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Science is objective?

Of course, Science deals with cold hard facts. 0.48453608247423 48.5% [ 47 ]
No, science is subject to human interpreatation and subjectivity. 0.41237113402062 41.2% [ 40 ]
I don't know. 0.10309278350515 10.3% [ 10 ]
Total Votes:[ 97 ]
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Distinct Genius

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Andy Worhal
dh8d1
Andy Worhal
frozen_water
dh8d1
Nope. That's your assertion. I said this thread is hilarious, and cited him. I never said anything like that he represents the entirety of this thread. It's just one thing I mentioned.

LOL
I don't see how his post is relevant then, what is your point exactly?
um, he's really into spirituality
"Spirituality" is a vague nebulous word. I have no idea what you mean when you use it.
you are into spirituality like the supernatural.

i know that because you manifested me into being by simply quoting me, like a genie out of a bottle
I have no idea what you mean. You enjoy vague nebulous words without explaining anything meaningful.
dh8d1
Andy Worhal
dh8d1
Andy Worhal
dh8d1




Sure I did.
hey, do you ever think about playing pretend?
Pretending can be fun?
i pretend that i'm good looking and people like me when i'm alone.
When you're alone, how good looking you are and how much people like you are both irrelevant. It's only when you're near others these things matter.
oh yeah, in my head it always matters. looks matter big time, when i look in the mirror, i don't wanna see ugly looking back!

Distinct Genius

13,400 Points
  • Perfect Attendance 400
  • Conversationalist 100
  • 50 Wins 150
Andy Worhal
dh8d1
Andy Worhal
dh8d1
Andy Worhal
dh8d1




Sure I did.
hey, do you ever think about playing pretend?
Pretending can be fun?
i pretend that i'm good looking and people like me when i'm alone.
When you're alone, how good looking you are and how much people like you are both irrelevant. It's only when you're near others these things matter.
oh yeah, in my head it always matters. looks matter big time, when i look in the mirror, i don't wanna see ugly looking back!
That to me seems psychologically a problem, not visually.
dh8d1
Andy Worhal
dh8d1
Andy Worhal
frozen_water
dh8d1
Nope. That's your assertion. I said this thread is hilarious, and cited him. I never said anything like that he represents the entirety of this thread. It's just one thing I mentioned.

LOL
I don't see how his post is relevant then, what is your point exactly?
um, he's really into spirituality
"Spirituality" is a vague nebulous word. I have no idea what you mean when you use it.
you are into spirituality like the supernatural.

i know that because you manifested me into being by simply quoting me, like a genie out of a bottle
I have no idea what you mean. You enjoy vague nebulous words without explaining anything meaningful.
when you quoted me, i magically popped into this forum
dh8d1
Andy Worhal
dh8d1
Andy Worhal
dh8d1
Pretending can be fun?
i pretend that i'm good looking and people like me when i'm alone.
When you're alone, how good looking you are and how much people like you are both irrelevant. It's only when you're near others these things matter.
oh yeah, in my head it always matters. looks matter big time, when i look in the mirror, i don't wanna see ugly looking back!
That to me seems psychologically a problem, not visually.
i thought that being pretty was a good thing, not a problem
frozen_water
Riviera de la Mancha
frozen_water
Riviera de la Mancha
Yes, interpretation is needed for analysis. What you don't get though is that the scientific method is just that; a method. Means of determining facts under the scientific method are not contingent on your opinion at all. The method merely assesses what is. To attempt to apply the scientific method to a discussion of what x means is an entirely separate stage and not to be confused with the scientific method, which is the essence and fundamental nature of science.
The scientific method (as a method) must be employed by humans, so the issue objectivity does not lie in the idea of the scientific method, but the execution. It is when I perform my tests, record my data, and analyze my results that subjectivity comes into play.

Quote:
So, while I already mentioned that facts themselves are meaningless, you muddle too much in assuming that its impossible to derive facts themselves because our giving them meaning will invariably to some extent include an element of the subjective.
How doesn't it? My interpretation of data is subjective, it's not as if given a set of data there is only one possible answer, there are virtually infinite numbers of possible explanations.

Quote:
And finally, not only is it entirely possible to account for variables, it also does not mean that a study was not objective because variables have a slight play in the results. And remember, by variables, I mean those other factual influences that effect scientific data (none of which are subjective, i.e. my will cannot change the constant force of gravity.).
1) How does one objectively decide what variable doesn't belong?
2)Who says the force of gravity is constant?

No... not at all. Your 'subjectivity' in your example would be a failure in applying and/or understanding basic math or other foundational principles. For example, if I am conducting an experiment to measure the PSI of a 10 lb. rock dropped from one story up, and I fail to properly apply the constant of gravity let's say, that does not demonstrate that science is subjective. That represents a fundamental failure of mine.

