Transgender Issues- not just "men in dresses"

Are you affected by trans issues?

Yes- I'm trans/I think I might be trans	16.2%	[ 919 ]
Yes- I have a trans friend or relative	12.1%	[ 687 ]
Indirectly- I have a trans acquaintance	6.0%	[ 341 ]
Not directly, but I feel these issues affect me indirectly/ I feel that these issues affect everyone	23.5%	[ 1336 ]
Not at all	31.1%	[ 1766 ]
I don't know	11.1%	[ 630 ]
Total Votes:			[ 5679 ]

[e-Claire rc1]

Syndactyly

Blairnensha

Syndactyly

Blairnensha

Syndactyly

Really? You think that the types are so solid that a person of one of those types would never say something like that for any reason?

I am not saying you can't figure out maybe a VERY vague idea of who I might be. But you certianly can't pinpoint a distinct type like you're saying you can. If you try, I probably will be able to counter it, unless you've made an extremely lucky UNeducated guess.

As for typos, wow, you're really being stupid on that point. Typos don't say anything about a person's personality. Especially if they have a physical disability. It could tell you I'm tired, or lazy, or that I broke my middle finger and didn't notice the typo caused by my injury. You have no way to know WHICH exactly is causing the typo unless I give you INFORMATION... which is not the words themselves, but the ideas they present. I also could be lying though.

I tried to avoid being a total a*****e this whole time, but I'm going to say it: stop pretending like you're an expert. You're a ******** amatuer, you can't read my mind. And if you think I'm mad because I cussed, then you really don't know "reading words" as well as you say you do. I choose my words carefully.

No, the concept of knowing a person's personality type based on an arbitrary response... would be extremely unwise, and a very uneducated assumption.

You're way high on your goddamn pedestal, thinking no one else understands fairly well-known psychological concepts (which I believe are bullshit, by the way).

You're doing what a lot of ******** on the internet do. "I r ov supeereeor inteligance, i kin reed ur maind, i kno ur thots, ur intenchuns, ur waes n evryting u desair bekuz i kno ur pursunalitee taip." You are NOT the first person to try to play this game with me.

Okay. If you're going to change pokémon, I can too, right?

Why WOULD you cuss, if you're choosing your words carefully?

Is there a reason why you ignored the rest of that post?

If I told you that, you might "know" my personality type. I wouldn't want to give you that satisfaction.

For like the eighty billionth time, I'm changing pokémon. Did you unplug the game link cable or something?

Which parts did you want me to respond to? Cause most if it looked like just bitching me out or making logical fallacies. I won't speculate as to what emotion might have engendered them because you're so intelligent and mystical that you must have predicted that I would think you were being emotional in an attempt to lure me into calling you on it. Oh, no, perhaps you predicted that I would think this, too, and are luring me into a trap where I must endlessly try to avoid being lured into a trap by following your infinite prediction!

I choose you, Gödel!!!

Well, if it was a logical faallcy at least teling me what fallacy you saw would be nice.

Oh, and I'm not going to take your bait by the way. You're not going to make me have an emotional response so you can label me as a F instead of a T.

And no, unlike you, I don't assume I know exactly what someone else is thinknig and how their brain works "beecuz im a geniuz dat kin diturman ur persunalitee frum ur wrods."

Hm, drunk perhaps? You don't seem like a drinker but that would explain it.

*shrug* Umm, mostly, like, straw man, and stating the opposite. Not really formal fallacies but since you don't know s**t about actual logic I doubt you care.

[Agent Cougar Draven]

Syndactyly

Agent Cougar Draven

Syndactyly

Blairnensha

Syndactyly

Really? You think that the types are so solid that a person of one of those types would never say something like that for any reason?

I am not saying you can't figure out maybe a VERY vague idea of who I might be. But you certianly can't pinpoint a distinct type like you're saying you can. If you try, I probably will be able to counter it, unless you've made an extremely lucky UNeducated guess.

