A

[Plata Plomo y Sangre]

Kaltros

Plata Plomo y Sangre

Kaltros

Brothern

Maybe take your own advice on learning how to feel compassion and empathy towards other people?

Selective compassion, you mean? Because importing foreign poverty will increase poverty among the citizens already here. Especially minority groups, like blacks, who are down economically already. Bringing in millions of Hispanics is a fine way to steal good jobs from blacks. Where's your compassion for American blacks struggling to find work?

Too bad they don't largely compete with American labor for the same jobs, so that's out. Sounds an awful lot like that race baiting you're always whining about, Kaltros. GASP ARE YOU BECOMING A SJW?

Hmm...

Quote:

one Friday earlier this month, a small but vocal group of black activists turned up at City Hall to blast Mayor Antonio Villaraigosa and members of the City Council for failing to work hard enough to prevent violence by Latino gang members against blacks in South Los Angeles.

"You have one race of people exterminating another race of people," said one African American woman.

On the same day, elsewhere in the city, Latino parents stormed out of a meeting of a Los Angeles Unified School District advisory council. The council had been fighting for months about whether to hold its meetings in Spanish or English -- a dispute that got so abusive that district officials felt the need to bring in dispute-resolution experts and mental health counselors. On this particular Friday, the Latino parents walked out after a group of black parents voted to censure the panel's Latino chairman.

These two events are certainly not isolated incidents, but they are the most recent examples of the long-running tensions between blacks and Latinos in Los Angeles. Just a few weeks earlier, federal prosecutors had filed a highly publicized case against more than 60 members of Florencia 13, a Latino street gang that prosecutors say engaged in a violent campaign to drive African American gang rivals out the South L.A. neighborhood of Florence-Firestone, resulting in more than 20 killings over three years. In the late 1980s, according to a report in The Times, the neighborhood was about 80% African American, but today it is 90% Latino.

Animosity between Latinos and blacks is the worst-kept secret in race relations in America. For years, Latino leaders have pointed the finger of blame at blacks when Latinos are robbed, beaten and even murdered. Blacks, in turn, have blamed Latinos for taking jobs, for colonizing neighborhoods, for gang violence. These days, the tension between the races is noticeable not only in prison life and in gang warfare (where it's been a staple of life for decades) but in politics, in schools, in housing, in the immigration debate. Conflicts today are just as likely -- in some cases, more likely -- to be between blacks and Latinos as between blacks and whites. In fact, even though hate-crime laws were originally created to combat crimes by whites against minority groups, the majority of L.A. County's hate crimes against blacks in 2006 were suspected to have been committed by Latinos, and vice versa, according to the county Commission on Human Relations.

Quote:

One of the first warnings that many blacks felt threatened by soaring Latino numbers was the battle over Proposition 187 in California in 1994. California voters approved the measure, which denied public services to illegal immigrants, by a huge margin. Shockingly, blacks also backed the measure; one L.A. Times poll several months after the proposition passed showed blacks supporting its "immediate implementation," 58% to 36%. Apparently, blacks were mortally afraid that Latinos would bump them from low-skill jobs and further marginalize them by increasing joblessness and fueling the crime and drug crises in black neighborhoods. And it's probably true that at the low end of the scale some young, poor, unskilled blacks have been shut out of jobs at hotels and restaurants and in manufacturing. There's also fierce competition for the dwindling number of affirmative action spots in colleges.

http://www.latimes.com/la-op-hutchinson25nov25-story.html#page=1

http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1542-4774.2011.01052.x/abstract

Hmmmm...

[Plata Plomo y Sangre]

Harley Jade Linnea

Plata Plomo y Sangre

Do you really not know how to read or are you just outright lying at this point to save face? I'm gonna swing and say it's the latter..

Only one here lying is you.

Quote:

State and local governments incur costs for providing services to unauthorized immigrants and have lim-ited options for avoiding or minimizing those costs.

