manga tone practice #2

[XMegantronX]

2nd try! ignore the wrist.i know i have to fix it, i just can't yet. broken tablet T.T i want more direct feedback on the tone work and how effective this picture would be in a manga. soon i'll make a mock manga page to show you guys ^^

attempt #2
sorry for the link, but it's far too big to post here. if a resize, it'll ruin the tones.

attempt #1

[Kyousouka]

If resizing your tones looks bad and you're not doing anything to remedy that, then I presume you're working exclusively for print?

In a comic, this kind of look might work for a large panel that the reader is meant to linger on for a while, but there's far too much detail in there for an average panel. I highly recommend drawing an actual page (multiple panels, things actually happening, with some speech bubbles perjaps), and toning that. You're not going to figure out an appropriate toning style for a comic without toning a comic :/

Be careful with pattern tones like on that jacket. The pattern will stay the same size even when you draw a smaller panel, so those squares could be the size of her head! Tones can be resized, of course, but it doesn't work well for all of them, and tones are generally optimized for their normal size, and lose definition at smaller sizes when printed. In general, avoid patterned tones on anything that's seen more than once and/or at various sizes unless you're okay with the pattern varying in relative size (to the object) from panel to panel.

I think overall, your toning isn't really doing much. Remember, the #1 purpose of the art in a comic is to tell the story. What do your tones do to help the art tell the story? Use tones to establish mood, call attention to important things, make the art easier to read (parse/understand at a glance), things like that. Design your characters and their clothes (including any tones on them) so that the designs highlight the important parts of that character, distinguish easily between characters even from afar, and give a hint to what that character is like.
It looks like you're just throwing tones on there to make it "prettier", add shading, etc. You're not actually using your tones, and I think that in a comic, that would actually be detrimental because it makes the art harder to read.

Also: Learn to spot blacks (use areas of solid black)! Even if you prefer a style that's more light and airy (no spot blacks), it'll help you a lot to learn how to do it, where to put the blacks, etc. Knowing how to establish mood and light/shadow with just black without overwhelming the piece will help you do the same with tones. Most artists use spot blacks (even airy shoujo manga often have some spot blacks, just less so than darker comics), and many combine spot blacks with tones or even colour.


Why did you make a new thread for this instead of updating the old one?

[XMegantronX]

Kyousouka

If resizing your tones looks bad and you're not doing anything to remedy that, then I presume you're working exclusively for print?

yeah, i definitely want to print my manga and read that resizing can cause moire.

Kyousouka

In a comic, this kind of look might work for a large panel that the reader is meant to linger on for a while, but there's far too much detail in there for an average panel. I highly recommend drawing an actual page (multiple panels, things actually happening, with some speech bubbles perjaps), and toning that. You're not going to figure out an appropriate toning style for a comic without toning a comic :/

that's what's next!

Kyousouka

Be careful with pattern tones like on that jacket. The pattern will stay the same size even when you draw a smaller panel, so those squares could be the size of her head! Tones can be resized, of course, but it doesn't work well for all of them, and tones are generally optimized for their normal size, and lose definition at smaller sizes when printed. In general, avoid patterned tones on anything that's seen more than once and/or at various sizes unless you're okay with the pattern varying in relative size (to the object) from panel to panel.

ah, i didn't think of that.

Kyousouka

I think overall, your toning isn't really doing much. Remember, the #1 purpose of the art in a comic is to tell the story. What do your tones do to help the art tell the story? Use tones to establish mood, call attention to important things, make the art easier to read (parse/understand at a glance), things like that. Design your characters and their clothes (including any tones on them) so that the designs highlight the important parts of that character, distinguish easily between characters even from afar, and give a hint to what that character is like.
It looks like you're just throwing tones on there to make it "prettier", add shading, etc. You're not actually using your tones, and I think that in a comic, that would actually be detrimental because it makes the art harder to read.

well, this was an avi of someone here on gaia, so i guess i was trying more to get the textures right and avoid moire more than anything else. but i'll try for next time.

Kyousouka

Also: Learn to spot blacks (use areas of solid black)! Even if you prefer a style that's more light and airy (no spot blacks), it'll help you a lot to learn how to do it, where to put the blacks, etc. Knowing how to establish mood and light/shadow with just black without overwhelming the piece will help you do the same with tones. Most artists use spot blacks (even airy shoujo manga often have some spot blacks, just less so than darker comics), and many combine spot blacks with tones or even colour.

well i was going to do that to make darker areas but my tablet broke. i tried with my old one but the lines started looking crappy

[XMegantronX]

Oh, and I didn't refresh the old one because I didn't see a point in it. It had already fallen off the front page so I thought I would just start a new one.

[Kyousouka]

I think it would benefit both you and anyone responding to reuse the same thread. That way, they can see what others have already told you, and avoid repeating things (or on the contrary, they might clarify what others have failed to communicate clearly).

[XMegantronX]

Kyousouka

I think it would benefit both you and anyone responding to reuse the same thread. That way, they can see what others have already told you, and avoid repeating things (or on the contrary, they might clarify what others have failed to communicate clearly).

I didn't think it was necessary because I want more feedback on the current one instead of the old one. The old one is just there to compare improvement. I dunno. Just my thinking process. When I do the the test page I'll post it here then.

[Kyousouka]

XMegantronX

Kyousouka

I think it would benefit both you and anyone responding to reuse the same thread. That way, they can see what others have already told you, and avoid repeating things (or on the contrary, they might clarify what others have failed to communicate clearly).

I didn't think it was necessary because I want more feedback on the current one instead of the old one. The old one is just there to compare improvement. I dunno. Just my thinking process. When I do the the test page I'll post it here then.

It would benefit you more to be able to easuly look for patterns in the feedback you get across multiple pieces. A single piece might not show all your problems, and a single critic might not emphasise the most important problems. By reading a whole spectrum of feedback on several related works, you'll be able to get a better idea of your most important problem areas.
One-off problems aren't very important, it's the stuff you keep doing that really needs to be looked at. Try to think of it that way :]

[XMegantronX]

Kyousouka

XMegantronX

Kyousouka

I think it would benefit both you and anyone responding to reuse the same thread. That way, they can see what others have already told you, and avoid repeating things (or on the contrary, they might clarify what others have failed to communicate clearly).

I didn't think it was necessary because I want more feedback on the current one instead of the old one. The old one is just there to compare improvement. I dunno. Just my thinking process. When I do the the test page I'll post it here then.

It would benefit you more to be able to easuly look for patterns in the feedback you get across multiple pieces. A single piece might not show all your problems, and a single critic might not emphasise the most important problems. By reading a whole spectrum of feedback on several related works, you'll be able to get a better idea of your most important problem areas.
One-off problems aren't very important, it's the stuff you keep doing that really needs to be looked at. Try to think of it that way :]

alrighty ^^ i'll just keep recycling this one then