What do you think about people calling anime "cartoons"?

[Mugetsu Ookamiza]

GuardianCentauri

To be honest, I do still take some issue with people calling anime cartoons. Yes, it's technically accurate that they're cartoons, and yes, most anime is marketed towards teenagers. The issue is more that most people I meet who use the term "cartoons" seem to apply blanket stereotypes to anime and to the person on the receiving end without any or much knowledge of anime. Even though seinen and josei are in the minority, a lot of the people described above don't even know that they exist, unless they're making assumptions that all adult-oriented anime is pornographic/hentai, as someone previously mentioned.

Mugetsu Ookamiza

when I said that I was referring to the art style. I was saying even tho certain demographic/genre combinations often have a stereotypical style used for them it's not always the case. I was taking three examples and asking if you could say that they were all the same style, if they fit they fit the technical definition of all being the same style. if all these three were drawn in the same style

http://i.imgur.com/BPj03Qv.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/OAVHftW.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/aPpMG1m.jpg

a true style has a set of criteria that must be found in all examples of that style. what you're talking about is stylistic stereotypes, not actual styles. stylistic elements that are common in Japanese animation but not an actual true style. you can't even really argue there's a "stereotypical anime style" since even many of the anime titles that do use some of the stereotypical stylistic elements don't use them all.

I agree that not every single anime out there will follow a set standard, but I think it's fair to say that most have various similarities. It's usually fairly obvious to me whether a show is Japanese (or at least eastern) rather than North American (or western). It's not just animation style either since cultural elements can be picked up in most titles eventually too, which I know wasn't the original subject of debate, but it definitely differentiates most anime and gives it a unique feel.

to be fair, how many people realize how much animation out there has been marketed to young adults/adults or is questionable about some of the material in it that's made in western countries? not even counting porn stuff there's Watership Down (ostensibly pg-13, but we have stuff like a warren that's basically a rabbit version of Nazi occupied Germany for one; I could mention The Plague Dogs as well for it's strong political stance against animal testing and what was done to the two dogs in it), Wizards (post apocalyptic Nazi elves and fanservice), Felidae (just look at the parental guide warnings on it on IMDb), and if I wasn't so damn exhausted from vacation and heading back home I could probably think of more. and that's not including stuff like Fritz the Cat either.

and I will not argue that there are not several common styles (PLURAL) found in anime, as there are and I've never said there weren't, but there are also no prerequisite styles needed for it to be anime (as in, non-Japanese slang for animation from Japan, instead of the literal Japanese definition of any animated cartoon). a Japanese studio could make an animation in the style of South Park or Family Guy and it would still be anime.

[Guarddess]

Nytemair is a new VNfag

Anime = Cartoons

Jesus ********, the word "anime" is literally "cartoons" in French.


People who argue that all Eastern anime is more "mature" than Western cartoons are delusional and I've never really understood why anyone would get riled at hearing someone else call anime cartoons.

For me, personally, it's all about the connotation. Like with most things in the English language, although there MAY be twenty different words for the same thing (ie. Skinny, thin, lean, slim, scrawny, emaciated, gaunt, twiggy), they don't all carry the same weight or bring the same image to mind.

A "cartoon" is connoted in such a manner that one thinks of a whimsical and brightly colored animated short of an episodic nature intended for children and young audiences.
Because of this, after about the age of twelve, "Sorry I didn't call you back last night, I just got caught up, bingeing watching this new cartoon I found," sounds a bit funny to the American ear.

"Anime," however, is designated strictly to animated series originating from Japan. Granted, the word "anime" itself doesn't exactly have a POSITIVE connotation, as far as the ever decisive, faceless majority of Americans are concerned, but it IS connoted to mean something of a more "adult" subject matter than the STANDARD American cartoon. Additionally, what is labeled as "anime" is also connoted to have a more sophisticated art style. Granted, anime doesn't have to contain any adult subject matter, fan service, or a "sophisticated art style," the connotation of the label is STILL more appropriate that that of a standard fair American "cartoon."

[malveillants]

Guarddess

Nytemair is a new VNfag

Anime = Cartoons

Jesus ********, the word "anime" is literally "cartoons" in French.


