Kadaverus
black_wing_angel
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Oh the law says its okay to kill?
In certain situations, yes.
Really, Id like to see where.
Castle Doctrine. Conceal Carry / Open Carry, for example.
They're not going to allow you to carry, open or concealed, a lethal weapon, if it weren't going to
EVER be legal to use it. That's like buying a car you're never allowed to drive. There's no point in it.
Generally speaking, as long as you have the legal ground to possess the weapon used, and are in a life or death situation, there's absolutely no foul in using lethal force, in most jurisdictions.
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Human nature justifies killing another person?
In certain situations, yes.
Like when?
Like when it's you or them. Someone rushes you with a knife, you are generally allowed to neutralize the threat, upto and including lethal force. Whatever it takes to make them stop.
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So if you were provoked its okay to kill someone then?
As long as the provocation was life threatening, yes.
If you pulled a knife or a gun on me, I'm well within my right (in most jurisdictions), to end your life, to protect my own.
Oh are you? so the first thing you do when someone pulls out a knife at you is you shoot them with intent to kill?
Thats cool, that doesn't sound like self defense though.
I shoot to "neutralize". Whether or not that requires them to stop breathing, is up to them and God.
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So how come the actions that happened at columbine were reprehensible?
Because they weren't under immediate threat to their lives. They were the provoking party, not the defensive party.
They?
Whos they, the columbine shooter was one person.
Um...no. There were 2 shooters at Columbine. Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold.
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Clearly the shooter was provoked by life long torment from his peers.
But not with the threat to their lives. And there were 2 shooters in Columbine. Get your facts straight, if you want to challenge me.
Id say being bullied to point of suicide is a threat to someones self preservation of their own lives.
But not
immediate. Immediate danger means here and now. That doesn't mean that someone can pull a gun on me, and I later hunt them down. I am only allowed to use lethal force, so long as they are
CURRENTLY a threat to my life. This was never the case with the Dylan or Eric.
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But youd go so far as to say, thats a justifiable means to kill someone, so by your logic, what the columbine shooter did was justified
smile
Nope. They were never in immediate life threatening danger. Their victims, however, were.
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Provocation justifies killing, you said so yourself, youd even shoot a home invader.
In certain situations, it does. You can't gun someone down, just because they pushed you. There has to be a clear cut threat to your life.
Yeah like in the columbine shooting!
No. Not at all like the Columbine shooting. I'd recommend you actually
LOOK INTO the event. Because based on what you've said this far, you clearly don't know s**t about it. Especially if you think there was only one shooter.
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I disagree though, I don't know why you're disagreeing with it because the Columbine Shooter was well within your logical fallacy to kill people.
Not at all. Quit trolling just because you can't defend your stance honestly.
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I bet you must feel really proud of yourself killing all those insurgents without giving a second thought of their humanity,
I've never killed insurgents. But if I did...yeah. I'd feel pretty proud of myself for doing my country a service.
Thats nice at least we know you wont need extra conditioning
Never did. Human life is not especially valuable to me, by default. Only to those I actually care about.
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its so nice you've been conditioned to disregard human life to brag about killing other people.
I haven't been "conditioned" to disregard humanity.
YOU'VE been conditioned to view it as unconditionally valuable. You're the kind of person who would let a rapist rape you, and do nothing about it, just so you don't have to live with having harmed them. I'd kill the b*****d, without a second thought. That's called survival instinct. Highly prized characteristic of nature.
Self preservation = killing other people?
My bad
In some situations, yes. If it's got to be them or you, you make sure it's them.
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I thought the highly prized characteristic of human nature was
ALTRUISM, but hey what do I know, you're the kind of person who would shoot a home invader just because you value property more than a human life.
I value my property more than the life of scum who would dishonestly take it from me. They don't respect my rights. Why should I respect theirs?
You get what you give. You do me no harm, I'll do no you no harm. Cross me, and you will suffer the consequences of your own misdeeds, in accordance with the law.
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I mean if it was up to me, Id scare the person to an inch of his life and wait for the authorities to apprehend him
That's always an option, sure. And legally, if they run away, you
have to let them. Unfortunately, this is not always the case. And never make an empty threat. If you're going to threaten the possibility of death, you damn well better be willing to carry through, should they call your bluff. Because if you pull a gun on someone, and they don't think you have it in you to pull the trigger, you're just pissing them off worse. You better be ready to take it to the next level, if necessary. I have no problem with that.
