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Keltoi Samurai's avatar

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Keltoi Samurai
God Emperor Akhenaton
Games do not cause violence. Violence is genetic


if that's true, then we're all screwed, since natural selection means that only the angriest, most violent and aggressive of the apelike prehumans survived to become humans.

I mean, let's face it: human survival strategy wasn't "outrun, outhide and outbreed your enemies." that's a food strategy. we made it to the top of our food chain by eating everything that stood between us and the top. it tried to kill us? we ate it. it refused to be eaten? we devised a better way to render it into bite-sized chunks.

we are all the byproducts of assholes and sons-a-bitches. if violence is genetic, then we all inherited it.
Kenneth Bainbridge
J. Robert Oppenheimer
Now we are all sons of bitches.


that IS a good point
What's the point of having a rating scheme, if the government only idea of enforcement is to tax consumers?

If game-stop isn't supposed to be selling M rated games to 12 years olds, then god-damn it, it's on them to develop measures to stop it or they should start getting fined. This s**t where lazy parents let their pre-pubescent children go nuts with online violent games really has to stop.
Fire 0ak's avatar

Buggy Mage

I guess they needed something to blame so they pick the faceless gaming companies. Thus negatively effecting everyone who enjoys games. Most of which, happen to mostly consist of sane and healthy people.
Never do they blame individual parents who saw the signs and did nothing to find needed therapy for their child they should have been concerned for. Never do they blame the schools either, who see how the child interacts with their peers. The evidence is there for predicting events like these but those who have the information fail to do anything positive to prevent the outcomes. They really need to come to more practical conclusions on these political discussions regarding the gaming industry.
black_wing_angel's avatar

Blessed Rogue

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Suicidesoldier#1
marshmallowcreampie
That's stupid.

First of all, there's no definite link between video games and large-scale violence. (or hell, even small-scale violence) If you want to justify a sin tax, there has to be some proven harm. That's the whole point of a sin tax.

Second, if you're going to tax video games with mature content, well, why not do it with movies? Or TV shows, or books? Yeah, good luck trying to put a sin tax on books, that'll go over well with the anti-censorship crowds.


Tax porn.

The U.S. will be out of this recession in no time. xp


You GROSSLY oversimply the matter.

You can't tax money people aren't spending. The government can't tax me for goods I don't buy. And as someone else already pointed out, buying porn is rather rare, in this golden age of cybernetic consumerism. Hell, 4chan alone provides more free porn per DAY than Playboy could sell in a year. And we're talking about a magazine that costs $1 a month to subscribers.

No, you're not going to get out of the recession by taxing porn. Just further destroy the industry for those who intend to use it for financial gain.
Suicidesoldier#1's avatar

Fanatical Zealot

black_wing_angel
Suicidesoldier#1
marshmallowcreampie
That's stupid.

First of all, there's no definite link between video games and large-scale violence. (or hell, even small-scale violence) If you want to justify a sin tax, there has to be some proven harm. That's the whole point of a sin tax.

Second, if you're going to tax video games with mature content, well, why not do it with movies? Or TV shows, or books? Yeah, good luck trying to put a sin tax on books, that'll go over well with the anti-censorship crowds.


Tax porn.

The U.S. will be out of this recession in no time. xp


You GROSSLY oversimply the matter.

You can't tax money people aren't spending. The government can't tax me for goods I don't buy. And as someone else already pointed out, buying porn is rather rare, in this golden age of cybernetic consumerism. Hell, 4chan alone provides more free porn per DAY than Playboy could sell in a year. And we're talking about a magazine that costs $1 a month to subscribers.

No, you're not going to get out of the recession by taxing porn. Just further destroy the industry for those who intend to use it for financial gain.


Tax the advertisement.

If they were smart they'd use the same technology as youtube, say hey, you have to pay us X amount per view on all the major porn sights, and then blam.


You get money from it. dramallama
Ontological Empiricism
Riviera de la Mancha
So, some things I need clarified if possible OP;

First, while I actually think there is enough evidence out there to suggest some link between violence and violent videogames and violent tendencies, I'd rather hold off on that for the moment. Instead, let's say that there indeed was information out there presenting a link of some sort between video games and violence- would you be open to it? If you would be open to it, then, if the link could be proven, would you support this kind of "sin tax"?

Firstly, correlation does not equal, nor should imply, causation. If there was, without a doubt, 100%, no if's, and's, or but's about it, unbiased information that states "video games causes people to be violent", then I guess there would be nothing I could say against some sort of "sin tax".

