Welcome to Gaia! ::

InariKistune
People who take shits on cars deserve to be beaten.
so the action of one person in a portland protest to years before OWS justifies violence against every other OWS protester?

wut?
Yuki the Third
InariKistune
People who take shits on cars deserve to be beaten.
so the action of one person in a portland protest to years before OWS justifies violence against every other OWS protester?

wut?
YES.
black_wing_angel
Je Nique vos Merdiers
black_wing_angel
In terms of the Occupiers, I just don't really sympathize with them, because I saw a video of them just provoking the riot control cops. Literally yelling "YOU'RE ON THE WRONG SIDE!"

I'm like "they're just standing there, overseeing the protest. They're just making sure your asses don't step out of line, and get violent...that's not picking a side. It's mediating, you ******** idiots!

OF COURSE! What could possibly be provocative about sending in a crack squad of heavily-armed and armored thugs to stand around and mean mug people while they wait for them to do something wrong? It's not as if riot police ever make mistakes or start conflict. OH WAIT A MINUTE


The best you have, is Canada? Nique, I am disappoint.

And yes, it does happen. I never said it doesn't. But that doesn't mean it's ALWAYS that way. And I specifically saw footage of occupiers provoking the riot control squad.

And maybe it's just me, but if there's going to be a lot of people gathered around in a tight space, I kinda want some security in the area. A group as potentially volatile as a protest? Heavily armored security. Just to be safe.

And the golden rule of not getting your a** slapped in handcuffs: Don't provoke the police.
If a police officer "provokes" me, can I beat the s**t out of him for it?

Like this one time I got pulled over and was given a seatbelt ticket even though I was wearing my seatbelt. I was even asked to exit the vehicle to get searched. I got in some trouble in that town in the past, so the police there just have it in for me.

This police officer was clearly provoking me. Given the facts of my case, would you find it acceptable for me to crack him upside the head with a baseball bat repeatedly until he went limp and stopped "resisting"?
InariKistune
Yuki the Third
InariKistune
People who take shits on cars deserve to be beaten.
so the action of one person in a portland protest to years before OWS justifies violence against every other OWS protester?

wut?
YES.
so...can I kiss you?
Suicidesoldier#1's avatar

Fanatical Zealot

They haven't really gone around shooting innocent protestors on purpose so...

yeah...


Thousands haven't died in obvious massacres and shelling.

So... it's on a completely different level and anything that is considered to be over the line (there's been a couple or so cases where it's been questionable) it's just on an entirely different scale and those few who do it are dealt with accordingly.


Unless you want to say that the crowds are just assaulting police officers left and right and doing illegal things for the few cases where a few individuals in the crowds have done such things as well.
Suicidesoldier#1's avatar

Fanatical Zealot

Robot Macai
black_wing_angel
Je Nique vos Merdiers
black_wing_angel
In terms of the Occupiers, I just don't really sympathize with them, because I saw a video of them just provoking the riot control cops. Literally yelling "YOU'RE ON THE WRONG SIDE!"

I'm like "they're just standing there, overseeing the protest. They're just making sure your asses don't step out of line, and get violent...that's not picking a side. It's mediating, you ******** idiots!

OF COURSE! What could possibly be provocative about sending in a crack squad of heavily-armed and armored thugs to stand around and mean mug people while they wait for them to do something wrong? It's not as if riot police ever make mistakes or start conflict. OH WAIT A MINUTE


The best you have, is Canada? Nique, I am disappoint.

And yes, it does happen. I never said it doesn't. But that doesn't mean it's ALWAYS that way. And I specifically saw footage of occupiers provoking the riot control squad.

And maybe it's just me, but if there's going to be a lot of people gathered around in a tight space, I kinda want some security in the area. A group as potentially volatile as a protest? Heavily armored security. Just to be safe.

And the golden rule of not getting your a** slapped in handcuffs: Don't provoke the police.
If a police officer "provokes" me, can I beat the s**t out of him for it?

Like this one time I got pulled over and was given a seatbelt ticket even though I was wearing my seatbelt. I was even asked to exit the vehicle to get searched. I got in some trouble in that town in the past, so the police there just have it in for me.

This police officer was clearly provoking me. Given the facts of my case, would you find it acceptable for me to crack him upside the head with a baseball bat repeatedly until he went limp and stopped "resisting"?


