Evolution: Fact Or Fiction

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Total Votes:			[ 2895 ]

[teen_1986]

chrisoya

Texas Gypsy

chrisoya

Texas Gypsy

Tails??? I'm sorry, but to the best of my knowledge humans have never HAD tails. Please show me a link to any proof that we did. And I'm not talking about the temporary fetal stage or the rare individual who doesn't completely absorb it before birth.

Yes, that's right. Reject the evidence in advance, and then claim that none exists!

Humans don't have tails. Our ancestors did.

*rolls eyes* Read my post again, please. I was asking for PROOF that we did, not rejecting it out of hand. PROVE it to me, don't just say we did. If there's anything in the fossil record to bear out the existence of tails in humans, I'll look at it.

rolleyes Yes, that's right, keep on with that ignorant strawman. You're quite right that humans do not have tails except in rare cases, but it's a strawman argument.

Wait a minute, why should she just take your word for it. Give her the proof she asked for.
Or are you just going to do what the creationists do and ignore the request for proof?

[Red Calypso]

chrisoya

Texas Gypsy

Cuddle-fish

Texas Gypsy

Chrono_Tata

http://wiki.cotch.net/index.php/No_new_body_parts_have_evolved

Forgive me, I don't have time to go through all that right now. Is that an argument for or against evolution?

how is it that you can be in this thread for an hour and a half an dnot have time to read a 4 sentence response

Check the link out. That was NOT a four sentence response, and I was on my way back to bed. I did not have time to read the whole article.

I just counted five sentences in the responses section, only four of which directly refer to humans.

So you had time to glance at it and lie about its content, but not to actually read the few short sentences? Well, I'll reproduce them here so you don't have to tire out your finger clicking on the link again:

Four sentences

In humans, the current trend is for body parts to evolve out rather than in since we are physically adapted for an environment that is more strenuous than our current one. For example, the palmaris longus tendon is currently vanishing in the human population. It is no longer advantageous to have it, since we do not routinely get from place to place via overhand swinging on tree branches. Our ancestors also lost their tails several million years ago.

Listen closely now. I WAS GOING BACK TO BED! I took one look at the lengthy article and backed out so I could check it later. Don't you EVER call me a liar. I WILL check out the claim that the tendon is disappearing, but I'm not going to take it as a fact from one article. I find your whole attitude rude and not conducive to further discussion.

[maybecca]

teen_1986

chrisoya

Texas Gypsy

chrisoya

Texas Gypsy

Tails??? I'm sorry, but to the best of my knowledge humans have never HAD tails. Please show me a link to any proof that we did. And I'm not talking about the temporary fetal stage or the rare individual who doesn't completely absorb it before birth.

Yes, that's right. Reject the evidence in advance, and then claim that none exists!

Humans don't have tails. Our ancestors did.

*rolls eyes* Read my post again, please. I was asking for PROOF that we did, not rejecting it out of hand. PROVE it to me, don't just say we did. If there's anything in the fossil record to bear out the existence of tails in humans, I'll look at it.

rolleyes Yes, that's right, keep on with that ignorant strawman. You're quite right that humans do not have tails except in rare cases, but it's a strawman argument.

Wait a minute, why should she just take your word for it. Give her the proof she asked for.
Or are you just going to do what the creationists do and ignore the request for proof?

Well, she already knows of the evidence - see the bolded bits in her post. She just declared it irrelevant, and started asking for fossil evidence of humans with tails, which... doesn't exist.

Edit: I just reread it to make sure I'm not going insane - she is asking explicitly for evidence that humans had tails. This evidence does not exist outside of rare cases which she knows of already, because the claim that humans had tails is not one made by the theory of evolution.

[teen_1986]

Texas Gypsy

chrisoya

Texas Gypsy

Cuddle-fish

Texas Gypsy

Forgive me, I don't have time to go through all that right now. Is that an argument for or against evolution?

how is it that you can be in this thread for an hour and a half an dnot have time to read a 4 sentence response

Check the link out. That was NOT a four sentence response, and I was on my way back to bed. I did not have time to read the whole article.

I just counted five sentences in the responses section, only four of which directly refer to humans.

So you had time to glance at it and lie about its content, but not to actually read the few short sentences? Well, I'll reproduce them here so you don't have to tire out your finger clicking on the link again:

Four sentences

In humans, the current trend is for body parts to evolve out rather than in since we are physically adapted for an environment that is more strenuous than our current one. For example, the palmaris longus tendon is currently vanishing in the human population. It is no longer advantageous to have it, since we do not routinely get from place to place via overhand swinging on tree branches. Our ancestors also lost their tails several million years ago.