All of the estimates that CBO reviewed, regardless of the jurisdiction examined or programs considered, reached this conclusion. Rules governing many federal programs, as well as decisions handed down by various courts, limit the authority of state and local governments to avoid or constrain the costs of providing services to unauthorized immigrants. For example, both state and federal courts have ruled that states may not refuse to provide free public education to a student on the basis of his or her immigration status. Furthermore, many states have their own statutory or constitutional requirements concerning the provision of certain services to needy residents.

The tax revenues that unauthorized immigrants generate for state and local governments do not offset the total cost of services provided to those immigrants.
Most of the estimates found that even though unauthorized immigrants pay taxes and other fees to state and local jurisdictions, the resulting revenues offset only a portion of the costs incurred by those jurisdictions for providing services related to education, health care, and law enforcement. Although it is difficult to obtain precise estimates of the net impact of the unauthorized population on state and local budgets (see Box 1), that impact is most likely modest.

Federal aid programs offer resources to state and local governments that provide services to unauthorized immigrants, but those funds do not fully cover the costs incurred by those governments.
Some of the reports that CBO examined did not include such federal transfers when estimating the net effect of the unauthorized population on state and local governments.

Like I said, troll, page 11 of 24 says you're making shut up. they're a DRAIN on the local and state arenas not a boost to them.

Nope, still you. It's amazing how you have to cherry pick and ignore all the evidence to the contrary. It's almost like you're stupid enough to think I haven't actually read the report in full. Unfortunately for you, I'm not a moron like you or Ice Dervish, so I tend to actually read what I link to in full before doing so. Here's the little ditty you conveniently avoided copypasting.

"However, the scope and analytical methods of the studies vary, and the reports do not provide detailed or consistent enough data to allow for a reliable assessment of the aggregate national effect of unautho-rized immigrants on state and local budgets."

"The amount that state and local governments spend on services for unauthorized immigrants represents a small percentage of the total amount spent by those governments to provide such services to residents in their jurisdictions."

"In most of the estimates that CBO examined, however, spending for unauthorized immigrants accounted for less than 5 percent of total state and local spending for those ser-
vices. Spending for unauthorized immigrants in cer-tain jurisdictions in California was higher but still represented less than 10 percent of total spending for those services."

"Over the past two decades, most efforts to estimate the fiscal impact of immigration in the United States have concluded that, in aggregate and over the long term, tax revenues of all types gene rated by immigrants—both legal and unauthorized—exceed the cost of the services they use. Generally, such estimates include revenues and spending at the federal, state, and local levels."

Whoops. So you're a liar, and now that I've made you look dumb repeatedly, I'll let you fume over how much of a 'troll' I am. I could break that down too, but it's probably important for you to same some face.

[Plata Plomo y Sangre]

The Ice Dervish

Harley Jade Linnea

The Ice Dervish

Harley Jade Linnea

The Ice Dervish

While going back and forth with that idiot Brothern I had almost forgotten what this thread is actually about. Damn. Seriously though, is it really so ******** up that a state is refusing to give illegal immigrants with no papers or right to be here something that only legal residents are supposed to have. It's not rocket science, things like drivers licenses are given to legal residents and if you're here illegally then you have no right to demand one.

I have to agree with you. You and I don't always see eye to eye on things, but in this we do. We need some serious reform to make it easier for those who want to come here, to do so, legally, but opening the borders completely would be bad. And some of the reform Obama has planned is not good for this country. I like some of the things he's done; the Lilly Ledbetter Act, the ACA (for the most part), but his immigration reform needs a lot of work.