As for typos, wow, you're really being stupid on that point. Typos don't say anything about a person's personality. Especially if they have a physical disability. It could tell you I'm tired, or lazy, or that I broke my middle finger and didn't notice the typo caused by my injury. You have no way to know WHICH exactly is causing the typo unless I give you INFORMATION... which is not the words themselves, but the ideas they present. I also could be lying though.

I tried to avoid being a total a*****e this whole time, but I'm going to say it: stop pretending like you're an expert. You're a ******** amatuer, you can't read my mind. And if you think I'm mad because I cussed, then you really don't know "reading words" as well as you say you do. I choose my words carefully.

No, the concept of knowing a person's personality type based on an arbitrary response... would be extremely unwise, and a very uneducated assumption.

You're way high on your goddamn pedestal, thinking no one else understands fairly well-known psychological concepts (which I believe are bullshit, by the way).

You're doing what a lot of ******** on the internet do. "I r ov supeereeor inteligance, i kin reed ur maind, i kno ur thots, ur intenchuns, ur waes n evryting u desair bekuz i kno ur pursunalitee taip." You are NOT the first person to try to play this game with me.

Okay. If you're going to change pokémon, I can too, right?

Why WOULD you cuss, if you're choosing your words carefully?

Is there a reason why you ignored the rest of that post?

If I told you that, you might "know" my personality type. I wouldn't want to give you that satisfaction.

50%.

Really? How is that? I was feigning a personality in that instance. =o

On an unrelated note, how do you so precisely determine your certainty on something?

Oh, I know you were faking. It's how you fake it, what you choose to fake, and again, the simple fact that you choose to.

And how do I precisely determine my certainty? There are four type factors. I know three. I am therefore unsure of one factor, of which there are two possibilities. Hence I can say that I am 50% certain.

And upon reflection, I have a guess.

Which I'm not going to give to you, because you're not playing nice. smile

(PS you can say that I don't actually have a guess all you want, but the simple fact is that you're wrong.)

[Syndactyly]

Blairnensha

Syndactyly

Blairnensha

Syndactyly

Blairnensha

Syndactyly

Really? You think that the types are so solid that a person of one of those types would never say something like that for any reason?

I am not saying you can't figure out maybe a VERY vague idea of who I might be. But you certianly can't pinpoint a distinct type like you're saying you can. If you try, I probably will be able to counter it, unless you've made an extremely lucky UNeducated guess.

As for typos, wow, you're really being stupid on that point. Typos don't say anything about a person's personality. Especially if they have a physical disability. It could tell you I'm tired, or lazy, or that I broke my middle finger and didn't notice the typo caused by my injury. You have no way to know WHICH exactly is causing the typo unless I give you INFORMATION... which is not the words themselves, but the ideas they present. I also could be lying though.

I tried to avoid being a total a*****e this whole time, but I'm going to say it: stop pretending like you're an expert. You're a ******** amatuer, you can't read my mind. And if you think I'm mad because I cussed, then you really don't know "reading words" as well as you say you do. I choose my words carefully.

No, the concept of knowing a person's personality type based on an arbitrary response... would be extremely unwise, and a very uneducated assumption.

You're way high on your goddamn pedestal, thinking no one else understands fairly well-known psychological concepts (which I believe are bullshit, by the way).

You're doing what a lot of ******** on the internet do. "I r ov supeereeor inteligance, i kin reed ur maind, i kno ur thots, ur intenchuns, ur waes n evryting u desair bekuz i kno ur pursunalitee taip." You are NOT the first person to try to play this game with me.

Okay. If you're going to change pokémon, I can too, right?

Why WOULD you cuss, if you're choosing your words carefully?

Is there a reason why you ignored the rest of that post?

If I told you that, you might "know" my personality type. I wouldn't want to give you that satisfaction.

For like the eighty billionth time, I'm changing pokémon. Did you unplug the game link cable or something?

