cup]

...oh my goshhhh ; ^;

I didn't realize, but that's so sad.

I kinda agree with Rei. ^^ Gaia's changed so much, and I hate to think of it like a huge business. It's... not really like a family anymore. Lanzer's not even in power.

I greatly, greatly respect her decision to leave, though I will miss alll she's contributed.

[Kaenai]

Gamine

Kaenai

[- DB -]

An example of what I'm trying to say is, such as at my job. I hate that the company I work for didn't want us having a bunch of empty containers sitting out on the floor (waiting to be switched with full ones) They thought it was too cluttered and made a mess. I showed them a way that I can place the empty containers that they were both out of the way, and made my job more efficient which helps them profit in the end.

then perhaps Gaia should have a user council of sorts. I think that's the best way to see what the users really want. the poll works, but how many opinions are really read? how many suggestions in a 65+ page thread actually go unnoticed? How often, in Site Feedback, do threads with actual suggestions and topics get knocked down off the first page in favor of threads that say things simplistically, like "OMGILUV(X-FEATURE)!!!1!ELEVENTY2!"

There needs to be a consistent way to reach out to the users, and Ask the Admin just isn't cutting it anymore.

It's a good idea in theory, but I'm still vehemently opposed to it..no matter how good a cross-section of users they think they get for such a council and no matter how objective they will claim to be, they will still be riddled with personal bias. I do not want other users speaking for me.
Site Feedback can be a mess at times, but I think it's the best system we have. Everybody gets a voice.

I agree, to a point. Site Feedback is useful, but everyone doesn't really get a voice there. The ones who need to read it most often don't, and the ones who have something real to say often are ignored. The squeaky wheel gets the oil, and unfortunately, the squeakiest wheels do not always have something intelligent or useful to say. This is why I suggested a council. I think the mods could play a part in that, as they are often the only ones who work for/with Gaia who still have constant contact with the users. They could quite simply ask users at random what they think of certain implementations.

As I said, it's just a suggestion, and it may or may not be a useful one, but it's a thought. They're not talking to us anymore, so you know they damn sure aren't listening.

[Gamine]

Kaenai

Gamine

Kaenai

[- DB -]

An example of what I'm trying to say is, such as at my job. I hate that the company I work for didn't want us having a bunch of empty containers sitting out on the floor (waiting to be switched with full ones) They thought it was too cluttered and made a mess. I showed them a way that I can place the empty containers that they were both out of the way, and made my job more efficient which helps them profit in the end.

then perhaps Gaia should have a user council of sorts. I think that's the best way to see what the users really want. the poll works, but how many opinions are really read? how many suggestions in a 65+ page thread actually go unnoticed? How often, in Site Feedback, do threads with actual suggestions and topics get knocked down off the first page in favor of threads that say things simplistically, like "OMGILUV(X-FEATURE)!!!1!ELEVENTY2!"

There needs to be a consistent way to reach out to the users, and Ask the Admin just isn't cutting it anymore.

It's a good idea in theory, but I'm still vehemently opposed to it..no matter how good a cross-section of users they think they get for such a council and no matter how objective they will claim to be, they will still be riddled with personal bias. I do not want other users speaking for me.
Site Feedback can be a mess at times, but I think it's the best system we have. Everybody gets a voice.

I agree, to a point. Site Feedback is useful, but everyone doesn't really get a voice there. The ones who need to read it most often don't, and the ones who have something real to say often are ignored. The squeaky wheel gets the oil, and unfortunately, the squeakiest wheels do not always have something intelligent or useful to say. This is why I suggested a council. I think the mods could play a part in that, as they are often the only ones who work for/with Gaia who still have constant contact with the users. They could quite simply ask users at random what they think of certain implementations.

As I said, it's just a suggestion, and it may or may not be a useful one, but it's a thought. They're not talking to us anymore, so you know they damn sure aren't listening.

Yeah, I get you 3nodding
I think what we need is some sort of compromise between the two; maybe not something as select as a User council, but definitely more organized than Site Feedback. Unfortunately, I don't really have any idea what that would be =P
But if it comes to me, I'll suggest it.

That last line really does ring true, though, and I cannot help but agree.

[Kaenai]

[ Admiral Suzie ]

I was nearly done reading Arrowchan's M-M-M-MONSTER POST on page 3 when I realized something.

No one respects this website. At least not anymore.
Yes, duh, people are mean on teh internets lol but I've been around here long enough to know that the level of complaining and bitchiness that is reflected, at least in the GCD, is new. When I started to post in this forum around 2005 or 2006 it wasn't like this at all. We were all so busy enjoying ourselves, coming up with new ideas for the plots, for items and for every damn thing this site does that if something went wrong only newer users or trolls were the ones complaining.