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but clearly you're more rational and just shoot the person without a second thought.
Italics for sarcasm.
I said I'd have no problem with it. That's not to say they don't have a chance. But we play by my rules. You do as you're told, you survive. You spend an indefinite amount of time in police custody, but you survive. Disobey my orders, and I can not guarantee your safety. You make your choices. I only enforce the consequences of those decisions.
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And don't give me that hippy bullshit, my uncle was a war vet in nam, and killing VC killed him, he still lives with the nightmares of his friends dead and the guilt of killing other men who were doing what he was asked to do.
What a coincidence!
MY uncle was also a 'Nam vet, who killed VCs. Didn't affect him, in the least, except gave him some stories to tell. Hell, he'd kill a VC, take their gun off their corpse, and sell it for profit, while he was there.
Your uncle just didn't have the mental gear for life or death combat.
Really he doesnt?
That's how you see it?
Obviously, if he was so "bothered" by it.
Either way, the point is that just because your uncle didn't have the mental ability to rationalize killing another human being, does not mean
nobody could. As I said, my own uncle did the exact same thing. No issues, at all. Didn't even have a problem looting the enemy gun out of their dead hands, to sell for profit.
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Wow you've really been conditioned to disregard human life havent you, cept for your own I mean.
That's the natural order. You look at the animals in the wild. The ones who survive, are the ones who are not afraid to kill, when necessary. Even a rat will fight, when cornered.
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Id say my uncle was more human than yours.
Humanity is of no value to the dead.
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But yes, feel free to go around killing people.
If I have to, I will.
There you go again with the "If I have to"
You dont have to, you just want to.
I do not want to. I hope I never do kill anyone. I don't ever want to be in that situation.
But if it were to come up, I will not hesitate. Being ready is not the same as being eager.
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If I werent a better man,
Which you're not, by any default
.
Oh but I am, as you will see.
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I'd suggest the state excute you
I've done nothing to warrant it. Unless you're trying to convict me of thought crimes. You can not convict for crimes not committed.
No? Well if its for self preservation, like what you've been rambling on, you've been spewing pro killing propaganda like a sociopath, wouldn't you agree for the safety of the public its best youd be put down?
No. Because I'm no threat to society in general. Just those who are a threat to me. Don't want me to kill you? Don't make me have to. As long as you mind your manners, I am no threat to you.
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Personally I'd rather have you locked up where you can do no harm and get the rehabilitation you deserve but knowing you, youd probably see death as more
merciful.
Except there is nothing to rehabilitate. I will not harm an innocent person. I am no threat to anyone who is no threat to me.
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but hey I am a better man
No you're not. You're an overly empathetic, emotional person with a moral high-ground complex.
Yes I am a better man and I'm able to emotionally disconnect myself from debates, and not bring up dumb rhetorical scenarios like home invaders and shooting them on sight and without dispute my morals on preservation of human LIVES is way higher than your morals on self preservation at the cost of others.
Morals are subjective, I hope you realize.
I get your side of the coin. I do. But the fact is, people like you, are the people who get victimized. The ones who will never stand against a threat, because you value the life of even the lowest of criminal scum.
Me? Not the same story. I can only be victimized by someone better prepared than I am. And I will not go down begging. I'll go down fighting. And if the good lord grants my dying wish, I'll take them with me.
To die fighting, is better than to live begging.
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and I respect no matter how stupid you are,
Awww...need some Preparation H for your butthurt, little bunny boy?
Awww did that hurt you?
Calling you dumb?
Not remotely. It takes a lot more than a cheap insult, especially one as empty as that, to get under my skin. But it's clear that I've gotten under yours.
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you're still a human being who deserves to live.
Yes. But only because I've done nothing to be revoked of that right to life. Many, many people do not share this fact.
But many people arent sociopaths unlike you
smile
*shrug* I've been called worse things. And even if it were true that I was a sociopath (as if you actually knew how to gauge it), I'd rather be a sociopathic survivor, than an empathetic doormat. People won't ******** with me, twice. You'd just as well put a sign on your door that says "Take all you want. I will not harm you." I prefer the sign that says "This house protected by Smith and Wesson."
