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What I wanna know is what happened with the mindwipes? Like, where did those memories go? We never got to see the words Zatanna used on Dr. Light. She did something MORE to him than she did everyone else.

And he got his memories back. Somehow.

She obviously didn't erase them. Maybe she sent them somewhere? Like an alternate universe.

But how did they come back?

Luthor. Well, not Luthor directly, but Luthor arranged for it. Marty already taked about wanting another "big gun" in Dr. Light as well as wanting to turn Bats against the League. At the time of Identity Crisis, Dr. Light was still a feeb, so he wouldn't be viable as a "big gun" in time for Luthor to hire Deathstroke, meaning Luthor would have no reason to pay for Light's protection.

Unless Luthor knew what happened to Dr. Light. And knew a way to reverse it, which he made sure happened at the exact moment it needed to, making sure that Light and Deathstroke got away, again protecting his investment.

We don't know what Zee did to Bats. It may have been "tegrof ALJ ycaripsnoc" like she did with most, OR, considering Bats' uncanny ability to know everything, even things he shouldn't, she went deeper on him, too. I'm betting Bats got his memories back at the same time, too. He showed up in Dr. Light's "memory," but he showed up wrong. He wasn't there when the JLA were taking Dr. Light down. He showed up later, during the mindwipe. Maybe Bats' image is there because of the spell that brought the memories back... to Dr. Light AND Bats?

But who could undo one of Zatanna's spells? And how?
I have a horrible feeling that i'm going to be the next Green Lantern...well, you know...I did make an arrow! And being dead automatically makes me Spectre later on in life...

Sorry, had a dream about the train wreck I speak of...it was funny. Solving the worlds Republican problem, forming a Corp with members of Green Peace, yeah...guess you could call it a nightmare?

Sorry, had to bring a twinge of humor to a serious topic... sweatdrop
Another question that's bugging me is...

WHY does The Spectre (and Jeanclipso) want to get rid of all the magic on Earth? Is it because of the mind-wipes? That could be a reason, but magic has been infinitely helpful in the DCU as well.

There'd have to be a specific reason OR person that was adversely affected by the magic behind Spectre in order for him/her to take a vendetta against it.
Well I've been thinking of how can Zatanna spells be reversed, it might be due to her losing her powers as she admits she can't do magic anymore in Zantanna #1. I'm not big on Zantanna history but I'm thinking she knew her powers were fading. This also came from watching some real bad movies the other day and one of the ways to reverse a spell is to kill the evil wizard. So if you lose your powers that would probably be the same thing.

As for to help with Luthor is the main bad guy theory by Marty. I read from some forum that maybe Max mind controled Jean to kill Sue, using his mind powers. It was said somewhere here that Luthor told Calculator he had his sources too, this would lead me to believe this is Max and OMAC. So I believe that Luthor is the puppet master controlling Max.

There is also the fact that somebody was also in the house when Sue died because she heard something downstairs in IC#1. It could be just bad writing but I think there has to be something there.
Sorce

WHY does The Spectre (and Jeanclipso) want to get rid of all the magic on Earth? Is it because of the mind-wipes? That could be a reason, but magic has been infinitely helpful in the DCU as well.


I dont understand how the avatar of God's wrath has become so distraught over losing its human host, which was always just a limiter placed on it, that it is easily manipulated by the new Eclipso.

And if they try to play it off as how its proven that women can easily affect god's creatures, Ill drop this Crisis crap real quick-like.
With Spectre wanting to get rid of magic I'm just guessing that it's being abused and according to the major religions magic is always viewed as man's way of becoming a god. So God's wrath on magic seems to make sense.
Eryu90
With Spectre wanting to get rid of magic I'm just guessing that it's being abused and according to the major religions magic is always viewed as man's way of becoming a god. So God's wrath on magic seems to make sense.


Thing is, magic is being abused less now than in the past, especially before the Crisis. Thats true in comics and in the bible, if you believe that sort of thing, substituting "the Flood" for "the Crisis."

The less religion in comics the better. AFAIK, in DC, "God" doesnt have a complete stranglehold on all cosmic energy, magic included. Im thinking, for better or for PIS, Spectre has gone rogue.
Well I'm thinking that magic is abused in small amounts constantly by regular people that it's effects are now being felt. Kind of like the slow destruction of the ozone layer.
I'm not so hot on this magic idea because if you're ******** around with magic on this scale in the DCU, who is that going to require? It's going to require John ******** Constantine and likely Tim Hunter as well, both of whom can't get their passports stamped to visit normal DC land. Not to mention the fact that Connie was a central figure in the last Crisis along with Swampy.
Spider_Jerusalem
I'm not so hot on this magic idea because if you're ******** around with magic on this scale in the DCU, who is that going to require? It's going to require John ******** Constantine and likely Tim Hunter as well, both of whom can't get their passports stamped to visit normal DC land. Not to mention the fact that Connie was a central figure in the last Crisis along with Swampy.