Your interpretation though has no bearing on THE ACTUAL DATA. If my data in our previous experiment reads as 20 PSI, my belief that it is 30 does nothing to the ACTUAL FACT that its still 20.

The function of your study determines that of course. If I am trying to measure someone's mass for example instead of weight, I need to account for gravity's pull, as it has nothing to do with how much mass is in an object. To include it in my calculations would be wrong. Really? Who says gravity is constant? Gravity for one.
Where do you think we got the "constant of gravity"? Someone did some calculations, and that was their best guess at what was going on. It's not a fact, it can't be proven, it's the idea someone came up with to try and explain something they observed. It wasn't handed down to us perfect and infallible from some perfectly objective source.

What if there is no gravity? What if god is just pushing that rock down? You can't prove otherwise. There are plenty of reasons to believe that it's actually gravity, but you can't prove that objectively, it's still just your interpretation.

Also, gravity may not be constant.

The force of gravity can and has been proven. Its not a guess at all. Its not called the Law of Universal Gravitation for a reason.

Even if we assume that gravity is not a constant though, that only addresses the one point of gravity. My larger point remains- there are objective facts, which do not bend to your will. Even from your own link, the presence of a black hole and its effect on gravity is a natural occurrence, which, if we are to belief the professor, means that we can measure it and quantify a black hole's effect on it. If its true, my or your opinion does not effect this at all.

Again, you muddle- the possibility of other options does not in any way have a thing to do with objectivity. Objectivity is looking at information and reality and assessing from that what is. Of course something can ALWAYS POSSIBLY be something else. That, however, is speculation, and is the equivalent of comparing apples to oranges for the purpose of understanding scientific study.

Distinct Genius

13,400 Points
  • Perfect Attendance 400
  • Conversationalist 100
  • 50 Wins 150
Andy Worhal
dh8d1
Andy Worhal
dh8d1
Andy Worhal
dh8d1
Pretending can be fun?
i pretend that i'm good looking and people like me when i'm alone.
When you're alone, how good looking you are and how much people like you are both irrelevant. It's only when you're near others these things matter.
oh yeah, in my head it always matters. looks matter big time, when i look in the mirror, i don't wanna see ugly looking back!
That to me seems psychologically a problem, not visually.
i thought that being pretty was a good thing, not a problem
Your perception of "being pretty is a good thing" while you're alone, is a problem.
Riviera de la Mancha
frozen_water
Riviera de la Mancha
frozen_water
Riviera de la Mancha
Yes, interpretation is needed for analysis. What you don't get though is that the scientific method is just that; a method. Means of determining facts under the scientific method are not contingent on your opinion at all. The method merely assesses what is. To attempt to apply the scientific method to a discussion of what x means is an entirely separate stage and not to be confused with the scientific method, which is the essence and fundamental nature of science.
The scientific method (as a method) must be employed by humans, so the issue objectivity does not lie in the idea of the scientific method, but the execution. It is when I perform my tests, record my data, and analyze my results that subjectivity comes into play.

Quote:
So, while I already mentioned that facts themselves are meaningless, you muddle too much in assuming that its impossible to derive facts themselves because our giving them meaning will invariably to some extent include an element of the subjective.
How doesn't it? My interpretation of data is subjective, it's not as if given a set of data there is only one possible answer, there are virtually infinite numbers of possible explanations.

Quote:
And finally, not only is it entirely possible to account for variables, it also does not mean that a study was not objective because variables have a slight play in the results. And remember, by variables, I mean those other factual influences that effect scientific data (none of which are subjective, i.e. my will cannot change the constant force of gravity.).
1) How does one objectively decide what variable doesn't belong?
2)Who says the force of gravity is constant?

No... not at all. Your 'subjectivity' in your example would be a failure in applying and/or understanding basic math or other foundational principles. For example, if I am conducting an experiment to measure the PSI of a 10 lb. rock dropped from one story up, and I fail to properly apply the constant of gravity let's say, that does not demonstrate that science is subjective. That represents a fundamental failure of mine.

Your interpretation though has no bearing on THE ACTUAL DATA. If my data in our previous experiment reads as 20 PSI, my belief that it is 30 does nothing to the ACTUAL FACT that its still 20.

The function of your study determines that of course. If I am trying to measure someone's mass for example instead of weight, I need to account for gravity's pull, as it has nothing to do with how much mass is in an object. To include it in my calculations would be wrong. Really? Who says gravity is constant? Gravity for one.
Where do you think we got the "constant of gravity"? Someone did some calculations, and that was their best guess at what was going on. It's not a fact, it can't be proven, it's the idea someone came up with to try and explain something they observed. It wasn't handed down to us perfect and infallible from some perfectly objective source.

What if there is no gravity? What if god is just pushing that rock down? You can't prove otherwise. There are plenty of reasons to believe that it's actually gravity, but you can't prove that objectively, it's still just your interpretation.

