nouveau sereph
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- Posted: Fri, 06 Apr 2012 05:23:17 +0000
nouveau sereph
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If you count Linden Dollars as digital currency, lets count neo points and gaia gold too. It's only fair. In fact almost every game company in the world has their own currency.
nouveau sereph
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- Posted: Fri, 06 Apr 2012 05:24:43 +0000
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nouveau sereph
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If you count Linden Dollars as digital currency, lets count neo points and gaia gold too. It's only fair. In fact almost every game company in the world has their own currency.
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- Posted: Fri, 06 Apr 2012 05:28:20 +0000
nouveau sereph
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nouveau sereph
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If you count Linden Dollars as digital currency, lets count neo points and gaia gold too. It's only fair. In fact almost every game company in the world has their own currency.
nouveau sereph
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- Posted: Fri, 06 Apr 2012 05:34:38 +0000
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nouveau sereph
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nouveau sereph
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If you count Linden Dollars as digital currency, lets count neo points and gaia gold too. It's only fair. In fact almost every game company in the world has their own currency.
This isn't very difficult.
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- Posted: Fri, 06 Apr 2012 05:39:08 +0000
nouveau sereph
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nouveau sereph
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nouveau sereph
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If you count Linden Dollars as digital currency, lets count neo points and gaia gold too. It's only fair. In fact almost every game company in the world has their own currency.
This isn't very difficult.
digitalchopsticks
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- Posted: Fri, 06 Apr 2012 06:40:54 +0000
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nouveau sereph
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nouveau sereph
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I see neopets and gaia gold cards at every convenience store I pass.
This isn't very difficult.
wat. Her "argument" is simply pointing out that Lindens and Bitcoins are an actual currency, which has an exchange rate in to and out of physical currency (USD, for example). Gaia gold and neopoints aren't legally exchangeable for physical currency. Bitcoins aren't designed to be "game money", they're meant to be a real, digital, decentralised currency, which, like any other world currency (i.e. HKD <-> USD), can be exchanged at a fluctuating rate into or from another form of currency.
Sitwon
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- Posted: Fri, 06 Apr 2012 06:42:34 +0000
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What you are saying contradicts yourself. To prevent inflation of the currency, instead of dumping 21 million BTCs they dump a few million a year . . .
Second. This influx of new currency has to eventually come to a halt or the value of the currency would continuously decline. A currency with no concept of scarcity is worthless, much like Gaia Gold.
Which brings us to...
29582351c3
If you count Linden Dollars as digital currency, lets count neo points and gaia gold too. It's only fair. In fact almost every game company in the world has their own currency.
LD and PED, on the other hand are operated as if they were real currencies. Indeed, they are even backed by real-world currencies which fix their exchange rate. The only way to create new LD or PED is by exchanging a real currency for them. Similarly, you are able to exchange them back into a real currency, thus removing them from the in-game economy. (In the case of PED you can actually get a Visa Debit card to spend your PED in the real world.) There is actual scarcity with these currencies.
The concept of scarcity and the fact that they are backed by real-world currencies, and thus regulated, makes them fundamentally different from game currencies such as monopoly dollars, gaia gold, neopoints, or WoW gold.
And frankly, of those four game currencies, only WoW gold has achieved anywhere near sufficient volume to act as a proxy currency for laundering any significant amount of money.
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- Posted: Fri, 06 Apr 2012 07:23:07 +0000
digitalchopsticks
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nouveau sereph
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nouveau sereph
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I see neopets and gaia gold cards at every convenience store I pass.
This isn't very difficult.
wat. Her "argument" is simply pointing out that Lindens and Bitcoins are an actual currency, which has an exchange rate in to and out of physical currency (USD, for example). Gaia gold and neopoints aren't legally exchangeable for physical currency. Bitcoins aren't designed to be "game money", they're meant to be a real, digital, decentralised currency, which, like any other world currency (i.e. HKD <-> USD), can be exchanged at a fluctuating rate into or from another form of currency.
29582351c3
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- Posted: Fri, 06 Apr 2012 07:28:16 +0000
Sitwon
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What you are saying contradicts yourself. To prevent inflation of the currency, instead of dumping 21 million BTCs they dump a few million a year . . .
Second. This influx of new currency has to eventually come to a halt or the value of the currency would continuously decline. A currency with no concept of scarcity is worthless, much like Gaia Gold.
Which brings us to...
29582351c3
If you count Linden Dollars as digital currency, lets count neo points and gaia gold too. It's only fair. In fact almost every game company in the world has their own currency.