Yeah, it's cool that we could see eye to eye on at least this. Not having too much fun in this thread arguing with the bleeding heard Plata or whatever. No logic, sources that don't support their claims or a lack of them entirely, and just total bleeding heart drama. I'm not even against allowing people to come here, I'm 100% in support of legal immigration and even think that our immigration policies need to be changed. Not to an open border, as that would allow cartels to get in and the schools would be overpopulated too quickly, but to allow more people to get in here more easily as long as they can prove that they're going to work/go to college/join the military and pay income taxes and that they can prove that they haven't committed any felony level offenses in the past. I'm just sick of arguing with these super emotional people about immigration, leave the emotion out of the debate and look at the facts. I'm sick of people claiming that I hate brown people because I don't think a 100% open border is a good idea rolleyes At least when you argue, even though I don't agree with you all the time, provide sources and don't just spew out emotion. So props to you.

I like the Lilly Ledbetter act and am personally on the fence about the ACA. My health insurance isn't as good as it was in the past now and I pay more for it, but overall it could have been worse. I consider myself slightly right of center on the political scale if that gives you any insight into the things I say.

I try to leave the emotions out as much as possible. Sometimes I fail at it, but I do try, and if I make a claim I provide sources, especially f asked to back my stuff up. It drives me nuts when people refuse to do that.

It does give me some insight into it. I'm a little more left but I don't really support either of the two main parties. I'm listed as independent on my voter registration card. >_>

You do a pretty good job at it, better than this nutjob dude I've been arguing with in here. I'm so done replying to him, he can't read or comprehend what is being told to him. It's like arguing with someone with a mental disability, I'm so done entertaining people like that. People who don't know how to have a debate have no place trying to.

Yeah, was just saying that because a lot of people assume that I'm super far right whenever I talk politics with them. I lean far to the left on social policies but I tend to not be a fan of the liberal idea of what is good economics. The liberals that I have run into usually tend to turn everything into a human rights issue as well, which isn't always the case. Like me for instance, I argue against an open border because of the economic and public safety issues that would result, but I'm in support of immigration reform. Not once did I mention human rights or bring emotion into it, the other guy did. It's what I call bleeding heart liberal tactics, most of them that I have met resort to them once someone refutes their argument. It's why I respect you, I'm cool with liberals in debate as long as they actually debate and not shove a mountain of pathos down my throat.

Amazing considering you were the one who stomped and whined about how mean I was. I'll let the post history speak for itself on the rest, considering you were utterly unable to make a cogent argument based on any sort of fact. Just lots of terrible flailing.

[Plata Plomo y Sangre]

Harley Jade Linnea

Plata Plomo y Sangre

Harley Jade Linnea

Plata Plomo y Sangre

Harley Jade Linnea

The last time I checked, 45% is nowhere near 'most', so the source doesn't prove that 'most' do that.

Last I checked it stated 45 entered the country through visas, while another percentage entered legally by other means. Source says slightly more than half crossed the border illegally.

More than 50% makes them the majority, which makes them MOST. Learn2Comprehend what you read.

I didn't claim it was the majority. That was Brothern. Learn2read the letters on the screen.

No one is really this dense. YOU defended the claim that 45% is most, when I said, the last time I checked 45% isn't most. You then said 'but but but it says only a little over half crossed the border illegally', which, as I pointed out, means the claim that 45% is MOST is false. You insisted that it was with your post, troll.

Uh, no. I'm sorry you have a hard time reading basic English, but nowhere did I defend any such claim. Now I know you have to lie because you're dumb and can't actually form a logical argument when someone has facts on their side, but you asked for a source of a specific phenomenon. I provided a source without ever making any claims on the statistics.

Keep swinging hard, dipshit.

[The Ice Dervish]

Plata Plomo y Sangre

The Ice Dervish

Harley Jade Linnea

The Ice Dervish

Harley Jade Linnea

The Ice Dervish

While going back and forth with that idiot Brothern I had almost forgotten what this thread is actually about. Damn. Seriously though, is it really so ******** up that a state is refusing to give illegal immigrants with no papers or right to be here something that only legal residents are supposed to have. It's not rocket science, things like drivers licenses are given to legal residents and if you're here illegally then you have no right to demand one.

