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Hanma Selis's avatar

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Captain Verd
What the ******** is war?

War is an organized, armed, and often a 'prolonged conflict' that is carried on between states, nations, or other parties[1][2] typified by extreme aggression, social disruption, and usually high mortality. War should be understood as an actual, intentional and widespread armed conflict between political communities, and therefore is defined as a form of political violence. (thanks Wikipedia)

Basically, it is armed robbery on a national scale.
Avgvsto's avatar

Anxious Knight

CH1YO
Firebird v2
False Dichotomy
CH1YO
Yes but it wasn't very nice.
Yea, that's pretty much my stance on it. The second one, I would almost say was more justified than the first.

Bomb #1: Will you surrender?
Japan: *Says nothing for a week*
Bomb #2: Hi?
Japan: *Finally speaks after 10 days*

It's a wonder we didn't drop a third one, to be honest.
That's actually false. Japan and the United States were already negotiating a peace treaty; it's just that the talks broke down and Japan refused to come to the negotiation table again.


Japan refused to sign an unconditional surrender, which is actually fairly reasonable.

I find the unconditional surrender unjustified and therefore committing mass genocide almost as large as the holocaust in order to enforce it was also not justified.
False Dichotomy
Firebird v2
False Dichotomy
CH1YO
Yes but it wasn't very nice.
Yea, that's pretty much my stance on it. The second one, I would almost say was more justified than the first.

Bomb #1: Will you surrender?
Japan: *Says nothing for a week*
Bomb #2: Hi?
Japan: *Finally speaks after 10 days*

It's a wonder we didn't drop a third one, to be honest.
That's actually false. Japan and the United States were already negotiating a peace treaty; it's just that the talks broke down and Japan refused to come to the negotiation table again.
History channel said total radio silence. Then again, history channel isn't really a prime source of information. Especially not now.

I could be wrong, but I certainly never heard anything about legitimate communication between our nations in the space between those bombings.


There were negotiations but they fell apart because Japan refused to compromise. They said "We want this, this and this." and they honestly had no leg to stand on. The Allies tried to negotiate but Japan refused to work with them. So we dropped the bombs. Japan actually still refused to compromise after the first one which is why we dropped the second one. I guess one mass death wasn't enough for them to surrender.
Aporeia's avatar

Obsessive Sage

Firebird v2
False Dichotomy
Firebird v2
False Dichotomy
CH1YO
Yes but it wasn't very nice.
Yea, that's pretty much my stance on it. The second one, I would almost say was more justified than the first.

Bomb #1: Will you surrender?
Japan: *Says nothing for a week*
Bomb #2: Hi?
Japan: *Finally speaks after 10 days*

It's a wonder we didn't drop a third one, to be honest.
That's actually false. Japan and the United States were already negotiating a peace treaty; it's just that the talks broke down and Japan refused to come to the negotiation table again.
History channel said total radio silence. Then again, history channel isn't really a prime source of information. Especially not now.

I could be wrong, but I certainly never heard anything about legitimate communication between our nations in the space between those bombings.

History Channel also lies.
I've certainly caught them doing it enough to treat everything they say with a grain of salt. That whole special they did on explaining the Jewish Exodus scientifically was, for lack of a better term, fanciful bullcrap. They literally explained WHY Egyptologists discounted everything they just said, then proceeded to say "but we're right anyway" without supporting evidence.
Hanma Selis's avatar

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CH1YO
Hanma Selis
Well, we had tow choices: Either we invade and have to ask the Soviet Union for help. And just to let you know, Japan would fight to the last man, women, and child. Or we can drop the A-bomb and show Japan (and the USSR) what we can do to them.


It would have been manageable without Soviet involvement but the loss of life would have been absurd.

The problem was that the Soviet Union want to help the US. We just didn't want their help. But when Stalin wants to do something, he gonna try to do it. So in my opinion, the dropping of the A-bomb was more to quickly end the Pacific War than to risk Soviet involvement in Japan.
Camera Stellata 's avatar

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They brought it upon themselves.
Avgvsto
CH1YO
Firebird v2
False Dichotomy
CH1YO
Yes but it wasn't very nice.
Yea, that's pretty much my stance on it. The second one, I would almost say was more justified than the first.

