Zimmerman should not be convicted of murder

[black_wing_angel]

DlCK CATSTY

It was raining that day and Trayvon was walking around and so Zimmerman obviously found it suspicious that someone he didn't recognize was walking around the gated community in the rain especially in light of recent home break-ins.

Why would you ever wear a hoodie in the rain?

For that matter, who could possibly walk in the rain, and not fear melting?



Son, I've gone walking in the rain. It's not unusual. It's not suspicious. And generally, if I'm GOING to walk in the rain, I'd prefer a hoodie, to keep my hair clean and dry.

And how dare Treyvon commit the felony act of being black in a gated community? What was he thinking? Did he not read the minds of all the people in the area, so as to be aware of the recent string of criminal activity?

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It wasn't racially motivated,

You're not doing much to support that claim, Cochise.

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he had also called in on caucasian and hispanic people as well.

And that proves what?

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He wasn't a racist, he had even gone as far as organize a protest for the treatment of a homeless black man by police in the past.

Good for him. How does that prove anything, again?

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Whether he did anything wrong or not by following Trayvon is debatable,

Not really. It's illegal. He's neighborhood watch. Not a cop. He does not have the same authorities that a cop has. His jurisdiction ends with his property line. By following Treyvon, he committed the criminal act of stalking.

There's nothing to debate.

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and he did not simply follow him around and then shoot him like the media would have you believe and following someone in public is not against the law.

You sure about that?

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Attacking someone who is following you is, however.

I'm not so sure about that. If someone's stalking you, I believe the law allows you to stand your ground.

Ergo, I think you have it a**-backwards, buddy.

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A witness even stated he saw Trayvon on top of Zimmerman and went to call 911 while Trayvon was hitting him.

Witnesses have claimed they saw Big Foot in Yellowstone National Park. Your point?

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Now if you were a 5'9" and 200 pounds or so being attacked by a 6'0" 160 pound football player and the only way to protect yourself was to use your handgun before your attacker tried to grab it(which Zimmerman said Trayvon was trying to do) what would you do?

Issue a verbal warning, and attempt to get out of there. You know...what the law ******** REQUIRES.

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Unless you're a bleeding heart that would gladly let your attacker bash your head in on the sidewalk (Zimmerman had a large bleeding gash on the back of his head when police arrived)

And yet, his clothes were Downy Fresh, when he arrived at the police precinct.

Police let you stop and do your laundry, now?

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while waiting for the police to show up, I think you would grab that handgun you're allowed to legally carry before your attacker does and defend your life.

Sure. But there's nothing substantial that's what happened.

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Either way one of them were going to end up dead in the confrontation and rather than try to stop it the witness left to call the police while Zimmerman was having his head beaten in.

Again, without any signs of blood. Was Treyvon a magician?

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There is nothing racist about this, despite what the media and the deceased's family are crying out to incite racial tensions.

Until you catch that part of the phone call where he called "them" "******** coons". That's pretty racist...

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Trayvon did not die with a bag of skittles in his hand,

Well, no. I imagine he dropped them, at some point. Probably about the point his hands were reaching for the sky, because there was a gun pointed at him.

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he died with his hands balled into fists that he was using to punch Zimmerman in the face.

And you have WHAT evidence of this? Also, I think if you're SHOT, your body is going to tense up from the pain. Incidentally, your hands included.

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Trayvon could have just simply run away

Sounds to me like he already tried that. Didn't work so well.

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instead of trying to act like a thug (he was already suspended had been suspended for being caught with drug paraphernalia at school, which is stupid enough, and certainly carried himself as one as his twitter showed)

Because "thugz" are the only people that deal with marijuana.

Nevermind the sea of white people who are anything but "street", that have attested to use of marijuana. But we can ignore that detail, for now.

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and attacking Zimmerman, or better yet he could have explained why he was there since he was spending his 10 day suspension living at his father's house.

Except that I'm pretty sure when there's a man with a gun following you, "explaining yourself" isn't exactly high on the to-do list.

