What is the ideal ethic of a Soldier?

[Suicidesoldier#1]

l_Shamrock_l

GunsmithKitten

So a good soldier ISN"T a blood thirsty killing machine?

I guess the USMC have it wrong then, what with all that "God has a hard on for Marines because they kill everything they see and keep Heaven packed with fresh souls!" and "What makes the grass grow; BLOOD BLOOD BLOOD"

This just in: War chants and battle cries to motivate people are now creed.

I thought those chants were just in the movies D:

[l_Shamrock_l]

Michael Noire

l_Shamrock_l

GunsmithKitten

So a good soldier ISN"T a blood thirsty killing machine?

I guess the USMC have it wrong then, what with all that "God has a hard on for Marines because they kill everything they see and keep Heaven packed with fresh souls!" and "What makes the grass grow; BLOOD BLOOD BLOOD"

This just in: War chants and battle cries to motivate people are now creed.

creed? you mean the 90s band with the heroin addiction?

You read me like a poem.

[l_Shamrock_l]

Suicidesoldier#1

l_Shamrock_l

GunsmithKitten

So a good soldier ISN"T a blood thirsty killing machine?

I guess the USMC have it wrong then, what with all that "God has a hard on for Marines because they kill everything they see and keep Heaven packed with fresh souls!" and "What makes the grass grow; BLOOD BLOOD BLOOD"

This just in: War chants and battle cries to motivate people are now creed.

I thought those chants were just in the movies D:

I wouldn't say they're exactly as described by the other person. "Kill! Kill! Kill!" is the typical one used to motivate during PT. Other than that they use phrases such as "Semper fi" and the likes to motivate. Nobody brainwashes the military into killing machines. They all maintain their own identity as people. They just want to be conditioned to perform as required.

[Michael Noire]

it doesn't matter how awesomely effective a particular military organization is, if they have to lose their souls to succeed, they've become less than good soldiers.

[Silence_Walker]

Okay: Here goes.

Some people are more detrimental to society than others.
It is my conviction that at birth, everyone is equal in terms of worth.
As their character develops, and they make life choices that negatively or positively impact society,
then their worth to society as a whole decreases or increases.

Some people are irrevocably and irreparably stuck in behavior patterns that cause more damage to society than good. At this point, their life becomes worth less than someone with a net positive influence on society.

This is of course operating on current/traditional societal models.

In an anarchy, everyone's life is truly equal, and every other individual's life is an additional threat to yours.

[GunsmithKitten]

l_Shamrock_l

GunsmithKitten

So a good soldier ISN"T a blood thirsty killing machine?

I guess the USMC have it wrong then, what with all that "God has a hard on for Marines because they kill everything they see and keep Heaven packed with fresh souls!" and "What makes the grass grow; BLOOD BLOOD BLOOD"

This just in: War chants and battle cries to motivate people are now creed.

What's the difference really?

[from blue to]

I think soldiers should be held to the same ethical standard as anyone. As people exceptionally competent at violence, their moral failings may have more impact than the failings of others, but they are the same failings. I think it is important that soldiers always evaluate their actions on a personal level and never allow group mentality to take control of their actions. Unfortunately, soldiers that take the time to consider their actions can find their careers cut short. That in mind, I think a good soldier is one who is no soldier at all in any time that soldiers are not necessary for he often can not risk being a morally good soldier.

[AsuraSyn]

Not exactly a "soldier" but regardless, a prime example of what it means to serve the whole.
Despite any romantic delusions to the contrary, there's only one requirement for a soldier: Follow orders. Obey.
Therefore, the ideal "ethic" of a soldier would be a complete lack of any ethical base and simple, blind obedience to the commanding power.

[Lisa_the_paramagic]

Whenever I hear soldier THESE days...

I think of hipster fags playing on their iphones and making shitty remakes of Gangnam Style instead of fighting the enemy.

[l_Shamrock_l]

GunsmithKitten

l_Shamrock_l

GunsmithKitten

So a good soldier ISN"T a blood thirsty killing machine?

I guess the USMC have it wrong then, what with all that "God has a hard on for Marines because they kill everything they see and keep Heaven packed with fresh souls!" and "What makes the grass grow; BLOOD BLOOD BLOOD"

This just in: War chants and battle cries to motivate people are now creed.

What's the difference really?

A war chant or battle cry is used to motivate the individual. Believe it or not these are typically used in PT rather than any actual combat.

Creed is faith.

[l_Shamrock_l]

Lisa_the_paramagic

Whenever I hear soldier THESE days...

I think of hipster fags playing on their iphones and making shitty remakes of Gangnam Style instead of fighting the enemy.

God forbid they do something to help their moral while away from their families for half a year or more at a time under shitty living conditions and the constant threat of attack/death.

[Michael Noire]

AsuraSyn

Not exactly a "soldier" but regardless, a prime example of what it means to serve the whole.
Despite any romantic delusions to the contrary, there's only one requirement for a soldier: Follow orders. Obey.
Therefore, the ideal "ethic" of a soldier would be a complete lack of any ethical base and simple, blind obedience to the commanding power.

You are simply incorrect.

A clerk can follow orders and obey. A Priest can follow orders and obey. A Doctor can follow orders and obey. Not to get into a Socratic Dialogue or anything, but it stands to reason that following orders and obeying is an ancillary, and possibly optional characteristic of a soldier. Many soldiers are trained to disobey orders that would jeopardize the mission, the lives of their allies, or the ethics of the community that sponsors them. Some soldiers are voluntary and collectively gather under mutually agreed rules with little to no hierarchy. A person in a self regulated militia could be a soldier, just like a town's men and women being able bodied could gather their weapons together and manufacture additional ones to defend themselves against a foreign invader. All of these people, upon establishing a collective body of militarized opposition to a foreign body become soldiers.

Soldiers, at the end of the day, are warriors with a sense of Community connection in the form of patriotism, religious devotion, or philosophical dedication toward an end, where large numbers of them become organized as platoons, companies, battalions, and armies, with the potential for captains and generals and warlords as leaders, but not with necessity. All soldiers are not Samurai/Saburai who become something else/Ronin upon leaving/killing/losing their leader/Daimyo. An E1 on the field who witnesses the death of his Captain is no less a soldier after watching the rest of his allies die, as long as he keeps fighting till his time is up, till he makes it back to his homeland, or till the war is over. When his time is finished, it is finished.


Thus, a Soldier's characteristic by definition is not dependent on following orders.

[CH1YO]

IDF

[Queen of Mercury]

Michael Noire

It seems to me such a thing as a good soldier can exist. That the idea of the soldier is one who struggles, but not necessarily someone who's only purpose is in killing and destroying. I think the idea of a soldier is to kill and destroy that which threatens the life and beauty around them, to represent a final solemn sense of resolution, to draw the line and say 'come no further'. I personally believe that the ideal ethic of a soldier is one with good intentions, and the bravery to see them through.

What kind of soldier do you see as ideal, ethically? Historical comparisons or examples being viable.

As a member of our Armed Forces, I commend you for this. Its true. Sure there are those who are total assholes in the service, goddess knows I've met my share, but your description of the ideal ethic of a soldier is spot on in my personal opinion.

(As an aside, in regards to something I've said in a previous thread, about gun control, I didn't get the chance to clarify that when I think of 'assault weapons' I think of military grade weaponry, things that a lay person isn't goign to get their hands on easily.)