I have to agree with you. You and I don't always see eye to eye on things, but in this we do. We need some serious reform to make it easier for those who want to come here, to do so, legally, but opening the borders completely would be bad. And some of the reform Obama has planned is not good for this country. I like some of the things he's done; the Lilly Ledbetter Act, the ACA (for the most part), but his immigration reform needs a lot of work.

Yeah, it's cool that we could see eye to eye on at least this. Not having too much fun in this thread arguing with the bleeding heard Plata or whatever. No logic, sources that don't support their claims or a lack of them entirely, and just total bleeding heart drama. I'm not even against allowing people to come here, I'm 100% in support of legal immigration and even think that our immigration policies need to be changed. Not to an open border, as that would allow cartels to get in and the schools would be overpopulated too quickly, but to allow more people to get in here more easily as long as they can prove that they're going to work/go to college/join the military and pay income taxes and that they can prove that they haven't committed any felony level offenses in the past. I'm just sick of arguing with these super emotional people about immigration, leave the emotion out of the debate and look at the facts. I'm sick of people claiming that I hate brown people because I don't think a 100% open border is a good idea rolleyes At least when you argue, even though I don't agree with you all the time, provide sources and don't just spew out emotion. So props to you.

I like the Lilly Ledbetter act and am personally on the fence about the ACA. My health insurance isn't as good as it was in the past now and I pay more for it, but overall it could have been worse. I consider myself slightly right of center on the political scale if that gives you any insight into the things I say.

I try to leave the emotions out as much as possible. Sometimes I fail at it, but I do try, and if I make a claim I provide sources, especially f asked to back my stuff up. It drives me nuts when people refuse to do that.

It does give me some insight into it. I'm a little more left but I don't really support either of the two main parties. I'm listed as independent on my voter registration card. >_>

You do a pretty good job at it, better than this nutjob dude I've been arguing with in here. I'm so done replying to him, he can't read or comprehend what is being told to him. It's like arguing with someone with a mental disability, I'm so done entertaining people like that. People who don't know how to have a debate have no place trying to.

Yeah, was just saying that because a lot of people assume that I'm super far right whenever I talk politics with them. I lean far to the left on social policies but I tend to not be a fan of the liberal idea of what is good economics. The liberals that I have run into usually tend to turn everything into a human rights issue as well, which isn't always the case. Like me for instance, I argue against an open border because of the economic and public safety issues that would result, but I'm in support of immigration reform. Not once did I mention human rights or bring emotion into it, the other guy did. It's what I call bleeding heart liberal tactics, most of them that I have met resort to them once someone refutes their argument. It's why I respect you, I'm cool with liberals in debate as long as they actually debate and not shove a mountain of pathos down my throat.

Amazing considering you were the one who stomped and whined about how mean I was. I'll let the post history speak for itself on the rest, considering you were utterly unable to make a cogent argument based on any sort of fact. Just lots of terrible flailing.

Keep telling yourself that LOL.

[The Ice Dervish]

Harley Jade Linnea

The Ice Dervish

Harley Jade Linnea

The Ice Dervish

Harley Jade Linnea

The Ice Dervish

While going back and forth with that idiot Brothern I had almost forgotten what this thread is actually about. Damn. Seriously though, is it really so ******** up that a state is refusing to give illegal immigrants with no papers or right to be here something that only legal residents are supposed to have. It's not rocket science, things like drivers licenses are given to legal residents and if you're here illegally then you have no right to demand one.

I have to agree with you. You and I don't always see eye to eye on things, but in this we do. We need some serious reform to make it easier for those who want to come here, to do so, legally, but opening the borders completely would be bad. And some of the reform Obama has planned is not good for this country. I like some of the things he's done; the Lilly Ledbetter Act, the ACA (for the most part), but his immigration reform needs a lot of work.

