What's so "bad" about religion?

[Corrupted Coco]

KuroFur

Corrupted Coco

KuroFur

Corrupted Coco

KuroFur

Yes, guess so.
Despite what people say about ignoring the old testament.. Never did understand that.

Yeah, in that case it would tell you to kill people, wouldn't it.

Citation needed.

(http://skepticsannotatedbible.com/lev/20.html#13)
(Yeah, I was in a hurry.)

"20:16 And if a woman approach unto any beast, and lie down thereto, thou shalt kill the woman, and the beast: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them."

That's just one of them.

I meant citation needed for a major religion that follows such things.

Exactly what do you mean?

I would assume Christianity, seeing as it is from the Bible, but I do not know if people follow leviticus.

It is illegal, after all.

Christians do not follow Levitical law.

[eden-of-mine]

Islam, yes, is a major religion that endorses violence against "non-believers". I have an extremely long list of quotes from the Quran...would you rather I quote them all here, select a few, or just link you?

[eden-of-mine]

Coco: My earlier opinions cannot possibly be proven without anecdotal evidence. That's all they were, subjective opinion, in response to a question basically asking for subjective opinion.

[Vajapocalypse]

Religion in itself isn't bad it's the people. Religious leaders turn religion into a tool for control, power and money. Without that taken into consideration religion can be good as it gives people a purpose.

[Corrupted Coco]

Poison-the-Monkey

Islam, yes, is a major religion that endorses violence against "non-believers". I have an extremely long list of quotes from the Quran...would you rather I quote them all here, select a few, or just link you?

Great, now all you need is proof that all Islamic people carry out this violence against non-believers as a direct result.

[Corrupted Coco]

Poison-the-Monkey

Coco: My earlier opinions cannot possibly be proven without anecdotal evidence. That's all they were, subjective opinion, in response to a question basically asking for subjective opinion.

You misunderstand, when I said "subjective", I mean the situation you speak of is subjective. Just because someone who believes in a god is close minded does not mean that the two are related. That's fallacious logic.

[eden-of-mine]

Corrupted Coco

Poison-the-Monkey

Coco: My earlier opinions cannot possibly be proven without anecdotal evidence. That's all they were, subjective opinion, in response to a question basically asking for subjective opinion.

You misunderstand, when I said "subjective", I mean the situation you speak of is subjective. Just because someone who believes in a god is close minded does not mean that the two are related. That's fallacious logic.

Yet, much of it stems from the religion itself. Once again, all I could provide is anecdotal evidence...countless times debating with theists or listening to them, only to claim they can't listen to me because "it's the work of Satan". But, once again, there is no way to really prove these things, so the point is moot because it can only be an opinion.

[Allythium]

MECHAnubis

The fact that it convinces people to remain uneducated, and to do whatever they're told to do.

Actually, I think for myself about religion. I believe that any true religious believer should question their beliefs. The ones who don't are the ones who are scared that if they start asking questions, they'll get answers they don't like. I've done enough studying to be sure about what I believe. I'm quite educated on the subject. And if you're implying that it stops scientific education, I'm quite educated on that subject too. It's possible to believe in religion alongside of science (it would be off topic to explain how here, though).

Some bad things are done in the name of religion, but that doesn't make all religion bad. Abusive teachers will do horrible things to students in the name of education sometimes (suggesting that kids learn better from tough punnishment) - does that make all education bad?

An no, as a Christian, I do not follow the book of Leviticus.

[eden-of-mine]

Corrupted Coco

Poison-the-Monkey

Islam, yes, is a major religion that endorses violence against "non-believers". I have an extremely long list of quotes from the Quran...would you rather I quote them all here, select a few, or just link you?

Great, now all you need is proof that all Islamic people carry out this violence against non-believers as a direct result.

I thought this wasn't supposed to be about the people but the religion itself? The Quran preaches violence against non-believers, and as the holy book it is the foundation of Islam and the religious beliefs. Since the holy book preaches violence against non-believers, the religion itself is as well--whether or not a significant portion of the Islamic community chose to follow those passages.

And the Quran does preach violence against non-believers.

Source: http://www.answering-islam.org/Quran/Themes/jihad_passages.html

Quote:

Excerpt K 2:190-191
Set 2, Count 3+4 [2.190] ...fight in the way of Allah with those who fight with you...[2.191] And kill them wherever you find them, and drive them out from whence they drove you out, and persecution is severer than slaughter, and do not fight with them at the Sacred Mosque until they fight with you in it, but if they do fight you, then slay them; such is the recompense of the unbelievers.

