Republicans get less subtle when they control both houses.

[Divine_Malevolence]

Stop Obama, fire Reid.




Obama's probably going to be remembered as a ridiculously good president for no reason other than the s**t he had to deal with.
In dealing with a blatantly, but not quite openly, racist Republican party, his attempts at bipartisanship were ruthlessly shut down time and again over the eight year period. Yet despite only having any real capacity for actually getting things done in two years of Democrats holding both house and senate, he managed to prevent the second great depression, vastly improve a rapidly breaking down economy, and push through healthcare reform that the country had been in need of for decades.


Similarly, this congress is going to be lauded as one of the worst in history. A question will probably be posed.
What, exactly, could Obama have managed if the Republicans weren't so bad at their jobs?


I also look forward to the history books retelling of the horrifying defeat of the next Republican presidential candidate. It'd be most amusing if it was Ted Cruz.
"Despite gaining the Republican nomination with surprising ease, Cruz was swept up in an overwhelming defeat after his previous role in the government shut down three years earlier and his place of birth were made known."

[Bogotanian]

Divine_Malevolence

Obama's probably going to be remembered as a ridiculously good president for no reason other than the s**t he had to deal with.

lol No

Quote:

In dealing with a blatantly, but not quite openly, racist Republican party,

Oh cool, I see we're peddling around Liberal Media narratives now. You should have added that all Republicans are white men, rich, greedy, and the devil

Quote:

his attempts at bipartisanship were ruthlessly shut down time and again over the eight year period.

I'm sorry but what president have we been following here? You do realize that Obama has been one of the most partisan, polarizing presidents in history right?

Quote:

Similarly, this congress president is going to be lauded as one of the worst in history.

The fact that the GOP won the midterm elections, as much as many people may not like it, is a sign that there is a huge discontent with the current administration and their way of running things. Obama's approval is at an all-time low, no getting around that.

Quote:

A question will probably be posed.
What, exactly, could Obama have managed if the Republicans weren't so bad at their jobs?

Even more spending, accumulation of debt, and the ability to do whatever he wanted without a voice of opposition maybe?

Quote:

I also look forward to the history books retelling of the horrifying defeat of the next Republican presidential candidate. It'd be most amusing if it was Ted Cruz.
"Despite gaining the Republican nomination with surprising ease, Cruz was swept up in an overwhelming defeat after his previous role in the government shut down three years earlier and his place of birth were made known."

This is one point I will actually partially agree with you. This may not serve in the GOP's favor come 2016. It would perhaps be better if Democrats retained Senate control so people could see the Dem's blunders. By then you know liberals will put the spin "Do you really want people in office that put Congress in gridlock for years with the President?" conveniently sidestepping the issue of Obama's many failures and his bad legacy.

[The20]

The two party system is a joke. Just saying.

[Avgvsto]

Divine_Malevolence

In dealing with a blatantly, but not quite openly, racist Republican party, his attempts at bipartisanship were ruthlessly shut down time and again over the eight year period.

Or ya know, blatantly republican at least.

[Heimdalr]

Bogotanian

You do realize that Obama has been one of the most partisan, polarizing presidents in history right?

and by that do you mean one of the 20 most partisan, polarizing...
Political parties have been much more fragmented for less, you know.

[Suicidesoldier#1]

Racist, really?

Where is there any evidence of that. The only evidence of a racist party, ever in the U.S., is for the democrats, who voted against most the civil rights bills throughout history.


The only healthcare plan Obama got pushed through was the one from the Conservative Heritage foundation, a think tank paid for by Mitt Romney, where he used a chopped up version of the Individual Mandate which has now more or less gutted what the program was supposed to be before, and has left it barely functional. He campaigned saying he wouldn't even do it, and now he's put in a hashed up (it's a tax now if you don't buy healthcare or something, instead of a government/public option, sort of like the Federal Reserve or mail system) version since it's necessary for it to work, in fact it's the core basis that brings the whole thing together.