Yeah, it's cool that we could see eye to eye on at least this. Not having too much fun in this thread arguing with the bleeding heard Plata or whatever. No logic, sources that don't support their claims or a lack of them entirely, and just total bleeding heart drama. I'm not even against allowing people to come here, I'm 100% in support of legal immigration and even think that our immigration policies need to be changed. Not to an open border, as that would allow cartels to get in and the schools would be overpopulated too quickly, but to allow more people to get in here more easily as long as they can prove that they're going to work/go to college/join the military and pay income taxes and that they can prove that they haven't committed any felony level offenses in the past. I'm just sick of arguing with these super emotional people about immigration, leave the emotion out of the debate and look at the facts. I'm sick of people claiming that I hate brown people because I don't think a 100% open border is a good idea rolleyes At least when you argue, even though I don't agree with you all the time, provide sources and don't just spew out emotion. So props to you.

I like the Lilly Ledbetter act and am personally on the fence about the ACA. My health insurance isn't as good as it was in the past now and I pay more for it, but overall it could have been worse. I consider myself slightly right of center on the political scale if that gives you any insight into the things I say.

I try to leave the emotions out as much as possible. Sometimes I fail at it, but I do try, and if I make a claim I provide sources, especially f asked to back my stuff up. It drives me nuts when people refuse to do that.

It does give me some insight into it. I'm a little more left but I don't really support either of the two main parties. I'm listed as independent on my voter registration card. >_>

You do a pretty good job at it, better than this nutjob dude I've been arguing with in here. I'm so done replying to him, he can't read or comprehend what is being told to him. It's like arguing with someone with a mental disability, I'm so done entertaining people like that. People who don't know how to have a debate have no place trying to.

Yeah, was just saying that because a lot of people assume that I'm super far right whenever I talk politics with them. I lean far to the left on social policies but I tend to not be a fan of the liberal idea of what is good economics. The liberals that I have run into usually tend to turn everything into a human rights issue as well, which isn't always the case. Like me for instance, I argue against an open border because of the economic and public safety issues that would result, but I'm in support of immigration reform. Not once did I mention human rights or bring emotion into it, the other guy did. It's what I call bleeding heart liberal tactics, most of them that I have met resort to them once someone refutes their argument. It's why I respect you, I'm cool with liberals in debate as long as they actually debate and not shove a mountain of pathos down my throat.

By the way, I was listening to the news on the way to work, and they mentioned Obama's immigration executive order. If he follows through, 4.5 million adults who have US born children will instantly be granted citizenship. They didn't mention how many minors who were brought over would be affected by it but I though, 4.5 million, holy s**t. We both know not all of them are working, and we both know that those living in poverty will be seeking aid, which is going to drain already low resources even further. This is going to be a nightmare for many states.

I have respect for you too, despite us not always seeing eye to eye, for the same reason. You don't turn it into a s**t storm of emotions. Some emotion on things can't be avoided, but come on.. personal attacks should never come into a debate. Its why, despite us butting heads, you're not on my ignore list. The people who end up there are the ones who lie, or attack others, or are just downright malicious.

Yup, it's going to be an enormous drain on the economy. Now we're going to have to start paying for at least a third of that 4.5 million if not more in welfare. They already cost a s**t ton of money, now they'll cost more. My state will be one of those states, unfortunately. I really wish Obama would be more open to changing his policy on immigration reform. I honestly don't think Obama has a clue as to how the economy works in this regard, he does not see that giving 4.5 million people free citizenship for nothing in return will end up costing us. Like I said, I'm all for immigration reform. We just need to make sure these people that are coming here are actually giving back, going to school, military, a job anything. Anything that will provide some benefit for what we have given them. As long as the majority of the people who come here are giving back by working or school and such then they will be worth it, and I'm super cool with that. Giving a bunch of people citizenship just so a good portion of them can go on state assistance does not sit well with me. There should be some requirements to come here, period.