People who argue that all Eastern anime is more "mature" than Western cartoons are delusional and I've never really understood why anyone would get riled at hearing someone else call anime cartoons.

For me, personally, it's all about the connotation. Like with most things in the English language, although there MAY be twenty different words for the same thing (ie. Skinny, thin, lean, slim, scrawny, emaciated, gaunt, twiggy), they don't all carry the same weight or bring the same image to mind.

A "cartoon" is connoted in such a manner that one thinks of a whimsical and brightly colored animated short of an episodic nature intended for children and young audiences.
Because of this, after about the age of twelve, "Sorry I didn't call you back last night, I just got caught up, bingeing watching this new cartoon I found," sounds a bit funny to the American ear.

"Anime," however, is designated strictly to animated series originating from Japan. Granted, the word "anime" itself doesn't exactly have a POSITIVE connotation, as far as the ever decisive, faceless majority of Americans are concerned, but it IS connoted to mean something of a more "adult" subject matter than the STANDARD American cartoon. Additionally, what is labeled as "anime" is also connoted to have a more sophisticated art style. Granted, anime doesn't have to contain any adult subject matter, fan service, or a "sophisticated art style," the connotation of the label is STILL more appropriate that that of a standard fair American "cartoon."

ANIME IS JUST THE WORD JAPAN USES TO SIGNIFY THEIR CARTOONS. I MEAN, LOOK AT CHI'S SWEET HOME.. THAT'S STILL CALLED AN ANIME WHEN IT'S MUCH MORE OF A "CARTOON."
BOONDOCKS, AVATAR, AND TEEN TITANS ARE TECHNICALLY STYLIZED AS ANIME BUT ARE AMERICAN MADE. OVER HERE, WE -DO- CALL THOSE CARTOONS BUT, STYLISTICALLY, THEY'RE MORE LIKE ANIME.
I DON'T THINK IT HAS ANYTHING TO DO WITH THE CONNOTATION WHATSOEVER.

CULTURES CHOSE WORDS TO REPRESENT; AND ANIME IS SHORT FOR ANIMATION.. AND AN ANIMATION, IN AMERICA, WE CALL A CARTOON. IT'S REALLY ALL THE SAME.

WILL YOU REBUT ?
&&HOW CAN YOU SAY THE LABEL IS, HONESTLY, MORE APPROPRIATE ? YOU'VE GIVEN NO REAL INFORMATION AS TO WHY THAT SHOULD BE SO.
TO ME, IT'S AN ANIME BECAUSE IT'S FROM JAPAN, YES, BUT IT DOESN'T -NOT- MAKE IT A CARTOON, EITHER.

[malveillants]

OH, AND SINCE YOU WERE CREEPIN' IN MY THREAD, I DECIDED TO CREEP IN YOURS, ENTRESSA. c:

[Guarddess]

Malveillants

Guarddess

Nytemair is a new VNfag

Anime = Cartoons

Jesus ********, the word "anime" is literally "cartoons" in French.


People who argue that all Eastern anime is more "mature" than Western cartoons are delusional and I've never really understood why anyone would get riled at hearing someone else call anime cartoons.

For me, personally, it's all about the connotation. Like with most things in the English language, although there MAY be twenty different words for the same thing (ie. Skinny, thin, lean, slim, scrawny, emaciated, gaunt, twiggy), they don't all carry the same weight or bring the same image to mind.

A "cartoon" is connoted in such a manner that one thinks of a whimsical and brightly colored animated short of an episodic nature intended for children and young audiences.
Because of this, after about the age of twelve, "Sorry I didn't call you back last night, I just got caught up, bingeing watching this new cartoon I found," sounds a bit funny to the American ear.

"Anime," however, is designated strictly to animated series originating from Japan. Granted, the word "anime" itself doesn't exactly have a POSITIVE connotation, as far as the ever decisive, faceless majority of Americans are concerned, but it IS connoted to mean something of a more "adult" subject matter than the STANDARD American cartoon. Additionally, what is labeled as "anime" is also connoted to have a more sophisticated art style. Granted, anime doesn't have to contain any adult subject matter, fan service, or a "sophisticated art style," the connotation of the label is STILL more appropriate that that of a standard fair American "cartoon."