However, just like how some studies have shown that spanking your child makes them more aggressive or violent as they get older, or manifests as a mental illness -- I am skeptical as to who's doing the study, and the unanswered variables such as "Why is the child being punished? Are the parents spanking their children out of anger?" and so on. I was spanked as a child, as were my sisters and cousins, and we are all considerably less violent and aggressive compared to my non-spanked cousins. But, according to studies, that just means we are freaks of nature, or I guess "outliers". But I digress, and that is for another thread.

Quote:
Secondly, you suggested that if it were 'more consistent' and all adult materials were taxed, you may be more supportive?

Honestly, I'd have more to b***h about, but yes, I would like some consistency. If it's "violent media" causing these things, then apply a "sin tax" across the board, instead of picking-and-choosing. And since we're frowning upon "unhealthy" life styles, a fat tax should be in place, as well, yea?

Quote:
As to my own views, I think the idea of taxing games like cigarettes is a workable idea, but not at the rate suggested. I actually wouldn't be opposed to something like a half of a percent or 1% for informational materials. I would hardly call it a nanny state to support governments, in their legislative capacity, use their superior fact finding powers to get accurate information out to the public for their optional consumption.

But I do feel it's a nanny state. As I'd like to reiterate, correlation does not equal, nor should it imply, causation. There is, as far as I am aware, nothing to show that video games turn people into sociopathic mass murderers. A 10% hike on M-rated games will either cause people to buy their games (such as Xbox games for example) with Microsoft Points, utilize Gamefly to play the game they want, or as Steam Punk Adept said, take a hop, skip, and a jump over state-lines to buy their game. It just seems like a waste of government time, and I'd be surprised if this bill 1. passes, and 2. lasts.

So, you do realize that the evidence is not 100% for alot of products which are similarly taxed or banned outright, right? I say that because 100% is a really high standard- I take it you would not be fore it were it 99%? 98%? 95%? Its a standard I don't think you apply for other things that are as risky or generally risky.

Feel or not, it makes no sense to use the term 'nanny state' in the government's promulgation of information, which is one of its original roles. I assume you don't object to government commissions which confirmed the risks of asbestos, or congressional inquiries which conclusively proved that cigarettes were health risks or government warning systems telling people about floods, storms, etc. Again, the point of the tax is to finance spreading information.
Weretindere's avatar

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Most games involve killing something. Kirby makes eating creatures alive seem cutesy. If people want to tax things because there's blood and realistic people in it, I'd say go for it. People will still pirate them, and this tax would make them even more furious than day-one DLC and DRM. Nintendo wouldn't care; they always liked censoring things. Did Lanza pirate that game; probably.

If it's violent video games causing killings, then sure, go for your bans. I still won't care. You gonna tax all those blood-infested Flash games and those freeware games that you find in the depths of the internet? s**t, most of them have a better story line than the crap this industry shits out. Of course, those don't get s**t like an ESRB rating. Hell, let's play Super Columbine Massacre RPG just for funzies. http://www.nbcnews.com/id/25835616/ns/technology_and_science-games/#.URU5saVOSiU

These ******** can go for their damn legislature, because they're not going solve anything.

Sin Tax, syntax, whatever.
Keltoi Samurai
God Emperor Akhenaton
Games do not cause violence. Violence is genetic


if that's true, then we're all screwed, since natural selection means that only the angriest, most violent and aggressive of the apelike prehumans survived to become humans.

I mean, let's face it: human survival strategy wasn't "outrun, outhide and outbreed your enemies." that's a food strategy. we made it to the top of our food chain by eating everything that stood between us and the top. it tried to kill us? we ate it. it refused to be eaten? we devised a better way to render it into bite-sized chunks.

we are all the byproducts of assholes and sons-a-bitches. if violence is genetic, then we all inherited it.

Not always. Anger turns a soldier in the battlefield into a non-threat. Which is why I keep proposing pissing off our enemies. Anger turns your frontal lobe off to may way for your emotional side of the brain to take over. In other words, angry people do not think, so they are the first to die on the battlefield. Aggressive is the same way. Charge men, even horsemen into a line of infantry, they will get shot at before they meet the end of a bayonet. Same with ape-like. The faster you think, the more likely you are to survive. So the ape-like die off quickly. We don't have a tendency to kill out of anger or stupidity. We kill because nature commands us to.