I never ignore anyone on this site, I see ignoring someone as a sign of my defeat. There also tends to be good ideas in almost every argument, I always try to see the other persons ideas and point of view before I get worked up.

[Plata Plomo y Sangre]

Kaltros

Plata Plomo y Sangre

Kaltros

Plata Plomo y Sangre

Kaltros

Selective compassion, you mean? Because importing foreign poverty will increase poverty among the citizens already here. Especially minority groups, like blacks, who are down economically already. Bringing in millions of Hispanics is a fine way to steal good jobs from blacks. Where's your compassion for American blacks struggling to find work?

Too bad they don't largely compete with American labor for the same jobs, so that's out. Sounds an awful lot like that race baiting you're always whining about, Kaltros. GASP ARE YOU BECOMING A SJW?

Hmm...

Quote:

one Friday earlier this month, a small but vocal group of black activists turned up at City Hall to blast Mayor Antonio Villaraigosa and members of the City Council for failing to work hard enough to prevent violence by Latino gang members against blacks in South Los Angeles.

"You have one race of people exterminating another race of people," said one African American woman.

On the same day, elsewhere in the city, Latino parents stormed out of a meeting of a Los Angeles Unified School District advisory council. The council had been fighting for months about whether to hold its meetings in Spanish or English -- a dispute that got so abusive that district officials felt the need to bring in dispute-resolution experts and mental health counselors. On this particular Friday, the Latino parents walked out after a group of black parents voted to censure the panel's Latino chairman.

These two events are certainly not isolated incidents, but they are the most recent examples of the long-running tensions between blacks and Latinos in Los Angeles. Just a few weeks earlier, federal prosecutors had filed a highly publicized case against more than 60 members of Florencia 13, a Latino street gang that prosecutors say engaged in a violent campaign to drive African American gang rivals out the South L.A. neighborhood of Florence-Firestone, resulting in more than 20 killings over three years. In the late 1980s, according to a report in The Times, the neighborhood was about 80% African American, but today it is 90% Latino.

Animosity between Latinos and blacks is the worst-kept secret in race relations in America. For years, Latino leaders have pointed the finger of blame at blacks when Latinos are robbed, beaten and even murdered. Blacks, in turn, have blamed Latinos for taking jobs, for colonizing neighborhoods, for gang violence. These days, the tension between the races is noticeable not only in prison life and in gang warfare (where it's been a staple of life for decades) but in politics, in schools, in housing, in the immigration debate. Conflicts today are just as likely -- in some cases, more likely -- to be between blacks and Latinos as between blacks and whites. In fact, even though hate-crime laws were originally created to combat crimes by whites against minority groups, the majority of L.A. County's hate crimes against blacks in 2006 were suspected to have been committed by Latinos, and vice versa, according to the county Commission on Human Relations.

Quote:

One of the first warnings that many blacks felt threatened by soaring Latino numbers was the battle over Proposition 187 in California in 1994. California voters approved the measure, which denied public services to illegal immigrants, by a huge margin. Shockingly, blacks also backed the measure; one L.A. Times poll several months after the proposition passed showed blacks supporting its "immediate implementation," 58% to 36%. Apparently, blacks were mortally afraid that Latinos would bump them from low-skill jobs and further marginalize them by increasing joblessness and fueling the crime and drug crises in black neighborhoods. And it's probably true that at the low end of the scale some young, poor, unskilled blacks have been shut out of jobs at hotels and restaurants and in manufacturing. There's also fierce competition for the dwindling number of affirmative action spots in colleges.

http://www.latimes.com/la-op-hutchinson25nov25-story.html#page=1

http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1542-4774.2011.01052.x/abstract

Hmmmm...

There you go again, posting links you don't understand.

Which is why you clearly explained how I "don't understand it".

It's seriously like the three stooges up in this thread. To be fair, normally your threads are pretty retarded.