Which parts did you want me to respond to? Cause most if it looked like just bitching me out or making logical fallacies. I won't speculate as to what emotion might have engendered them because you're so intelligent and mystical that you must have predicted that I would think you were being emotional in an attempt to lure me into calling you on it. Oh, no, perhaps you predicted that I would think this, too, and are luring me into a trap where I must endlessly try to avoid being lured into a trap by following your infinite prediction!

I choose you, Gödel!!!

Well, if it was a logical faallcy at least teling me what fallacy you saw would be nice.

Oh, and I'm not going to take your bait by the way. You're not going to make me have an emotional response so you can label me as a F instead of a T.

And no, unlike you, I don't assume I know exactly what someone else is thinknig and how their brain works "beecuz im a geniuz dat kin diturman ur persunalitee frum ur wrods."

Hm, drunk perhaps? You don't seem like a drinker but that would explain it.

*shrug* Umm, mostly, like, straw man, and stating the opposite. Not really formal fallacies but since you don't know s**t about actual logic I doubt you care.

The fact thay you're constantly dodging my responses, and have been since the beginning, says a lot.

Also if you consider my arguments "immune" to yours, that says a lot about your arguments.

Lastly, I was hoping you'd be more specific than just aying, "You may fallacy A, B, and C." I was hoping you might quote it and being like, "This is an example of fallacy D." That would be much easier to understand and possibly concede to if you were right. Otherwise it just looks like you're spitting out excuses to ignore what I've said.

The fact now that you have to indirectly respond to me, and now lower yourself to petty insults, says that you've given up. For good reasons probably.

[Syndactyly]

Agent Cougar Draven

Syndactyly

Agent Cougar Draven

Syndactyly

Blairnensha

Syndactyly

Really? You think that the types are so solid that a person of one of those types would never say something like that for any reason?

I am not saying you can't figure out maybe a VERY vague idea of who I might be. But you certianly can't pinpoint a distinct type like you're saying you can. If you try, I probably will be able to counter it, unless you've made an extremely lucky UNeducated guess.

As for typos, wow, you're really being stupid on that point. Typos don't say anything about a person's personality. Especially if they have a physical disability. It could tell you I'm tired, or lazy, or that I broke my middle finger and didn't notice the typo caused by my injury. You have no way to know WHICH exactly is causing the typo unless I give you INFORMATION... which is not the words themselves, but the ideas they present. I also could be lying though.

I tried to avoid being a total a*****e this whole time, but I'm going to say it: stop pretending like you're an expert. You're a ******** amatuer, you can't read my mind. And if you think I'm mad because I cussed, then you really don't know "reading words" as well as you say you do. I choose my words carefully.

No, the concept of knowing a person's personality type based on an arbitrary response... would be extremely unwise, and a very uneducated assumption.

You're way high on your goddamn pedestal, thinking no one else understands fairly well-known psychological concepts (which I believe are bullshit, by the way).

You're doing what a lot of ******** on the internet do. "I r ov supeereeor inteligance, i kin reed ur maind, i kno ur thots, ur intenchuns, ur waes n evryting u desair bekuz i kno ur pursunalitee taip." You are NOT the first person to try to play this game with me.

Okay. If you're going to change pokémon, I can too, right?

Why WOULD you cuss, if you're choosing your words carefully?

Is there a reason why you ignored the rest of that post?

If I told you that, you might "know" my personality type. I wouldn't want to give you that satisfaction.

50%.

Really? How is that? I was feigning a personality in that instance. =o

On an unrelated note, how do you so precisely determine your certainty on something?

Oh, I know you were faking. It's how you fake it, what you choose to fake, and again, the simple fact that you choose to.

And how do I precisely determine my certainty? There are four type factors. I know three. I am therefore unsure of one factor, of which there are two possibilities. Hence I can say that I am 50% certain.