Listen closely now. I WAS GOING BACK TO BED! I took one look at the lengthy article and backed out so I could check it later. Don't you EVER call me a liar. I WILL check out the claim that the tendon is disappearing, but I'm not going to take it as a fact from one article. I find your whole attitude rude and not conducive to further discussion.

FOUR sentences is NOT a "lengthy article". You are either a liar or an idiot...

[teen_1986]

chrisoya

teen_1986

chrisoya

Texas Gypsy

chrisoya

Texas Gypsy

Tails??? I'm sorry, but to the best of my knowledge humans have never HAD tails. Please show me a link to any proof that we did. And I'm not talking about the temporary fetal stage or the rare individual who doesn't completely absorb it before birth.

Yes, that's right. Reject the evidence in advance, and then claim that none exists!

Humans don't have tails. Our ancestors did.

*rolls eyes* Read my post again, please. I was asking for PROOF that we did, not rejecting it out of hand. PROVE it to me, don't just say we did. If there's anything in the fossil record to bear out the existence of tails in humans, I'll look at it.

rolleyes Yes, that's right, keep on with that ignorant strawman. You're quite right that humans do not have tails except in rare cases, but it's a strawman argument.

Wait a minute, why should she just take your word for it. Give her the proof she asked for.
Or are you just going to do what the creationists do and ignore the request for proof?

Well, she already knows of the evidence - see the bolded bits in her post. She just declared it irrelevant, and started asking for fossil evidence of humans with tails, which... doesn't exist.

Edit: I just reread it to make sure I'm not going insane - she is asking explicitly for evidence that humans had tails. This evidence does not exist outside of rare cases which she knows of already, because the claim that humans had tails is not one made by the theory of evolution.

That's fair enough then.

[maybecca]

Texas Gypsy

Listen closely now. I WAS GOING BACK TO BED! I took one look at the lengthy article and backed out so I could check it later. Don't you EVER call me a liar. I WILL check out the claim that the tendon is disappearing, but I'm not going to take it as a fact from one article. I find your whole attitude rude and not conducive to further discussion.

This:

Quote:

Claim

The evolution of new body parts has never been observed.

Source

* Kepler, Christian, n.d. Another False Link Discovered in the Theory of Evolution.

Responses

1. Fruit flies can grow new body segments or limbs by mutations to Hox genes and modifier genes.
2. In humans, the current trend is for body parts to evolve out rather than in since we are physically adapted for an environment that is more strenuous than our current one. For example, the palmaris longus tendon is currently vanishing in the human population. It is no longer advantageous to have it, since we do not routinely get from place to place via overhand swinging on tree branches. Our ancestors also lost their tails several million years ago.
3. add more responses

...is not a lengthy article. The relevant response, the second, is four sentences long. If you took the time to read the first response as well that would still be only five sentences. If you want to count the third point as a response, feel free, but it'll only get you up to six.

[teen_1986]

chrisoya

Texas Gypsy

Listen closely now. I WAS GOING BACK TO BED! I took one look at the lengthy article and backed out so I could check it later. Don't you EVER call me a liar. I WILL check out the claim that the tendon is disappearing, but I'm not going to take it as a fact from one article. I find your whole attitude rude and not conducive to further discussion.

This:

Quote:

Claim

The evolution of new body parts has never been observed.

Source

* Kepler, Christian, n.d. Another False Link Discovered in the Theory of Evolution.

Responses

1. Fruit flies can grow new body segments or limbs by mutations to Hox genes and modifier genes.
2. In humans, the current trend is for body parts to evolve out rather than in since we are physically adapted for an environment that is more strenuous than our current one. For example, the palmaris longus tendon is currently vanishing in the human population. It is no longer advantageous to have it, since we do not routinely get from place to place via overhand swinging on tree branches. Our ancestors also lost their tails several million years ago.
3. add more responses

...is not a lengthy article. The relevant response, the second, is four sentences long. If you took the time to read the first response as well that would still be only five sentences. If you want to count the third point as a response, feel free, but it'll only get you up to six.

To be fair, if she does suffer from a mental disability (as I suspect might be the case) then that may be considered a lengthy article. But if not... then ya.. wahmbulance idiot alert wahmbulance

[Red Calypso]

chrisoya

Texas Gypsy

chrisoya

Texas Gypsy

Tails??? I'm sorry, but to the best of my knowledge humans have never HAD tails. Please show me a link to any proof that we did. And I'm not talking about the temporary fetal stage or the rare individual who doesn't completely absorb it before birth.

Yes, that's right. Reject the evidence in advance, and then claim that none exists!

Humans don't have tails. Our ancestors did.

