MRAs Discuss the "Matriarchy" in the Black Community

[Omorose Panya]

fubar0

Funny, you try to deny his logical argument with an analogy to racism, going so far as to use the full derogatory term. If that isn't an appeal to emotion I don't know what is.

Your argument is that appealing to the law is acceptable? Or are you saying that you actually didn't understand that my point was the opposite, which I illustrated with culturally significant examples?

'Cause, y'know, it was kind of obvious.

[Princess Creampie]

Well, all I know is this: African-American women are as attractive and beautiful as any other woman of any other race.

[La Veuve Zin]

ExodusNirvana

issues pertaining to legal paternal status, the family court system and the reluctantly to judge women accountable for rape and a host of other crimes in which they get a slap on the wrist, comparatively speaking. It's like people forgot that feminism was the agent that caused the scales to tip so far in the first place. They did a shitty hatchet job at creating this supposed "equality", if you're an empowerment movement then say you are but don't run with the banner of "equality" when it's clearly not the goal.

So what you're saying is that before the feminist movement, men were believed when they reported domestic violence or sexual harassment, men were considered to be more fit than women to stay home and raise children, etc.?

Quote:

Just how many rights and special provisions under the law do women need to become "equal" to men? Just how do we measure "equality"?

Um.....equal pay for equal work?
Equal educational opportunities?
Gender proportions among legislators and executives that at least approach that of the general population?
Do I really need to continue like you're mentally challenged and live under a rock?

Quote:

I hate to break it to you but not all men are treated equally.

STOP THE PRESSES! Maybe we should invent a type of feminism that specifically addresses this....wait...wait...n/m....it already exists.

Quote:

I don't see no feminist demanding to be treated like a poor black man. Or the other way around. They ignore these men when they go after the patriarchy. Which is the point that ironically this thread was based on before it turned into a cluster ******** of emotional derailment.

Do you even understand what patriarchy is? It's what assigned men the role of the stoic, macho, unvictimizable breadwinner who dies in wars and goes down with ships. It's what MRAs don't even realize they're against when they say men and women should be treated equally. You want the right to the same scant privileges women have? Feminism didn't take that away from you, genius, men did that to themselves!

[Blind Hodd]

Omorose Panya

fubar0

Why is it O.K. for feminists to marginalize the suffering of men in order to say that what we go through isn't as important?
if marginalizing women's issues makes one a misogynist why are you all not willing to accept the term misandrist? What makes what you do any different than what you claim we do?

Probably because MRAs tend to have a massive victim complex and mega comprehensionphail.

Read: It's typically all in their heads.


You keep complaining about nonissues. Do you have anything useful to say? How about you make a thread of your own highlighting men's issues. I'll even explain how to do it without being sexist:

1) Don't complain about how "good" women have it with the implication that their lives should be worse than they are now.

2) Do not suggest that the only way to fix men's issues is to make life worse for women.

3) Use valid sources that fully cite their own sources. "US Department of Labor, 2004," for example" is not a citation. Note that you're very unlikely to find MRA websites that fulfill this requirement, so I suggest you don't even try to look. BUT! Feel free to if you manage to find some that actually do properly cite.

4) Actually discuss men's issues and look for solutions that lift both men and women up, as opposed to number 2. If your solutions are similar to those ExodusNirvana typically posts, note that you are doing it wrong.

5) Don't spend half the OP posting wrong information about women's issues, feminism, patriarchy, etc., and then bitching about people correcting that information (aka "turning a men's issues thread into a women's issues one" wink . Don't get me wrong: you can be wrong about it. Just don't b***h when people correct you.

That's a start. It can be done. Really. It just doesn't tend to be. The most recent fail examples to refer to were posted by Phallic, mellifluous glass optics, and God The Rapist v4.0or something like that Vixianna made a men's issues thread (and maybe even more than one) that isn't sexist and full of fail. Refer to it if you must.

Good luck!

I find it funny how the default response to any one of your vague points is "comprehension fail". It's almost like you make points that you can make any number of arguments from just so you can say "LOL that's not what I meant, y u no smart liek me?!"