And upon reflection, I have a guess.

Which I'm not going to give to you, because you're not playing nice. smile

(PS you can say that I don't actually have a guess all you want, but the simple fact is that you're wrong.)

Wow, you fell right into that. I wasn't faking, but I did just lie to you about faking. Now I'm suspecting you'll say you've lied too in order to collect information on my personality that you're so completely and accurately formulating.

You admit it's a guess. You don't really know anything in this situation.

[Agent Cougar Draven]

Syndactyly

Blairnensha

Syndactyly

Blairnensha

Syndactyly

Is there a reason why you ignored the rest of that post?

If I told you that, you might "know" my personality type. I wouldn't want to give you that satisfaction.

For like the eighty billionth time, I'm changing pokémon. Did you unplug the game link cable or something?

Which parts did you want me to respond to? Cause most if it looked like just bitching me out or making logical fallacies. I won't speculate as to what emotion might have engendered them because you're so intelligent and mystical that you must have predicted that I would think you were being emotional in an attempt to lure me into calling you on it. Oh, no, perhaps you predicted that I would think this, too, and are luring me into a trap where I must endlessly try to avoid being lured into a trap by following your infinite prediction!

I choose you, Gödel!!!

Well, if it was a logical faallcy at least teling me what fallacy you saw would be nice.

Oh, and I'm not going to take your bait by the way. You're not going to make me have an emotional response so you can label me as a F instead of a T.

And no, unlike you, I don't assume I know exactly what someone else is thinknig and how their brain works "beecuz im a geniuz dat kin diturman ur persunalitee frum ur wrods."

Hm, drunk perhaps? You don't seem like a drinker but that would explain it.

*shrug* Umm, mostly, like, straw man, and stating the opposite. Not really formal fallacies but since you don't know s**t about actual logic I doubt you care.

The fact thay you're constantly dodging my responses, and have been since the beginning, says a lot.

Also if you consider my arguments "immune" to yours, that says a lot about your arguments.

Lastly, I was hoping you'd be more specific than just aying, "You may fallacy A, B, and C." I was hoping you might quote it and being like, "This is an example of fallacy D." That would be much easier to understand and possibly concede to if you were right. Otherwise it just looks like you're spitting out excuses to ignore what I've said.

The fact now that you have to indirectly respond to me, and now lower yourself to petty insults, says that you've given up. For good reasons probably.

Syndactyly

You're not going to make me have an emotional response so you can label me as a F instead of a T.

Example of a strawman.

Syndactyly

And no, unlike you, I don't assume I know exactly what someone else is thinknig and how their brain works "beecuz im a geniuz dat kin diturman ur persunalitee frum ur wrods."

Example of stating the obvious. Also, implied argumentum ad hominem.

[Aino Ailill]

Recursive Paradox

Syndactyly

Recursive Paradox

Syndactyly

Recursive Paradox

Who oppresses men as a social class? o_O

Women.

How? Women's bodies are construed as owned, we're raped far, far more often than men are, we make less money, are harassed more, our views are construed as less valid, etc etc etc. Men do in fact have privilege over women cuz masculinity is treated as higher than femininity. It's why people beat the s**t out of trans women and mostly just ignore trans guys. It is expected for femininity to be shed. Attempting to gain it goes against the ideology of our culture.

Men are expected to be strong, the providers, and all the other stereotypical roles, and women condone and encourage these stereotypes.

But women do not have the social power to enforce these stereotypes. Only men do.

I'd very much like to the evidence to support this. My experiences would indicate that women are very influential in shaming and manipulating men into playing their 'proper' role.

[Syndactyly]

Agent Cougar Draven

Syndactyly

Blairnensha

Syndactyly

Blairnensha

For like the eighty billionth time, I'm changing pokémon. Did you unplug the game link cable or something?