I don't like Republican candidates, very much, but at least get your facts straight.

Let's not forget he talked about a desire to practically remove the 2nd amendment his second term, which all the democrats said he wouldn't do and that we were paranoid, and now change their story to say "well, it's a good idea".

[Divine_Malevolence]

Bogotanian

lol No

Oh, you'd be surprised what happens once bias goes away.
Sure, people hate him now, but history's not going to pay attention to that. It's going to pay attention at what happened during his presidency.
Which is actually kind of amazing. Especially when you compare it to Bush.

Bogotanian

Oh cool, I see we're peddling around Liberal Media narratives now. You should have added that all Republicans are white men, rich, greedy, and the devil

Oh, no, it's quite blatant that they're racist.
Shouting Muslims and constantly hounding him for his birth certificate. You think they'd do that for a white guy?
Fat chance.
They saw black and decided instantly that he was an African terrorist. I'd tell you to prove me wrong but I wouldn't want to die from laughter.

Bogotanian

I'm sorry but what president have we been following here? You do realize that Obama has been one of the most partisan, polarizing presidents in history right?

The one who crafted bills so conservative democrats wouldn't vote for them.
That's actually a thing. Early drafts of the ACA wouldn't pass in a democratic house and senate because they pandered so much to Republicans who wouldn't vote for them anyway.
I honestly don't see why he bothered with a party who literally came out and said they'd go out of their way to ******** him over, but maybe that's why he's president and I'm not.


Oh, and he wasn't polarizing.
That was entirely, 100% the Republicans. Democrats vote across party lines, but when Republicans voted against something, it was 100% of them.
You should look it up. There is actually no question, Obama tried like crazy to be bipartisan, but the Republicans took up the polarization strategy and ran with it all the way.
Didn't even ******** hide it.
And the sad thing about the two party system is that if one side pulls that bullshit, the mere nature of polarization makes it look like the other side's participating as well.
Nobody would be fooled if there was a third relevant party.

Bogotanian

The fact that the GOP won the midterm elections, as much as many people may not like it, is a sign that there is a huge discontent with the current administration and their way of running things. Obama's approval is at an all-time low, no getting around that.

You ******** dense bro?
The party in power always loses the mid terms because the people in power get complacent. It literally happens every time, and you know the fun thing?
The people who voted against democrats also voted overwhelmingly in favor of everything that democrats stand for when it was put to the ballot. That isn't people having a problem with the president.
That's people just being stupid.

Bogotanian

Even more spending, accumulation of debt, and the ability to do whatever he wanted without a voice of opposition maybe?

Which is funny because all the debt we've racked up in the past... What... Thirty years?
Direct result of Republicans. Look it up.
Debt rises like crazy after Reagan, stays up with GHWB, turns into a surplus with Clinton, skyrockets with Bush Jr, and despite not turning into a surplus again....
Testament to just how bad Bush Jr. ******** the country over....
The deficit has gone down by a good half by this point.
If the Republicans hadn't fought him at every turn we might ******** well have another surplus at this point, alongside less income inequality because he'd do the smart person thing and put more taxes on those who can afford to pay them.
Sadly, the Republicans will probably have enough power to prevent Dems from actually fixing the country for a while. Even more if they can convince people GWB wasn't their president, which they may well manage with how dumb their base is.

Bogotanian

This is one point I will actually partially agree with you. This may not serve in the GOP's favor come 2016. It would perhaps be better if Democrats retained Senate control so people could see the Dem's blunders. By then you know liberals will put the spin "Do you really want people in office that put Congress in gridlock for years with the President?" conveniently sidestepping the issue of Obama's many failures and his bad legacy.

Yeah, but how're you going to succeed when half the people you're supposed to be working with have no intention of letting you do anything and made it known that they'd act like spoiled three year olds from day one?
I mean, when it comes down to it, there isn't actually any bad legacy from the Obama administration, wherein the only negative thing is that...
Well....
He was prevented from doing s**t.