Now I dunno exactly when it started up, and I don't know exactly how it ties into the changes Gaia has gone through but if anyone is going to start behaving themselves and being polite as they were and as they should be then I think Gaia needs to make the first step instead of us. We all know what happens when someone makes a thread to discuss/whine/b***h or rant about how rude we are. There is just no way we can convince the forum to be more constructive instead of complaining all the time.

I think that it would be more beneficial if we had an announcement or something from Lanzer (because we all see him as the head of Gaia, even if it's not the case anymore) that mentioned the problems Gaia is going through, apologizes for any heartbreak that it caused and asks us for a second chance. Or something. Something that shows humility and sincerity and gives us all hope for the future of Gaia.
If Gaia could earn more respect from its users I think that would be a huge step in the right direction to fix this site, to make it less corporate and more friendly and fun and everything it was when I joined 4 years ago. We would be so much more able to provide the necessary feedback to bring this website back to what it once was.

Honestly I feel a bit embarrassed to still post here, even though I still love the site too much to leave. I don't like to tell my friends I use Gaia, because I know that Gaia no longer as enjoyable as it was and should be.

I have never agreed more with anything any user has said. I landed here around the same time you did, and it wasn't like this, no matter who may say it is. Sure, there was complaining, and some people whined, but there was always a level of civility to everything. That's gone. There was also a certain amount of camaraderie that isn't here anymore.

I still love Gaia. I'm not saying that I don't, or that I'm leaving. But some things are too large to ignore or put aside.

[Queene of the May]

I am totally for Gaia and it's Marriage with the Consumerist Corporate World! biggrin

(until they do something that actually affects me personally and then you just watch how fast I jump on your bandwagon! lol!)

[sandvich]

Kaenai

[ Admiral Suzie ]

I was nearly done reading Arrowchan's M-M-M-MONSTER POST on page 3 when I realized something.

No one respects this website. At least not anymore.
Yes, duh, people are mean on teh internets lol but I've been around here long enough to know that the level of complaining and bitchiness that is reflected, at least in the GCD, is new. When I started to post in this forum around 2005 or 2006 it wasn't like this at all. We were all so busy enjoying ourselves, coming up with new ideas for the plots, for items and for every damn thing this site does that if something went wrong only newer users or trolls were the ones complaining.

Now I dunno exactly when it started up, and I don't know exactly how it ties into the changes Gaia has gone through but if anyone is going to start behaving themselves and being polite as they were and as they should be then I think Gaia needs to make the first step instead of us. We all know what happens when someone makes a thread to discuss/whine/b***h or rant about how rude we are. There is just no way we can convince the forum to be more constructive instead of complaining all the time.

I think that it would be more beneficial if we had an announcement or something from Lanzer (because we all see him as the head of Gaia, even if it's not the case anymore) that mentioned the problems Gaia is going through, apologizes for any heartbreak that it caused and asks us for a second chance. Or something. Something that shows humility and sincerity and gives us all hope for the future of Gaia.
If Gaia could earn more respect from its users I think that would be a huge step in the right direction to fix this site, to make it less corporate and more friendly and fun and everything it was when I joined 4 years ago. We would be so much more able to provide the necessary feedback to bring this website back to what it once was.

Honestly I feel a bit embarrassed to still post here, even though I still love the site too much to leave. I don't like to tell my friends I use Gaia, because I know that Gaia no longer as enjoyable as it was and should be.

I have never agreed more with anything any user has said. I landed here around the same time you did, and it wasn't like this, no matter who may say it is. Sure, there was complaining, and some people whined, but there was always a level of civility to everything. That's gone. There was also a certain amount of camaraderie that isn't here anymore.

I still love Gaia. I'm not saying that I don't, or that I'm leaving. But some things are too large to ignore or put aside.

I don't think anything that Gaia does at this point is going to work unless they get users to respect the site like they used to.

[Malocide]

The problem is we allow this. Every time we log in and see a add. Everytime we log in and click on some sponserships item. Everytime we buy a cash shop item. We encourage them to just make money however then can. We need to first prove that we are the ones making them the money. Not the youngins on the site and steal there parents credit card, not the log in every month type, or the I don't donate type cause spending money on pixels is not cool.

WE MAKE THEM MONEY. The ussers who acctual care and spend anywear from 5-200$ a month on MCs or maby more on CS items. Thoes sponserships make decent nummbers I have heard but the ammount of effort as oppsed to MCs and the amount of money thoes could make.

If givin 5 bucks a month would get rid of stupid sponserships and Gaia would be like it used to be I would ******** do it but becasue I feel like thats not what my 5 dollars would go to I just don't want to donate anymore. Its like feeding a fire gasoline.

Somethign needs to change. Something needs to happen. I feel like everyone who cared about Gaia is leaving the company. With Duck and Foo gone I just don't know about Gaia anymore. There are a few amazing Devs left but lossing two that were so very passointe about Gaia is just sad and shows that something is terbily rong if people who once loved it can't stay with it anymore.

