The truth. AMDXP/Intel pentium Benchmarks.

[gloin]

NinaV

As for the soon-to-be United States of America vs. Great Britain, we were eminently qualified to fight that war because, unlike the British, we figured out that guerilla tactics worked a whole lot better than marching in line down the field at your enemy. We won by refusing to be gentlemen.
-V

Looks like you described our war perfectly. Same type of war, same side on top. Thanks for making my evening better! Off to work!

h-baX

[U-235]

NinaV

Though some people claim that there's evidence that Bush knew that the intelligence was wrong, the British say they discounted the report he quoted before he got it, and stuff like that.

Me, I'll wait for the paperback before passing judgement (though I'll happily say I don't like him as a person or many of his political views), but the truth of the matter is, all leaders do things in an effort to sway public opinion they way they want. The question is just how much.

Stastics lie - they are always quoted to support something or other, and they're pretty much always biased, whether intentionally or un. Benchmarks are just another form of statistics.

I completely agree.

As a side note, I despise Bush. But I despise Kerry even more. The purpose of limited terms in office has proven to be to end the cycle of corruption.

NinaV

Gloin

We weren't "qualified" to fight a war, but we kicked Great Britain's a** in the Revolutionary War. PC vs Mac thread, if you don't know that, you aren't "qualified" to comment on the situation at hand. Negative, Apple spewed BS, and I shoved it up your asses.

Stop pretending to be intelligent and shut the ******** up.

Actually, there were two completely different wars going on that never met in the middle. You were fighting the war of numbers being the only indicator while the "other side" was fighting a war of personal preference. You could neither win nor lose, and the same for 'them' because it was two completely different wars.

As for the soon-to-be United States of America vs. Great Britain, we were eminently qualified to fight that war because, unlike the British, we figured out that guerilla tactics worked a whole lot better than marching in line down the field at your enemy. We won by refusing to be gentlemen.

-V

@ Gloin: Qualified? I feel that comparing a war of arms to a war of wit to be two completely different battlefields. To qualify in a war of wit, you must have some credential, otherwise, your words will go unnoticed, and likewise, your words must carry credibility for the same reasons. That's juat my opinion, however.

@NinaV: Heh. Nice guys never win girls, Gentleman never win wars. wink

Although I do find it odd that during several battles in the American Civil War, troops on both sides marched squares instead of using conventional (for the time) tactics.

[NinaV]

Gloin

NinaV

As for the soon-to-be United States of America vs. Great Britain, we were eminently qualified to fight that war because, unlike the British, we figured out that guerilla tactics worked a whole lot better than marching in line down the field at your enemy. We won by refusing to be gentlemen.
-V

Looks like you described our war perfectly. Same type of war, same side on top. Thanks for making my evening better! Off to work!

h-baX

You still purposefully miss my point. You fought a war of personal preference with raw numbers. They fought a war of numbers with personal preference. Neither works. There could be no winner. You might as well ask if North or South Korea won World War II.

You only won in your own mind because you only saw a war of numbers. There was no winner. Heck, there was no war. There were only people charging across two completely different battlefields and declaring victory.

-V

[NinaV]

U-235

I completely agree.

As a side note, I despise Bush. But I despise Kerry even more. The purpose of limited terms in office has proven to be to end the cycle of corruption.

@NinaV: Heh. Nice guys never win girls, Gentleman never win wars. wink

Although I do find it odd that during several battles in the American Civil War, troops on both sides marched squares instead of using conventional (for the time) tactics.

I despise Bush. I don't know enough about Kerry to despise him, but I don't like Kerry either. But I'll vote for Kerry. If he gets elected, fine. I won't like him either. But even if Bush stays in office, I want my vote to be a wake-up call to him that there are people out here who don't like him.

As for the American Civil War... I can only guess that military minds got complacent and fell into 'comfortable ways of thinking'.