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George Zimmerman was knowledgeable about who his neighbors were

Obviously not as well as he thought, if he missed that one little detail.

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and would probably have recognized his father.

So now he's robocop, with a digital index?

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Instead the exchange of words reportedly consisted of Trayvon asking if Zimmerman had a problem

I don't blame him. I'd be a little curious, myself.

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to which the response was "no" and then responded by saying "now you do"

[citation needed]

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and then punching Zimmerman in the face as his bloody nose would attest to.

I didn't see any bloody nose. Or any blood at all, honestly.

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To charge Zimmerman with second degree murder is downright wrong.

You're right. He should get first degree.

[halfcocked catstabator]

Smash the State

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That wasn't his reason for shooting him. His reason for shooting was that Trayvon was on top of him trying to grab his gun while punching him in the face, a person came forth and told the police this.

Cite this.

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It was a fight for his life, he did not unjustly shoot Trayvon on the sidewalk and Trayvon held up his bag of skittles and iced tea which he lacked a receipt for in self-defense.

Show me any evidence that Trayvon stole either of these items or admit you just made s**t up to paint a bad picture of Trayvon.

http://digg.com/newsbar/Politics/upi_zimmerman_told_police_trayvon_tried_to_grab_his_gun_before_he_fired_national_news

http://www.theblaze.com/stories/report-witness-claims-trayvon-martin-attacked-george-zimmerman/

http://www.myfoxtampabay.com/dpp/news/state/witness-martin-attacked-zimmerman-03232012

[halfcocked catstabator]

The Living Force

DlCK CATSTY

Trayvon held up his bag of skittles and iced tea which he lacked a receipt for in self-defense.

You've got a lot stupid with your post, so I'll just address this. I almost never get a receipt when I make a purchase at a convenience store or gas station. There's pretty much no reason to get a receipt for a two dollar purchase, and they don't tend to give them unless you say you want one. Also, I wasn't aware that anyone was obligated to keep receipts and such on them or present them when a random someone demands. Zimmerman had no right to demand *anything.*

He thought he was the Sheriff of London and started a fight and then finished the fight he started. TL;DR, Zimmerman's a bigoted punk who was unaware that starting s**t meant there'd be s**t. Don't start no s**t, won't be no s**t.

And I take a receipt every time I buy something.

[Riviera de la Mancha]

Smash the State

We can speculate who attacked whom all day; but there is no factual evidence to back either claim up. Your speculation that Trayvon attacked Zimmerman; is simply that. We can only go on the facts present; and your denunciation of Trayvon for possibly defending himself, shows your unwillingness to apply the law equally.

FACT: Trayvon is dead.

FACT: Trayvon's girlfriend and a 911 operator are the only immediate witnesses; and testimony by both support the idea that Zimmerman followed him with both Trayvon and Zimmerman admitting it separately, respectively; but neither provided proof that Trayvon was engaged in anything besides walking down the street.

FACT: Following someone is not illegal in most circumstances; but it is reasonable cause to attack someone in Florida under FS 776.013 which "justifies the use of deadly force" when one posses a "reasonable presumption of fear"

FACT: The same "Stand Your Ground Law" (aka 776.013) that Zimmerman's defenders are citing as a defense; applies equally to Trayvon; meaning Trayvon was justified in attacking someone who both Zimmerman himself (on the 911 call) and the two witnesses all collaborate was following Trayvon.

My position on this to a T.

The only 'witness' that came to support Zimmerman's argument can only attest that he saw Trayvon on top of Zimmerman. Its my belief that, under Florida law, he attempted to defend himself (As per his right in FL) when confronted by Zimmerman, who had his firearm drawn and in his hand.

I dont know about others, but some joker has a gun drawn and is asking me "What am I doing?", my instinct will be to either run or try my damnedest to get that arm out of his possession.

[halfcocked catstabator]

worse than i seem

Did you really just bring up the fact that he didn't have a receipt for the stuff he bought at 7/11?

The cashier asks me if I want my receipt every time I buy something there and I always say yes.