Which parts did you want me to respond to? Cause most if it looked like just bitching me out or making logical fallacies. I won't speculate as to what emotion might have engendered them because you're so intelligent and mystical that you must have predicted that I would think you were being emotional in an attempt to lure me into calling you on it. Oh, no, perhaps you predicted that I would think this, too, and are luring me into a trap where I must endlessly try to avoid being lured into a trap by following your infinite prediction!

I choose you, Gödel!!!

Well, if it was a logical faallcy at least teling me what fallacy you saw would be nice.

Oh, and I'm not going to take your bait by the way. You're not going to make me have an emotional response so you can label me as a F instead of a T.

And no, unlike you, I don't assume I know exactly what someone else is thinknig and how their brain works "beecuz im a geniuz dat kin diturman ur persunalitee frum ur wrods."

Hm, drunk perhaps? You don't seem like a drinker but that would explain it.

*shrug* Umm, mostly, like, straw man, and stating the opposite. Not really formal fallacies but since you don't know s**t about actual logic I doubt you care.

The fact thay you're constantly dodging my responses, and have been since the beginning, says a lot.

Also if you consider my arguments "immune" to yours, that says a lot about your arguments.

Lastly, I was hoping you'd be more specific than just aying, "You may fallacy A, B, and C." I was hoping you might quote it and being like, "This is an example of fallacy D." That would be much easier to understand and possibly concede to if you were right. Otherwise it just looks like you're spitting out excuses to ignore what I've said.

The fact now that you have to indirectly respond to me, and now lower yourself to petty insults, says that you've given up. For good reasons probably.

Syndactyly

You're not going to make me have an emotional response so you can label me as a F instead of a T.

Example of a strawman.

No it isn't. I was preemptively stating my expectations. I hadn't said she'd yet argued that.

Agent Cougar Draven

Syndactyly

And no, unlike you, I don't assume I know exactly what someone else is thinknig and how their brain works "beecuz im a geniuz dat kin diturman ur persunalitee frum ur wrods."

Example of stating the obvious. Also, implied argumentum ad hominem.

Implicit, not explicit. You assumed. Also, stating the obvious, as far as I know, isn't a fallacy. If you can link me to that, I'll concede.

[Agent Cougar Draven]

Syndactyly

Agent Cougar Draven

Syndactyly

Agent Cougar Draven

Syndactyly

Is there a reason why you ignored the rest of that post?

If I told you that, you might "know" my personality type. I wouldn't want to give you that satisfaction.

50%.

Really? How is that? I was feigning a personality in that instance. =o

On an unrelated note, how do you so precisely determine your certainty on something?

Oh, I know you were faking. It's how you fake it, what you choose to fake, and again, the simple fact that you choose to.

And how do I precisely determine my certainty? There are four type factors. I know three. I am therefore unsure of one factor, of which there are two possibilities. Hence I can say that I am 50% certain.

And upon reflection, I have a guess.

Which I'm not going to give to you, because you're not playing nice. smile

(PS you can say that I don't actually have a guess all you want, but the simple fact is that you're wrong.)

Wow, you fell right into that. I wasn't faking, but I did just lie to you about faking. Now I'm suspecting you'll say you've lied too in order to collect information on my personality that you're so completely and accurately formulating.

You admit it's a guess. You don't really know anything in this situation.

Or you're lying now. Because I'll tell you something. I wasn't. I assumed you were lying, and even if I was wrong, the fact that you lied about lying pretty much means the same as if you were just lying.

Except it makes me double-check my friends and family for anyone named Wellington Yueh. Can't ever be too safe.

[Aino Ailill]

Recursive Paradox

Blairnensha

Recursive Paradox

Syndactyly

Recursive Paradox

I can say that I understand the concept of safe spaces for marginalized groups. Gender separation doesn't make sense in a college (where you go for learning, not for a safe space), but say in groups where women (it should be cis and trans, but normally we're dumped) take some time to recover from sexism and bullshit in society and discuss those issues without guys chiming in and questioning whether we're all just delusional or creating strawfeminists to attack us with (which happens often).