I agree with you, though. Doesn't matter which is faster. They're all bloody fast enough for 97% of the population. So just use the one you like and stop arguing about it. However tech-heads must scream numbers back and forth just like gear-heads have to quote horsepower. Everyone's just trying to prove that "their side is right" when most people, even most people in the idustry, don't care because they all get the work done.

-V

[Twistex]

Don't you just love it when a debate on processors started by a pointless post turns into a politics discussion. Oh yeah. I love that. stare

[Naed]

Gloin

We weren't "qualified" to fight a war, but we kicked Great Britain's a** in the Revolutionary War. PC vs Mac thread, if you don't know that, you aren't "qualified" to comment on the situation at hand. Negative, Apple spewed BS, and I shoved it up your asses.

Stop pretending to be intelligent and shut the ******** up.

hollab@x!~

Did you just compare your attempt of a **** waving contest to an actual, real war?

I don't need to pretend that I'm intelligent - you on the other hand, can't even do that much. And what's entirely amusing is that you don't even see this - you keep posting yoru rethoric trollboi, see how far it gets you. No more snacks from me though. wink

[NinaV]

Twistex

Don't you just love it when a debate on processors started by a pointless post turns into a politics discussion. Oh yeah. I love that. stare

One pointless discussion replaces another. At least an interesting, compelling, intelligent conversation didn't get ruined by politics? xd

-V

[gloin]

I don't mean to get off topic. But by your professions, you sound to be adults. I, however, am 17 years old and still in high school. You are supposed to have a career and a life rather than posting on an anime forum and arguing with teenagers. Sorry, I don't normally turn it into a personal issue, but you left yourself wide open.

h-baX

[NinaV]

Gloin

I don't mean to get off topic. But by your professions, you sound to be adults. I, however, am 17 years old and still in high school. You are supposed to have a career and a life rather than posting on an anime forum and arguing with teenagers. Sorry, I don't normally turn it into a personal issue, but you left yourself wide open.

h-baX

You're the one who calls people idiots or says things like "mac users stupid f**ks." You turn it into a personal attack frequently.

You're right. I'm an adult. You know what, I like coming here and chatting with some people. Ramiel, Xeon, Catsoup, Kiretsu, Excel, just to name a few... There are people I like, here. Then you go around bashing something and insulting people just because you don't like something they choose to use JUST because you personally dislike it.

It upsets me because all you're doing is acting like a hateful, spiteful child craving attention. At age 17 you should have moved on to bigger and better things, like thinking about your future, college, and how to 'play well with others', even if they have different viewpoints. Because that WILL come in useful when you have to work with people who like things you don't like just to earn a paycheck to keep a roof over your head.

The only thing I haven't figured out is why I keep trying to broaden your mind to realizing that your viewpoint is not the only one, nor is it always the right one. That's a life lesson, and I'll be darned if I can figure out why I keep trying to help you learn it.

-V

[Foolish]

i like kitties <3

[gloin]

I didn't call them stupid f*cks. And it's not because I dislike Apple, it's because Apple just isn't as good. I never tried to switch people to PC, I only wanted them to admit and realize what they had done when they bought an Apple manufactured computer. I believe my partner in crime, Red Comet, and I settled down to the conclusion, based on all the arguing, that Mac users PREFER to pay more for a computer that does less.

You don't know me in real life, so your judgement doesn't mean s**t.

I don't understand why you waste your time either. I thought that when I was to become an adult I'd have a lot better things to be doing. Maybe I was wrong confused

[NinaV]

I'll say it again, Gloin. They paid what they found to be a fair amount for a piece of hardware that did what they want, how they wanted it done. That is the only test of the situation that matters to them. You tried to impose your values upon them and THAT's what got them so riled up. We're all free to think what we want - we're not free to expect other people to think the same way.

As for having better things to do... Didn't you notice that I was more or less gone for like two months? Being off at events with friends, helping to educate people about history, photographing things, helping to put on a show enjoyed by tens of thousands of people. Now I'm back at home on the weekends, taking a break, coming here to try to help answer a few questions and talk with friends when I'm not following my other hobbies.

-V

[gloin]

You mean they were dooped in to paying more for less.