[Plata Plomo y Sangre]

The Ice Dervish

Plata Plomo y Sangre

The Ice Dervish

Harley Jade Linnea

The Ice Dervish

Yeah, it's cool that we could see eye to eye on at least this. Not having too much fun in this thread arguing with the bleeding heard Plata or whatever. No logic, sources that don't support their claims or a lack of them entirely, and just total bleeding heart drama. I'm not even against allowing people to come here, I'm 100% in support of legal immigration and even think that our immigration policies need to be changed. Not to an open border, as that would allow cartels to get in and the schools would be overpopulated too quickly, but to allow more people to get in here more easily as long as they can prove that they're going to work/go to college/join the military and pay income taxes and that they can prove that they haven't committed any felony level offenses in the past. I'm just sick of arguing with these super emotional people about immigration, leave the emotion out of the debate and look at the facts. I'm sick of people claiming that I hate brown people because I don't think a 100% open border is a good idea rolleyes At least when you argue, even though I don't agree with you all the time, provide sources and don't just spew out emotion. So props to you.

I like the Lilly Ledbetter act and am personally on the fence about the ACA. My health insurance isn't as good as it was in the past now and I pay more for it, but overall it could have been worse. I consider myself slightly right of center on the political scale if that gives you any insight into the things I say.

I try to leave the emotions out as much as possible. Sometimes I fail at it, but I do try, and if I make a claim I provide sources, especially f asked to back my stuff up. It drives me nuts when people refuse to do that.

It does give me some insight into it. I'm a little more left but I don't really support either of the two main parties. I'm listed as independent on my voter registration card. >_>

You do a pretty good job at it, better than this nutjob dude I've been arguing with in here. I'm so done replying to him, he can't read or comprehend what is being told to him. It's like arguing with someone with a mental disability, I'm so done entertaining people like that. People who don't know how to have a debate have no place trying to.

Yeah, was just saying that because a lot of people assume that I'm super far right whenever I talk politics with them. I lean far to the left on social policies but I tend to not be a fan of the liberal idea of what is good economics. The liberals that I have run into usually tend to turn everything into a human rights issue as well, which isn't always the case. Like me for instance, I argue against an open border because of the economic and public safety issues that would result, but I'm in support of immigration reform. Not once did I mention human rights or bring emotion into it, the other guy did. It's what I call bleeding heart liberal tactics, most of them that I have met resort to them once someone refutes their argument. It's why I respect you, I'm cool with liberals in debate as long as they actually debate and not shove a mountain of pathos down my throat.

Amazing considering you were the one who stomped and whined about how mean I was. I'll let the post history speak for itself on the rest, considering you were utterly unable to make a cogent argument based on any sort of fact. Just lots of terrible flailing.

Keep telling yourself that LOL.

I'm not ..telling myself that? I'm telling you. Man you're bad at this.

[The Ice Dervish]

Plata Plomo y Sangre

The Ice Dervish

Plata Plomo y Sangre

The Ice Dervish

Harley Jade Linnea

The Ice Dervish

Yeah, it's cool that we could see eye to eye on at least this. Not having too much fun in this thread arguing with the bleeding heard Plata or whatever. No logic, sources that don't support their claims or a lack of them entirely, and just total bleeding heart drama. I'm not even against allowing people to come here, I'm 100% in support of legal immigration and even think that our immigration policies need to be changed. Not to an open border, as that would allow cartels to get in and the schools would be overpopulated too quickly, but to allow more people to get in here more easily as long as they can prove that they're going to work/go to college/join the military and pay income taxes and that they can prove that they haven't committed any felony level offenses in the past. I'm just sick of arguing with these super emotional people about immigration, leave the emotion out of the debate and look at the facts. I'm sick of people claiming that I hate brown people because I don't think a 100% open border is a good idea rolleyes At least when you argue, even though I don't agree with you all the time, provide sources and don't just spew out emotion. So props to you.

I like the Lilly Ledbetter act and am personally on the fence about the ACA. My health insurance isn't as good as it was in the past now and I pay more for it, but overall it could have been worse. I consider myself slightly right of center on the political scale if that gives you any insight into the things I say.