I don't think I said anything about safety. But it could be a preference, and why aren't people allowed to have that preference? So a guy wants to be in a strictly male environment. Does he really need a reason?

You misunderstand me. I'm simply saying that safe spaces are an exception to Blair's logic.

Quote:

As for men "aren't oppressed," that's a load of horseshit and you know it. >_>;

Who oppresses men as a social class? o_O

are we talking about how men expect each other to be homophobic, grog-swilling, foul-smelling pigs with trophy wives? Or something else.

I dunno, you'd have to ask Syn. I don't think the label class oppression applies to in house battles. For instance, the bitchy s**t trans women do to each other isn't oppression. It just sucks.

If it is effectively the same, why ought it not be considered oppression?

[Syndactyly]

Aino Ailill

Recursive Paradox

Syndactyly

Recursive Paradox

Syndactyly

Recursive Paradox

Who oppresses men as a social class? o_O

Women.

How? Women's bodies are construed as owned, we're raped far, far more often than men are, we make less money, are harassed more, our views are construed as less valid, etc etc etc. Men do in fact have privilege over women cuz masculinity is treated as higher than femininity. It's why people beat the s**t out of trans women and mostly just ignore trans guys. It is expected for femininity to be shed. Attempting to gain it goes against the ideology of our culture.

Men are expected to be strong, the providers, and all the other stereotypical roles, and women condone and encourage these stereotypes.

But women do not have the social power to enforce these stereotypes. Only men do.

I'd very much like to the evidence to support this. My experiences would indicate that women are very influential in shaming and manipulating men into playing their 'proper' role.

THIS.

Women can be an emotional/psychological threat to men. And a physical threat to some men, also depending on the woman in question.

[Aino Ailill]

Corrupted Coco

Blairnensha

Corrupted Coco

Then drop it, s**t. You guys make all these gigantic posts arguing over petty s**t for pages at a time and nobody else gets any replies to anything they post.

Imagine that: an extended discussion in the Extended Discussion forum.

*headshakesighs*

Lol sure, an extended discussion on something meaningless and stupid. You aren't proving anything here.

That it does not hold value to you does not mean that it does not hold value to others.

[Syndactyly]

Agent Cougar Draven

Syndactyly

Agent Cougar Draven

Syndactyly

Agent Cougar Draven

Syndactyly

Is there a reason why you ignored the rest of that post?

If I told you that, you might "know" my personality type. I wouldn't want to give you that satisfaction.

50%.

Really? How is that? I was feigning a personality in that instance. =o

On an unrelated note, how do you so precisely determine your certainty on something?

Oh, I know you were faking. It's how you fake it, what you choose to fake, and again, the simple fact that you choose to.

And how do I precisely determine my certainty? There are four type factors. I know three. I am therefore unsure of one factor, of which there are two possibilities. Hence I can say that I am 50% certain.

And upon reflection, I have a guess.

Which I'm not going to give to you, because you're not playing nice. smile

(PS you can say that I don't actually have a guess all you want, but the simple fact is that you're wrong.)

Wow, you fell right into that. I wasn't faking, but I did just lie to you about faking. Now I'm suspecting you'll say you've lied too in order to collect information on my personality that you're so completely and accurately formulating.

You admit it's a guess. You don't really know anything in this situation.

Or you're lying now. Because I'll tell you something. I wasn't. I assumed you were lying, and even if I was wrong, the fact that you lied about lying pretty much means the same as if you were just lying.

Except it makes me double-check my friends and family for anyone named Wellington Yueh. Can't ever be too safe.

Right, but lying about lying does mean that the original lie was a truth and thus according to how this conversation went down makes your last claim incorrect. Unless YOU were lying. But you won't admit to that because I said you might, which is why I said that. To prevent you from saying it. Because when a person is in an argument, they won't let their opponent be right about anything. So all I gave to do is tell you what you're gonna do and you won't do it. Saves me a lot of trouble.