Bomb #1: Will you surrender?
Japan: *Says nothing for a week*
Bomb #2: Hi?
Japan: *Finally speaks after 10 days*

It's a wonder we didn't drop a third one, to be honest.
That's actually false. Japan and the United States were already negotiating a peace treaty; it's just that the talks broke down and Japan refused to come to the negotiation table again.


Japan refused to sign an unconditional surrender, which is actually fairly reasonable.

I find the unconditional surrender unjustified and therefore committing mass genocide almost as large as the holocaust in order to enforce it was also not justified.


Actually that is false. It's not that Japan refused unconditional surrender it's that they asked for too much and refused to compromise.
Quote:
Emperor Hirohito, the government, and the war council were considering four conditions for surrender: the preservation of the kokutai (Imperial institution and national polity), assumption by the Imperial Headquarters of responsibility for disarmament and demobilization, no occupation of the Japanese Home Islands, Korea, or Formosa, and delegation of the punishment of war criminals to the Japanese government.


They wanted those four things and were unwilling to budge. Now if you know anything about politics and war you can understand why some of those were completely unacceptable.

Also, not even close to how big the holocaust was. Holocaust was at least 7 million people. The bombs killed between 150,000 and 246,000 people.
Hanma Selis's avatar

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Camera Stellata
They brought it upon themselves.

Actually, the Imperial Japanese Army brought it upon Japan. The Imperial Japanese Navy were the smart ones. They knew that America would eventually win. I could never understand why the IJA hated America so much as to wanna start a war with us.
Aporeia's avatar

Obsessive Sage

Mei tsuki7
False Dichotomy
Firebird v2
False Dichotomy
CH1YO
Yes but it wasn't very nice.
Yea, that's pretty much my stance on it. The second one, I would almost say was more justified than the first.

Bomb #1: Will you surrender?
Japan: *Says nothing for a week*
Bomb #2: Hi?
Japan: *Finally speaks after 10 days*

It's a wonder we didn't drop a third one, to be honest.
That's actually false. Japan and the United States were already negotiating a peace treaty; it's just that the talks broke down and Japan refused to come to the negotiation table again.
History channel said total radio silence. Then again, history channel isn't really a prime source of information. Especially not now.

I could be wrong, but I certainly never heard anything about legitimate communication between our nations in the space between those bombings.


There were negotiations but they fell apart because Japan refused to compromise. They said "We want this, this and this." and they honestly had no leg to stand on. The Allies tried to negotiate but Japan refused to work with them. So we dropped the bombs. Japan actually still refused to compromise after the first one which is why we dropped the second one. I guess one mass death wasn't enough for them to surrender.
That sounds pretty believable.
Valiant Corvus's avatar

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This was way before we fully understood the implications of radiation poisoning. For the time, it was a sound military decision; instead of sacrificing thousands of American lives, why not just drop a few bombs and be done with it?

On that note, saying that the dropping of the bombs was on par with the holocaust: You're retarded.

Holocaust killed a bit over 6 million people.
About 300,000 Japanese died in the initial bombings.
Avgvsto
CH1YO
Firebird v2
False Dichotomy
CH1YO
Yes but it wasn't very nice.
Yea, that's pretty much my stance on it. The second one, I would almost say was more justified than the first.

Bomb #1: Will you surrender?
Japan: *Says nothing for a week*
Bomb #2: Hi?
Japan: *Finally speaks after 10 days*

It's a wonder we didn't drop a third one, to be honest.
That's actually false. Japan and the United States were already negotiating a peace treaty; it's just that the talks broke down and Japan refused to come to the negotiation table again.


Japan refused to sign an unconditional surrender, which is actually fairly reasonable.

I find the unconditional surrender unjustified and therefore committing mass genocide almost as large as the holocaust in order to enforce it was also not justified.


It was distinctly smaller than the Holocaust and strategically purposeful but still not very nice.

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