Nothing still standing that's negative is his legacy. It's either dead in the water, like Benghazi, or quite easily noted as the Republican's legacy.

[Chahklet]

I miss your old avatar.

[Divine_Malevolence]

Suicidesoldier#1

Racist, really?

Where is there any evidence of that. The only evidence of a racist party, ever in the U.S., is for the democrats, who voted against most the civil rights bills throughout history.

People screamed birth certificate.
Unique among all presidents, that. Funny how he's also the only black one.

Suicidesoldier#1

The only healthcare plan Obama got pushed through was the one from the Conservative Heritage foundation, a think tank paid for by Mitt Romney, where he used a chopped up version of the Individual Mandate which has now more or less gutted what the program was supposed to be before, and has left it barely functional. He campaigned saying he wouldn't even do it, and now he's put in a hashed up (it's a tax now if you don't buy healthcare or something, instead of a government/public option, sort of like the Federal Reserve or mail system) version since it's necessary for it to work, in fact it's the core basis that brings the whole thing together.

Yeah, funny how trying to be bipartisan works.
If he had been a true liberal we'd just go single payer. Less problems, less ridiculous infrastructure, better in the long term, proven to be effective in literally every country...
And state? Doesn't Hawaii have that?
Maybe state.
But, no. He wanted to be bipartisan and basically sucked off the Republicans by feeding them their own bill.


Not a single vote for it, though.
Reach across the table and into a bear trap. ******** Republicans.

Suicidesoldier#1

I don't like Republican candidates, very much, but at least get your facts straight.

Let's not forget he talked about a desire to practically remove the 2nd amendment his second term, which all the democrats said he wouldn't do and that we were paranoid, and now change their story to say "well, it's a good idea".

Which happened never.
And even if it did you still have literally no valid reason to resist such a move. I suspect that's why you're so terrified of it.
At the end of the day you can't justify keeping your toys so you're hellbent on making sure they never come under fire.

[Divine_Malevolence]

Chahklet

I miss your old avatar.

By old avatar I'm assuming you mean my default, the stabby leg demon with the blue fire eye.

May be a poor assumption.

[Chahklet]

Divine_Malevolence

Chahklet

I miss your old avatar.

By old avatar I'm assuming you mean my default, the stabby leg demon with the blue fire eye.

May be a poor assumption.

Yes that one.

[Suicidesoldier#1]

Divine_Malevolence

Suicidesoldier#1

Racist, really?

Where is there any evidence of that. The only evidence of a racist party, ever in the U.S., is for the democrats, who voted against most the civil rights bills throughout history.

People screamed birth certificate.
Unique among all presidents, that. Funny how he's also the only black one.

How ss asking for a birth certificate racist? Hawaii is different from the rest of the U.S., in that they only make one copy of a birth certificate, for the state, rather than for the state and the person , so that's where the confusion arose.

There are plenty of unique things asked of many presidents, so again, irrelevant that he's black and that this is there.

Quote:

Suicidesoldier#1

The only healthcare plan Obama got pushed through was the one from the Conservative Heritage foundation, a think tank paid for by Mitt Romney, where he used a chopped up version of the Individual Mandate which has now more or less gutted what the program was supposed to be before, and has left it barely functional. He campaigned saying he wouldn't even do it, and now he's put in a hashed up (it's a tax now if you don't buy healthcare or something, instead of a government/public option, sort of like the Federal Reserve or mail system) version since it's necessary for it to work, in fact it's the core basis that brings the whole thing together.

Yeah, funny how trying to be bipartisan works.
If he had been a true liberal we'd just go single payer. Less problems, less ridiculous infrastructure, better in the long term, proven to be effective in literally every country...
And state? Doesn't Hawaii have that?
Maybe state.
But, no. He wanted to be bipartisan and basically sucked off the Republicans by feeding them their own bill.


Not a single vote for it, though.
Reach across the table and into a bear trap. ******** Republicans.

The individual mandate is what the Republicans proposed, not Obama.

Which is more similar to Norway and all them. Obama's is unique in that's a tax or something.