[halfcocked catstabator]

Riviera de la Mancha

Smash the State

We can speculate who attacked whom all day; but there is no factual evidence to back either claim up. Your speculation that Trayvon attacked Zimmerman; is simply that. We can only go on the facts present; and your denunciation of Trayvon for possibly defending himself, shows your unwillingness to apply the law equally.

FACT: Trayvon is dead.

FACT: Trayvon's girlfriend and a 911 operator are the only immediate witnesses; and testimony by both support the idea that Zimmerman followed him with both Trayvon and Zimmerman admitting it separately, respectively; but neither provided proof that Trayvon was engaged in anything besides walking down the street.

FACT: Following someone is not illegal in most circumstances; but it is reasonable cause to attack someone in Florida under FS 776.013 which "justifies the use of deadly force" when one posses a "reasonable presumption of fear"

FACT: The same "Stand Your Ground Law" (aka 776.013) that Zimmerman's defenders are citing as a defense; applies equally to Trayvon; meaning Trayvon was justified in attacking someone who both Zimmerman himself (on the 911 call) and the two witnesses all collaborate was following Trayvon.

My position on this to a T.

The only 'witness' that came to support Zimmerman's argument can only attest that he saw Trayvon on top of Zimmerman. Its my belief that, under Florida law, he attempted to defend himself (As per his right in FL) when confronted by Zimmerman, who had his firearm drawn and in his hand.

I dont know about others, but some joker has a gun drawn and is asking me "What am I doing?", my instinct will be to either run or try my damnedest to get that arm out of his possession.

Cite that he had it in his hand. When police showed up it was in his pants waistband and that's presumably where it stayed until a struggle broke out.

[The Living Force]

DlCK CATSTY

The Living Force

DlCK CATSTY

Trayvon held up his bag of skittles and iced tea which he lacked a receipt for in self-defense.

You've got a lot stupid with your post, so I'll just address this. I almost never get a receipt when I make a purchase at a convenience store or gas station. There's pretty much no reason to get a receipt for a two dollar purchase, and they don't tend to give them unless you say you want one. Also, I wasn't aware that anyone was obligated to keep receipts and such on them or present them when a random someone demands. Zimmerman had no right to demand *anything.*

He thought he was the Sheriff of London and started a fight and then finished the fight he started. TL;DR, Zimmerman's a bigoted punk who was unaware that starting s**t meant there'd be s**t. Don't start no s**t, won't be no s**t.

And I take a receipt every time I buy something.

Congratulations. That doesn't mean he stole anything.

[worse than i seem]

DlCK CATSTY

worse than i seem

Did you really just bring up the fact that he didn't have a receipt for the stuff he bought at 7/11?

The cashier asks me if I want my receipt every time I buy something there and I always say yes.

Why? That is such a huge waste of paper. No one is going to return a soda and bag of candy.

I had a 7/11 down the street from me growing up, I would go there every day or so. Not once did I ever get a receipt from them.

You're acting as if this is unusual behavior.

[The Living Force]

DlCK CATSTY

Riviera de la Mancha

Smash the State

We can speculate who attacked whom all day; but there is no factual evidence to back either claim up. Your speculation that Trayvon attacked Zimmerman; is simply that. We can only go on the facts present; and your denunciation of Trayvon for possibly defending himself, shows your unwillingness to apply the law equally.

FACT: Trayvon is dead.

FACT: Trayvon's girlfriend and a 911 operator are the only immediate witnesses; and testimony by both support the idea that Zimmerman followed him with both Trayvon and Zimmerman admitting it separately, respectively; but neither provided proof that Trayvon was engaged in anything besides walking down the street.

FACT: Following someone is not illegal in most circumstances; but it is reasonable cause to attack someone in Florida under FS 776.013 which "justifies the use of deadly force" when one posses a "reasonable presumption of fear"

FACT: The same "Stand Your Ground Law" (aka 776.013) that Zimmerman's defenders are citing as a defense; applies equally to Trayvon; meaning Trayvon was justified in attacking someone who both Zimmerman himself (on the 911 call) and the two witnesses all collaborate was following Trayvon.