Excerpt K 4:074-077
Set 15, Count 38-41 [4.74] Therefore let those fight in the way of Allah, who sell this world's life for the hereafter; and whoever fights in the way of Allah, then be he slain or be he victorious, We shall grant him a mighty reward. [4.75] ...fight in the way of Allah... [4.76] Those who believe fight in the way of Allah, and those who disbelieve fight in the way of the Satan. Fight therefore against the friends of the Satan... [4.77] ...when fighting is prescribed for them...Our Lord! why hast Thou ordained fighting for us?...

Excerpt K 4:089-091
Set 17, Count 43-45 [4.89] ...take not from among them friends until they fly (their homes) in Allah’s way; but if they turn back [to their homes], then seize them and kill them wherever you find them... [4.90] Allah has not given you a way against them [Allah supposedly does not allow Muslims to fight people friendly to Muslims]. [4.91]...seize them and kill them wherever you find them...

Excerpt K 8:012
Set 28, Count 62 ...make firm those who believe. I will cast terror into the hearts of those who disbelieve. Therefore strike off their heads and strike off every fingertip of them.

Excerpt K 8:039-048
Set 30, Count 66-75 [8.39] Shakir: ...fight with them until there is no more persecution and religion should be only for Allah...

Excerpt K 33:25-27
Set 66, Count 131-133 [33.25]...Allah sufficed the believers in fighting... [33.26]...some [Jews] you killed and you took captive another part. [33.27]...He made you heirs to their [Jewish] land and their dwellings and their property, and (to) a land which you have not yet trodden...

Excerpt K 66:009
Set 83, Count 162 O Prophet! strive hard against the unbelievers and the hypocrites, and be hard against them...

[Corrupted Coco]

Poison-the-Monkey

Corrupted Coco

Poison-the-Monkey

Coco: My earlier opinions cannot possibly be proven without anecdotal evidence. That's all they were, subjective opinion, in response to a question basically asking for subjective opinion.

You misunderstand, when I said "subjective", I mean the situation you speak of is subjective. Just because someone who believes in a god is close minded does not mean that the two are related. That's fallacious logic.

Yet, much of it stems from the religion itself. Once again, all I could provide is anecdotal evidence...countless times debating with theists or listening to them, only to claim they can't listen to me because "it's the work of Satan". But, once again, there is no way to really prove these things, so the point is moot because it can only be an opinion.

You can't prove that. "Close minded a*****e" is not a trait limited to religious persons. I've talked to atheists who are exactly the same.

[Corrupted Coco]

Allythium

MECHAnubis

The fact that it convinces people to remain uneducated, and to do whatever they're told to do.

Actually, I think for myself about religion. I believe that any true religious believer should question their beliefs. The ones who don't are the ones who are scared that if they start asking questions, they'll get answers they don't like. I've done enough studying to be sure about what I believe. I'm quite educated on the subject. And if you're implying that it stops scientific education, I'm quite educated on that subject too. It's possible to believe in religion alongside of science (it would be off topic to explain how here, though).

Some bad things are done in the name of religion, but that doesn't make all religion bad. Abusive teachers will do horrible things to students in the name of education sometimes (suggesting that kids learn better from tough punnishment) - does that make all education bad?

An no, as a Christian, I do not follow the book of Leviticus.

This times a thousand.

[Corrupted Coco]

Poison-the-Monkey

Corrupted Coco

Poison-the-Monkey

Islam, yes, is a major religion that endorses violence against "non-believers". I have an extremely long list of quotes from the Quran...would you rather I quote them all here, select a few, or just link you?

Great, now all you need is proof that all Islamic people carry out this violence against non-believers as a direct result.

I thought this wasn't supposed to be about the people but the religion itself? The Quran preaches violence against non-believers, and as the holy book it is the foundation of Islam and the religious beliefs. Since the holy book preaches violence against non-believers, the religion itself is as well--whether or not a significant portion of the Islamic community chose to follow those passages.

And the Quran does preach violence against non-believers.

Source: http://www.answering-islam.org/Quran/Themes/jihad_passages.html

Quote:

Excerpt K 2:190-191
Set 2, Count 3+4 [2.190] ...fight in the way of Allah with those who fight with you...[2.191] And kill them wherever you find them, and drive them out from whence they drove you out, and persecution is severer than slaughter, and do not fight with them at the Sacred Mosque until they fight with you in it, but if they do fight you, then slay them; such is the recompense of the unbelievers.

Excerpt K 4:074-077
Set 15, Count 38-41 [4.74] Therefore let those fight in the way of Allah, who sell this world's life for the hereafter; and whoever fights in the way of Allah, then be he slain or be he victorious, We shall grant him a mighty reward. [4.75] ...fight in the way of Allah... [4.76] Those who believe fight in the way of Allah, and those who disbelieve fight in the way of the Satan. Fight therefore against the friends of the Satan... [4.77] ...when fighting is prescribed for them...Our Lord! why hast Thou ordained fighting for us?...