LD and PED, on the other hand are operated as if they were real currencies. Indeed, they are even backed by real-world currencies which fix their exchange rate. The only way to create new LD or PED is by exchanging a real currency for them. Similarly, you are able to exchange them back into a real currency, thus removing them from the in-game economy. (In the case of PED you can actually get a Visa Debit card to spend your PED in the real world.) There is actual scarcity with these currencies.
The concept of scarcity and the fact that they are backed by real-world currencies, and thus regulated, makes them fundamentally different from game currencies such as monopoly dollars, gaia gold, neopoints, or WoW gold.
And frankly, of those four game currencies, only WoW gold has achieved anywhere near sufficient volume to act as a proxy currency for laundering any significant amount of money.
I don't think scaricity has anything to do at all with a currency. Currency is just a generally accepted medium of exchange. The total volume of united state dollars, for example, can change, and does change, by trillions a year. The biggest difference is gaia gold is a generally accepted medium of exchange on gaia while dollars is everywhere else.
29582351c3
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- Posted: Fri, 06 Apr 2012 07:38:17 +0000
I also just realized, the hazard of having your fake currency yanked like linden dollars and gaia gold also applies to bitcoins. See Liberty Dollars or through an act of congress banning them Here is a good wiki spot http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bitcoin#Reception_and_concerns
"The Electronic Frontier Foundation did so for a while but has since stopped, citing concerns about a lack of legal precedent about new currency systems,"
"The Electronic Frontier Foundation did so for a while but has since stopped, citing concerns about a lack of legal precedent about new currency systems,"
Sitwon
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- Posted: Fri, 06 Apr 2012 16:58:09 +0000
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So what you are saying is to prevent early adopters from having a monopoly they will introduce the vast majority of the currency early in the life of bitcoins.
29582351c3
Let us nevermind the fact the goal is for the value of bitcoins to go up overtime.
29582351c3
I don't think scaricity has anything to do at all with a currency. Currency is just a generally accepted medium of exchange. The total volume of united state dollars, for example, can change, and does change, by trillions a year.
29582351c3
The biggest difference is gaia gold is a generally accepted medium of exchange on gaia while dollars is everywhere else.
If we were playing a game of Monopoly I could use USD to buy some of your Monopoly money from you (if I recall correctly, the rules of Monopoly don't forbid it). However, just because you exchanged those colored pieces of paper for USD does NOT mean that it is a real currency. Outside of the context of the game they are still just colored pieces of paper.
29582351c3
I also just realized, the hazard of having your fake currency yanked like linden dollars and gaia gold also applies to bitcoins. See Liberty Dollars or through an act of congress banning them Here is a good wiki spot http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bitcoin#Reception_and_concerns
With Bitcoin there's no controlling authority to "yank" your currency, but since you bring that up it's no different from the real world where the government can "yank" your USD. The IRS does it to millions of Americans every year.
29582351c3
"The Electronic Frontier Foundation did so for a while but has since stopped, citing concerns about a lack of legal precedent about new currency systems,"
29582351c3
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- Posted: Sat, 07 Apr 2012 06:45:51 +0000
Sitwon
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So what you are saying is to prevent early adopters from having a monopoly they will introduce the vast majority of the currency early in the life of bitcoins.
29582351c3
Let us nevermind the fact the goal is for the value of bitcoins to go up overtime.
29582351c3
I don't think scaricity has anything to do at all with a currency. Currency is just a generally accepted medium of exchange. The total volume of united state dollars, for example, can change, and does change, by trillions a year.
29582351c3
The biggest difference is gaia gold is a generally accepted medium of exchange on gaia while dollars is everywhere else.
If we were playing a game of Monopoly I could use USD to buy some of your Monopoly money from you (if I recall correctly, the rules of Monopoly don't forbid it). However, just because you exchanged those colored pieces of paper for USD does NOT mean that it is a real currency. Outside of the context of the game they are still just colored pieces of paper.
29582351c3
I also just realized, the hazard of having your fake currency yanked like linden dollars and gaia gold also applies to bitcoins. See Liberty Dollars or through an act of congress banning them Here is a good wiki spot http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bitcoin#Reception_and_concerns
With Bitcoin there's no controlling authority to "yank" your currency, but since you bring that up it's no different from the real world where the government can "yank" your USD. The IRS does it to millions of Americans every year.