My position on this to a T.

The only 'witness' that came to support Zimmerman's argument can only attest that he saw Trayvon on top of Zimmerman. Its my belief that, under Florida law, he attempted to defend himself (As per his right in FL) when confronted by Zimmerman, who had his firearm drawn and in his hand.

I dont know about others, but some joker has a gun drawn and is asking me "What am I doing?", my instinct will be to either run or try my damnedest to get that arm out of his possession.

Cite that he had it in his hand. When police showed up it was in his pants waistband and that's presumably where it stayed until a struggle broke out.

How can you presume anything about it from the fact that he'd already holstered it by the time the police had shown up? There is absolutely zero logic in such an assumption. ZERO.

[Riviera de la Mancha]

DlCK CATSTY

worse than i seem

Did you really just bring up the fact that he didn't have a receipt for the stuff he bought at 7/11?

The cashier asks me if I want my receipt every time I buy something there and I always say yes.

Stellar argument... oh wait, except when someone like me comes along and always refuses receipts from 7/11 unless its for business reasons (am I really going to return a Slurpie and a hot dog?).

[worse than i seem]

Riviera de la Mancha

Smash the State

We can speculate who attacked whom all day; but there is no factual evidence to back either claim up. Your speculation that Trayvon attacked Zimmerman; is simply that. We can only go on the facts present; and your denunciation of Trayvon for possibly defending himself, shows your unwillingness to apply the law equally.

FACT: Trayvon is dead.

FACT: Trayvon's girlfriend and a 911 operator are the only immediate witnesses; and testimony by both support the idea that Zimmerman followed him with both Trayvon and Zimmerman admitting it separately, respectively; but neither provided proof that Trayvon was engaged in anything besides walking down the street.

FACT: Following someone is not illegal in most circumstances; but it is reasonable cause to attack someone in Florida under FS 776.013 which "justifies the use of deadly force" when one posses a "reasonable presumption of fear"

FACT: The same "Stand Your Ground Law" (aka 776.013) that Zimmerman's defenders are citing as a defense; applies equally to Trayvon; meaning Trayvon was justified in attacking someone who both Zimmerman himself (on the 911 call) and the two witnesses all collaborate was following Trayvon.

My position on this to a T.

The only 'witness' that came to support Zimmerman's argument can only attest that he saw Trayvon on top of Zimmerman. Its my belief that, under Florida law, he attempted to defend himself (As per his right in FL) when confronted by Zimmerman, who had his firearm drawn and in his hand.

I dont know about others, but some joker has a gun drawn and is asking me "What am I doing?", my instinct will be to either run or try my damnedest to get that arm out of his possession.

Seriously.

The Stand Your Ground law is in Trayvon's favor here, not Zimmermans.

Guy is following you at night with a gun? You pretty much only have two options there.

[worse than i seem]

It's also worth noting that volunteers for the neighborhood watch are not allowed to carry weapons via their organization's policy.

So right there is shows disregard on Zimmerman's part for the rules.

This is also the man who had assaulted a cop and has an ex-girlfriend who took a restraining order out on him because he was violent towards her.

The man has a history of violence, it's a pattern.

[Riviera de la Mancha]

DlCK CATSTY

Riviera de la Mancha

Smash the State

We can speculate who attacked whom all day; but there is no factual evidence to back either claim up. Your speculation that Trayvon attacked Zimmerman; is simply that. We can only go on the facts present; and your denunciation of Trayvon for possibly defending himself, shows your unwillingness to apply the law equally.

FACT: Trayvon is dead.

FACT: Trayvon's girlfriend and a 911 operator are the only immediate witnesses; and testimony by both support the idea that Zimmerman followed him with both Trayvon and Zimmerman admitting it separately, respectively; but neither provided proof that Trayvon was engaged in anything besides walking down the street.