I have been on the verge of quiting knowing that I don't want to have be sad all the time my fav website is failing but at the same time I don't want to becasue I love it so much. I guess part of me is staying hopeing it will go back to the way things were.

[Kaenai]

Gamine

Kaenai

Gamine

Kaenai

[- DB -]

An example of what I'm trying to say is, such as at my job. I hate that the company I work for didn't want us having a bunch of empty containers sitting out on the floor (waiting to be switched with full ones) They thought it was too cluttered and made a mess. I showed them a way that I can place the empty containers that they were both out of the way, and made my job more efficient which helps them profit in the end.

then perhaps Gaia should have a user council of sorts. I think that's the best way to see what the users really want. the poll works, but how many opinions are really read? how many suggestions in a 65+ page thread actually go unnoticed? How often, in Site Feedback, do threads with actual suggestions and topics get knocked down off the first page in favor of threads that say things simplistically, like "OMGILUV(X-FEATURE)!!!1!ELEVENTY2!"

There needs to be a consistent way to reach out to the users, and Ask the Admin just isn't cutting it anymore.

It's a good idea in theory, but I'm still vehemently opposed to it..no matter how good a cross-section of users they think they get for such a council and no matter how objective they will claim to be, they will still be riddled with personal bias. I do not want other users speaking for me.
Site Feedback can be a mess at times, but I think it's the best system we have. Everybody gets a voice.

I agree, to a point. Site Feedback is useful, but everyone doesn't really get a voice there. The ones who need to read it most often don't, and the ones who have something real to say often are ignored. The squeaky wheel gets the oil, and unfortunately, the squeakiest wheels do not always have something intelligent or useful to say. This is why I suggested a council. I think the mods could play a part in that, as they are often the only ones who work for/with Gaia who still have constant contact with the users. They could quite simply ask users at random what they think of certain implementations.

As I said, it's just a suggestion, and it may or may not be a useful one, but it's a thought. They're not talking to us anymore, so you know they damn sure aren't listening.

Yeah, I get you 3nodding
I think what we need is some sort of compromise between the two; maybe not something as select as a User council, but definitely more organized than Site Feedback. Unfortunately, I don't really have any idea what that would be =P
But if it comes to me, I'll suggest it.

That last line really does ring true, though, and I cannot help but agree.

I know what you mean, too. I don't mean that Gaia should select some sort of elite group - last thing we need is ACTUAL elitism around here. rolleyes

What I don't want Gaia to be is Neopets II. I wasn't around when it fell apart, but I remember what it was, and I logged in after most of the changes, and I was not thrilled. I don't think Mr. Sherman, et al., really understand what drives Gaia. It's not money, and it never has been. If all you're willing to do for its users is pick at their wallets, you're going to lose them, and fast.

[Auntie Crackhead]

Wow, just... wow.
I knew things around here were getting a little
corporate, but I didn't know how bad it really was.
If anyone ever needs help with some sort of project
to fight this, let me know. I want to help.

EDIT:
You know, this reminds me a lot of Neopets...
I was pretty addicted to Neo for a few years, and I eventually
quit because it became so corporate... this is how it all started.

[Bunai]

well that sucks

one thing i have to poke at and question is this:

foobarbazquux

Project Playlist. Some of you may have seen their widget on Gaia. Their business model is advertising and being a middleman for selling ringtones and mp3s.

In my talks with the CEO, he said that his goal is to keep the company small and focused on development of cool stuff, which is exactly what I think should be done.

that is dandy. but people consider ringtones and mp3 bizz, as corporate fat cows just as much as outside businesses are on a community website.

it seems like she misses her job of development. which can be discussed and sorted out. and which i can totally understand. you dont train yourself to be something in life only to have your skills either not required or lessened.

and with something that obvious -in my opinion- it wont stay "small" for long. and if it does, its likely to fade out like many other ringtone/mp3 businesses. if it can stay like it is forever, good for it. i wish her and it luck.


she mentions nothing of sponsors. which is what everyone else in the forum will focus on. her focus is the lack of work freedom she was promised. and Lanzer's position in Gaia.


i've been on Gaia since Jan of 04
never had much issues with it, and knew dang well that as more and more people registered. more and more expansions would have to take place.
the more workers hired to kick out items faster with quality -cost more money.

-maintaining a Forums Archive -cost money
-having over 300 servers working day and night, paying for them every month -cost money
-having a building to house the servers and the employees -cost money
-developing a game, that was an idea of one lone Gaian -cost money

and A LOT of other things go into this.

yes the Users make the community a community and use the site like it should be used. we donate what we can because we enjoy the site. yet it is obvious and a reality that a few thousand people giving money every month or when they feel like it, is NOT ENOUGH. unless one of us is a freakin millionaire in hiding, sites as large as Gaia need sponsors or Ads to balance out cost.

i hope strongly that Lanzer begins to discuss things with Craig (who i actually like) and assert his power and position on a site he created and wants to continue with.