Evolution: Fact Or Fiction

Whats your religion?

Atheist	39.3%	[ 1138 ]
Protestant	16.9%	[ 489 ]
Catholic	14.1%	[ 407 ]
Hindu	1.3%	[ 37 ]
Muslim	1.8%	[ 53 ]
Jew	2.3%	[ 67 ]
Buddhist	5.1%	[ 149 ]
Greek Orthodox	0.7%	[ 21 ]
Pagan	14.2%	[ 412 ]
Egyptian	4.2%	[ 122 ]
Total Votes:			[ 2895 ]

[x.inComplete.]

If bible is FACT then explain to me WHY there are so many Gospels? if there are sooooo many versions of the bible, a lot of the versions being very different from the ones currently being used then how can you say that it's FACT. Now i believe in God but i'm not Christian.

[elvisnake]

It all boils down to this, in my opinion. If you disagree, tough Noogiees. Religion's only purpose is one of the following.
1. A pre-medievil system of getting people to behave
2. A way for people like Joseph Smith or L. Ron Hubbard to get Money/Power/Fame
Meanwhile, the world's intelligent population, (Those with open minds.) Have realized the uselessness of faith that is blind to the point of disagreeing with proven facts, know of the truth of such things like evolution and the age of the Earth.

[A Soporific]

x.inComplete.

If bible is FACT then explain to me WHY there are so many Gospels? if there are sooooo many versions of the bible, a lot of the versions being very different from the ones currently being used then how can you say that it's FACT. Now i believe in God but i'm not Christian.

Why is there so much InuYasha Fan Fiction? Because it's a good story that people are emotionally involved in. Just because something has the word "Gospel" in the title doesn't mean that it's legitimate. Much of the books that are now being rediscovered are simply that, Biblical Fanfiction written so long ago that people don't remember that it's fanfiction.

Actually, there are few differences between the various versions. Most of them are simply different translations. The single largest difference is between that of the Catholic and Protestant build of the Bible. Catholics have seven more books in the OT, because Protestant reformers and printers took them out.

[A Soporific]

elvisnake

It all boils down to this, in my opinion. If you disagree, tough Noogiees. Religion's only purpose is one of the following.
1. A pre-medievil system of getting people to behave
2. A way for people like Joseph Smith or L. Ron Hubbard to get Money/Power/Fame
Meanwhile, the world's intelligent population, (Those with open minds.) Have realized the uselessness of faith that is blind to the point of disagreeing with proven facts, know of the truth of such things like evolution and the age of the Earth.

I fundimetnally disagree.

Intellegence is not related to theism or atheism. Open mindedness is not necessarily a trait of atheist, nor is close mindedness is a trait of those who follow religion. The disagreement with the age of the Earth and Evolution is only a problem of a segement of the Christian population, I am a devout Catholic and see absolutely no conflict with my faith and Evolution and an old Earth. Popes agree with me as well, so it isn't just me.

I find your understanding of religion and their roles sorely lacking.

[Henry Dorsett Case]

A Soporific

Actually, there are few differences between the various versions. Most of them are simply different translations. The single largest difference is between that of the Catholic and Protestant build of the Bible. Catholics have seven more books in the OT, because Protestant reformers and printers took them out.

Very slight nitpick:
Took them back out. The deuterocanonical books of the Old Testament are considered as such in part because they are not considered canonical by the terms of the Hebrew Tanakh/Torah. As far as my limited research indicates, the first known place the deuterocanonical OT texts appears inline with the remainder of the OT is in the Greek Septuagint, the basis for the Catholic and Orthodox bibles.

A little closer to the topic - what's interesting is that many Christians can understand parable when it's laid out for them beforehand in so many words that a particular story is parable, but if the words "a parable" don't appear then they argue that the particular story is either literal historical fact or Divinely Inspired revelation, rather than perhaps a written collection of tales originally preserved by oral tradition.

[A Soporific]

Henry Dorsett Case

A Soporific

Actually, there are few differences between the various versions. Most of them are simply different translations. The single largest difference is between that of the Catholic and Protestant build of the Bible. Catholics have seven more books in the OT, because Protestant reformers and printers took them out.

Very slight nitpick:
Took them back out. The deuterocanonical books of the Old Testament are considered as such in part because they are not considered canonical by the terms of the Hebrew Tanakh/Torah. As far as my limited research indicates, the first known place the deuterocanonical OT texts appears inline with the remainder of the OT is in the Greek Septuagint, the basis for the Catholic and Orthodox bibles.

That's largely because the Hebrew Tanakh was standardized before they were written.

Quote:

A little closer to the topic - what's interesting is that many Christians can understand parable when it's laid out for them beforehand in so many words that a particular story is parable, but if the words "a parable" don't appear then they argue that the particular story is either literal historical fact or Divinely Inspired revelation, rather than perhaps a written collection of tales originally preserved by oral tradition.

Then again, that's not an issue with all segements of the Christian population, but actually rather limited in scope to fundies.

[Flackle]

The determining factor is waiting, you cannot exsepect just one generation to see a big change in evolution to happen in a matter of 100 years. We must look into the past, far beyond to find our answers. Christianity was there to help answer questions so people could stop asking them. For reason unknown, though effective. It made others so unopend minded. The fact of the matter rest unsure to most, but to others a fact, to truely know the power that nature has over time, is to know what you are looking at, and know what you are saying.