ANIME IS JUST THE WORD JAPAN USES TO SIGNIFY THEIR CARTOONS. I MEAN, LOOK AT CHI'S SWEET HOME.. THAT'S STILL CALLED AN ANIME WHEN IT'S MUCH MORE OF A "CARTOON."
BOONDOCKS, AVATAR, AND TEEN TITANS ARE TECHNICALLY STYLIZED AS ANIME BUT ARE AMERICAN MADE. OVER HERE, WE -DO- CALL THOSE CARTOONS BUT, STYLISTICALLY, THEY'RE MORE LIKE ANIME.
I DON'T THINK IT HAS ANYTHING TO DO WITH THE CONNOTATION WHATSOEVER.

CULTURES CHOSE WORDS TO REPRESENT; AND ANIME IS SHORT FOR ANIMATION.. AND AN ANIMATION, IN AMERICA, WE CALL A CARTOON. IT'S REALLY ALL THE SAME.

WILL YOU REBUT ?
&&HOW CAN YOU SAY THE LABEL IS, HONESTLY, MORE APPROPRIATE ? YOU'VE GIVEN NO REAL INFORMATION AS TO WHY THAT SHOULD BE SO.
TO ME, IT'S AN ANIME BECAUSE IT'S FROM JAPAN, YES, BUT IT DOESN'T -NOT- MAKE IT A CARTOON, EITHER.

Excuse me if I've missed your point here, but I think you've missed mine.... I'm not saying that anime isn't a form of animation or that it COULDN'T be classified as cartoons; my point is that this entire debate is one of a "Blue vs. Sapphire," nature:

Both ARE blue, but not all blues are the same blue. When I hear blue, I picture a royal blue, you may picture navy or sky blue, or something else entirely, but SAPPHIRE is specific. If something is sapphire, opposed to blue, we are both picturing the same exact color (theoretically at least; for all I know, what we have mutually agreed on as being blue could actually be two entirely different colors all together).
That's how connotations WORK. You say cartoon, I think SpongeBob, but one could also think Comic Strips, Political Cartoons, Mickey Mouse, Family Guy, Total Drama Island, Winx Club, Llamas with Hats, or Pokémon. Saying "anime" specifically denotes ONLY animation originating from Japan.

Japanese animation is special in that it's developed an immense and devoted international following to the point where, in America at least, anime as a whole has become its own genre (which is a bit cluttered and causes WAY too much confusion for people who aren't into it due to the fact that it DOES extend quite extensively beyond just being ONE genre, but it's a start I suppose...) with American artists now trying to emulate the style. Having become so popular and having developed a reputation for being drastically different from American cartoons, it's only natural that it become more appropriate to designate it with a separate term of its own.

Blue and Sapphire,
Rectangles and Squares,
Cartoons and Anime.

[malveillants]

Guarddess

Malveillants

Guarddess

Nytemair is a new VNfag

Anime = Cartoons

Jesus ********, the word "anime" is literally "cartoons" in French.


People who argue that all Eastern anime is more "mature" than Western cartoons are delusional and I've never really understood why anyone would get riled at hearing someone else call anime cartoons.

For me, personally, it's all about the connotation. Like with most things in the English language, although there MAY be twenty different words for the same thing (ie. Skinny, thin, lean, slim, scrawny, emaciated, gaunt, twiggy), they don't all carry the same weight or bring the same image to mind.

A "cartoon" is connoted in such a manner that one thinks of a whimsical and brightly colored animated short of an episodic nature intended for children and young audiences.
Because of this, after about the age of twelve, "Sorry I didn't call you back last night, I just got caught up, bingeing watching this new cartoon I found," sounds a bit funny to the American ear.

"Anime," however, is designated strictly to animated series originating from Japan. Granted, the word "anime" itself doesn't exactly have a POSITIVE connotation, as far as the ever decisive, faceless majority of Americans are concerned, but it IS connoted to mean something of a more "adult" subject matter than the STANDARD American cartoon. Additionally, what is labeled as "anime" is also connoted to have a more sophisticated art style. Granted, anime doesn't have to contain any adult subject matter, fan service, or a "sophisticated art style," the connotation of the label is STILL more appropriate that that of a standard fair American "cartoon."