First of all you'd be using a weapon, second of all he wasn't attacking you with a weapon so there's no reason to use a weapon to defend yourself.

Police officers aren't allowed to kill people at random just becuase they are "provoked" but it you assault one yeah, you are provoking them.


Why be mean or act stupid?

Calmly and cooly get out the car and do whatever unless they obviously are trying to kill you for no reason or something.
Vehadrah's avatar

5,700 Points
  • Friendly 100
  • Risky Lifestyle 100
  • Tycoon 200
Mannequin Harpsichord
Yuki the Third
I have noticed something kind of distrubing lately in my debates, and reading about the protests in american and in the middle east. To keep it short and sweet, middle eastern police shoot at and beat on armed citizens, it's seen as an abuse.
American police shoot at and injure american citizens who are NOT armed, and it's the unarmed protesters who are seen as the bad guys.

I can't wrap my mind around this...."oh, they should expect it for civil disobedience"..."they were asked to leave"...they threw bottles".

Maybe so, but does that justify bashing someone multiple times with a lead-filled cane (aka a police baton), shooting people in the head, stepping/kneeling on the windpipe of people, throwing people around like ragdolls, and just generaly trying to hurt anyone and everyone?

Can someone explain to me how this is not only judtified,
but why it's seen by some people as the fault of the OWS protesters?


tl:dr- why is the general concensus that the OWS protesters deserve to be beaten, bloodied, and maimed with zero police repercussion?


I've seen those "police brutality" videos and I see the police trying to maintain order during a riot. Any time a police officer fires their gun they have a stack of paperwork to do for each and every bullet. Police are constantly being judged for using any force, even when they have guns pointed in their face and their lives threatened.

In the middle east if you're arrested, chances are you're going to die. Here resisting arrest is the only thing that will get you man-handled and that's just because the cops can't stand around all day watching you be drunk and high.
Yuki the Third
InariKistune
Yuki the Third
InariKistune
People who take shits on cars deserve to be beaten.
so the action of one person in a portland protest to years before OWS justifies violence against every other OWS protester?

wut?
YES.
so...can I kiss you?
Go for it if it'll float your boat.
stealthmongoose's avatar

Dangerous Conversationalist

7,550 Points
  • Beta Forum Regular 0
  • Beta Citizen 0
  • Beta Contributor 0
Suicidesoldier#1
Robot Macai
black_wing_angel
Je Nique vos Merdiers
black_wing_angel
In terms of the Occupiers, I just don't really sympathize with them, because I saw a video of them just provoking the riot control cops. Literally yelling "YOU'RE ON THE WRONG SIDE!"

I'm like "they're just standing there, overseeing the protest. They're just making sure your asses don't step out of line, and get violent...that's not picking a side. It's mediating, you ******** idiots!

OF COURSE! What could possibly be provocative about sending in a crack squad of heavily-armed and armored thugs to stand around and mean mug people while they wait for them to do something wrong? It's not as if riot police ever make mistakes or start conflict. OH WAIT A MINUTE


The best you have, is Canada? Nique, I am disappoint.

And yes, it does happen. I never said it doesn't. But that doesn't mean it's ALWAYS that way. And I specifically saw footage of occupiers provoking the riot control squad.

And maybe it's just me, but if there's going to be a lot of people gathered around in a tight space, I kinda want some security in the area. A group as potentially volatile as a protest? Heavily armored security. Just to be safe.

And the golden rule of not getting your a** slapped in handcuffs: Don't provoke the police.
If a police officer "provokes" me, can I beat the s**t out of him for it?

Like this one time I got pulled over and was given a seatbelt ticket even though I was wearing my seatbelt. I was even asked to exit the vehicle to get searched. I got in some trouble in that town in the past, so the police there just have it in for me.

This police officer was clearly provoking me. Given the facts of my case, would you find it acceptable for me to crack him upside the head with a baseball bat repeatedly until he went limp and stopped "resisting"?


First of all you'd be using a weapon, second of all he wasn't attacking you with a weapon so there's no reason to use a weapon to defend yourself.

Police officers aren't allowed to kill people at random just becuase they are "provoked" but it you assault one yeah, you are provoking them.


Why be mean or act stupid?

Calmly and cooly get out the car and do whatever unless they obviously are trying to kill you for no reason or something.