29582351c3
"The Electronic Frontier Foundation did so for a while but has since stopped, citing concerns about a lack of legal precedent about new currency systems,"
Well, bitcoins will have a near static money supply in the end, while real government currencies intentionally devalue themselves constantly. So in dollar amounts bitcoins should go up in price. Especially so if bitcoins become an actual general use currency which will spike demand for them. Seriously, I don't know anyone who uses bitcoins right now. Not a single store I've been to or any of my friends or family. If everyone were to use it, even with the amount of coins still left to be distributed, you are looking at an increase from maybe a few ten thousand people at most using them to a few hundred million, that is a much larger increase in demand than an increase in supply from a few million to a few ten million.
If you are talking physical dollars to go around, yeah there is a physical limit on that, however the government at any time can ******** it, let's go mine a googolplex dollar bill" and there goes your argument. There is also HUGE amounts of currency which are on books but never actually printed. Here is an example. http://research.stlouisfed.org/fred2/graph/?id=BASE In the last 3 years the amount of currency in our system has changed by more than 3x, by trillions in single years. The way the US system works is different from many other countries like Greece, Spain or Portugal. It is also vastly different than how businesses run as well. It is why there is a whole other economics theory to describe it (Neo-chartalism or MMA) different from others people are used to and it is counter-intuitive despite being very good at describing the system and what to expect from it.
As for inherent value of money, our currency has no inherent value either. We went off the gold standard twice because of the problems with it. To this end, out money has no value outside the context of the united states or our current market systems. When you play Monopoly the generally accepted medium of exchange is monopoly money, and while I suppose you could use USD for a poker type effect I doubt most would. Further, if the money had inherent value, the government could not manipulate it as it does. Another good reason to stay clear of gold as that would give large multinational corporations or other countries with big wallets the ability to directly influence the currency. To wit: Fiat currency is called fiat currency and only has value because as the name suggests, the government has declared it so. That is, demand for said currency is stimulated because they make you pay your taxes in it, so you have to have it.
Liberty was shut down for minting their own money using gold and silver which is illegal. TO quote the wiki,"Von NotHaus was convicted of "making, possessing and selling his own coins" on March 18, 2011, in Statesville, North Carolina, after a jury deliberated for less than two hours.[28] ". This puts bitcoins under some scrutiny since, from my understanding, these statutes have not been tested for digital currencies.
29582351c3
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- Posted: Sat, 07 Apr 2012 06:58:45 +0000
Woops, missed a bit.The currencies in question are considered illegal but they are tolerated. It is also not the Fed that tolerates them but the Justice department. They simply do not consider them worth their time. There is also state and local currencies which are outright recognized as legal.
Simply enough, it is enough to make bitcoins illegal, or take people's wallet files, or whatever it is called. The wiki article also states problems with bitcoin fraud due to it's online nature. Mainly stealing wallet files.
Your note about the EFF might be true, but that wasn't the only reason they did it.
Sitwon
Liberty Services was shutdown for fraud and counterfeiting, not simply for being an alternative currency. There are plenty of other alternative currencies in the US which are tolerated by the Fed. Furthermore, by it's very design, the Bitcoin network is extremely resilient to fraud and counterfeiting. That's whole point behind mining, those machines are constantly validating transactions to ensure that counterfeiting and double-spending can't occur.
With Bitcoin there's no controlling authority to "yank" your currency, but since you bring that up it's no different from the real world where the government can "yank" your USD. The IRS does it to millions of Americans every year.
It's important to note that they did this under public pressure during the height of concerns about possible links between Bitcoins and criminal activity, much of which was fabricated for news articles.
With Bitcoin there's no controlling authority to "yank" your currency, but since you bring that up it's no different from the real world where the government can "yank" your USD. The IRS does it to millions of Americans every year.
29582351c3
"The Electronic Frontier Foundation did so for a while but has since stopped, citing concerns about a lack of legal precedent about new currency systems,"
Simply enough, it is enough to make bitcoins illegal, or take people's wallet files, or whatever it is called. The wiki article also states problems with bitcoin fraud due to it's online nature. Mainly stealing wallet files.
Your note about the EFF might be true, but that wasn't the only reason they did it.
Sitwon
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- Posted: Sat, 07 Apr 2012 07:17:00 +0000
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The currencies in question are considered illegal but they are tolerated. It is also not the Fed that tolerates them but the Justice department. They simply do not consider them worth their time. There is also state and local currencies which are outright recognized as legal.
29582351c3
The wiki article also states problems with bitcoin fraud due to it's online nature. Mainly stealing wallet files.