ANIME IS JUST THE WORD JAPAN USES TO SIGNIFY THEIR CARTOONS. I MEAN, LOOK AT CHI'S SWEET HOME.. THAT'S STILL CALLED AN ANIME WHEN IT'S MUCH MORE OF A "CARTOON."
BOONDOCKS, AVATAR, AND TEEN TITANS ARE TECHNICALLY STYLIZED AS ANIME BUT ARE AMERICAN MADE. OVER HERE, WE -DO- CALL THOSE CARTOONS BUT, STYLISTICALLY, THEY'RE MORE LIKE ANIME.
I DON'T THINK IT HAS ANYTHING TO DO WITH THE CONNOTATION WHATSOEVER.

CULTURES CHOSE WORDS TO REPRESENT; AND ANIME IS SHORT FOR ANIMATION.. AND AN ANIMATION, IN AMERICA, WE CALL A CARTOON. IT'S REALLY ALL THE SAME.

WILL YOU REBUT ?
&&HOW CAN YOU SAY THE LABEL IS, HONESTLY, MORE APPROPRIATE ? YOU'VE GIVEN NO REAL INFORMATION AS TO WHY THAT SHOULD BE SO.
TO ME, IT'S AN ANIME BECAUSE IT'S FROM JAPAN, YES, BUT IT DOESN'T -NOT- MAKE IT A CARTOON, EITHER.

Excuse me if I've missed your point here, but I think you've missed mine.... I'm not saying that anime isn't a form of animation or that it COULDN'T be classified as cartoons; my point is that this entire debate is one of a "Blue vs. Sapphire," nature:

Both ARE blue, but not all blues are the same blue. When I hear blue, I picture a royal blue, you may picture navy or sky blue, or something else entirely, but SAPPHIRE is specific. If something is sapphire, opposed to blue, we are both picturing the same exact color (theoretically at least; for all I know, what we have mutually agreed on as being blue could actually be two entirely different colors all together).
That's how connotations WORK. You say cartoon, I think SpongeBob, but one could also think Comic Strips, Political Cartoons, Mickey Mouse, Family Guy, Total Drama Island, Winx Club, Llamas with Hats, or Pokémon. Saying "anime" specifically denotes ONLY animation originating from Japan.

Japanese animation is special in that it's developed an immense and devoted international following to the point where, in America at least, anime as a whole has become its own genre (which is a bit cluttered and causes WAY too much confusion for people who aren't into it due to the fact that it DOES extend quite extensively beyond just being ONE genre, but it's a start I suppose...) with American artists now trying to emulate the style. Having become so popular and having developed a reputation for being drastically different from American cartoons, it's only natural that it become more appropriate to designate it with a separate term of its own.

Blue and Sapphire,
Rectangles and Squares,
Cartoons and Anime.

No, no, no.
My point is this :
That no matter how you "connote" the word, the fact remains that "anime's" denotation is the same as "cartoon."
Origin doesn't change that the denotation is exactly the same.
It's like taking any word in any two given languages.
One is English, one is Japanese.
It is still holds the same meaning no matter how you look at it. The connotation you make, yourself, is personal not worldy by any means. So what does it really matter if you have your personal connotation at all ?
It doesn't. Connotation is simply one's idea, not necessarily what it is.
Thus you're taking something that is and making it something it really -isn't- at all.
So you saying that one word is more APPROPRIATE is solely based off your opinion, and not the actual meaning of the word.
What makes YOU right while I sit idly by inferring they are, in actuality, the same thing ?
You make no sense.
Yes, there are many shades of colour, but that isn't really an "appropriate" way to look at it given that style is actually MORE limited with anime than it is with westernized "cartoons."

You crazy people give words extra meaning which isn't necessary; let it be what it is, American or Japanese. An animation. Sure you can call it what you want and give it whatever meaning you please, but it's still just a cartoon by means of a name. What you personally choose to call it has nothing to do with what I call it. And in short, in my "ever decisive, faceless"ness seems to have just as well-rounded opinion as you. Funny that since I call everything animated an animation or a cartoon. Maybe it's just my.. faceless American ways ? That's silly.