Because the standard for respect isn't what size gun you have on you. Fear is more equatable to force than respect. That being said, there's nothing that you can really say that justifieds a PMC squad paid by taxpayers to uphold a standard of law they themselves do not see fit to follow.

They constantly bring weapons to the party, they work for independent companies to unlawfully remove undesirables (Not to be confused with criminals) and to be honest, most of them probably don't know the law to begin with.

Any time you elect a group to uphold ideals that are higher than the rest of the community, there is going to be a massive abuse of power. This does not make that abuse excusable.

If you don't want me to bring a fire bomb to a riot shield fight, don't bring a riot shield to a speech fight.
Suicidesoldier#1's avatar

Fanatical Zealot

stealthmongoose
Suicidesoldier#1
Robot Macai
black_wing_angel
Je Nique vos Merdiers
black_wing_angel
In terms of the Occupiers, I just don't really sympathize with them, because I saw a video of them just provoking the riot control cops. Literally yelling "YOU'RE ON THE WRONG SIDE!"

I'm like "they're just standing there, overseeing the protest. They're just making sure your asses don't step out of line, and get violent...that's not picking a side. It's mediating, you ******** idiots!

OF COURSE! What could possibly be provocative about sending in a crack squad of heavily-armed and armored thugs to stand around and mean mug people while they wait for them to do something wrong? It's not as if riot police ever make mistakes or start conflict. OH WAIT A MINUTE


The best you have, is Canada? Nique, I am disappoint.

And yes, it does happen. I never said it doesn't. But that doesn't mean it's ALWAYS that way. And I specifically saw footage of occupiers provoking the riot control squad.

And maybe it's just me, but if there's going to be a lot of people gathered around in a tight space, I kinda want some security in the area. A group as potentially volatile as a protest? Heavily armored security. Just to be safe.

And the golden rule of not getting your a** slapped in handcuffs: Don't provoke the police.
If a police officer "provokes" me, can I beat the s**t out of him for it?

Like this one time I got pulled over and was given a seatbelt ticket even though I was wearing my seatbelt. I was even asked to exit the vehicle to get searched. I got in some trouble in that town in the past, so the police there just have it in for me.

This police officer was clearly provoking me. Given the facts of my case, would you find it acceptable for me to crack him upside the head with a baseball bat repeatedly until he went limp and stopped "resisting"?


First of all you'd be using a weapon, second of all he wasn't attacking you with a weapon so there's no reason to use a weapon to defend yourself.

Police officers aren't allowed to kill people at random just becuase they are "provoked" but it you assault one yeah, you are provoking them.


Why be mean or act stupid?

Calmly and cooly get out the car and do whatever unless they obviously are trying to kill you for no reason or something.


Because the standard for respect isn't what size gun you have on you. Fear is more equatable to force than respect. That being said, there's nothing that you can really say that justifieds a PMC squad paid by taxpayers to uphold a standard of law they themselves do not see fit to follow.

They constantly bring weapons to the party, they work for independent companies to unlawfully remove undesirables (Not to be confused with criminals) and to be honest, most of them probably don't know the law to begin with.

Any time you elect a group to uphold ideals that are higher than the rest of the community, there is going to be a massive abuse of power. This does not make that abuse excusable.

If you don't want me to bring a fire bomb to a riot shield fight, don't bring a riot shield to a speech fight.


Don't bring a riot shield?

What the ******** is wrong with you?


If I was walking around the street with a ******** bullet proof vest on that isn't an invitation for an attack, that's just an intelligent precaution.

The very fact you'd even consider bringing a fire bomb to a supposed peaceful rally implies it's almost necessary for a person to bring a riot shield.


And, what if it's not for you, it's just for the FEW people who are taking things out of control?

You're going to attack them becuase they're going to prepare themselves to take away the people who are actually doing bad thing, ruining your supposed peaceful protest by making the police come down there in the first place?


People who protect themselves from harm with precautions so when the time comes they can put you in a head lock or taze you even if you DO make an assault on some person's life?

******** you.


You'd attack someone becuase they are trying to put themselves in a position where if they DO get attacked that they don't have to respond violently to defend themselves, taking it upon themselves to prepare themselves so that if they do get attacked, they need not respond violently?

Go do the world a favor...



/sigh

By giving a police officer body armor you are essentially making so they can put themselves into situations they ordinarily couldn't do without facing death or injury.