[Pie_Junkie]

The bible is fiction. It's just a glorified story. You say that we have no proof that it was for sure evolution but what proof do you have that god is real? The bible was written by man-kind so don't even try to tell me that's proof, for all you know it could just be the ravings of a lunatic. At least we have evidence that backs our theory, what do you have to back your theory?

[XxbAd_luCkxX]

I've seen more evidence supporting evolution.
Plus, I'm not usually one to go by what the books say.

[XxbAd_luCkxX]

Pie_Junkie

The bible is fiction. It's just a glorified story. You say that we have no proof that it was for sure evolution but what proof do you have that god is real? The bible was written by man-kind so don't even try to tell me that's proof, for all you know it could just be the ravings of a lunatic. At least we have evidence that backs our theory, what do you have to back your theory?

To an extent I feel the same way.
It's just a bunch of bed time stories to me.
=___=

Although, I'm sure there's some fact/truth behind each 'tall tale'.

But that's what religion is isn't it?
Stories, based off of actual events told over and over again.
Kinda like the telephone game.
xD

Every time you tell the phrase it gets longer and longer, as more things are added on to make it more exciting.

It's also the belief.
Some people feel more secure knowing there's a higher being they can look up too.

[Ihavenoarmz]

A Soporific

MyxineDamion

Sinner

thelovelyLIZ

I believe in intelligent design. I don't nessicarily believe we eveolved from Apes, but I believe there may have been physical changes in human genes.

Basically, I believe God created evolution.

If God "created" evolution, then why don't you believe that we evolved from apes? After all, it's a pretty natural course for God to take, given the similarities.

Also, how the ******** does one create evolution? It's not created, it's not physical. It happens.

It's a natural process. I hold that all natural processes are created by God, but that's beside the point.

Nothing "just happens," and things can be crated and non-physical. Language isn't physical, neither is Culture, Society, Politics, and Economics. Those examples are all man-made, we create and recreate them.

No, that's not what I meant. God can create DNA, or the cell, or sexual reproduction, and he can surely modify the criteria of natural selection (ie, make the world hotter, for example). But he can't CREATE evolution. Evolution is plainly what happens when a population of fertile, living beings exists. To put it simply: Cells are formed from their DNA. If they are adapted to their environment, they survive. If not, they die. If they don't die, they pass the DNA down.
There's no need for God to create anything more than death, cells, DNA, and reproduction for evolution to exist. It's not created.
See? It's more of a side effect or something.

[Ihavenoarmz]

A Soporific

elvisnake

MyxineDamion

elvisnake

The reason people aren't evolving. (A question I get a lot.) is that there is no need. There is no circumstance that says that only the fittest people can breed, thus no human evolution. There, thought I'd just put that out there.

Actually, we're still perfectly evolving. Just not in the way we used to.

Explain, please. In what way are circumstances making it so that only people with certain traits survive to breed. If that isn't so, then we aren't evolving.

Any genetic drift is evolution. There is constant change, it might not be significant and it might not be directed but change is still change. There is no such thing as "Devolving" either, that's simply evolution in a different direction.

It's not just genetic drift of course. Our medecine is not omnipotent, so everyone who dies because it wasn't good enough, well, are submitted to NATURAL selection. There are diseases we can't cure, there are bad doctors, there are people who are allergic to some medicine, and of course there are people who don't have access to any of it.
Most of Africa is a good exemple of natural selection, especially with the AIDS-immune people that pop up now, as are some parts of Asia and South America, and Australia, and even some parts of Europe and North America.
We're very far from not being subjected to Natural Selection.

And of course, there's the natural selection we created for the comfy upper class: the more charismatic/smart you are, the most well paid you are. Some of it at least is genetic, so it works. Funnily enough, on a huge scale, people who live well tend to have fewer kids, so we could say that smart/charismatic people are actually disappearing from the gene pool, eh.
But let's stop the example here.

[Uncle Duke]

MyxineDamion

Our medecine is not omnipotent, so everyone who dies because it wasn't good enough, well, are submitted to NATURAL selection. There are diseases we can't cure, there are bad doctors, there are people who are allergic to some medicine, and of course there are people who don't have access to any of it.

But it's only natural selection if the sickness harmed their ability to raise children. If you have a mild to moderate set of the CAG repeat in the huntingtin gene, you can still pass it on to your children, and if you do they may pass it on to theirs - it's a mutation that causes a fatal neurological disease, but its onset is usually past the point that people have had children. Most people who develop it are in their 50s, and by then most people's kids are adults.

Just to nitpick.

Oh: the trend of people better adapted to our modern world having fewer children is an example of natural selection leading down a dead end. Read "Total Eclipse", by John Brunner for another (hypothetical) example of this.

[Zangyaku]

Well I belive that humans evoling from apes and that Adam and Eve is true. In the Bible it says that God made Earth in 7 days. And that 1day could be like billions of years. So I belive that Adam and Eve where the first fully developed humans.

[puresilver]

Zangyaku

Well I belive that humans evoling from apes and that Adam and Eve is true. In the Bible it says that God made Earth in 7 days. And that 1day could be like billions of years. So I belive that Adam and Eve where the first fully developed humans.

Right... so about what date would Adam & Eve have existed?

And how do you explain the whole made from dust and from a rib? Allegory? Because it seems pretty literal minded to me...