What's Wrong With Obama's Health Care Plan?

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xsv.ninja

the same problem as with countries that have free health care, wait lists.

how ever i'd like to see how america does with it...

I have a friend in Canada. He has a heart condition. But he didn't always know that. He got light headed and went to the hospital. He was in and out in a couple hours.

Every time I've been to the ER I sat and waited 5-10 hours before I even got to see a doctor.

Usually you have people abuse the ER room which leads to an extended wait for those who are not considered a true emergency. The triage nurse prioritizes who gets seen based upon the severity of the complaint. I.E a sniffle is not going to be seen before heart palpitations.

[20 Shades of Crazy]

Tobias_London

Nonesuch Solo

Tobias_London

Nonesuch Solo

Foxie-Sama

source please

[1]

Tobias_London

Isn't this a failure to pay taxes?

Yes, at the end, it all comes down to failure to pay taxes.

At the start, it's adding tax penalties if you fail to hold, at any point during the taxable year, acceptable health insurance.

Massachusetts did something similar a few years back. I remember scrambling at the end of the year to find some sort of affordable state-option for health insurance or else I wouldn't get all of my tax return for the year. I thought it was complete bullshit personally.

Failure to pay taxes has always been punishable by law.
So why is this any worse?
I'm kinda confused on which side you're taking on the issue.

We're talking about additional taxes that would be imposed if you don't have health insurance for the entire year's time. Extra taxes if you remain uninsured, if you don't choose the Public Option.

I think I should study up on this part some more.
Don't know much about it.

It has a reason behind it. When you go to a hospital, they must treat you, due to the Hippocratic Oath which they take. They have no choice in the matter, sa they are bound by law. Even if you cannot pay, then they must treat you. Now, they will slap you with a bill, but even that doesn't mean the hospital will see the payment any time soon, and that money had to have come from somewhere.

It would cost the government much more than necessary to let people be uninsured. This is to eliminate unneeded costs.

[Foxie-Sama]

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Foxie-Sama

Tobias_London

Foxie-Sama

Tobias_London

It was an example to show how he can't take his time to perfect everything.
It's apparently not possible to do so right now, because people keep demanding that he come through on all his promises.
Give the man some time.
You can't change an entire country overnight.
In my opinion, yes, the rich should pay for it.
A slight increase in taxes isn't going to hurt them.
Republicans help the rich, Democrats hurt them.
We just had Republican leave office after helping the rich, now its our turn to hurt them. LoL

How in the hell is it fair that the rich should have to pay for YOUR health insurance?
Put yourself in the rich person's shoes. Would you like someone to charge you $10 for a product and sell the same exact product to someone else for $5, just because "you can afford to pay more for it then they can?" Hell no! You would get pissed and yell discrimination, because in reality, it IS discrimination.

Actually, I'm not a selfish b***h like most Americans and would love to help those in need.
I wouldn't be bitching about higher taxes on me, because I can actually afford it.
I'd be donating money to charities that need it.
I'd be helping those who cannot help themselves.
It's sad that Americans aren't willing to help their fellow countrymen.
If you make more money, you should be taxed more.
If you make less money, you should be taxed less.
Sounds like common sense to me.

Ah, you bring up the point of charities. I believe that charities should be controlled no father then the state level. Its easier to catch fraud that way.

Not necessarily. Charities could be federally run but still have state divisions.

Yah, because there has been NO fraud with the hurricane Katrina payouts
Link

[Syndactyly]

Grapes and Fried Chicken

I have a problem with the government having that much power over my life. Yes, I know what you're all thinking. "Dirty Republican." I'm not. I'm Libertarian. I just don't want the government have the power to control my health care, which, although they don't say it, is the way it looks like it is going, to me.

Is there a reason why you are no longer Sarcasm Man? =o

[Grapes and Fried Chicken]

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Grapes and Fried Chicken

I have a problem with the government having that much power over my life. Yes, I know what you're all thinking. "Dirty Republican." I'm not. I'm Libertarian. I just don't want the government have the power to control my health care, which, although they don't say it, is the way it looks like it is going, to me.

Is there a reason why you are no longer Sarcasm Man? =o

I'm easily bored.

[Syndactyly]

Foxie-Sama

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Foxie-Sama

Tobias_London

It was an example to show how he can't take his time to perfect everything.
It's apparently not possible to do so right now, because people keep demanding that he come through on all his promises.
Give the man some time.
You can't change an entire country overnight.
In my opinion, yes, the rich should pay for it.
A slight increase in taxes isn't going to hurt them.
Republicans help the rich, Democrats hurt them.
We just had Republican leave office after helping the rich, now its our turn to hurt them. LoL

How in the hell is it fair that the rich should have to pay for YOUR health insurance?
Put yourself in the rich person's shoes. Would you like someone to charge you $10 for a product and sell the same exact product to someone else for $5, just because "you can afford to pay more for it then they can?" Hell no! You would get pissed and yell discrimination, because in reality, it IS discrimination.

Bad analogy is bad.

Poor people have to pay taxes too. If they don't they go to prison for tax evasion.

Then give me an analogy that fits this situation then. My analogy is exactly what you are proposing.

Syndactyly

In my opinion, yes, the rich should pay for it.
A slight increase in taxes isn't going to hurt them.