Yes I did have something useful to add, it got one reply and after explaining it again it went largely ignored. In before "cause you so stupid!"

I'd rather not waste my time making what feminists consider troll bait. In the end one of you three will come in and try to make it sound like what we go through doesn't amount to anything and call us misogynists, all the while trying to justify it by making poor one v.s. a million analogies about disease or murder.

[Blind Hodd]

Omorose Panya

fubar0

Funny, you try to deny his logical argument with an analogy to racism, going so far as to use the full derogatory term. If that isn't an appeal to emotion I don't know what is.

Your argument is that appealing to the law is acceptable? Or are you saying that you actually didn't understand that my point was the opposite, which I illustrated with culturally significant examples?

'Cause, y'know, it was kind of obvious.

If you wanted to illustrate law change there are a dozen different laws that could have been looked into, no this was about getting the biggest emotional/shock impact.

[Omorose Panya]

fubar0

I find it funny how the default response to any one of your vague points is "comprehension fail". It's almost like you make points that you can make any number of arguments from just so you can say "LOL that's not what I meant, y u no smart liek me?!"

Yes I did have something useful to add, it got one reply and after explaining it again it went largely ignored. In before "cause you so stupid!"

I'd rather not waste my time making what feminists consider troll bait. In the end one of you three will come in and try to make it sound like what we go through doesn't amount to anything and call us misogynists, all the while trying to justify it by making poor one v.s. a million analogies about disease or murder.

Aaaand we're back to the point about determining if a label is warranted rather than complaining that it is used. If I must explain the two times I used it, which can be considered a "default" only by those who are terrible with math, then I will.

1) ExodusNirvana took Zin's words out of context---literally emphasized half the statement in two instances, which effectively changed the point---and attacked a straw man.

2) You keep complaining about things that are not happening and changing arguments. On top of that, you keep complaining about the labels people are giving to these actions. Sure we can stop labeling them, but that doesn't make the issues themselves go away. It's better for you all to, y'know, stop doing it in the first place. If you refuse, then stop complaining when people call you on it.

Sounds reasonable to me. Do you have an actual refute?

Which point was it?

Direct quote evidence that has not been taken out of contet (<--- back up if you missed that part) for the bold.

---This is where you, once again, run with your tail between your legs because you know damn well that there isn't any. But I'll humor you. Please remember that we expect you to back up your bull in this forum.

[Omorose Panya]

fubar0

Omorose Panya

fubar0

Funny, you try to deny his logical argument with an analogy to racism, going so far as to use the full derogatory term. If that isn't an appeal to emotion I don't know what is.

Your argument is that appealing to the law is acceptable? Or are you saying that you actually didn't understand that my point was the opposite, which I illustrated with culturally significant examples?

'Cause, y'know, it was kind of obvious.

If you wanted to illustrate law change there are a dozen different laws that could have been looked into, no this was about getting the biggest emotional/shock impact.

You have essentially admitted that the example was valid and thus did in fact counter his argument.

...And I suppose it does take a genius to realize that examples that hit home are more effective than random examples no-one cares about.

[Blind Hodd]

Omorose Panya

fubar0

I find it funny how the default response to any one of your vague points is "comprehension fail". It's almost like you make points that you can make any number of arguments from just so you can say "LOL that's not what I meant, y u no smart liek me?!"

Yes I did have something useful to add, it got one reply and after explaining it again it went largely ignored. In before "cause you so stupid!"

I'd rather not waste my time making what feminists consider troll bait. In the end one of you three will come in and try to make it sound like what we go through doesn't amount to anything and call us misogynists, all the while trying to justify it by making poor one v.s. a million analogies about disease or murder.

Aaaand we're back to the point about determining if a label is warranted rather than complaining that it is used. If I must explain the two times I used it, which can be considered a "default" only by those who are terrible with math, then I will.

1) ExodusNirvana took Zin's words out of context---literally emphasized half the statement in two instances, which effectively changed the point---and attacked a straw man.