Nope, because I've been gone for quite a bit longer. I had a rendezvous with the sunlight. There a lot of people here that definately need to meet that guy.

I still don't knwo why you're getting involved. I don't think I ever targetted you until you started writing essays about how wrong I was and why preference outweighed everything (including common sense).

h-baX

[NinaV]

Gloin

You mean they were dooped in to paying more for less.

No, I mean they paid what they thought was a fair price for hardware and an OS they wanted. If I had the money to afford a Mac right now, I'd buy one. Because I like them. Even knowing performace difference in hardware. I haven't been duped. I know full well the 'benchmarks'. I just like how macs work. And I'd keep my PC too, because I like the games I play on it.

Gloin

Nope, because I've been gone for quite a bit longer. I had a rendezvous with the sunlight. There a lot of people here that definately need to meet that guy.

I still don't knwo why you're getting involved. I don't think I ever targetted you until you started writing essays about how wrong I was and why preference outweighed everything (including common sense).

h-baX

I got involved because it always annoys me when people go around spouting off that they hate X hardware and everyone who doesn't think the same way is an idiot. Which was your effective argument. So I tried to show you that not all people feel the same way and then you 'targeted me'.

I've said it time and time again in this thread and others... For most people, ANY computer on the market is fast enough. As long as it runs the software you want to run fast enough for you to be happy, then it's the right machine for you. That... is the only consideration that matters.

Remember, one of the oldest quotes is, "Common sense isn't." If people like something, they'll buy it, even if you don't think it's as good. Because for some reason or other, they think it's better. And if they're happy with their purchase, then for them, it IS better. Preference DOES outweigh raw numbers for some people, and there's nothing more or less right about either side. If you can just see that, then there's no more 'war' and everyone goes off happy.

And we can get back to THIS particular pointless 'war' about Intel vs. AMD. sweatdrop

-V

[U-235]

This will be my last post in this thread, but I just had a few things to say.

After using the what is for all intents and purposes the highest end equipment on the market, I find everything to be "slow" and "inferior" that isn't mine.

However, being a network administrator at a sci-fi convention (as we speak) and using a lot of the other prebuilts/home builts, I still find them slow, even though they do use AMDXP2800+ or higher, and of similar Intel variants.

All that aside, I was at a Fry's Electronics today and walked down their Apple aisle, where I used a G5 for the third time ever, and a G4 Powerbook, all running OSX... And for the first time EVER, I was impressed with a factory assembled computer. More over, even on my standards of home builts, I was still fairly impressed. For one third the cost of my home built, I could've had a lappy with a 15 inch screen, unmatched customer support, a 1GHz G4, that performed and looked flawless, streamlined, and overall... Sexy. That's right. I used a Mac, and I liked it. The only problem I have with getting a Mac is that I'm not too familiar with them, and I don't want to re-invest in buying more application software. However, I will definately get a Powerbook in the future for works sake.

As a side note, I would like to say that Macs, with the proper set up, do play games just fine. I've benched, but more importantly, I've played games on them. Starcraft, Quake III, and Unreal 2004, all ran PERFECTLY with a Radeon 9800Pro and a 1.8GHz G5 with settings set to one or two notches above normal ( I would put it higher, but I happen to be a statistic that notices frame tearing and redraws on anything less than 40FPS, so I tend to use lower settings for my sanity). The overall cost of the G5 system I used (here at the convention, incidentally. And it weasled into the network perfectly, too) was about 1,700 USD, which excludes tax and the cost of the DiNovo Duo that the guy bought.

On a really funny side note, I just want to say that when you are on a G5 and owning up in UT2k4... People really start to get annoyed more than usual... But at least they don't blame your skill on hardware differences... Like they do when I used my FX53... xd


Am I defending Macs? Yeah. I am. Why? Because other than the interface... I can't tell the difference between a high end Mac and a high end PC, configured to my liking.

However, one thing I will say is that the Macs used in schools (even the ones used in my former school's graphics and design class) all SUCK. Badly.