Excerpt K 4:089-091
Set 17, Count 43-45 [4.89] ...take not from among them friends until they fly (their homes) in Allah’s way; but if they turn back [to their homes], then seize them and kill them wherever you find them... [4.90] Allah has not given you a way against them [Allah supposedly does not allow Muslims to fight people friendly to Muslims]. [4.91]...seize them and kill them wherever you find them...

Excerpt K 8:012
Set 28, Count 62 ...make firm those who believe. I will cast terror into the hearts of those who disbelieve. Therefore strike off their heads and strike off every fingertip of them.

Excerpt K 8:039-048
Set 30, Count 66-75 [8.39] Shakir: ...fight with them until there is no more persecution and religion should be only for Allah...

Excerpt K 33:25-27
Set 66, Count 131-133 [33.25]...Allah sufficed the believers in fighting... [33.26]...some [Jews] you killed and you took captive another part. [33.27]...He made you heirs to their [Jewish] land and their dwellings and their property, and (to) a land which you have not yet trodden...

Excerpt K 66:009
Set 83, Count 162 O Prophet! strive hard against the unbelievers and the hypocrites, and be hard against them...

Well considering I don't remember ever watching the local news and seeing Islamic people acting out said violence, I'm going to to have to take their inaction as strong evidence that you don't know the full story.

[eden-of-mine]

Corrupted Coco

Poison-the-Monkey

Corrupted Coco

Poison-the-Monkey

Coco: My earlier opinions cannot possibly be proven without anecdotal evidence. That's all they were, subjective opinion, in response to a question basically asking for subjective opinion.

You misunderstand, when I said "subjective", I mean the situation you speak of is subjective. Just because someone who believes in a god is close minded does not mean that the two are related. That's fallacious logic.

Yet, much of it stems from the religion itself. Once again, all I could provide is anecdotal evidence...countless times debating with theists or listening to them, only to claim they can't listen to me because "it's the work of Satan". But, once again, there is no way to really prove these things, so the point is moot because it can only be an opinion.

You can't prove that. "Close minded a*****e" is not a trait limited to religious persons. I've talked to atheists who are exactly the same.

See, now you've gone and put words in my mouth, and since you love tossing "fallacies" out there when there are no real arguments going to be made, I'm going to go ahead and point this out for what it was: straw man.

[Corrupted Coco]

Poison-the-Monkey

Corrupted Coco

Poison-the-Monkey

Corrupted Coco

Poison-the-Monkey

Coco: My earlier opinions cannot possibly be proven without anecdotal evidence. That's all they were, subjective opinion, in response to a question basically asking for subjective opinion.

You misunderstand, when I said "subjective", I mean the situation you speak of is subjective. Just because someone who believes in a god is close minded does not mean that the two are related. That's fallacious logic.

Yet, much of it stems from the religion itself. Once again, all I could provide is anecdotal evidence...countless times debating with theists or listening to them, only to claim they can't listen to me because "it's the work of Satan". But, once again, there is no way to really prove these things, so the point is moot because it can only be an opinion.

You can't prove that. "Close minded a*****e" is not a trait limited to religious persons. I've talked to atheists who are exactly the same.

See, now you've gone and put words in my mouth, and since you love tossing "fallacies" out there when there are no real arguments going to be made, I'm going to go ahead and point this out for what it was: straw man.

You missed the point.

[Xlay233]

Poison-the-Monkey

Corrupted Coco

Poison-the-Monkey

I'm not well equipped to answer, but I'll provide my own thoughts.

Religion is bad, in my opinion, because it usually teaches us not to do good things simply because they are good and we should strive to be moral on our own, but because there is some reward waiting at the end of the tunnel, or some punishment if we do not.

Subjective.

Quote:

Religion is bad because, if forced upon a child early in their lives, it restricts their thinking and doesn't give them the chance to choose for themselves.

Subjective, and applies to all religious and moral viewpoints, including atheism.

Quote:

Religion is bad because it is often used to control behavior and to separate and exclude.

Corruption in leadership, manipulation by people.

Quote:

Religion is bad because once you convince yourself that the world is a certain way no matter what, the evidence no longer matters, only belief.

Subjective.

Quote:

Religion is bad because it tends to focus on conversion and sustaining the religion or group itself, instead of simply doing good deeds.

Subjective, corruption in leadership.

Quote:

I could say more things but...there are far juicier debates and I'm not really interested in this one.

You didn't say much at all.

My own thoughts...in my opinion... Bad is inherently subjective, so all I can truly offer are my opinions.


you know, if people paid closer attention to you like i do, they would probably come to realize that you are, indeed a big hypocrite. Didnt you just post a reply to one of my comments telling me to "get the hell out of this debate if i just want to post my opnions"? you have some nerve.