*rolls eyes* Read my post again, please. I was asking for PROOF that we did, not rejecting it out of hand. PROVE it to me, don't just say we did. If there's anything in the fossil record to bear out the existence of tails in humans, I'll look at it.

rolleyes Yes, that's right, keep on with that ignorant strawman. You're quite right that humans do not have tails except in rare cases, but it's a strawman argument.

Oh for God's sake! Show me the proof or shut up! There must be something in the fossil record to prove your claim.

[maybecca]

Texas Gypsy

Oh for God's sake! Show me the proof or shut up! There must be something in the fossil record to prove your claim.

There must be fossils to prove my claim that humans had tails? I'm off home now, but I very much doubt that proof of this claim will appear while I'm walking, since I did not make it, and it is not a claim made by the theory of evolution.

[Red Calypso]

teen_1986

chrisoya

Texas Gypsy

Listen closely now. I WAS GOING BACK TO BED! I took one look at the lengthy article and backed out so I could check it later. Don't you EVER call me a liar. I WILL check out the claim that the tendon is disappearing, but I'm not going to take it as a fact from one article. I find your whole attitude rude and not conducive to further discussion.

This:

Quote:

Claim

The evolution of new body parts has never been observed.

Source

* Kepler, Christian, n.d. Another False Link Discovered in the Theory of Evolution.

Responses

1. Fruit flies can grow new body segments or limbs by mutations to Hox genes and modifier genes.
2. In humans, the current trend is for body parts to evolve out rather than in since we are physically adapted for an environment that is more strenuous than our current one. For example, the palmaris longus tendon is currently vanishing in the human population. It is no longer advantageous to have it, since we do not routinely get from place to place via overhand swinging on tree branches. Our ancestors also lost their tails several million years ago.
3. add more responses

...is not a lengthy article. The relevant response, the second, is four sentences long. If you took the time to read the first response as well that would still be only five sentences. If you want to count the third point as a response, feel free, but it'll only get you up to six.

To be fair, if she does suffer from a mental disability (as I suspect might be the case) then that may be considered a lengthy article. But if not... then ya.. wahmbulance idiot alert wahmbulance

You know what? I came here for a discussion. You people seem more intent on insults and slurs, so ******** it.

[Maze1125]

Texas Gypsy

teen_1986

chrisoya

Texas Gypsy

Listen closely now. I WAS GOING BACK TO BED! I took one look at the lengthy article and backed out so I could check it later. Don't you EVER call me a liar. I WILL check out the claim that the tendon is disappearing, but I'm not going to take it as a fact from one article. I find your whole attitude rude and not conducive to further discussion.

This:

Quote:

Claim

The evolution of new body parts has never been observed.

Source

* Kepler, Christian, n.d. Another False Link Discovered in the Theory of Evolution.

Responses

1. Fruit flies can grow new body segments or limbs by mutations to Hox genes and modifier genes.
2. In humans, the current trend is for body parts to evolve out rather than in since we are physically adapted for an environment that is more strenuous than our current one. For example, the palmaris longus tendon is currently vanishing in the human population. It is no longer advantageous to have it, since we do not routinely get from place to place via overhand swinging on tree branches. Our ancestors also lost their tails several million years ago.
3. add more responses

...is not a lengthy article. The relevant response, the second, is four sentences long. If you took the time to read the first response as well that would still be only five sentences. If you want to count the third point as a response, feel free, but it'll only get you up to six.

To be fair, if she does suffer from a mental disability (as I suspect might be the case) then that may be considered a lengthy article. But if not... then ya.. wahmbulance idiot alert wahmbulance

You know what? I came here for a discussion. You people seem more intent on insults and slurs, so ******** it.

Well considering you completely ignored my post that showed your entire argument to be a red herring it would seem like you weren't here for a debate either.

[teen_1986]

Texas Gypsy

teen_1986

chrisoya

Texas Gypsy

Listen closely now. I WAS GOING BACK TO BED! I took one look at the lengthy article and backed out so I could check it later. Don't you EVER call me a liar. I WILL check out the claim that the tendon is disappearing, but I'm not going to take it as a fact from one article. I find your whole attitude rude and not conducive to further discussion.

This:

Quote:

Claim

The evolution of new body parts has never been observed.

Source

* Kepler, Christian, n.d. Another False Link Discovered in the Theory of Evolution.

Responses

1. Fruit flies can grow new body segments or limbs by mutations to Hox genes and modifier genes.
2. In humans, the current trend is for body parts to evolve out rather than in since we are physically adapted for an environment that is more strenuous than our current one. For example, the palmaris longus tendon is currently vanishing in the human population. It is no longer advantageous to have it, since we do not routinely get from place to place via overhand swinging on tree branches. Our ancestors also lost their tails several million years ago.
3. add more responses

...is not a lengthy article. The relevant response, the second, is four sentences long. If you took the time to read the first response as well that would still be only five sentences. If you want to count the third point as a response, feel free, but it'll only get you up to six.