2) You keep complaining about things that are not happening and changing arguments. On top of that, you keep complaining about the labels people are giving to these actions. Sure we can stop labeling them, but that doesn't make the issues themselves go away. It's better for you all to, y'know, stop doing it in the first place. If you refuse, then stop complaining when people call you on it.

Sounds reasonable to me. Do you have an actual refute?

Which point was it?

Direct quote evidence that has not been taken out of contet (<--- back up if you missed that part) for the bold.

---This is where you, once again, run with your tail between your legs because you know damn well that there isn't any. But I'll humor you. Please remember that we expect you to back up your bull in this forum.

Good luck, child.

I guess the good point you asked for goes ignored again.
No we're not. I never said it whether it's warranted or not, no doubt there would be some men who actually hate women in there, I just said you would do it. Is that true or not?
When I said default you were not the only person I was taking into consideration.
The usual reaction to being taken out of context is usually to explain what you said better, so please do.


1. I never addressed this
2. where did I do this?

[Blind Hodd]

Omorose Panya

fubar0

Omorose Panya

fubar0

Funny, you try to deny his logical argument with an analogy to racism, going so far as to use the full derogatory term. If that isn't an appeal to emotion I don't know what is.

Your argument is that appealing to the law is acceptable? Or are you saying that you actually didn't understand that my point was the opposite, which I illustrated with culturally significant examples?

'Cause, y'know, it was kind of obvious.

If you wanted to illustrate law change there are a dozen different laws that could have been looked into, no this was about getting the biggest emotional/shock impact.

You have essentially admitted that the example was valid and thus did in fact counter his argument.

Thanks for playing.

...And I suppose it does take a genius to realize that examples that hit home are more effective than random examples no-one cares about.

GASP! How did you discover that I was saying you had a point while disagreeing with the delivery?! Truly I am out matched!

Seriously though, you don't have to make Jim Crow examples to make a point.

[La Veuve Zin]

If anyone can find me a men's rights website that acknowledges feminism is an okay thing and doesn't approve of calling women bitches and sluts, I'll tip the post.

[Princess Creampie]

La Veuve Zin

If anyone can find me a men's rights website that acknowledges feminism is an okay thing and doesn't approve of calling women bitches and sluts, I'll tip the post.

www.menrespectwomen.com

[ExodusNirvana]

La Veuve Zin

If anyone can find me a men's rights website that acknowledges feminism is an okay thing and doesn't approve of calling women bitches and sluts, I'll tip the post.

While we're on that, find me a feminist site that doesn't exclusively blame men for all forms of gender opression. I'll tip them

[Princess Creampie]

ExodusNirvana

La Veuve Zin

If anyone can find me a men's rights website that acknowledges feminism is an okay thing and doesn't approve of calling women bitches and sluts, I'll tip the post.

While we're on that, find me a feminist site that doesn't exclusively blame men for all forms of gender opression. I'll tip them

You don't deserve a tip, blacky. twisted

[Omorose Panya]

ExodusNirvana

La Veuve Zin

If anyone can find me a men's rights website that acknowledges feminism is an okay thing and doesn't approve of calling women bitches and sluts, I'll tip the post.

While we're on that, find me a feminist site that doesn't exclusively blame men for all forms of gender opression. I'll tip them

You'll have an easier time finding feminist websites that don't "exclusively blame men for all forms of gender oppression" than the reverse. Assuming you don't head straight for a manhating website, of course.

[Omorose Panya]

Gen_Desolas Arterius

La Veuve Zin

If anyone can find me a men's rights website that acknowledges feminism is an okay thing and doesn't approve of calling women bitches and sluts, I'll tip the post.

www.menrespectwomen.com

I'm guessing that it was a trick question. Note thatMRA and gender quality are not synonymous; in fact, MRA implies that it is misogynistic and primarily about making women's lives worse to make men's better.

Positive gender equality websites with a male focus are considered by many to be feminist, OR at the very least not MRA. There are plenty such websites. 3nodding