If a police officer isn't wearing armor and is attacked he WILL fight back, violently, to defend himself, killing the target if necessary.

If the police need not defend himself, becuase he has armor on, or say, is like wolverine, or is say, invincible, then we need not worry about him responding violently. He can defend himself without worry. I support the use of body armor on all police officers, to virtually make them invincible- then they won't even need guns! They could get shot, and not have to worry about dieing- even use themselves as human shields if necessary. Then they could tazer their target or physically restrain them without worry of having to maybe kill them in their own self defense.


THIS IS JUST COMMON SENSE.

If you're that much of a moron I don't know what to do...
Suicidesoldier#1
If I was walking around the street with a ******** bullet proof vest on that isn't an invitation for an attack, that's just an intelligent precaution.

Oh yeah? So what do you think would happen if protestors showed up wearing a suit of ballistic armor and wielding bats, assault rifles, grenade launchers, and zip ties? You think the police would say "oh hey, those guys are intelligent, they know that we'll probably beat the s**t out of them, so they wore protection"? Yeah? Really? Is that how it goes?

Suicidesoldier#1
And, what if it's not for you, it's just for the FEW people who are taking things out of control?

You're going to attack them becuase they're going to prepare themselves to take away the people who are actually doing bad thing, ruining your supposed peaceful protest by making the police come down there in the first place?

Ha! What a magical, wonderful place your world must be.
Police only attack the ones that "ruin" protests, do they?
This isn't exclusive to any one country, by the way.
Police are pretty much the same all around.
Where'd the police go?
Quote:
If a police officer isn't wearing armor and is attacked he WILL fight back, violently, to defend himself, killing the target if necessary.

Oh, really? And why is it that it's only okay when police do this, now?
Suicidesoldier#1's avatar

Fanatical Zealot

Je Nique vos Merdiers
Suicidesoldier#1
If I was walking around the street with a ******** bullet proof vest on that isn't an invitation for an attack, that's just an intelligent precaution.

Oh yeah? So what do you think would happen if protestors showed up wearing a suit of ballistic armor and wielding bats, assault rifles, grenade launchers, and zip ties? You think the police would say "oh hey, those guys are intelligent, they know that we'll probably beat the s**t out of them, so they wore protection"? Yeah? Really? Is that how it goes?

Suicidesoldier#1
And, what if it's not for you, it's just for the FEW people who are taking things out of control?

You're going to attack them becuase they're going to prepare themselves to take away the people who are actually doing bad thing, ruining your supposed peaceful protest by making the police come down there in the first place?

Ha! What a magical, wonderful place your world must be.
Police only attack the ones that "ruin" protests, do they?
This isn't exclusive to any one country, by the way.
Police are pretty much the same all around.
Where'd the police go?
Quote:
If a police officer isn't wearing armor and is attacked he WILL fight back, violently, to defend himself, killing the target if necessary.

Oh, really? And why is it that it's only okay when police do this, now?


Police don't go to kill- if protestors showed up in body armor I'm sure police would applaud them.

You bring a gun- cop brings a vest.


Cops shows an attempt to avoid violence even if that means taking it on to himself without dishing it back out.

Crazy nut with a gun, weapon etc. does not.


Riot shields and armor as well as pepper spray and tazer guns are intended to prevent violence, not exacerbate it, or else they'd just fire randomly into a crowd.

That would disperse the crowd all right, but it's not the way to go.


Protestors who get caught in the cross fire are either morons or the result of a tragic accident, or both.

The smart thing to do is to keep things civilized and then don't break any laws (unless you are protesting a law, like jim crow laws for instance etc.)


Standing in the street and blocking traffic is bad for a number of reasons, reasons I probably don't even have to go into (ambulance, can't get to work, food and other things that could spoil etc.) and the fact that they aren't the owners of the street, it's public property and the less than 1%, whether you consider yourself poor or homeless or rich, don't own it anymore than anyone else and the laws already established by the people are expected to be followed within reasonable degree. If you disobey and won't move without being forced to move then it's your problem. You get into my house I'll kick you out even if you are theoretically being non-violent, and in the public streets it's the same issue. Our society is based on roads and to pretend single individuals own them or we should all stop for them is ludicrous. Society would break down if we let that happen, no-one could get anywhere or doing anything, it's really just insane anyone would want to do it at all, I mean the risk you give yourself getting hit by a car, it's a wonder we haven't had near as many pedestrian accidents (probably the presence of the police redirecting traffic, *cough*).