To be fair, if she does suffer from a mental disability (as I suspect might be the case) then that may be considered a lengthy article. But if not... then ya.. wahmbulance idiot alert wahmbulance

You know what? I came here for a discussion. You people seem more intent on insults and slurs, so ******** it.

Yet you are unwilling to discuss? You just lie lie and lie...

[southerndrawl118]

well, this whole tail thing is kinda dumb, considering that humans, as cordates, has vestigial post a**l tails. Speaking of vestigial body parts and how it proves evolution here ya go Texas Gypsy:
No organism can have a vestigial structure that was not previously functional in one of its ancestors. Thus, for each species, the standard phylogenetic tree makes a huge number of predictions about vestigial characters that are allowed and those that are impossible for any given species.

Shared derived characters and molecular sequence data, not vestigial characters, determine the phylogeny and the characteristics of predicted common ancestors. Thus, if common descent is false, vestigial characters very possibly could lack an evolutionary explanation. For example, whales are classified as mammals according to many criteria, such as having mammary glands, a placenta, one bone in the lower jaw, etc. Snakes likewise are classified as reptiles by several other derived features. However, it is theoretically possible that snakes or whales could have been classified as fish (as Linnaeus originally did). If this were the case, the vestigial legs of whales or the vestigial pelvises of snakes would make no sense evolutionarily and would be inconsistent with common descent.

It follows, then, that we should never find vestigial nipples or a vestigial incus bone in any amphibians, birds, or reptiles. No mammals should be found with vestigial feathers. No primates should ever be found with vestigial horns or degenerate wings hidden underneath the skin of the back. We should never find any arthropods with vestigial backbones. Snakes may occasionally have vestigial legs or arms, but they should never be found with small, vestigial wings. Humans may have a vestigial caecum, since we are descendants of herbivorous mammals, but neither we nor any other primate can have a vestigial gizzard like that found in birds. Mutatis mutandis ad infinitum.
http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/comdesc/section2.html

[Jossiqua]

FromFirstToLast_Rock

Vryko Lakas

FromFirstToLast_Rock

Now I believe that god created us all, and the bible is fact.
...
Try to back up your idea... mrgreen

You first.

Well okay.
I believe that god created us all as:
a) Where could we of come from if we didn't evolve
b) How can you explain there not being 'Intermediate Forms' Meaning the inbetween stages that must of existed if Evoloution is true.

Answer to a)

All evidence points to the fact that we did evolve so thats where we came from.

Answer to b)

"Evolution of modern human beings from extinct nonhuman and humanlike forms. Genetic evidence points to an evolutionary divergence between the lineages of humans and the great apes on the African continent 8–5 million years ago (mya). The earliest fossils considered to be remains of hominins (members of the human lineage) date to at least 4 mya in Africa; they are classified as genus Australopithecus. The next major evolutionary stage, Homo habilis, inhabited sub-Saharan Africa about 2–1.5 mya. Homo habilis appears to have been supplanted by a taller and more humanlike species, Homo erectus, which lived from c. 1,700,000 to 200,000 years ago, gradually migrating into Asia and parts of Europe. Between c. 600,000 and 200,000 years ago, Homo heidelbergensis, sometimes called archaic Homo sapiens, lived in Africa, Europe, and perhaps parts of Asia. Having features resembling those of both H. erectus and modern humans, H. heidelbergensis may have been an ancestor of modern humans and also of the Neanderthals (H. neanderthalensis), who inhabited Europe and western Asia from c. 200,000 to 28,000 years ago. Fully modern humans (H. sapiens) seem to have emerged in Africa only c. 150,000 years ago, perhaps having descended directly from H. erectus or from an intermediate species such as H. heidelbergensis." - Taken from the Britannica Concise Encyclopedia

Hope that answers your question!

[Chrono_Tata]

Texas Gypsy

Chrono_Tata

Texas Gypsy

I'll try to read through your link later today. Is there any part of our body that has totally disappeared?

The tail, millions of years ago.

The link is basically a list of usual arguments against evolution with rebuttals, so you don't have to read the whole thing.

Tails??? I'm sorry, but to the best of my knowledge humans have never HAD tails. Please show me a link to any proof that we did. And I'm not talking about the temporary fetal stage or the rare individual who doesn't completely absorb it before birth.

Sorry. When you said "our" I assumed you included our ancestors as well. I think our ancestors did have tails, correct me if I'm wrong.