Thats what I was about to point out. Why cant J.C. make an appearance in DC anymore? Doesnt DC flippin' own Vertigo anyway?
Kyle_Rayner
Spider_Jerusalem
I'm not so hot on this magic idea because if you're ******** around with magic on this scale in the DCU, who is that going to require? It's going to require John ******** Constantine and likely Tim Hunter as well, both of whom can't get their passports stamped to visit normal DC land. Not to mention the fact that Connie was a central figure in the last Crisis along with Swampy.


Thats what I was about to point out. Why cant J.C. make an appearance in DC anymore? Doesnt DC flippin' own Vertigo anyway?


Because they aren't allowed to make references to Vertigo in the happy land DCU by editorial edict. It's like advertising "R" rated movies in front of a "PG-13" one I guess.
Kyle_Rayner

Thats what I was about to point out. Why cant J.C. make an appearance in DC anymore? Doesnt DC flippin' own Vertigo anyway?


It's bananas, but the thinking behind it is that it'd be wrong to use all ages titles to 'promote' Mature Readers material.

Bananas since Marvel seem perfectly happy to use New Avengers to direct readers to the explicit events of Alias (And good for them!) and doubly bananas since the company fretting over moral conduct in this instance is the same one that put out an all ages book with no warning that it contained an explict and voyeuristic portrayl of rape.

It's hard to see how 'Day of Vengence' could make the slightest sense without referencing the Vertigo characters...but then Geoff Johns has always been diligent and meticulous about maintaining Vertigo continuity in JSA and I think Willingham will be just as sneaky.

He's a Vertigo-writer first and foremost after all.
And one who got Barry Allen into a Thessaly mini.
pinderpanda


It's bananas, but the thinking behind it is that it'd be wrong to use all ages titles to 'promote' Mature Readers material.

Bananas since Marvel seem perfectly happy to use New Avengers to direct readers to the explicit events of Alias (And good for them!) and doubly bananas since the company fretting over moral conduct in this instance is the same one that put out an all ages book with no warning that it contained an explict and voyeuristic portrayl of rape.

It's hard to see how 'Day of Vengence' could make the slightest sense without referencing the Vertigo characters...but then Geoff Johns has always been diligent and meticulous about maintaining Vertigo continuity in JSA and I think Willingham will be just as sneaky.

He's a Vertigo-writer first and foremost after all.
And one who got Barry Allen into a Thessaly mini.


Thanks for backing me up on that one, I just knew what you told me. sweatdrop
Max Mercury

In other news,
there already WAS a sequel to Crisis on Infinite Earths.

Animal Man addressed the aftermath and how the Psycho-Pirate was
the only one who remembered it all, locked away in a sanitarium.


Yay! A chance to talk about something I actually know about!

Now's a really good time to re-read Grant Morrison's Animal Man.
Not just for the Crisis elements, but also because once you've understood who the Yellow Aliens are then the 'Seven Mysterious Men' from Seven Soldiers #0 will make immediate sense.

The thing to watch in Animal Man is the animals (no s**t!).

The DC multiverse was created by Gardner Fox in 'Flash of Two Worlds'

The DC multiverse was destroyed by Marv Wolfman in 'Crisis'.

The name 'Morrison' translates as 'Son of the Fox'.

Therefore much of Animal Man can be read as a battle between the pro-monoverse wolves and the pro-multiverse foxes, the agents of "the wolfman" and the agents of 'foxy'...the avatar of childhood innocence with whom the story ends.

Morrison follows William Burroughs in most things and Burroughs wrote at length about how mono-anything (whether it's monotheism, monoculture or monogamy) was morally inferior to multi-anything. It's a theme Warren Ellis has taken directly from Burroughs too, especially in Planetary and Transmetropolitan...but when The Son Of The Fox persues this theme he normally does it by attacking Crisis....

....Through Animal Man...through Earth 2...through introducing Hypertime in JLA and doing backroom conceptual work on The Kingdom...through a Burroughs-esque examination of the moral effects of a monoverse in SeaGuy that explictly rips the piss out of Crisis...
Spider_Jerusalem

Thanks for backing me up on that one, I just knew what you told me. sweatdrop


Yeah...though I think DC are aware of the absurdity.
That's why they've nominated as a writer a guy who so far has done most of his work writing series about magic for Vertigo.

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