[Entressa]

Malveillants

OH, AND SINCE YOU WERE CREEPIN' IN MY THREAD, I DECIDED TO CREEP IN YOURS, ENTRESSA. c:

Dayum, calling me out in my own thread?! That's dirty, yo'. scream

[malveillants]

Entressa

Malveillants

OH, AND SINCE YOU WERE CREEPIN' IN MY THREAD, I DECIDED TO CREEP IN YOURS, ENTRESSA. c:

Dayum, calling me out in my own thread?! That's dirty, yo'. scream

No, not dirty. I just think it's an incredibly interesting debate. ^^

[GuardianCentauri]

Mugetsu Ookamiza

to be fair, how many people realize how much animation out there has been marketed to young adults/adults or is questionable about some of the material in it that's made in western countries? not even counting porn stuff there's Watership Down (ostensibly pg-13, but we have stuff like a warren that's basically a rabbit version of Nazi occupied Germany for one; I could mention The Plague Dogs as well for it's strong political stance against animal testing and what was done to the two dogs in it), Wizards (post apocalyptic Nazi elves and fanservice), Felidae (just look at the parental guide warnings on it on IMDb), and if I wasn't so damn exhausted from vacation and heading back home I could probably think of more. and that's not including stuff like Fritz the Cat either.

and I will not argue that there are not several common styles (PLURAL) found in anime, as there are and I've never said there weren't, but there are also no prerequisite styles needed for it to be anime (as in, non-Japanese slang for animation from Japan, instead of the literal Japanese definition of any animated cartoon). a Japanese studio could make an animation in the style of South Park or Family Guy and it would still be anime.

Okay, good point. I admit that I'm not particularly knowledgeable about what exists in the less mainstream corners of western animations as compared to Japanese ones, so most of what I'm thinking of is what's commonly more popular, gets time on TV stations or in major theatres, etc.

It sounds like we actually view the issue of styles and what not similarly. I agree with you that it isn't black and white and that there are no clearly defined dividing lines other than where an animation is made. It's more about overall ranges and bell curves - the majority will usually conform to most of a set of characteristics while a smaller number of titles further on the fringes will share less in common. As such, I still think some generalizations can be made as long as one is careful to use qualifiers and note that there are obviously exceptions and that there isn't any hard rule that anime has to follow despite said generalizations. As you've pointed out above, this applies to western animations as well of course.

[Entressa]

Malveillants

No, not dirty. I just think it's an incredibly interesting debate. ^^

It is, it's funny because I didn't even mean for it to spark these debates. I expected more replies like "anime are not cartoons, cartoons are stupid" to be honest. Or people getting extremely upset at me because I consider them almost the same. x_x So I am pleasantly surprised. sweatdrop

[malveillants]

Entressa

Malveillants

No, not dirty. I just think it's an incredibly interesting debate. ^^

It is, it's funny because I didn't even mean for it to spark these debates. I expected more replies like "anime are not cartoons, cartoons are stupid" to be honest. Or people getting extremely upset at me because I consider them almost the same. x_x So I am pleasantly surprised. sweatdrop

As you should be ! Debates like this are so much fun to read, haha.
I expected replied similar to that, as well.. but what I've seen is a vast, and almost discriminate, view against calling them anything similar. I, too, believe they are pretty much the same; just to each country their own when it comes to "identification." 3nodding
So, you know, thanks for sparking this.
It's always interesting to see what have to say.

[GuardianCentauri]

Malveillants

No, no, no.
My point is this :
That no matter how you "connote" the word, the fact remains that "anime's" denotation is the same as "cartoon."
Origin doesn't change that the denotation is exactly the same.
It's like taking any word in any two given languages.
One is English, one is Japanese.
It is still holds the same meaning no matter how you look at it. The connotation you make, yourself, is personal not worldy by any means. So what does it really matter if you have your personal connotation at all ?
It doesn't. Connotation is simply one's idea, not necessarily what it is.
Thus you're taking something that is and making it something it really -isn't- at all.
So you saying that one word is more APPROPRIATE is solely based off your opinion, and not the actual meaning of the word.
What makes YOU right while I sit idly by inferring they are, in actuality, the same thing ?
You make no sense.
Yes, there are many shades of colour, but that isn't really an "appropriate" way to look at it given that style is actually MORE limited with anime than it is with westernized "cartoons."