"The rich can pay $10 for water, where as the poor can only pay $5 for the SAME EXACT WATER, so we will charge the rich the $10, and the poor $5"

You're quoting the wrong person, I did not say that.

[20 Shades of Crazy]

Grapes and Fried Chicken

I have a problem with the government having that much power over my life. Yes, I know what you're all thinking. "Dirty Republican." I'm not. I'm Libertarian. I just don't want the government have the power to control my health care, which, although they don't say it, is the way it looks like it is going, to me.

If you don't want the government to control your life, fine. Don't. Go private.

Don't deprive an entire country of people who need care so that you can appease your own fears.

[Sensorium139]

xsv.ninja

the same problem as with countries that have free health care, wait lists.

how ever i'd like to see how america does with it...

Most Americans wait longer than Canadians >_> ...just saying. My boyfriend lives in Canada that's how I know this.

If you're having a life threatening injury they'll get to you immediately in Canada, I've heard many stories of people here dying because they waited over 2 hours in the ER.

The wait times rarely apply to anything life threatening, if it's life threatening it'd get care faster than someone with a very small injury or the cold (unless they're immunocompromised) .

[Syndactyly]

bbamazon

Syndactyly

xsv.ninja

the same problem as with countries that have free health care, wait lists.

how ever i'd like to see how america does with it...

I have a friend in Canada. He has a heart condition. But he didn't always know that. He got light headed and went to the hospital. He was in and out in a couple hours.

Every time I've been to the ER I sat and waited 5-10 hours before I even got to see a doctor.

Usually you have people abuse the ER room which leads to an extended wait for those who are not considered a true emergency. The triage nurse prioritizes who gets seen based upon the severity of the complaint. I.E a sniffle is not going to be seen before heart palpitations.

Why is it that people don't abuse the ER in other countries, then? Why is it that I had to wait for 10 hours when I was experiencing numbness, blindness, severe head pain and various other serious symptoms? I don't think there was 10 hours worth of serious injuries and heart palpitations in the ER that day. A lot of people who DID have the sniffles go to go before me.

[Syndactyly]

Foxie-Sama

Syndactyly

Foxie-Sama

Tobias_London

Foxie-Sama

Tobias_London

It was an example to show how he can't take his time to perfect everything.
It's apparently not possible to do so right now, because people keep demanding that he come through on all his promises.
Give the man some time.
You can't change an entire country overnight.
In my opinion, yes, the rich should pay for it.
A slight increase in taxes isn't going to hurt them.
Republicans help the rich, Democrats hurt them.
We just had Republican leave office after helping the rich, now its our turn to hurt them. LoL

How in the hell is it fair that the rich should have to pay for YOUR health insurance?
Put yourself in the rich person's shoes. Would you like someone to charge you $10 for a product and sell the same exact product to someone else for $5, just because "you can afford to pay more for it then they can?" Hell no! You would get pissed and yell discrimination, because in reality, it IS discrimination.

Actually, I'm not a selfish b***h like most Americans and would love to help those in need.
I wouldn't be bitching about higher taxes on me, because I can actually afford it.
I'd be donating money to charities that need it.
I'd be helping those who cannot help themselves.
It's sad that Americans aren't willing to help their fellow countrymen.
If you make more money, you should be taxed more.
If you make less money, you should be taxed less.
Sounds like common sense to me.

Ah, you bring up the point of charities. I believe that charities should be controlled no father then the state level. Its easier to catch fraud that way.

Not necessarily. Charities could be federally run but still have state divisions.

Yah, because there has been NO fraud with the hurricane Katrina payouts
Link

You are a huge fan of the slippery slope.

[Roastbeef Milkshake]

It is Communistic and ignorant!

[Syndactyly]

Grapes and Fried Chicken

I have a problem with the government having that much power over my life. Yes, I know what you're all thinking. "Dirty Republican." I'm not. I'm Libertarian. I just don't want the government have the power to control my health care, which, although they don't say it, is the way it looks like it is going, to me.

To address your point: You don't want the government to control your healthcare; do you know how is controlling it today? And do you trust them more?

[Foxie-Sama]

Syndactyly

Foxie-Sama

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Foxie-Sama

Now that she is retired and on social security they are charging premiums on her social security for her Medicare!

That's not a problem with Medicare, that's a problem with Social Security.

Social Security was fine, but the government started dipping into it. So what is to prevent the government from dipping into the premiums they will collect from the "public health care" product? Answer? Nothing. Its just the government's way of taking more of or money to line their pockets with promises that "everything will be ponies and rainbows! (but not the gay kind, because gays are evil!) [for the record, I am very pro-gay rights]


THE CAKE IS A LIE

Slippery slope.

Also, you never answered my question on what is to prevent the government from dipping into the health care money? When a criminal commits a crime, they lock them up to prevent them from committing more crimes. No one is holding the government accountable for dipping into social security. I highly doubt it will even be around by the time we are of age to retire.

[Drow_Elven_Warrior]

Let me preface this by saying that I have a pre-existing condition. Obama's health care plan would be good for me for that reason but I oppose a "universal" health care mainly for the reason that people in different areas have different needs for their health care. Someone who lives in a suburb will not necessarily need the same health care as someone who lives in a city.