Anyways your videos don't prove anything, isolated incidents, everyone's an individual, some protestors are bad and need to be taken down, even if the group in general is peaceful etc. it's really pretty sucky when people do stupid things. Then accidents occur which are virtually inevitable and everyone goes crazy whether it's on either side, and while bad, we should all remember to stay calm, focus on the issue and go home at the end of the night peaceful and unscathed, which can happen, easily.
Suicidesoldier#1
Police don't go to kill- if protestors showed up in body armor I'm sure police would applaud them.

rofl

Quote:
You bring a gun- cop brings a vest.

rofl

Quote:
Cops shows an attempt to avoid violence even if that means taking it on to himself without dishing it back out.

rofl
Where are you getting this s**t? It's gold.

Quote:
Riot shields and armor as well as pepper spray and tazer guns are intended to prevent violence, not exacerbate it, or else they'd just fire randomly into a crowd.

Provoking violence does not require random attack, what a ridiculous straw man.

Quote:
Protestors who get caught in the cross fire are either morons or the result of a tragic accident, or both.
[...]
Anyways your videos don't prove anything, isolated incidents, everyone's an individual, some protestors are bad and need to be taken down, even if the group in general is peaceful etc.

Ah, I see. So, violence is never caused by the cops, and not only are those "isolated incidents [of police attacking unprovoked [by accident]]", but they are also the fault of some unseen "bad" people. It's amazing how you can see so much into these videos that nobody else can. Tell me, how many isolated incidents before we have a pattern?

And seriously, "everyone's an individual"? We're talking about "the police", which is a networked entity, not just a collection of individuals that only indirectly influence one another. Police have their own culture, a collective conscious, they WEAR A UNIFORM. All the "individuals" in the police don't just think the same, they even look the same.

You're ridiculous.
Police brutality is never okay so long as the protest is a peaceful one.
Suicidesoldier#1's avatar

Fanatical Zealot

Je Nique vos Merdiers
Suicidesoldier#1
Police don't go to kill- if protestors showed up in body armor I'm sure police would applaud them.

rofl

Quote:
You bring a gun- cop brings a vest.

rofl

Quote:
Cops shows an attempt to avoid violence even if that means taking it on to himself without dishing it back out.

rofl
Where are you getting this s**t? It's gold.

Quote:
Riot shields and armor as well as pepper spray and tazer guns are intended to prevent violence, not exacerbate it, or else they'd just fire randomly into a crowd.

Provoking violence does not require random attack, what a ridiculous straw man.

Quote:
Protestors who get caught in the cross fire are either morons or the result of a tragic accident, or both.
[...]
Anyways your videos don't prove anything, isolated incidents, everyone's an individual, some protestors are bad and need to be taken down, even if the group in general is peaceful etc.

Ah, I see. So, violence is never caused by the cops, and not only are those "isolated incidents [of police attacking unprovoked [by accident]]", but they are also the fault of some unseen "bad" people. It's amazing how you can see so much into these videos that nobody else can. Tell me, how many isolated incidents before we have a pattern?

And seriously, "everyone's an individual"? We're talking about "the police", which is a networked entity, not just a collection of individuals that only indirectly influence one another. Police have their own culture, a collective conscious, they WEAR A UNIFORM. All the "individuals" in the police don't just think the same, they even look the same.

You're ridiculous.


If you bring a shield to a FIGHT to you are obviously looking to defend yourself not hurt others.

That's where I get it from.


Sometimes police start violence; in hostage situations they may take the preemptive strike and take down a guy or something cause they think he's about to pull the trigger- they may come into a person's house and arrest them, etc.

In some cases some police do things that are bad, there is no question. Some have been paid off by the mafia, others have done all kinds of things, some turn on other police officers for revenge or whatever etc. But it doesn't mean that all of them are the same way, especially when there is internal struggle. O_o



But, "a collective conscious"...?

Do you have any idea how people work, I mean at all?


That's not even...

physically possible...

Quick Reply

Submit
Manage Your Items
Other Stuff
Get GCash
Offers
Get Items
More Items
Where Everyone Hangs Out
Other Community Areas
Virtual Spaces
Fun Stuff
Gaia's Games