I try to leave the emotions out as much as possible. Sometimes I fail at it, but I do try, and if I make a claim I provide sources, especially f asked to back my stuff up. It drives me nuts when people refuse to do that.

It does give me some insight into it. I'm a little more left but I don't really support either of the two main parties. I'm listed as independent on my voter registration card. >_>

You do a pretty good job at it, better than this nutjob dude I've been arguing with in here. I'm so done replying to him, he can't read or comprehend what is being told to him. It's like arguing with someone with a mental disability, I'm so done entertaining people like that. People who don't know how to have a debate have no place trying to.

Yeah, was just saying that because a lot of people assume that I'm super far right whenever I talk politics with them. I lean far to the left on social policies but I tend to not be a fan of the liberal idea of what is good economics. The liberals that I have run into usually tend to turn everything into a human rights issue as well, which isn't always the case. Like me for instance, I argue against an open border because of the economic and public safety issues that would result, but I'm in support of immigration reform. Not once did I mention human rights or bring emotion into it, the other guy did. It's what I call bleeding heart liberal tactics, most of them that I have met resort to them once someone refutes their argument. It's why I respect you, I'm cool with liberals in debate as long as they actually debate and not shove a mountain of pathos down my throat.

Amazing considering you were the one who stomped and whined about how mean I was. I'll let the post history speak for itself on the rest, considering you were utterly unable to make a cogent argument based on any sort of fact. Just lots of terrible flailing.

Keep telling yourself that LOL.

I'm not ..telling myself that? I'm telling you. Man you're bad at this.

No, I'm the one telling you emotion_donotwant

[black_wing_angel]

The Ice Dervish

Plata Plomo y Sangre

The Ice Dervish

Plata Plomo y Sangre

The Ice Dervish

You do a pretty good job at it, better than this nutjob dude I've been arguing with in here. I'm so done replying to him, he can't read or comprehend what is being told to him. It's like arguing with someone with a mental disability, I'm so done entertaining people like that. People who don't know how to have a debate have no place trying to.

Yeah, was just saying that because a lot of people assume that I'm super far right whenever I talk politics with them. I lean far to the left on social policies but I tend to not be a fan of the liberal idea of what is good economics. The liberals that I have run into usually tend to turn everything into a human rights issue as well, which isn't always the case. Like me for instance, I argue against an open border because of the economic and public safety issues that would result, but I'm in support of immigration reform. Not once did I mention human rights or bring emotion into it, the other guy did. It's what I call bleeding heart liberal tactics, most of them that I have met resort to them once someone refutes their argument. It's why I respect you, I'm cool with liberals in debate as long as they actually debate and not shove a mountain of pathos down my throat.

Amazing considering you were the one who stomped and whined about how mean I was. I'll let the post history speak for itself on the rest, considering you were utterly unable to make a cogent argument based on any sort of fact. Just lots of terrible flailing.

Keep telling yourself that LOL.

I'm not ..telling myself that? I'm telling you. Man you're bad at this.

No, I'm the one telling you emotion_donotwant

You tell him! scream

(I have no idea what's going on. XD Just saw this little squabble about somebody telling somebody something, and had to make a joke)

[Chahklet]

I triedn reading thru this thread to get some basic information because I like to learn new things. But it was just a bunch of people attacking eachother.

[Chahklet]

I mean, I do it to sometimes when I'm having a bad day but next time please call me out on it guys. None of this is necessary. sweatdrop

[Plata Plomo y Sangre]

Kaltros

Plata Plomo y Sangre

It's seriously like the three stooges up in this thread. To be fair, normally your threads are pretty retarded.

You're Curly, of course.

So you're admitting you're dumb, but your response is "well you too!". Good one.

Still nothing to show how I don't understand the link I provided, eh? I guess it undermines your point too much.