You crazy people give words extra meaning which isn't necessary; let it be what it is, American or Japanese. An animation. Sure you can call it what you want and give it whatever meaning you please, but it's still just a cartoon by means of a name. What you personally choose to call it has nothing to do with what I call it. And in short, in my "ever decisive, faceless"ness seems to have just as well-rounded opinion as you. Funny that since I call everything animated an animation or a cartoon. Maybe it's just my.. faceless American ways ? That's silly.

Granted, some of this extends into the realm of personal opinions and past experiences of how others around you treat different words, but I think Guarddess made some decent points. At the very least, anime is still a more specific term than simply saying cartoons since it usually specifies an animation that comes from Japan. I think being specific is usually better than being unnecessarily generalized.

Beyond that, I thought it was fair to compare it to the various synonyms for skinny. Based on my own experiences, some words that are technically synonymous will be treated slightly or sometimes very differently in usage and meaning behind them. To the extreme, some words become downright derogatory, and that definitely makes a world of difference to people who have been on the receiving end of them.

So while I wouldn't consider usage of the word cartoons for anime on the extreme end of always being derogatory, its use often carries negative connotations that aren't simply my own ones, based on my past experiences with lots of people who use the word without really seeming to have much or any knowledge of what anime is. This doesn't mean that cartoon can't be used to describe anime, just that anime is a better pick for specifics and avoiding possible negative associations.

[Entressa]

Malveillants

As you should be ! Debates like this are so much fun to read, haha.
I expected replied similar to that, as well.. but what I've seen is a vast, and almost discriminate, view against calling them anything similar. I, too, believe they are pretty much the same; just to each country their own when it comes to "identification." 3nodding
So, you know, thanks for sparking this.
It's always interesting to see what have to say.

lol -Takes off pretty, fancy text and gets game-face on- Round 1, go! That's what these intense debates feel like. Hard to keep up with how fast people type up a response. sweatdrop

[malveillants]

GuardianCentauri

Malveillants

No, no, no.
My point is this :
That no matter how you "connote" the word, the fact remains that "anime's" denotation is the same as "cartoon."
Origin doesn't change that the denotation is exactly the same.
It's like taking any word in any two given languages.
One is English, one is Japanese.
It is still holds the same meaning no matter how you look at it. The connotation you make, yourself, is personal not worldy by any means. So what does it really matter if you have your personal connotation at all ?
It doesn't. Connotation is simply one's idea, not necessarily what it is.
Thus you're taking something that is and making it something it really -isn't- at all.
So you saying that one word is more APPROPRIATE is solely based off your opinion, and not the actual meaning of the word.
What makes YOU right while I sit idly by inferring they are, in actuality, the same thing ?
You make no sense.
Yes, there are many shades of colour, but that isn't really an "appropriate" way to look at it given that style is actually MORE limited with anime than it is with westernized "cartoons."

You crazy people give words extra meaning which isn't necessary; let it be what it is, American or Japanese. An animation. Sure you can call it what you want and give it whatever meaning you please, but it's still just a cartoon by means of a name. What you personally choose to call it has nothing to do with what I call it. And in short, in my "ever decisive, faceless"ness seems to have just as well-rounded opinion as you. Funny that since I call everything animated an animation or a cartoon. Maybe it's just my.. faceless American ways ? That's silly.

Granted, some of this extends into the realm of personal opinions and past experiences of how others around you treat different words, but I think Guarddess made some decent points. At the very least, anime is still a more specific term than simply saying cartoons since it usually specifies an animation that comes from Japan. I think being specific is usually better than being unnecessarily generalized.