I used the word "gonna." I bet that says A LOT about who I am, right?

[Agent Cougar Draven]

Syndactyly

Agent Cougar Draven

Syndactyly

You're not going to make me have an emotional response so you can label me as a F instead of a T.

Example of a strawman.

No it isn't. I was preemptively stating my expectations. I hadn't said she'd yet argued that.

You assumed Blair would, and set up a strawman argument.

Syndactyly

Agent Cougar Draven

Syndactyly

And no, unlike you, I don't assume I know exactly what someone else is thinknig and how their brain works "beecuz im a geniuz dat kin diturman ur persunalitee frum ur wrods."

Example of stating the obvious. Also, implied argumentum ad hominem.

Implicit, not explicit. You assumed. Also, stating the obvious, as far as I know, isn't a fallacy. If you can link me to that, I'll concede.

Wow, I ******** this one up. I should have said "stating the opposite". Which is just a form of poisoning the well.

[Agent Cougar Draven]

Syndactyly

Aino Ailill

Recursive Paradox

Syndactyly

Recursive Paradox

How? Women's bodies are construed as owned, we're raped far, far more often than men are, we make less money, are harassed more, our views are construed as less valid, etc etc etc. Men do in fact have privilege over women cuz masculinity is treated as higher than femininity. It's why people beat the s**t out of trans women and mostly just ignore trans guys. It is expected for femininity to be shed. Attempting to gain it goes against the ideology of our culture.

Men are expected to be strong, the providers, and all the other stereotypical roles, and women condone and encourage these stereotypes.

But women do not have the social power to enforce these stereotypes. Only men do.

I'd very much like to the evidence to support this. My experiences would indicate that women are very influential in shaming and manipulating men into playing their 'proper' role.

THIS.

Women can be an emotional/psychological threat to men. And a physical threat to some men, also depending on the woman in question.

Agreed. I'd also like to see some evidence.

[Agent Cougar Draven]

Syndactyly

Agent Cougar Draven

Syndactyly

Agent Cougar Draven

Syndactyly

Really? How is that? I was feigning a personality in that instance. =o

On an unrelated note, how do you so precisely determine your certainty on something?

Oh, I know you were faking. It's how you fake it, what you choose to fake, and again, the simple fact that you choose to.

And how do I precisely determine my certainty? There are four type factors. I know three. I am therefore unsure of one factor, of which there are two possibilities. Hence I can say that I am 50% certain.

And upon reflection, I have a guess.

Which I'm not going to give to you, because you're not playing nice. smile

(PS you can say that I don't actually have a guess all you want, but the simple fact is that you're wrong.)

Wow, you fell right into that. I wasn't faking, but I did just lie to you about faking. Now I'm suspecting you'll say you've lied too in order to collect information on my personality that you're so completely and accurately formulating.

You admit it's a guess. You don't really know anything in this situation.

Or you're lying now. Because I'll tell you something. I wasn't. I assumed you were lying, and even if I was wrong, the fact that you lied about lying pretty much means the same as if you were just lying.

Except it makes me double-check my friends and family for anyone named Wellington Yueh. Can't ever be too safe.

Right, but lying about lying does mean that the original lie was a truth and thus according to how this conversation went down makes your last claim incorrect. Unless YOU were lying. But you won't admit to that because I said you might, which is why I said that. To prevent you from saying it. Because when a person is in an argument, they won't let their opponent be right about anything. So all I gave to do is tell you what you're gonna do and you won't do it. Saves me a lot of trouble.

I used the word "gonna." I bet that says A LOT about who I am, right?

You didn't use the word "gonna".

And no. The more chains of deceit within deceit within deceit that you pull, the further you drag yourself down. I'm now 100% sure of two out of four, and about 66% on the other two, bringing me to an adjusted certainty of 83%.