Again, just completely off base.

Quote:

Suicidesoldier#1

I don't like Republican candidates, very much, but at least get your facts straight.

Let's not forget he talked about a desire to practically remove the 2nd amendment his second term, which all the democrats said he wouldn't do and that we were paranoid, and now change their story to say "well, it's a good idea".

Which happened never.
And even if it did you still have literally no valid reason to resist such a move. I suspect that's why you're so terrified of it.
At the end of the day you can't justify keeping your toys so you're hellbent on making sure they never come under fire.

But he tried to do it, there just wasn't public support for it. That says a lot about his character. And then proposals were made to bypass the people and do it with an executive order, which were seriously considered by his vice president, and almost by him.

I can justify wanting a means to defend myself, and for all Americans to do so which I have many, many times. How about we go out on a limb here; why do YOU support the assault weapons ban? You really think pistol grips and adjustable stocks are that dangerous? rolleyes

I've doubt you've even read it, and if you did, that you would understand what's in it.

When you want to ban something, you have to have a good reason. These are rights, not privileges, everything in society is assumed to be free unless you can verifiabley PROVE otherwise. A bunch of vague meaningless statements that don't even match up with your sources is not sufficient evidence.

[SparkyKid3000]

Meh, I don't have too much faith in any party at this point. The Democratic Party is weak on some issues even when they have good ideas and the Republican Party likes to ******** over anyone who isn't rich and doesn't fit into their social views. I really wish we had more Independents like Bernie Sanders. I'll tell you what I am looking forward to though: the next time we have a Republican president while the party is in the sort of crazy state it's in now, I will be watching the Republicans VERY closely to catch them on any hypocrisy they show. Let's see how easy it is for them to do a 180 on issues they opposed Obama on. Fun times ahead everyone! cheese_whine

[Divine_Malevolence]

Suicidesoldier#1

How ss asking for a birth certificate racist? Hawaii is different from the rest of the U.S., in that they only make one copy of a birth certificate, for the state, rather than for the state and the person , so that's where the confusion arose.

There are plenty of unique things asked of many presidents, so again, irrelevant that he's black and that this is there.

It's funny how far someone will go to deny their racism.

Suicidesoldier#1

The individual mandate is what the Republicans proposed, not Obama.

Which is more similar to Norway and all them. Obama's is unique in that's a tax or something.

Again, just completely off base.

Single payer uses tax money, you know.
And you do realize that Republicans fought to remove the public option, AKA opting into single payer, from the bill?
Something they proposed. Sure.

Suicidesoldier#1

But he tried to do it, there just wasn't public support for it. That says a lot about his character. And then proposals were made to bypass the people and do it with an executive order, which were seriously considered by his vice president, and almost by him.

First, sure.
Second, a public official doing what the country supports. That says a lot of good things about his character.

Suicidesoldier#1

I can justify wanting a means to defend myself, and for all Americans to do so which I have many, many times. How about we go out on a limb here; why do YOU support the assault weapons ban? You really think pistol grips and adjustable stocks are that dangerous? rolleyes

Did I ever say I did?
I mean, I've outlined a measure which would allow all you ******** to go about and keep your little toys with minimum interference, but at this point I'm more apt to just say ******** it.
The children will get over it if you just take the toys away.

Oh, good luck defending yourself from someone who shot you dead before you even saw them. Interest in safety is actually the best reason to ban guns, not keep them around.

Suicidesoldier#1

I've doubt you've even read it, and if you did, that you would understand what's in it.

When you want to ban something, you have to have a good reason. These are rights, not privileges, everything in society is assumed to be free unless you can verifiabley PROVE otherwise. A bug of vague meaningless statements that don't even match up with your sources is not sufficient evidence.

Have to have a good reason.
Something that kills 30000 people every year and serves absolutely no purpose.... No, there's no possible reason to want to do something about that.