Beyond that, I thought it was fair to compare it to the various synonyms for skinny. Based on my own experiences, some words that are technically synonymous will be treated slightly or sometimes very differently in usage and meaning behind them. To the extreme, some words become downright derogatory, and that definitely makes a world of difference to people who have been on the receiving end of them.

So while I wouldn't consider usage of the word cartoons for anime on the extreme end of always being derogatory, its use often carries negative connotations that aren't simply my own ones, based on my past experiences with lots of people who use the word without really seeming to have much or any knowledge of what anime is. This doesn't mean that cartoon can't be used to describe anime, just that anime is a better pick for specifics and avoiding possible negative associations.

They still call our american cartoons "anime."
I still don't see what the difference is with western culture calling their animations cartoons.

What we're really talking about is a group of people, who like to refer to something in a specific way, getting frustrated thinking they're enjoying something of a different caliber than the rest of the world. I don't think it is so wrong for "regular americans" or whoever, to blindly refer to them as cartoons. One's personal outlook on "possible negative associations" is just.. one's perspective. I just don't see why it matters. It only seems to matter to those who want to debate that cartoons is "negative," even if it isn't "wholly" negative.

I think she makes some interesting points as well.. but I also feel like her points are more subjective than anything. Though all things can be entirely subjective, I still feel like she is trying to debate that they, even if of the same root, are entirely different flowers. To me, they just aren't.

How one person thinks is not how every person thinks.
And Blue is not sapphire. Sapphire is a gem, blue is a base colour.
So perhaps we all just look at this in different lights.

[GuardianCentauri]

Malveillants

They still call our american cartoons "anime."
I still don't see what the difference is with western culture calling their animations cartoons.

What we're really talking about is a group of people, who like to refer to something in a specific way, getting frustrated thinking they're enjoying something of a different caliber than the rest of the world. I don't think it is so wrong for "regular americans" or whoever, to blindly refer to them as cartoons. One's personal outlook on "possible negative associations" is just.. one's perspective. I just don't see why it matters. It only seems to matter to those who want to debate that cartoons is "negative," even if it isn't "wholly" negative.

I think she makes some interesting points as well.. but I also feel like her points are more subjective than anything. Though all things can be entirely subjective, I still feel like she is trying to debate that they, even if of the same root, are entirely different flowers. To me, they just aren't.

How one person thinks is not how every person thinks.
And Blue is not sapphire. Sapphire is a gem, blue is a base colour.
So perhaps we all just look at this in different lights.

I have heard a few people over here in North America call western animations "anime", but, like my observations of most people using the word cartoon in reference to anime, those people usually seem to not actually know much about anime, thus it may not be coming from a place of much accuracy or understanding when it's said. Most anime database websites I've seen draw the line on what they add based on whether or not the animation was made in Japan.

I agree that it essentially comes down to a matter of perspective, but it involves far more perspectives than just one's own, and that's what gives this its powerful effect in terms of meaning behind the words. With the skinny example, I would say that "lean" is probably the most positive sounding word based on its general usage (like when used by fitness enthusiastic people) while thin and slim are usually more neutral and words like scrawny imply weakness and emaciated by definition suggests that there may be an illness causing a problem. While there's some variation on usage of these words obviously, I don't think that's simply my own opinion on the matter because I've certainly been on the receiving end of many of these words my whole life from others (ie, their opinions and perspectives as well). The differences may not always be technically there in the definitions, but those differences are nonetheless real.

And yes, it's true that we won't all view any of this in exactly the same way. It's what makes defining these subtle differences a bit difficult, I admit. Like I said above, I think stuff like this can best be defined as generalized understandings while noting that there can be exceptions on usage. It's become apparent to me from this thread that there are many people here who do use the term cartoons to describe anime and/or use it interchangeably, and I think it's fair to assume everyone here is reasonably knowledgeable about anime. Under those conditions and the technical fact that anime is a type of cartoon, I think it's understandable for people to use the word. I'm actually kind of encouraged by this realization because I'm just so used to it being applied by those seemingly in a place of ignorance in local life. ^^;

EDIT:
My CAPTCHA was "winterpeg"... Given the weird summer weather right now (cooler weather in central Canada versus high temperatures in the west and the Maritimes), this seems fitting. o.o