Also, gravity may not be constant.

The force of gravity can and has been proven. Its not a guess at all. Its not called the Law of Universal Gravitation for a reason.

Even if we assume that gravity is not a constant though, that only addresses the one point of gravity. My larger point remains- there are objective facts, which do not bend to your will. Even from your own link, the presence of a black hole and its effect on gravity is a natural occurrence, which, if we are to belief the professor, means that we can measure it and quantify a black hole's effect on it. If its true, my or your opinion does not effect this at all.

Again, you muddle- the possibility of other options does not in any way have a thing to do with objectivity. Objectivity is looking at information and reality and assessing from that what is. Of course something can ALWAYS POSSIBLY be something else. That, however, is speculation, and is the equivalent of comparing apples to oranges for the purpose of understanding scientific study.
you can turn reality into anything you want though, objective reality isn't really what it seems, people CAN bend it

Distinct Genius

13,400 Points
  • Perfect Attendance 400
  • Conversationalist 100
  • 50 Wins 150
Andy Worhal
dh8d1
Andy Worhal
dh8d1
Andy Worhal
um, he's really into spirituality
"Spirituality" is a vague nebulous word. I have no idea what you mean when you use it.
you are into spirituality like the supernatural.

i know that because you manifested me into being by simply quoting me, like a genie out of a bottle
I have no idea what you mean. You enjoy vague nebulous words without explaining anything meaningful.
when you quoted me, i magically popped into this forum
Again you use words which do not explain anything meaninful. Please use words that are well defined, instead of vague ones like "spirituality" or "magical"
dh8d1
Andy Worhal
dh8d1
Andy Worhal
dh8d1
When you're alone, how good looking you are and how much people like you are both irrelevant. It's only when you're near others these things matter.
oh yeah, in my head it always matters. looks matter big time, when i look in the mirror, i don't wanna see ugly looking back!
That to me seems psychologically a problem, not visually.
i thought that being pretty was a good thing, not a problem
Your perception of "being pretty is a good thing" while you're alone, is a problem.
i wouldn't call it a problem, i just find security in looking pretty

Distinct Genius

13,400 Points
  • Perfect Attendance 400
  • Conversationalist 100
  • 50 Wins 150
Andy Worhal
dh8d1
Andy Worhal
dh8d1
Andy Worhal
dh8d1
When you're alone, how good looking you are and how much people like you are both irrelevant. It's only when you're near others these things matter.
oh yeah, in my head it always matters. looks matter big time, when i look in the mirror, i don't wanna see ugly looking back!
That to me seems psychologically a problem, not visually.
i thought that being pretty was a good thing, not a problem
Your perception of "being pretty is a good thing" while you're alone, is a problem.
i wouldn't call it a problem, i just find security in looking pretty
This is quite defined already as a problem. It's called Narcissism.
dh8d1
Andy Worhal
dh8d1
Andy Worhal
dh8d1
That to me seems psychologically a problem, not visually.
i thought that being pretty was a good thing, not a problem
Your perception of "being pretty is a good thing" while you're alone, is a problem.
i wouldn't call it a problem, i just find security in looking pretty
This is quite defined already as a problem. It's called Narcissism.
how is it narcissism? i don't think that I'm the best ever

Distinct Genius

13,400 Points
  • Perfect Attendance 400
  • Conversationalist 100
  • 50 Wins 150
Andy Worhal
dh8d1
Andy Worhal
dh8d1
Andy Worhal
dh8d1
That to me seems psychologically a problem, not visually.
i thought that being pretty was a good thing, not a problem
Your perception of "being pretty is a good thing" while you're alone, is a problem.
i wouldn't call it a problem, i just find security in looking pretty
This is quite defined already as a problem. It's called Narcissism.
how is it narcissism? i don't think that I'm the best ever
I don't think you understand the term.
dh8d1
Andy Worhal
dh8d1
Andy Worhal
dh8d1
Your perception of "being pretty is a good thing" while you're alone, is a problem.
i wouldn't call it a problem, i just find security in looking pretty
This is quite defined already as a problem. It's called Narcissism.
how is it narcissism? i don't think that I'm the best ever
I don't think you understand the term.
no, i don't

what is it?

Distinct Genius

13,400 Points
  • Perfect Attendance 400
  • Conversationalist 100
  • 50 Wins 150
Andy Worhal
dh8d1
Andy Worhal
dh8d1
Andy Worhal
dh8d1
Your perception of "being pretty is a good thing" while you're alone, is a problem.
i wouldn't call it a problem, i just find security in looking pretty
This is quite defined already as a problem. It's called Narcissism.
how is it narcissism? i don't think that I'm the best ever
I don't think you understand the term.
no, i don't

what is it?
Sorry. I'm not google.

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