And it is genetic. You cannot have war on every single piece of land that humans have touched and not call it human nature. Also,
http://www.hgalert.org/topics/behavGenetics/geneticsviolence.html

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/06/20/arts/genetics-and-crime-at-institute-of-justice-conference.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0

http://abcnews.go.com/Nightline/warrior-gene-tied-violence/story?id=12422661

http://www.sagepub.com/upm-data/26264_4sc.pdf
Suicidesoldier#1
Good idea.

If we started taxxing porn, even just a few more percents higher, we'd likely be out of this recession in no time.


I mean really, if we just increased a 3% tax on all porn?

America's recession would be over; so we could be all like, thank you America, for watching porn.


^^^^^^^^^^^
This guy for President
Suicidesoldier#1's avatar

Fanatical Zealot

Quies_Letum
Suicidesoldier#1
Good idea.

If we started taxxing porn, even just a few more percents higher, we'd likely be out of this recession in no time.


I mean really, if we just increased a 3% tax on all porn?

America's recession would be over; so we could be all like, thank you America, for watching porn.


^^^^^^^^^^^
This guy for President


lol blaugh

We could also put solar panels in Antarctica too. ninja
Suicidesoldier#1's avatar

Fanatical Zealot

Keltoi Samurai
HMS Thunder Child
Keltoi Samurai
God Emperor Akhenaton
Games do not cause violence. Violence is genetic


if that's true, then we're all screwed, since natural selection means that only the angriest, most violent and aggressive of the apelike prehumans survived to become humans.

I mean, let's face it: human survival strategy wasn't "outrun, outhide and outbreed your enemies." that's a food strategy. we made it to the top of our food chain by eating everything that stood between us and the top. it tried to kill us? we ate it. it refused to be eaten? we devised a better way to render it into bite-sized chunks.

we are all the byproducts of assholes and sons-a-bitches. if violence is genetic, then we all inherited it.
Kenneth Bainbridge
J. Robert Oppenheimer
Now we are all sons of bitches.


that IS a good point


Humanity got to where we were through organized cooperation.

When agriculture took off we all blew up and expanded; when governments set in with food, and running water, and cool stuff, our population exploded.


It was by mutual cooperation and the development of better goods that we survived. xp

We are one of the the single most defenseless animals on the planet, yet we have all this stuff; violence was not the cause. xp
Actually, I do partially blame the media for the shootings following Columbine. I mean, hey! If I want to get my point across and be immortalized, I know the media will blow up (accidental tasteless pun)any action I do and show the world for a few months and every year following. The world WILL know my name.

And yes, I DO believe that kids are getting these ideas from the things they are watching/playing/reading. And yes, it SHOULD be the parent's job to make sure their children are in proper care and occupying their time with age appropriate materials. However, if half the damned people in this country that decided they were responsible enough to have children ACTUALLY took care if them, the government wouldn't HAVE to step in.

Honestly, I'd MUCH rather them put laws on who can and can not have children, but then either everyone will b***h about that or the simple idea to protect future children will be turned into some insane eugenics project.

Really a sin tax isn't a terrible idea. It's not like any law they pass isn't going to piss people off. Better than banning the damned games completely. And not like it's going to stop people from purchasing them.
Suicidesoldier#1
Quies_Letum
Suicidesoldier#1
Good idea.

If we started taxxing porn, even just a few more percents higher, we'd likely be out of this recession in no time.


I mean really, if we just increased a 3% tax on all porn?

America's recession would be over; so we could be all like, thank you America, for watching porn.


^^^^^^^^^^^
This guy for President


lol blaugh

We could also put solar panels in Antarctica too. ninja


And later work days.

I mean... If that's okay with you, Mr. President.
Suicidesoldier#1's avatar

Fanatical Zealot

Quies_Letum
Suicidesoldier#1
Quies_Letum
Suicidesoldier#1
Good idea.

If we started taxxing porn, even just a few more percents higher, we'd likely be out of this recession in no time.


I mean really, if we just increased a 3% tax on all porn?

America's recession would be over; so we could be all like, thank you America, for watching porn.


^^^^^^^^^^^
This guy for President


lol blaugh

We could also put solar panels in Antarctica too. ninja


And later work days.

I mean... If that's okay with you, Mr. President.


4 days a week 10 hours a day sounds great. xp

I suppose we could always add flursday to the calendar. xp
Connecticut should ponder less about "Sin Tax," more about "Syntax," and realize how uneducated and ridiculous this idea actually appears to be.

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