[Suicidesoldier#1]

Divine_Malevolence

Suicidesoldier#1

How ss asking for a birth certificate racist? Hawaii is different from the rest of the U.S., in that they only make one copy of a birth certificate, for the state, rather than for the state and the person , so that's where the confusion arose.

There are plenty of unique things asked of many presidents, so again, irrelevant that he's black and that this is there.

It's funny how far someone will go to deny their racism.

LMFAO

Because common sense is now racism. I just... I don't even.

His birth certificate *was* different from all the other president's that came before him, because Hawaii refuses to get with the national program on the issue for some reason. So it is a reasonable thing; he could not produce his birth certificate, the state of Hawaii had to, which is where the controversy came from. It wasn't even that big of an issue, either.

Quote:

Suicidesoldier#1

The individual mandate is what the Republicans proposed, not Obama.

Which is more similar to Norway and all them. Obama's is unique in that's a tax or something.

Again, just completely off base.

Single payer uses tax money, you know.
And you do realize that Republicans fought to remove the public option, AKA opting into single payer, from the bill?
Something they proposed. Sure.

What happened was Obama tried to pass the measure without the individual mandate, and then wanted to add something insane to compensate.

I'm sorry, but you know he was against the individual mandate at first, despite literally having an otherwise identical program to the one produced by the heritage foundation, the think tank produced by Romney, right? And that he campaigned on not having a mandate for over 2 years and put billions of dollars into it despite it being completely non-functional right, right? The thing he put would literally have not worked, even according to his own sources.

So yeah, people naturally voted against it.

But then people like you chalk up stuff like that to racism. The Republicans are just tah ebilsz, that's why it didn't work. I don't even.

Quote:

Suicidesoldier#1

But he tried to do it, there just wasn't public support for it. That says a lot about his character. And then proposals were made to bypass the people and do it with an executive order, which were seriously considered by his vice president, and almost by him.

First, sure.
Second, a public official doing what the country supports. That says a lot of good things about his character.

The country did not support the assault weapon's ban, evident by the fact it did not pass by a wide margin. -.-

Quote:

Suicidesoldier#1

I can justify wanting a means to defend myself, and for all Americans to do so which I have many, many times. How about we go out on a limb here; why do YOU support the assault weapons ban? You really think pistol grips and adjustable stocks are that dangerous? rolleyes

Did I ever say I did?
I mean, I've outlined a measure which would allow all you ******** to go about and keep your little toys with minimum interference, but at this point I'm more apt to just say ******** it.
The children will get over it if you just take the toys away.

Oh, good luck defending yourself from someone who shot you dead before you even saw them. Interest in safety is actually the best reason to ban guns, not keep them around.

No you haven't, you've said you supported Obama's policies on guns, which is the assault weapon's ban, which yes, I realize you don't know what's in it, so you've never said you supported those things specifically, you do indirectly. That was kind of my whole point.

Also the idea that as soon as I pull out a gun I'm dead is incredible. Because guns are magic talismans that instantly kill people, right, and no-one ever misses the first shot?

The ignorance is strong with this one, I see.

Quote:

Suicidesoldier#1

I've doubt you've even read it, and if you did, that you would understand what's in it.

When you want to ban something, you have to have a good reason. These are rights, not privileges, everything in society is assumed to be free unless you can verifiabley PROVE otherwise. A bug of vague meaningless statements that don't even match up with your sources is not sufficient evidence.

Have to have a good reason.
Something that kills 30000 people every year and serves absolutely no purpose.... No, there's no possible reason to want to do something about that.

According to you, they have no use, but they're used in hundreds of thousands of self defense cases a year (a study by the CDC and authorized by Obama himself), and including suicides into your 30,000 figure is just sad. Without guns, suicide levels would be around the same, like how Japan has twice as much as the U.S.. I've shown you this over and over again, as well as evidence even relating to other country's how gun control and bans are largely irrelevant on total homicide, let alone violent crime.

Wanting to support an assault weapon's ban, which is even dumber, just because you support any gun control, based on the most ridiculous of reasons, is really where the problem stems from.