FACT: Following someone is not illegal in most circumstances; but it is reasonable cause to attack someone in Florida under FS 776.013 which "justifies the use of deadly force" when one posses a "reasonable presumption of fear"

FACT: The same "Stand Your Ground Law" (aka 776.013) that Zimmerman's defenders are citing as a defense; applies equally to Trayvon; meaning Trayvon was justified in attacking someone who both Zimmerman himself (on the 911 call) and the two witnesses all collaborate was following Trayvon.

My position on this to a T.

The only 'witness' that came to support Zimmerman's argument can only attest that he saw Trayvon on top of Zimmerman. Its my belief that, under Florida law, he attempted to defend himself (As per his right in FL) when confronted by Zimmerman, who had his firearm drawn and in his hand.

I dont know about others, but some joker has a gun drawn and is asking me "What am I doing?", my instinct will be to either run or try my damnedest to get that arm out of his possession.

Cite that he had it in his hand. When police showed up it was in his pants waistband and that's presumably where it stayed until a struggle broke out.

Presumably? Perhaps to you- I think its at least plausible that, in the time it took for the police to come, he put the gun into his waistband. And, drawn or not, I see a joker confront me on a rainy night asking "What am I doing?" as I am walking home with snacks, and I dont see a badge, I assume he has no good intentions for me.

[black_wing_angel]

DlCK CATSTY

The Living Force

DlCK CATSTY

Trayvon held up his bag of skittles and iced tea which he lacked a receipt for in self-defense.

You've got a lot stupid with your post, so I'll just address this. I almost never get a receipt when I make a purchase at a convenience store or gas station. There's pretty much no reason to get a receipt for a two dollar purchase, and they don't tend to give them unless you say you want one. Also, I wasn't aware that anyone was obligated to keep receipts and such on them or present them when a random someone demands. Zimmerman had no right to demand *anything.*

He thought he was the Sheriff of London and started a fight and then finished the fight he started. TL;DR, Zimmerman's a bigoted punk who was unaware that starting s**t meant there'd be s**t. Don't start no s**t, won't be no s**t.

And I take a receipt every time I buy something.

Wonderful.

Who the ******** are you, again?

[Riviera de la Mancha]

worse than i seem

Riviera de la Mancha

Smash the State

We can speculate who attacked whom all day; but there is no factual evidence to back either claim up. Your speculation that Trayvon attacked Zimmerman; is simply that. We can only go on the facts present; and your denunciation of Trayvon for possibly defending himself, shows your unwillingness to apply the law equally.

FACT: Trayvon is dead.

FACT: Trayvon's girlfriend and a 911 operator are the only immediate witnesses; and testimony by both support the idea that Zimmerman followed him with both Trayvon and Zimmerman admitting it separately, respectively; but neither provided proof that Trayvon was engaged in anything besides walking down the street.

FACT: Following someone is not illegal in most circumstances; but it is reasonable cause to attack someone in Florida under FS 776.013 which "justifies the use of deadly force" when one posses a "reasonable presumption of fear"

FACT: The same "Stand Your Ground Law" (aka 776.013) that Zimmerman's defenders are citing as a defense; applies equally to Trayvon; meaning Trayvon was justified in attacking someone who both Zimmerman himself (on the 911 call) and the two witnesses all collaborate was following Trayvon.

My position on this to a T.

The only 'witness' that came to support Zimmerman's argument can only attest that he saw Trayvon on top of Zimmerman. Its my belief that, under Florida law, he attempted to defend himself (As per his right in FL) when confronted by Zimmerman, who had his firearm drawn and in his hand.

I dont know about others, but some joker has a gun drawn and is asking me "What am I doing?", my instinct will be to either run or try my damnedest to get that arm out of his possession.

Seriously.

The Stand Your Ground law is in Trayvon's favor here, not Zimmermans.

Guy is following you at night with a gun? You pretty much only have two options there.

The sad truth is that I think its in both men's favor and is the reason I think, at a minimum, that the FL Stand Your Ground law should be eliminated.